A different kind of cheating dilemma

[MsThang]

sometimes I think people use their kids as an excuse because they are scared of making a decision

 

[askew]

Sounds like you and her need to sit down and have a long talk about all this. Bring your feelings out into the open and see where she is at also. But having sex just to have sex when you are both not on the same page could really complicate things.

 

[TripHammer]

As far as staying together "for the children":
If you think for one second that your kids don't perceive that you and your wife don't really want to be together, you're fooling yourself. Children pick up on all that energy (or lack thereof), and can without a doubt see that you and your wife are being, above all, dishonest.
What, are you going to stay together until they're in college? As if, at age 18, they'll be able to better handle their parents' divorce somehow? With all the changes that teenagers are forced to go through, you want to add your divorce into it? It's selfish.
If you truly want to be good parents to your kids, you and your wife will be HONEST with each other above all else, because honest is what you should want to teach your kids to be. As it is now, you're teaching them to lie and smile about it.
I have thanked my parents on MANY occasions for getting a divorce when I was two years old rather than lying to me and my sister and themselves by staying together in a relationship that wasn't working.
You're not protecting your children by staying together when it's a lie -- rather, you're damaging them.

 

[monel]

As far as staying together "for the children":
If you think for one second that your kids don't perceive that you and your wife don't really want to be together, you're fooling yourself. Children pick up on all that energy (or lack thereof), and can without a doubt see that you and your wife are being, above all, dishonest.
What, are you going to stay together until they're in college? As if, at age 18, they'll be able to better handle their parents' divorce somehow? With all the changes that teenagers are forced to go through, you want to add your divorce into it? It's selfish.
If you truly want to be good parents to your kids, you and your wife will be HONEST with each other above all else, because honest is what you should want to teach your kids to be. As it is now, you're teaching them to lie and smile about it.
I have thanked my parents on MANY occasions for getting a divorce when I was two years old rather than lying to me and my sister and themselves by staying together in a relationship that wasn't working.
You're not protecting your children by staying together when it's a lie -- rather, you're damaging them.

I appreciate your input, TripHammer. We are not "teaching our kids to lie and smile about it". As I have said we are trying to figure out where we go from here. I would not be willing to stay just for the kids since I think that hurts the kids more. Unless there is a good chance for my wife and I to have the loving relationship a married couple should, then staying together will not be an option. I am not confident that that is possible but we are talking.

 

[ColoradoGuy]

{snip}
I am not prepared to get into all of the reasons my wife and I find ourselves where we do. For one thing it would make for exceedingly tedious reading. Suffice to say that substance of your inquiry palys no part in it.
{snip}

You're right... you would be remiss to try and go into every detail here, but you need to go into every detail somewhere. I think nicenycdick had some great advice:

These are the things you should do, I think:

1. go see a therapist;
2. ask her to go see a therapist;
3. speak to a divorce attorney (the laws vary state-to-state, so don't ask here);
4. be honest with yourself and with her;
5. keep the kids out of it;
6. make a decision between fight or flight quickly;
7. give your decision a good amount of time to take hold...don't waffle;
8. always think of the kids (it is worth repeating.)

Good luck.

The reason why the top two items on his list of "to do's" involve therapy is because it's way too easy for you to launch a question here without providing all of the facts and get feedback. The one thing this community seems to be very good at is responding to others who reach out for advice. However, our feedback is way too easy for all of us to dispense from the comfort of a distant keyboard simply because we don't have the facts.

Even if you think you know what the outcomes of therapy will be, it's an important step in deciding whether to dissolve your relationship or not. And therapy allows you and your wife the best possible option for resolving the situation in a fashion you can both live with and feel good about. To deny her the opportunity to talk about her feelings and to deny you the opportunity to talk about your feelings would be cheat both of you out of some much-needed understanding. As august86 pointed out:

{snip}
I'm sure your marriage, as with many people, is the longest commitment you've ever had to anything/anyone, which is why it is crucial that you do some serious "soul-searching" and introspection before making decisions of this magnitude.
{snip}

Finally, your kids are important as most of the commentators in this Thread have noted. I liked this:

{snip}
As far as staying together "for the children":
If you think for one second that your kids don't perceive that you and your wife don't really want to be together, you're fooling yourself. Children pick up on all that energy (or lack thereof), and can without a doubt see that you and your wife are being, above all, dishonest.
{snip}

TripHammer is right: kids will amaze you at what they pick up. They almost have a sixth sense about relationships, so they will need to be included in the decision at some point -- not as just an item to consider, but as an interested stake-holder to be consulted after you and your wife have made your decision. Again, I would include a therapist to help the conversation unfold and to provide a 'neutral' reference point for the conversation.

A divorce doesn't have to be ugly, expensive or emotionally devastating, but it will be all those things if you can't work out your divorce in partnership with your wife. You and your wife should try everything possible to save your marriage and if you fail, you can both acknowledge that. You're much more likely to have a successful divorce (and I think there is such a thing) if you have a successful process that involves both you and your wife in arriving at the decision to divorce.

Good luck, monel.

 

[monel]

Thank you ColoradoGuy. My initial inquiry was pretty narrow. I have said before that in most of the threads on here where someone is seeking advice, the OP already knows the answer. I think that is the same with me to some degree. I wanted confirmation that, considering the state of my relationship with my wife, I would be misleading her if we were to have sex. I got that confirmation and thank everyone who commented. With regard to the broader state of our relationship, we have, in some form or another, explored many of the "to do's" that have been suggested by members.

 

[D_Ben Twilly]

From where I'm sitting, you're long overdue to discuss this openly and directly with your wife. Communication is only as difficult as you make it, so eliminate the guesswork by coming right out and establishing both of your feelings in plain language. You're husband and wife... it is okay to discuss your sex life and the emotions attached to it. Wondering what it would mean to one another if you were to have sex is high school stuff.

 

[mcstang]

For what it's worth, my situation is somewhat the same. I admitted last month I was bi to my wife, and at that point the sex stopped. We're now seeking people elsewhere for romance, friendship or what not, but we have decided to live together to raise our son-we both want to be active presences in his life. I don't know how well this will work out. She's meeting up with guys, and so am I, since I've sat on these feelings for 30 years and now have the chance to explore the urges I stifled all this time.

Wife said initially she might be open to having sex from time to time, but that quickly went to a 'no way never again'. We sleep in the same bed though, a king size. We are trying so hard to keep our son secure in the idea that mommy and daddy will always be here for him (he's almost 8). My therapist, and hers, are not convinced we can make this work. We can't afford for me to move out and spend money on an apartment and other expenses; my wife doesn't work and thus any attempts to save for our son's college education or home expenses are lost on me living separately.

Point was this: how old are the kids? Are you ready to walk away from being a daily part of their life? Would your wife consider leaving them? It's one thing to try and repair a relationship, but if you feel it cannot be, for whatever reason(s), you have to decide if you can live with the aftermath, and what that will do to your kids. The kids are most important; they look to us for everything and I can't imagine the harm done if you aren't there for them.

I feel for you, I really do. I understand what goes through your mind. My advice: no sex. If it's done, don't treat what was once a loving gesture into meaningless physical action. It will only complicate things further.

 

[RumperRoom]

Come here I will take care of your sexual needs. If she won't eat your ass, kick the bitch to the curb.

 

[ten2ride]

Possibly this is the time when you really should go find yourself a younger women & have a steamy affair. You will get laid & will probably seriously enjoy it, your wife will find out & all hell will break loose, you will break up with the bimbo realizing it will take you several years to learn anough about anyone else to know what you like and don;t like about them, then you will realize you don;t have that many years left in life to try again several more times ar a few years each, and that you already know how to live with your wife. Here's the gamble... She may realize she is seriously fucking up by not keeping you happy, and turn on the charm, and finally figure out that she needs to be a sexual woman with you and keep you happy so in turn you will keep her happy. Then if the two of you can get past the affairs you had while waiting for wifey to wake up, you very possibly will return to each other and be happy.

If it does not work, you will have begun your new life (and depending on what state you live in), a poor man, so whoever you date better know you will be loosing everything in the divorce & better be happy living on the cheap.

Good luck man... I've been there & luckily mine came back together...

 

[ColoradoGuy]

Thank you ColoradoGuy. My initial inquiry was pretty narrow. I have said before that in most of the threads on here where someone is seeking advice, the OP already knows the answer. I think that is the same with me to some degree. I wanted confirmation that, considering the state of my relationship with my wife, I would be misleading her if we were to have sex. I got that confirmation and thank everyone who commented. With regard to the broader state of our relationship, we have, in some form or another, explored many of the "to do's" that have been suggested by members.

Monel: let us know how this resolves. It sounds like you've decided you won't be having sex with your wife -- at least, for the time being -- but beyond that, I know I'd be curious about what eventually happens. I had a relationship years ago that ended badly and I always hope others can avoid making the mistakes I made.

I think a lot of people on here are hoping for the best for you, so keep us posted.

 

[helgaleena]

Monel: let us know how this resolves. It sounds like you've decided you won't be having sex with your wife -- at least, for the time being -- but beyond that, I know I'd be curious about what eventually happens. I had a relationship years ago that ended badly and I always hope others can avoid making the mistakes I made.

I think a lot of people on here are hoping for the best for you, so keep us posted.

Seconded. Some of us are serious about this being a support group, you know. If you feel the need, bounce things off us again.

 

[monel]

Thank you ColoradoGuy, helgaleen and everyone else. Whatever the outcome we are determined to make it as painless for everyone as is possible. In the meantime you are right ColoradoGuy, I do not think sex is a good idea. Even if we were to agree on what it meant to the relationship, actions do speak louder than words and no matter how we may covince ourselves otherwise, in a situation such as this, sex does carry an emotional component. I will update you on the ultimate outcome.

 

[D_Jess_Kilme]

Dear Monel

I hope you and your family are well under the circumstances.

I was in a similar situation after 15 years of marriage, which is now 15 years ago. How time flies.

In my case I decided to stay in the marriage and to make it work. Yes, our children were a significant part of the decision, but more than that was my own realization that divorse would be very destructive towards the woman, my wife. Shortly after we first married she shelved her own (very promising) career to be the home maker in our partnership. As a result she developed on that trajectory while I built a successful career. At that stage her life was defined as being my wife, the mother of our children, the maker of our home. By divorcing she would have lost the entire nexus of her world, and no divorse settlement could compensate for that.

I did not hate her. We did not have fights. We had just grown apart, we had different needs, including specifically my own peculiarities. We were still a reasonably good team albeit without the passion of earlier in our marriage.

I ended up making the call to submit my own needs and desires for the "greater good" of our family. While we never recaptured the magic of the early days, we managed to run a good and satisfying partnership which endures to this day. And I am today glad that we did.

I am reasonably happy, so is she. Our children, friends and family consider ours to be a model and inspirational marriage. Little do they realize how painful it has been at times.

If Imwas faced with the same decision again today, would I do it differently.

No, In the end we made the right decision. Life is not perfect. But it is good - probably better than if we did split up 15 years ago.

We today have a solid partnership with a deep well of respect and caring for each other, and a family that is whole and happy. The only serious downside is that the past 15 years has been largely without sex between us - lots of emotion and tenderness, but no sex.

I am not suggesting that you follow our example. I just want you to know that given the right motivation and effort it can work.

 

[monel]

Thank you Finfoot. We are still together though it has not been easy and I am uncertain where we'll be in another year. There is still much tension and that is probably not good for anyone. It is difficult to decide what is the better option, particularly for the kids. The thought of turning their lives upside down troubles me greatly. At the same time I do not see my relationship with my wife being what it once was or what is should be.

I am glad for you and your family that you were able to find a way to make your marriage work on some level, though I find it sad that it has been largely sexless. I have been living this for the past few months and it is not easy.