so heres the situation im in. i have a best friend for many years..and about a year ago i found gay porn on his computer while he was gettin ready. at first i thought it was proably by accident but then a couple weeks later i saw the same site agina on his list of visited site.. and by the next day tho it would be gone... so that gave me the feeling he was def tryin to hide it ...well anyway at the time he also just got his first girl friend and was in his twenties and still a virgin.. he eventually lost it but it took him 4 months after tbeing with his girl.. now a year later his girlfriend breaks up with him and tells me she just saw him more like a firend... but she also said for the last 2 months of the relation ship they didnot have sex once. she actually said she was gunna try again and if sparks flew she wouldstay with him ..but next thing you know she breaks up with him ..but still talks to him everyday because she says hes her best friend... i thought that was wierd ...cuz into the relationship hehad told they went another month without it too ....and i have onlysee this friend hook up with girls when hes really drunnkkk.. other than that he leads girls on when hes soberbut waits till hes drunk to actually do something...but themain thing that got me was for the last year i ve still caughtgay porn on his computerr...and ni dont think straight guys jerk off to gay pornn... and another thing we used to be really closeee and sometimes a lil too close and i get this vibe whenwe wrestle and stuff ...one time he had to stop he siad cuz he got a boner...BUTT heres the thing hes the biggest HOMOPHOB ..hell curse out a gay or tallk really bad about someone who is ay or something..and one time when we were drunk i toold him i knew he was gay ..he flipped and said fuck you ..after that we pacthed things up but were not as close as we used to be even though i didnt tell him how i kneww... and we havent talked bout that ever again ....BUT here the situation i know hell never come out hes big on sports and an so his dad he comes from a fmaily that would never ecpet nor would the group of friends we havee hbut i just want to lett him knowww how i knoww and that im in the same boat ass himmm..but how do i do that withought fucking myslef over cuz i think he would turn it around on me if i tiold him bout me..thats how scared he is of anyone prob knowin...hes always when my kid does this or my wifee ...soo obvisouly the guy is gettin married cuz thats wats expected of hm..and im in the same sitiuation tooo but i want let him know its cool i know andi wouldnt tell a SOUL and i would nt mind if we tried some stuff out sooo how do i go about this ...do i just wait cuz its beenover year since i ve known and no progress what shouldd i do ?
2 closet guys
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EdWoody
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Yeah, he's gay, and having massive issues with it.
He's been conditioned to think gay is wrong by his family. Because of that, he's trying his best to live what he thinks is the right life, hitting on girls, hating gays, etc. Research says the most homophobic men are the ones who have secret gay leanings themselves.
I say, tell him you're gay too, it will help him. Don't come on to him, just let him know he's not alone. He doesn't have to come out to anyone else - just having you to confide in will help him.
It's called the Mutual Assured Destruction Principle. Which makes it sound worse than it actually is. But the general idea is that you both share the same secret, neither of you wants it getting out just yet, so you're each other's confidante and deterrent at the same time.
This boy needs help to get over his horribly repressive upbringing and you're in the perfect position to provide it. Be gentle, subtle, unpressuring, but constant.
He's been conditioned to think gay is wrong by his family. Because of that, he's trying his best to live what he thinks is the right life, hitting on girls, hating gays, etc. Research says the most homophobic men are the ones who have secret gay leanings themselves.
I say, tell him you're gay too, it will help him. Don't come on to him, just let him know he's not alone. He doesn't have to come out to anyone else - just having you to confide in will help him.
It's called the Mutual Assured Destruction Principle. Which makes it sound worse than it actually is. But the general idea is that you both share the same secret, neither of you wants it getting out just yet, so you're each other's confidante and deterrent at the same time.
This boy needs help to get over his horribly repressive upbringing and you're in the perfect position to provide it. Be gentle, subtle, unpressuring, but constant.
fortiesfun
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Buddy:
A couple of things. Without judgment, you'll find that you get better responses if you take the time to write better. Capital letters, paragraphs, that sort of thing. It is hard to follow your post and lots of folks just give up.
Second, explain why you are looking at sites visited on someone else's computer? That isn't a great way to build trust, especially with the closeted.
But most of all, you seem to be struggling with some coming out issues yourself. My advice is that it is better to work those out with gay men with more experience. At this stage, its a bit of the blind leading the blind. Your friend has good reason to be cautious about you. I understand that you wouldn't intentionally hurt him, but how much experience do you really have? Can you be sure that you won't accidentally "out" him before he is ready? Do you know how to keep his confidence? And what if it turns sexual? Do you have any idea what to do?
I hope you understand I don't mean to criticize you, but urge you to take care of your issues first and that way you'll be ready when your friend is finally ready himself to come out.
A couple of things. Without judgment, you'll find that you get better responses if you take the time to write better. Capital letters, paragraphs, that sort of thing. It is hard to follow your post and lots of folks just give up.
Second, explain why you are looking at sites visited on someone else's computer? That isn't a great way to build trust, especially with the closeted.
But most of all, you seem to be struggling with some coming out issues yourself. My advice is that it is better to work those out with gay men with more experience. At this stage, its a bit of the blind leading the blind. Your friend has good reason to be cautious about you. I understand that you wouldn't intentionally hurt him, but how much experience do you really have? Can you be sure that you won't accidentally "out" him before he is ready? Do you know how to keep his confidence? And what if it turns sexual? Do you have any idea what to do?
I hope you understand I don't mean to criticize you, but urge you to take care of your issues first and that way you'll be ready when your friend is finally ready himself to come out.
biguy2738
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If there's anybody's advice or opinion on this site that you ought to take seriously and take into consideration...it's Doc's. I've seen his posts and they always makes good sense. My advice would be to take Doc's advice.
All of the best, be assured that you have our support and you are always welcome to ask for advice in the future. :smile:
I agree with "fortiesfun" (a/k/a Doc).
I would also assert that you should not come out to your friend. I predict that if you come out to him, he will tell your mutual friends and others. And he would not be telling them to deliberately hurt you. In fact, him OUTTING you has very little to do with you. He would be outting you just to see other peoples' reactions. Who's okay with it? Who's not? So, you become his "gay guinea pig" for homophobia. Not cool.
My guess is that you are very attracted to this friend. You happen to find a little dirt on him, and you're using it as a "green light" to try to unzip his jeans. As strong as your feelings are for this guy, it will not compare to all the excess baggage, stress, and sex hang-ups that will surely come after the first hook-up. It's not worth the trouble. Believe me. I had a bi-curious experience with my college roommate, and we took each other (and our girlfriends) through a whole lot of head games.
btw: A quick refresher course on grade school grammar and spelling couldn't hurt either, dude. Remember: "Punctuation" is our friend, too!
I would also assert that you should not come out to your friend. I predict that if you come out to him, he will tell your mutual friends and others. And he would not be telling them to deliberately hurt you. In fact, him OUTTING you has very little to do with you. He would be outting you just to see other peoples' reactions. Who's okay with it? Who's not? So, you become his "gay guinea pig" for homophobia. Not cool.
My guess is that you are very attracted to this friend. You happen to find a little dirt on him, and you're using it as a "green light" to try to unzip his jeans. As strong as your feelings are for this guy, it will not compare to all the excess baggage, stress, and sex hang-ups that will surely come after the first hook-up. It's not worth the trouble. Believe me. I had a bi-curious experience with my college roommate, and we took each other (and our girlfriends) through a whole lot of head games.
btw: A quick refresher course on grade school grammar and spelling couldn't hurt either, dude. Remember: "Punctuation" is our friend, too!
yes ,,and he needs to come to terms with it.as he'll later discover...all closets have glass doors!
OK, so buddy7706 doesn't have the best puctuation, but u figured out the issues. I type fast and don;t proof read, so if you wanna skip my response that's cool.
Anyway buddy7706, as far as calling ur friend gay or you gay (since you seem to be leaning to experiment) or anything else, sounds like u guys are freaking over the labels. So, instead of being so label conscious, just think about that fact that you might like both sexes. That sounds less drastic and final and gives the sound that all sorts of things can happen intead of being pigeon holed.
That being said, so u were on ur friends computer? Because u are best friends u happen to be on his computer? That's cool if it is with him. Some friends are like brothers and share all kinds of stuff. Or were u snooping? That's not so cool.
As for the issue of you feelinng the urge to experiment as well, doing so with ur friend is a 50-50 toss up. With both of you questioning sexual issues, it could explode inn ur faces, especially since ur friend has already maded homphobic comments and insists he's not gay when you brought it up. Then again, if u guys had some conversations where sex doesn't sound like the end of ur lives or it's what ur whole life will revolve around, you guys could be buddies or more than you are. Just because one thing did or didn;t work for someone else here oesn;t mean u'll havfe the same results.
Just be careful and don't push too much. You don;t want to alienate one of ur best friends.
Anyway buddy7706, as far as calling ur friend gay or you gay (since you seem to be leaning to experiment) or anything else, sounds like u guys are freaking over the labels. So, instead of being so label conscious, just think about that fact that you might like both sexes. That sounds less drastic and final and gives the sound that all sorts of things can happen intead of being pigeon holed.
That being said, so u were on ur friends computer? Because u are best friends u happen to be on his computer? That's cool if it is with him. Some friends are like brothers and share all kinds of stuff. Or were u snooping? That's not so cool.
As for the issue of you feelinng the urge to experiment as well, doing so with ur friend is a 50-50 toss up. With both of you questioning sexual issues, it could explode inn ur faces, especially since ur friend has already maded homphobic comments and insists he's not gay when you brought it up. Then again, if u guys had some conversations where sex doesn't sound like the end of ur lives or it's what ur whole life will revolve around, you guys could be buddies or more than you are. Just because one thing did or didn;t work for someone else here oesn;t mean u'll havfe the same results.
Just be careful and don't push too much. You don;t want to alienate one of ur best friends.
great advice from forties & ram, esp about your own sexual interest in the guy.
I'd also recommend getting to know him better. Instead of defining or confronting him (males don't like that as a rule), why not ask him what he feels and thinks? If you are close friends, and you give him an invitation to open up, maybe he will take it. But you have to mean it. Jerk off 100x before you see him, so you can forget about sex and talk. Communication is 90% of a relationship even when you're having sex, and esp when you're not.
I'd also recommend getting to know him better. Instead of defining or confronting him (males don't like that as a rule), why not ask him what he feels and thinks? If you are close friends, and you give him an invitation to open up, maybe he will take it. But you have to mean it. Jerk off 100x before you see him, so you can forget about sex and talk. Communication is 90% of a relationship even when you're having sex, and esp when you're not.
i wasnt snooping it was complete accident he goes on my computer and i go on his ...he just got done using and went into the bathroom to shower and i wanted to visit the same site as him"myspace" so i scrolled down the list to find it back instead of typing it over again.and thats when i saw it ... but then it happended again aweek later...but thanks for the advice and i still dont know what i should do.. cuz hes not so innocent himslef he asked me to have a threesome with a girl i hook up with and me.. so what do you think thats about?? and everytime were drunk or smoking he gets all touchy and trys to wrestle .. he iniates contact basicly ... so that is why im confused... i think were both just too scared cuz were thinking the same exact way u feel me?? i could still use some more adviceeee
Bro, I may not be the best to be giving you advice since I am BI-closeted, but I have had several hot friends over the years who I have thought may be bi or gay. Be patient if you guys are gonna come out to one another it will happen. I have lost one friend who I made a move on and it offended him. So be careful.
Another roommate of mine. we had sex couple times when we were both drunk and still to this day act as if nothing happened. He was drunk and I helped him to his room and he acted as if he was passed out. So I took his shoes off and then got curious and took his pants off(he had no problem positioning himself to where this was easy) I could easily see he had a hard on so one thing led to another. We fucked 2 different times once I was a top and once he was. We had 2 other roommates so we had to be discreet.
Got another metrosexual friend with whom we had a mmf threesome a couple months ago with a chick in Vegas (both of us drunk), we did not touch each other but it seemed as if we both wanted to since we watched each other more than the girl, but neither of us had the balls to make a move.
So if you really want to know there is several ways you could be sly and make a move:1) visit another gay porn site on his computer and leave it in the history, 2)Have the threesome and see what happens, 3) get hard and let him know it when he is wrestling with you, 4) one of the 2 of you get drunk and help one out of his clothes down to undies, 5) Talk him into jacking off watching porn with him, 6) get hard a few times around him and let him know, see if he looks and watches.
I would try any of these before I tried to out each other!!
Another roommate of mine. we had sex couple times when we were both drunk and still to this day act as if nothing happened. He was drunk and I helped him to his room and he acted as if he was passed out. So I took his shoes off and then got curious and took his pants off(he had no problem positioning himself to where this was easy) I could easily see he had a hard on so one thing led to another. We fucked 2 different times once I was a top and once he was. We had 2 other roommates so we had to be discreet.
Got another metrosexual friend with whom we had a mmf threesome a couple months ago with a chick in Vegas (both of us drunk), we did not touch each other but it seemed as if we both wanted to since we watched each other more than the girl, but neither of us had the balls to make a move.
So if you really want to know there is several ways you could be sly and make a move:1) visit another gay porn site on his computer and leave it in the history, 2)Have the threesome and see what happens, 3) get hard and let him know it when he is wrestling with you, 4) one of the 2 of you get drunk and help one out of his clothes down to undies, 5) Talk him into jacking off watching porn with him, 6) get hard a few times around him and let him know, see if he looks and watches.
I would try any of these before I tried to out each other!!
ive tried somethings ... like ill grab my cock pretend i have an itch in the car and i catch him looking...and i know sometimes hell get hard because hell put his hat over his parts or hell bend foward to cover it...and sometimes if he s wrestling me and ill try to punch him he just giggles and just leans on me or puts his head on my shoulder or into my chest...he also has gotten on top of me and ill try to squezz his ribs with my legs but hell just lay his face on my chest and stop a for a little while... heress the problem i think ever since i told him i knew he was gay hes been more distant... the wrestling will only happen wen hes drunk when he used to want to do it every day he would keep score...he also used to text me constantly and now its only on occasions... he even texted me at one point wen hes was sad drunk like crying leaving the bar callin me to get him. I couldnt find him since he had walked for a while before calling me but i told him since he was crying he can talk to me bout it which he did and i told him i loved him like a bro and i got his back if needed anything and he texted me back with i knowww i love you too... BUUUTT i think hes got his gurad up now i think hes goin to act as straight as can be to try to almost convince me that hes not... or i just think hes mad at me cuz i found out i really dont know... maybe hes in denial or just trying to fight it now that its leaked out alil bit but we have never ever even brought that converation up its almost like it never happend ....because even though i know he looks at gay porn... im the only one that knows ...and it will always stay like that but i also think he dont really care about what i said cuz hes never been with a guy and i never told him how i knew soo i think he figures NO PROOF so hes still safe and hes still talking to his grilfriend so that makes him look completely straight ... any way howw do i get him to stop building that wall or just goin back to normal like it used to be before...will this takee time ? or is anyone kinda in the same boat?? MORe advicee pleaasee...
ive tried somethings ... like ill grab my cock pretend i have an itch in the car and i catch him looking...and i know sometimes hell get hard because hell put his hat over his parts or hell bend foward to cover it...and sometimes if he s wrestling me and ill try to punch him he just giggles and just leans on me or puts his head on my shoulder or into my chest...he also has gotten on top of me and ill try to squezz his ribs with my legs but hell just lay his face on my chest and stop a for a little while... heress the problem i think ever since i told him i knew he was gay hes been more distant... the wrestling will only happen wen hes drunk when he used to want to do it every day he would keep score...he also used to text me constantly and now its only on occasions... he even texted me at one point wen hes was sad drunk like crying leaving the bar callin me to get him. I couldnt find him since he had walked for a while before calling me but i told him since he was crying he can talk to me bout it which he did and i told him i loved him like a bro and i got his back if needed anything and he texted me back with i knowww i love you too... BUUUTT i think hes got his gurad up now i think hes goin to act as straight as can be to try to almost convince me that hes not... or i just think hes mad at me cuz i found out i really dont know... maybe hes in denial or just trying to fight it now that its leaked out alil bit but we have never ever even brought that converation up its almost like it never happend ....because even though i know he looks at gay porn... im the only one that knows ...and it will always stay like that but i also think he dont really care about what i said cuz hes never been with a guy and i never told him how i knew soo i think he figures NO PROOF so hes still safe and hes still talking to his grilfriend so that makes him look completely straight ... any way howw do i get him to stop building that wall or just goin back to normal like it used to be before...will this takee time ? or is anyone kinda in the same boat?? MORe advicee pleaasee...
- emu,
ok dude,
take a step back and just chill.
you need to lay off him about this issue. several dudes in this thread have given you some very good advice and I suggest you take it.
Even if you don't confront him on being gay or at least having a curiosity, the fact that you are obsessing about it yourself about yourself as well as about him, you give off a vibe that would make even a random stranger uncomfortable, this obsession is not healthy and creates unintentional and unspoken tension between you and probably anyone you may be interacting with.
Take this thing with a grain of salt and put your feelings into perspective.
is getting your rocks off behind closed doors with this dude worth destroying your freindship with him and possibly destroying your social lives...?
find ways to distract yourself from these sexcual thoughts and try developing a genuine buddy friendship with the dude, stop focusing on the sex aspect and stop trying to read into things. it's great that you know he looks at gay porn, it's great that you can be trusted with that knowledge about him, now show some integrity and respect and be the friend he needs you to be and keep it cool, don't be selfish, don't pressure him, don't destroy yourself by obsession over some fantasy you may have of wanting to be with him, just keep it on the DL and roll with it.
he will come to terms with his issues on his own in his own way and on his own time and it may actually be with you. but you will destroy that opportunity for both of you to have a confidant in coming to terms with your issues if you continue to allow this unspoken tension create that wall that he is building up.
here are some possible reasons why he is building that wall...
1. he is afriad you may unintentionally out him
2. he is having deeper, intense feelings for you and it scares him
3. the whole tension between you, that you are unknowingly bringing on is literally scaring him straight.
so just chill, take it as a priveledge, feel honored that you know certain things about him that he may have even intentionally wanted you to find as a way of passively telling you that he wants you to know this about him because he feels the tension from you right back and needs to be able to confide in you.
metaphor:
there is no need to talk about the sky being blue....just understand how to communicate without words when the sun starts to set.
how to get this thing back to normal:
just act the way you acted before all this crap started happening.
act as if you never stumbled across the gay porn sites and act as if you never told him he was gay when you were drunk. he needs you to be "straight" and needs you to be the way you always have been. just let the past be the past, don't dwell on it, move on and build up the freindship. value him as a brother, show that you can be trusted and he can count on you to understand his situation with out the need to talk about it complete with uncomfortable details and feelings n shit.
just be a friend, don't be a freak.
E
Hmmm, it sounds like you are walking through a field of potential land mines, ready to explode, with just one misstep from you! Obviously, your telling him that you knew that he was gay, a year ago, was a misstep and mistake on your part.
First and foremost, you need to value, respect, and preserve the long-term, close friendship that you two have!
Clearly, on the one hand, your buddy is attracted to men, but, just as clearly, on the other hand, he hasn't come to terms with those feelings that he has, and gotten past his own homophobia and the homophobia of his family, friends and society, at large. If you were to come out to him, you would only be forcing the issue, and you would only scare him and send him running in the opposite direction, far from you, and even deeper into denial and his safe, 100% "straight" cover. No doubt, your buddy is quite conflicted about all this and has more than his share of inner turmoil, below the cool facade. BUT he has to process it in his own good time and not on your time. As a good friend, all you can do is to be there for him, when and if he decides to open up to you about these feelings that he has.
What about you? Have you made connections with other gay or bisexual men online? How about going to a gay club? How old are you? Early 20's? I think that you need to do some exploring and growing on your own, for yourself. You need an outlet for these feelings and desires... One that doesn't involve your buddy, who obviously isn't comfortable or ready to go there. This would definitely help to take your mind off of your buddy and lower the intensity level.
Out of curiosity, when did your buddy suggest this 3-way with a girl that you know? Was this recently, or before you confronted him about being gay? I suppose that since it was his suggestion, you could revisit that and bring it up with him as a possiblity? If the girl would be interested in that at all?! If you did go ahead with that 3-way, your attention and his, would have to be predominanty focused on the girl. We wouldn't want her to get any wrong ideas about the 2 of you! You 2 could have raging hard-ons together and it would only be because of the girl arrousing you...wink, wink! Sounds like a male bonding experience and yet still within the confines of straight dude behavior.
Kind of sad and stupid, that men in our society are so suppressed and homophobic, that they still can't openly express their feelings for other men, whether it be from the heart or the hard-on, or both. Oh, well, enlightenment dawns slowly, if it dawns at all!
First and foremost, you need to value, respect, and preserve the long-term, close friendship that you two have!
Clearly, on the one hand, your buddy is attracted to men, but, just as clearly, on the other hand, he hasn't come to terms with those feelings that he has, and gotten past his own homophobia and the homophobia of his family, friends and society, at large. If you were to come out to him, you would only be forcing the issue, and you would only scare him and send him running in the opposite direction, far from you, and even deeper into denial and his safe, 100% "straight" cover. No doubt, your buddy is quite conflicted about all this and has more than his share of inner turmoil, below the cool facade. BUT he has to process it in his own good time and not on your time. As a good friend, all you can do is to be there for him, when and if he decides to open up to you about these feelings that he has.
What about you? Have you made connections with other gay or bisexual men online? How about going to a gay club? How old are you? Early 20's? I think that you need to do some exploring and growing on your own, for yourself. You need an outlet for these feelings and desires... One that doesn't involve your buddy, who obviously isn't comfortable or ready to go there. This would definitely help to take your mind off of your buddy and lower the intensity level.
Out of curiosity, when did your buddy suggest this 3-way with a girl that you know? Was this recently, or before you confronted him about being gay? I suppose that since it was his suggestion, you could revisit that and bring it up with him as a possiblity? If the girl would be interested in that at all?! If you did go ahead with that 3-way, your attention and his, would have to be predominanty focused on the girl. We wouldn't want her to get any wrong ideas about the 2 of you! You 2 could have raging hard-ons together and it would only be because of the girl arrousing you...wink, wink! Sounds like a male bonding experience and yet still within the confines of straight dude behavior.
Kind of sad and stupid, that men in our society are so suppressed and homophobic, that they still can't openly express their feelings for other men, whether it be from the heart or the hard-on, or both. Oh, well, enlightenment dawns slowly, if it dawns at all!
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