The police misconduct thread

StormfrontFL

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Focus on real problems what a bunch of nose in the air people thinking they know everything. You all think putting videos on the internet is actually going to change something? New flash it won't. Putting all this effort to fix such a small problem when right in their faces lies the problem. Criminals are criminals, where is the outrage at black on black crime? Where is the outrage at the crazy pregnancy rates in poor areas? Ahh don't mean anything. Where is the outrage at a country who is $18 trillion dollars in debt with no way to pay. Ahh just a rounding error make the rich pay more.

Liberals are the misguided drones that walk the streets preaching about shit no one cares about. All this talk about police no one really cares, no one. Why because most of us are trying to figure out ways to pay our bills, raise our kids (so they dont become thugs) and build a path to retirement.
During your rant which had little to do with this discussion(go figure) you forgot to end it properly. It should finish with, "and hope that you don't get killed by the cops if you mistakenly drive with your turn signal on."
 
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ClintHardBall

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If you have that many issues with police then as I had mentioned long ago there should be a list. When those on the list call a 911 operator the officers have the discretion to say NO. Then while you are having your balls cut off and stuffed into your mouth you can think about all those "bad" cops. But then again most liberals would never ever agree to such an idea.
 
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Calboner

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If you have that many issues with police then as I had mentioned long ago there should be a list. When those on the list call a 911 operator the officers have the discretion to say NO. Then while you are having your balls cut off and stuffed into your mouth you can think about all those "bad" cops. But then again most liberals would never ever agree to such an idea.

What is it that incapacitates you from grasping the point that the two statements

(1) We need police.
(2) We need police to act WITHIN THE LAW.​

are not logically incompatible?

You apparently think that anyone who asserts (2) must give up (1)

You are a driveling imbecile, with no capacity for learning.
 

jaap_stam

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If you have that many issues with police then as I had mentioned long ago there should be a list. When those on the list call a 911 operator the officers have the discretion to say NO. Then while you are having your balls cut off and stuffed into your mouth you can think about all those "bad" cops. But then again most liberals would never ever agree to such an idea.

I suspect you have not ever lived in a poor black neighborhood in the US, or if in Europe, in a poor immigrant banlieu, like in France. To be fair, it sounds like you have a white/middle class perspective on the value of the police.

People who live in such places routinely get harassed by the police, often to the point of physical intimidation, and frequently for no reason other than not acting in immediate submissive deference. See "stop and frisk" in New York, or the proximate causes of the multiple national race riots in France from 2005-2009. It is not an instinct in such places to call the police at the sign of trouble, which is one (of many) reasons why violence is higher in such areas. There is a hatred of police that comes from repeated traumatic events at the hands of bad police.

Your assumption is that most people would just fall to pieces in the face of a violent attack - which is an assumption of white, middle class values and attitudes towards physical violence. Another perspective to your strawman example is that when someone pulls a knife, perhaps instead of thinking to call the police, the person would pull out their own knife. Or maybe call their brother or cousin. Or maybe pull out their gun.

The difficultly, also, of labelling some police as bad and others good, is that police will behave differently towards a person depending on wealth, race, gender, etc. The officer who let you off with just a warning for speeding could be the same one who roughs up the Mexican immigrant for the same offense. Perhaps most police are good and only a few bad from your perspective because proportionally fewer would treat you with disrespect. That may not be true if your skin was a lot darker, or if your home was in a different neighborhood. It's important to some times just listen when someone of a disadvantaged background is telling you what's happening instead of disagreeing based on your own perspective. Because just maybe, you are getting preferential treatment that they don't get.

Also, before he started getting vitriolic at the end of his post, Calboner made a good point:
(1) We need police.
(2) We need police to act WITHIN THE LAW.

When police stop doing #2, or do #2 unevenly, we start to have problems.
 

ClintHardBall

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OK so the poor neighborhood excuse is old and tired. Where does most crime happen poor neighborhoods, what is the incarnation rate of those from poorer areas?? See the correlation? So when an officer goes to an area that is poorer the percentage of criminals is much higher. So that would stand to reason the arrest records for those in a poorer area would be higher. That being said being poor does not give anyone the right to be a criminal without punishment. So to my original points rather than jumping on police for policing go after the criminals, publicly shame them, call them out, turn them in what ever just rid them of those areas.

What is the problem with Stop and Frisk, I have nothing to hide do you? Then quit bitching. Don't make assumptions as to my background. I grew up in a poorer neighborhood. My father was a police officer. I was personally threatened multiple times due to what my father did as a career. He put criminals in prison only for them to be let out so they could threaten him and his family. So please don't try to tell me about all the innocent criminals in prison and they are all good people. It's BS.
 

Boobalaa

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Oh, We're you bullied as a child because your father was a policeman? It sounds like you were traumatized by the experiences.
 

Calboner

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See the correlation? So when an officer goes to an area that is poorer the percentage of criminals is much higher. So that would stand to reason the arrest records for those in a poorer area would be higher. That being said being poor does not give anyone the right to be a criminal without punishment.
Neither does it give police the right to treat people who have not broken the law as criminals simply because they are poor, or inflict brutal and unlawful treatment on people who have broken the law. Is the point so difficult to grasp?
What is the problem with Stop and Frisk, I have nothing to hide do you? Then quit bitching.
I have nothing to fear from it myself, as I am lily-white and don't live anywhere near a rough neighborhood where police might carry out such a policy. Apparently you, showing all the empathetic imagination of Eric Cartman, have difficulty grasping the idea that the treatment of human beings other than oneself, or of people much different from oneself in racial and social origin, might matter somehow. Whether you have anything to hide or not is irrelevant. Stop-and-frisk is a form of harassment directed at people according to marks of race and social class.
 
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jaap_stam

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OK so the poor neighborhood excuse is old and tired. Where does most crime happen poor neighborhoods, what is the incarnation rate of those from poorer areas?? See the correlation? So when an officer goes to an area that is poorer the percentage of criminals is much higher. So that would stand to reason the arrest records for those in a poorer area would be higher. That being said being poor does not give anyone the right to be a criminal without punishment. So to my original points rather than jumping on police for policing go after the criminals, publicly shame them, call them out, turn them in what ever just rid them of those areas.

What is the problem with Stop and Frisk, I have nothing to hide do you? Then quit bitching. Don't make assumptions as to my background. I grew up in a poorer neighborhood. My father was a police officer. I was personally threatened multiple times due to what my father did as a career. He put criminals in prison only for them to be let out so they could threaten him and his family. So please don't try to tell me about all the innocent criminals in prison and they are all good people. It's BS.

Well, the lack of empathy reinforces my suspicion about your racial and class background. Similarly, having a police officer in your family is highly prejudicial in the type of treatment you received from other police officers.

In the US, you have actual evidence that for the same crime, blacks and latinos get harsher jail sentences than whites.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887324432004578304463789858002
http://www.allgov.com/news/top-stor...n-white-americans-for-same-crimes?news=843984
In fact, this is so widely documented I somewhat doubt the sincerity of your disbelief, and think it may be more of some kind of investment in believing certain people are inherently more violent or arrest-prone than others.

Stop and frisk is not about "not having anything to hide." Again, going to data, stop and frisk is disproportionately targeted towards specific ethnic groups living in specific neighborhoods. It was so blatant and so bad that it was ruled to be unconstitutional, and ruling was upheld in your federal court, and the NYPD faces 5 years of court-run oversight as a result of the ruling
http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-upholds-rulings-stop-frisk-unconstitutional
http://nypost.com/2014/03/05/nypd-faces-five-years-of-oversight-after-stop-and-frisk-ruling/

If you sympathize with the police "just doing their job" it might be good to review the arrest quota systems that were used as part of the policy - quotas that actual NYPD officers (the "good" police officers) admitted to having
http://www.npr.org/2013/03/21/174941454/at-stop-and-frisk-trial-cops-describe-quota-driven-nypd
http://www.cnn.com/2013/03/22/justice/new-york-stop-and-frisk-trial/

Stop and Frisk data shows very systematic ethnic profiling by the police in who they stop. The fact that 90% of those stopped "had nothing to hide" suggests that the police were quite terrible at accurately profiling potential criminals...either that or they had arrest quotas...
http://www.nyclu.org/content/stop-and-frisk-data
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/13/opinion/racial-discrimination-in-stop-and-frisk.html

Now, to address the very poor statistical arguments you made. Where does all the crime happen, you ask? Well, we know that the rich and the poor, white and black have similar frequency of illegal drug use, yet the vast majority of people in jail for drugs are poor minorities - this points to a concentration of enforcement on specific populations. This is not a correlation borne from causation, but from department policies/individual police choices on where and when to enforce the law.

Your attitude and comments also point out another key factor in arrest rates - unconscious bias. If as a police officer, I enter a neighborhood with an assumption that more of "those people" are criminals than other neighborhoods (antagonistic mindset from the start), and I have an arrest quota like stop and frisk, I am more likely to make an arrest. And more importantly, I will be looking for a reason to arrest someone, and so I might behave in a way that triggers someone to act in a manner that gives me grounds to arrest. The behavior is called micro-aggression. To learn more about what micro-aggression might sound like check out this video

Obviously, you have some emotional investment in justifying behaviors that many of your fellow American citizens perceive to be abuse of police power. The points made above are so well documented, and the data so widely and easily verified and available, that your behavior points to either brilliant trolling or some cognitive dissonance.
 

MisterVIP

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OK so the poor neighborhood excuse is old and tired. Where does most crime happen poor neighborhoods, what is the incarnation rate of those from poorer areas?? See the correlation? So when an officer goes to an area that is poorer the percentage of criminals is much higher. So that would stand to reason the arrest records for those in a poorer area would be higher. That being said being poor does not give anyone the right to be a criminal without punishment. So to my original points rather than jumping on police for policing go after the criminals, publicly shame them, call them out, turn them in what ever just rid them of those areas.

What is the problem with Stop and Frisk, I have nothing to hide do you? Then quit bitching. Don't make assumptions as to my background. I grew up in a poorer neighborhood. My father was a police officer. I was personally threatened multiple times due to what my father did as a career. He put criminals in prison only for them to be let out so they could threaten him and his family. So please don't try to tell me about all the innocent criminals in prison and they are all good people. It's BS.
The problem with stop and frisk is that the 4th amendment protects us from such violations of our rights, regardless of which kangaroo courts upheld this BS unconstitutional practice as reasonable and permissible. This isn't the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany or even the tyrannical rule of the English crown (reason for that amendment and others).

It's not that people here are as upset about "police policing" as they are about police abusing their positions and overstepping their limits all the damned time.
 

slurper_la

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Focus on real problems what a bunch of nose in the air people thinking they know everything. You all think putting videos on the internet is actually going to change something? New flash it won't. Putting all this effort to fix such a small problem when right in their faces lies the problem. Criminals are criminals, where is the outrage at black on black crime? Where is the outrage at the crazy pregnancy rates in poor areas? Ahh don't mean anything. Where is the outrage at a country who is $18 trillion dollars in debt with no way to pay. Ahh just a rounding error make the rich pay more.

Liberals are the misguided drones that walk the streets preaching about shit no one cares about. All this talk about police no one really cares, no one. Why because most of us are trying to figure out ways to pay our bills, raise our kids (so they dont become thugs) and build a path to retirement.

You're a disgusting animal!!!
.
 

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Calboner

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It's a funny thing how those bad cops who are supposedly such a small minority are so often joined in their acts of brutality by other cops who, far from restraining them, join in and go one better:

WATCH: NYPD officers beat young black man who had his hands up over allegedly-stolen pizza (Raw Story, July 22, 2015)

Thomas Jennings, 24, can be seen in the surveillance camera video leaning on the counter at a grocery store in Brooklyn on July 7, when NYPD officer Lenny Lutchman approaches from behind and immediately starts shoving him in the chest and grabbing his wrist. Jenning appears surprised and raises both hands in surrender.

Suddenly, Lutchman’s partner Pearce Martinez runs in and without breaking his stride or saying anything, rains down a full-force right hand punch to Jennings’ head. He continues to pummel him and Lutchman joins in, hitting Jennings with his baton. During the beating, Jennings remains curled over the counter and doesn’t fight back.

While Martinez handcuffs Jennings, Lutchman continues striking him, even though Martinez is facing no challenge from Jennings, who appears to helpfully put his hand behind his back.

Of course, only the victim of this attack--the one with black skin and no police uniform--was charged with a crime.
 
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jaap_stam

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MisterVIP

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It's a funny thing how those bad cops who are supposedly such a small minority are so often joined in their acts of brutality by other cops who, far from restraining them, join in and go one better:

WATCH: NYPD officers beat young black man who had his hands up over allegedly-stolen pizza (Raw Story, July 22, 2015)

Thomas Jennings, 24, can be seen in the surveillance camera video leaning on the counter at a grocery store in Brooklyn on July 7, when NYPD officer Lenny Lutchman approaches from behind and immediately starts shoving him in the chest and grabbing his wrist. Jenning appears surprised and raises both hands in surrender.

Suddenly, Lutchman’s partner Pearce Martinez runs in and without breaking his stride or saying anything, rains down a full-force right hand punch to Jennings’ head. He continues to pummel him and Lutchman joins in, hitting Jennings with his baton. During the beating, Jennings remains curled over the counter and doesn’t fight back.

While Martinez handcuffs Jennings, Lutchman continues striking him, even though Martinez is facing no challenge from Jennings, who appears to helpfully put his hand behind his back.

Of course, only the victim of this attack--the one with black skin and no police uniform--was charged with a crime.
Don't worry, they'll probably testify that he was resisting and threatening, etc.
 

Calboner

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Yeah, if you cops would refrain from hog-tying the people you arrest, that would be great. . . . .

While paramedics loaded Goode into the back of the ambulance, a bystander can be heard saying, "They've hogtied him. That's such a bad idea." Seconds later, another witness can be heard saying, "Video it, just in case he dies."

Goode was transported to a local hospital. Two hours later, his family was notified that he had died.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/man-dies-hogtied-by-mississippi-police_55ad3ed7e4b0d2ded39f9812
 
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MisterVIP

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There are much better ways to restrain a man going into an ambulance if he was in fact that dangerous. Hell, the EMTs have ways to restrain them for their own good.
But those ways won't allow them to flex their authority aggressively enough to their satisfaction.
 
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Calboner

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Some apt observations about the Sandra Bland incident—not how she came to be dead in her jail cell, but how she got to be in that cell in the first place (Lezlie Bishop, "Sandra Bland Committed the Crime of Arrogance," The Broad Side, July 23, 2015; bold type added):


On Tuesday, July 21, 2015 former NYPD detective Harry Houck said the following about the Bland arrest:
“The whole thing here is that she was very arrogant from the beginning, very dismissive of the officer, alright?”

Substitute the word “arrogant” with the word “uppity,” and we are right back in the Jim Crow era. Nothing but total deference would do when a black person, male or female, encountered any white person. An “uppity nigger” was considered fair game for discipline, ranging from a good tongue-lashing all the way to death.

Police officers are charged with enforcement of the law. There is no law on any official books against arrogance. There is no law against declining the officer’s request to extinguish one’s cigarette when inside one’s own car. There is no law against “having an attitude.”

When Texas trooper Brian Encinia pulled what appeared to be his Taser device and screamed “get out of the car or I will light you up,” he was no longer an officer of the law; he was an out-of-control bully who was furious that the woman behind the wheel was not intimidated, would not cower under his absolute power over her, and had the audacity to speak to him in a what he considered a disrespectful way.
 
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Fuzzy_

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Thomas Jennings, 24, allegedly stole two slices of pizza. Consequently, five of New York's finest arrived on the scene of this important pizza napping.

While Jennings' hands were in the air, Officer Pearce Martinez appears and starts pummelling Jennings. The beating continues after Jennings falls then Officer Lutchman, on the right, continues to strike him despite Jennings offering no resistance -- he evenly voluntarily put his hand behind his back.


While Jennings is handcuffed, Lutchman gives Jennings a few more pokes with his baton (obviously to further protect the public).
 
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