A crossdresser in the ladies washroom??

Discussion in 'Underwear, Clothing, and Appearance Issues' started by jeff black, May 30, 2007.

  1. jeff black

    jeff black <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    A few minutes ago, I read a thread posted by Quite Irate about men who crossdress using the women's washroom. . Click HERE to read the thread.

    Personally, I am a bit concerned about this. Allow me to explain why before you all condemn me as someone who is against cross dressing.:smile:

    There was more to the thread, but what I caught was this. Since he is a cross dresser who looks like a woman, it is easier for him to go to the bathroom in the ladies room rather than spend time explaining why he is in the men's room.

    First, I completely support freedom of expression and being allowed to wear what you want to express how you feel, etc etc. I can see how easy it would be to be a cross dresser and just use the women's bathroom. I get that. What I don't get is why one should be allowed to do this.

    I mean, technically, in the eyes of the government etc, they are considered a man. They have a penis, testicles and so on. This is NOT supposed to turn into a discussion about transexuals/ or being a woman trapped in a man's body. I understand it happens, I am not disputing that. My problem is the fact that allowing men into the ladies room could lead to some sort of issue/attack with women.

    Picture this: A man dresses up as a woman, looks like a woman when he is dressed up. That's fine. Now, to avoid being ridiculed or questioned about his behaviours, he chooses to use the ladies room. It is around 9:00pm at night, and there is only one other woman in the bathroom. Now, the cross dresser turns out to be a rapist, and takes advantage of this woman in the bathroom.

    I know that cross dressers are people and most of them are likely to be good people. However, what's to say that a sexual predator can't have cross dressing fantasies and use them to his advantage in a washroom.

    What bugs me (and this is where the problem will start) is the idea of choice. These men are choosing to dress as members of the opposite sex. Whatever the reason, they conciously put on the clothes and the make up and go out to interact in public. Like I said above, a person is welcome to dress as they wish. However, does that mean they should be allowed to use the woman's washroom?

    As ridiculous as this sounds, is it much different from dressing like a senior citizen so that one can get the early bird special from their local diner?

    Alright, now you can slam me as you see fit... I just wanted to express my thoughts on the subject.

    EDIT: OH, I WANTED TO ADD THIS...IRATE SAID TO ME " IF IT IS AN ISSUE OF SAFETY, DON'T FRET. MOST OF THE WOMEN IN THE BATHROOM COULD TAKE ME EASILY.

    This is cool, I get that it takes alot to look like a woman, but still, it doesn't ease my mind.
     
  2. B_big dirigible

    B_big dirigible New Member

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    The important factor is that he's a rapist. His attire hardly enters into it. He has access to the ladies' room no matter how he's dressed, unless there are guards at the door.
     
  3. jeff black

    jeff black <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    And that is a valid and logical point. However, looking like a woman is going to get him in there with minimal screams and complaints from women.
     
  4. Principessa

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    I may be wrong but the "profile" of a rapist does not include cross dresser. Why? Because many rapists already have such poor self images and reduced senses of masculinity that dressing as a woman even as a lure/ploy to an attack never occurs to them.

    I understand your point I just dont think it has ever been an issue.

     
  5. SpoiledPrincess

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    This situation could only happen in a lonely rest room, so whether he was dressed as a man or a woman wouldn't make that much of a difference. I can imagine that a crossdresser going into a men's room might receive hostility from men who often perceive a crossdresser as automatically gay or would imagine his only reason for using the rest room dressed as a woman would be to invite sexual offers. I'm also not altogether sure that a man going into a lady's room is actually illegal there was a case in England quite a while ago (of which I can't remember the exact details) of a crossdresser who was using the lady's room at work and only prohibited from doing so when a number of women complained.
     
  6. B_big dirigible

    B_big dirigible New Member

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    Do screams and complaints inhibit rapists?

    (I have no idea, seriously.)
     
  7. jeff black

    jeff black <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    If we are going to get technical,:rolleyes: what I am refering to is the idea that if a burly man was to walk into the bathroom, there would be a scream or something from inhabitants of the washroom. However, if someone who looks like a woman were to walk in, the lady/ladies wouldn't pay attention.

    In regards to NJQT's thought about rapists having "poor self images and a reduced senses of masculinity" is probably valid, but unless you have actually been in the head of a rapist, you don't know any better than I do. :rolleyes: Psychologically, yes, they have poor self esteem and a desire to feel manly, but who knows what they are capable of?
     
  8. B_big dirigible

    B_big dirigible New Member

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    Some years ago a bona-fide m-f transsexual-in-process told me that the pre-surgical program involved estrogen treatments, electrolysis treatments to eliminate facial hair, and life as a woman in all respects, including (of course) clothing, a legal name change, and use of the woman's can.

    Whenever I've heard women speak about m-f transsexuals-in-process who they themselves knew and worked with, they always seemed to consider them women. And that would imply little excitement about the facilities.

    Obviously there are other possiblilities lurking in the twilight zone between biological m and f. The above are the only relevant things I happen to know of. In that specific context, it seems to make sense and causes minimal disruption.
     
  9. rob_just_rob

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    IMO - If you can pass, you use the women's washroom. If you can't, you use the men's washroom.

    Otherwise, you're just making the other patrons of the washroom uncomfortable.
     
  10. Ethyl

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    If a cross dresser goes into the ladies' room dressed as a woman, he's going to lock himself inside a stall. I don't see why the other women would be nervous since there's nothing to see. Now if he goes into the men's room dressed as a woman and stands at the urinal, then it might be disconcerting for the other men next to him, at least at first. Overall, I think it's easier for him to use the ladies' room.

    If a man dressed as a woman tries to corner you: 1) Pull the front of his bra and let it snap. 2) Run.
     
  11. jeff black

    jeff black <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    Both interesting points. I was just having trouble wrapping my head around the idea... and I automatically go to the worst possible situation.
     
  12. D_alex8

    D_alex8 Member

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    Somebody's watched one cheap psychological thriller too many. :rolleyes:
    This is real life, not a fucking Michael Caine movie.

    The notion of 'choice' posited within your argument is questionable and incredibly simplistic. Would this be an act of 'choosing' in the same sense that gay men 'choose' to have sexual and romantic relations with other men? And if so, do both groups make their 'choices' simply to aggravate others through their 'failure' to conform to normative behavior?
     
  13. dreamer20

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    What Quite Irate said made pefect sense to me. The best place for him to touch up his make up etc. and avoid being bothered by men would be the ladies room.
     
  14. B_big dirigible

    B_big dirigible New Member

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    The OP implied no such thing.
     
  15. D_alex8

    D_alex8 Member

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    JB wrote: "These men are choosing to dress as members of the opposite sex" in paragraph 8 of the opening post.
     
  16. yongdo

    yongdo New Member

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    At a cafe I regulary go to it is quite common for the men and women to share bathrooms - each going into the other's.

    It's all pretty much all the same stuff going on:

    Mostly number 1s
    Sometimes number 2s (but why not save that until home unless absolutely necessary)
    Hand washing and drying

    Have yet to sexual acts or violent acts such as rape.

    YMMV
     
  17. B_big dirigible

    B_big dirigible New Member

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    Sure. And one day, I can choose to wear my dress with the green sequins, or my dress with the black sequins. Simple free will is all that's implied.
     
  18. Yorkie

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    You just reminded me of the scene in 'Cabaret' where this happens to Michael York.It was certainly disconcerting for him! :smile:
     
  19. rob_just_rob

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    Would a man dressed as a woman want to use a urinal? Wouldn't that destroy the illusion for him?

    Regardless, I do agree that it would be in most cases be easier for him to use the ladies room, due to the stall culture.
     
  20. CPearl

    CPearl New Member

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    What about the woman with androgynous looks who gets chased out of the women's room, mistaken for a man?

    What about the pretty cd who is forced to use the men's room and then sexually assaulted?

    Most importantly, I don't think a 'no cd' rule would deter a violent criminal.
     
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