Abortion, choice or wrong?

[D_Jurgen Klitgaard]

Wear a condom, practice safe sex, be responsible. I can tell you that here in the south, it's the people that really have no business having kids in the first place getting pregnant. I can't begin to count how many young women in my graduating high school class dropped out before completion because they got pregnant. It wasn't a small amount, that's for sure.

I'm more upset at people not using common fucking sense than getting abortions. Accidents do happen, I understand that. No form of birth control is 100% effective, but it's the people that have no utter business having kids that spread their legs foolheartedly without even trying some form of birth control or condom.

To the women that do get unwanted pregnancies and become responsible and ultimately a good parent, I applaud you. I wish there were more women like you. I knew one girl in my senior class that got pregnant and had the child. She did what she could to be a responsible mother and continued on with her education. Unfortunately she was involved in a life changing car accident and damn near became a vegetable. Last I saw she was completely dependent on her parents. :frown1: But for this one example of good, I see a handful of bad frequenting the local Walmart. If they had been more sexually responsible in the first place they wouldn't be faced with a choice of life or death.

It's a tough choice to make indeed and it's a tough fight in general, but I think it's up to the individual or couple to make that choice. Hopefully what they decide will be what's best for them.

Now in saying that, I will go on and say that I was born when my mother was 21 and I have no idea who my real father is. Kinda tells you and me that I probably wasn't planned. It's not something I think about or worry about, it is what it is. My mom obviously made a choice to keep me, and she's been a wonderful mother at that. She did the best she could to raise me with the help of my grandparents until my now father came along and filled the void I was missing. All in all I think I turned out alright. Brought up with good morals, raised in a good home, and grew up to be a respectful person. My mom made a choice to keep me, and I'm glad she did. She would be my other example of someone overcoming a tough situation to become a good parent.

All I can hope for is people to just use their heads in the first place. Whatever you choose, make sure it's for the best. Sex is not something to rush into without a good head on your shoulders. Every time you engage in it, you take a little gamble. Be safe, be responsible.

 

[Bbucko]

Abortion should be safe, legal and rare.

It's an intensely personal matter between a woman and her doctor.

 

[Sergeant_Torpedo]

No one should have a monopoly on propaganda. Listen to both sides of the argument and make a decision. It isn't morally ambiguous. Bomb babies in Afghanistan and
put medlas on the men that do it (from a safe distance) but don't then go and picket abortion clinics. Termination is terrible but stoneing is sickening also

 

[Ericsson1228d]

I'm anti-abortion because I feel that it is the termination of a life.

 

[blooeyz]

I don't think anyone has the right to tell anyone what to do with their body.
Pregnancy is a personal decision best left to the woman.
For those of you who would deny a woman this right, why don't you go adopt some kids that need homes
While I personally wouldn't want one, I can see how this is could be felt as the right choice for some people.

 

[Rugbypup]

So... what if... a couple get pregnant... she doesn't want the child, but he does.

Do fathers not have an equal say in abortion?

 

[Rugbypup]

What if the father does not want a child with the pregnant woman, but she insists on keeping it?

Does he have the right to say, I have chosen to terminate, you have chosen to keep, all responsibility from here on out is yours, do not ask me for support for a child I chose not to have?

 

[cdarro]

What if the father does not want a child with the pregnant woman, but she insists on keeping it?

Does he have the right to say, I have chosen to terminate, you have chosen to keep, all responsibility from here on out is yours, do not ask me for support for a child I chose not to have?

I think you have a very interesting point. But no one wants to talk about their responsibilities anymore, only their "rights", which seems to mean whatever they think they want that particular day.

 

[B_dxjnorto]

Wrong of course. We were all fetuses once.

 

[D_Jared Padalicki]

It's a right to make that decision, it just depends on how you would feel after it and if you wanna take the risks for not getting pregnant anymore after the procedure.

 

[B_Stronzo]

There is no predetermined right or wrong, they are creations of your own imagination. If you're against abortion, adopt a child. Until then, shut the fuck up.

Singly this response to the OP is the most direct and valid. Hear hear!

BRAVISSIMO

However, this situation is far stickier than you'd like to think. What if you don't believe an unborn baby is merely a part of the woman's "own" body, and is a person in its own right?

I find the endless effort at male dominance over the female anatomy tiresome.

It does NOT MATTER what "you believe". It's her body to do with as she sees fit.

Again;

If YOU don't believe in abortion don't have one... or your opposite sex partner for that matter. You have no right to jurisdiction over what goes on in any woman's body save (possibly) the one you impregnate.

Regardless of whether it is right or wrong, this "my body" argument is sketchy at best, hinging on an important definition on which opposing sides will never agree. I'm sorry, but while it isn't rocket science, you have oversimplified a complex moral issue to the point of indignity.

"definition" be damned... it's none of your business...

It becomes a "moral issue" only to tiresome moralists. Get out of other peoples lives and determinations. Not up to you to make them into mini versions of YOUR 'moral issue' self. This may come as a real surprise but not everyone marches to the same drummer you do.

Your argument is an INFLICTION of your moral take on others.. and a "sketchy" argument at best.

If people who think as you do had a place for all these wee ones you appear to want to litter the planet I might give you ten minutes of time to state your case but invariably you simply want to (on moral grounds of course ) get every fetus onto this planet with no real plan for placement upon arrival.

This topic is so tiresome it defies logic.

We like to think of ourselves as champions of those who cannot stand up for themselves, such as the mentally disabled, the poor, the sick et al. Unborn children could fall into this category depending on your assessment of the situation.

Assess your own situation. Leave others to their own 'moral' dilemma. This falls under the category of MYOB.

 

[houtx48]

I think all men should have opinions on this subject, they sure as hell only have a "small" part in the process.

 

[Rugbypup]

Singly this response to the OP is the most direct and valid. Hear hear!

I find the endless effort at male dominance over the female anatomy tiresome.

It does NOT MATTER what "you believe". It's her body to do with as she sees fit.

Again;

If YOU don't believe in abortion don't have one... or your opposite sex partner for that matter. You have no right to jurisdiction over what goes on in any woman's body save (possibly) the one you impregnate.

If that's so, do men, fathers who do not wish to be fathers, have the choice to 'divorce' the unborn child so that a woman has no claim to expect support after the birth?

If an unborn child is 'her' body and a fathers wishes to terminate are ignored, what right do women have to demand support from men for a child they didn't want and a woman chose to keep?

 

[invisibleman]

If you don't believe in abortion don't have one.

If you don't believe in same sex marriage don't marry someone of the same sex.

This isn't rocket science folks.

However I will say this; relegating the females of our species to back alley butchers (since we ALL know that abortions will be had when needed) is fucking barbaric.

A woman has utter and complete sovereignty over her own body. FULL STOP

I agree. A woman does have a choice over whether she wants the child or not.

I think that religious groups that hang outside of abortion clinics are fucked up.

 

[B_Stronzo]

If that's so, do men, fathers who do not wish to be fathers, have the choice to 'divorce' the unborn child so that a woman has no claim to expect support after the birth?

Fathers who do no want to be fathers should take the proper precautions to insure they not impregnate a woman before they stick it in. All too often the male of the species gets his rocks off and dissociates himself from all responsibility. The Welfare rolls are full of this phenomenon.

Also- I will address the phenomenon of the woman trapping a fellow into the "oh NO! I'm pregnant" ploy to get her need to love something or worse still to bilk the system. This isn't a Betsy Wetsy doll ladies... it's real life. Christ people are thick.

Sex education is key.

If an unborn child is 'her' body and a fathers wishes to terminate are ignored, what right do women have to demand support from men for a child they didn't want and a woman chose to keep?

In my opinion RESPONSIBLE people of both sexes should be prepared before they copulate. But all the while we hear these morons go on about abstinence and no sex education in our schools.

The long and short of this is; were people not slaves to religion and its tenets we'd be a much more evolved and informed society. Note how often the dissenting voices in this endless argument are heterosexual males... even and including this thread.

 

[invisibleman]

If that's so, do men, fathers who do not wish to be fathers, have the choice to 'divorce' the unborn child so that a woman has no claim to expect support after the birth?

A father should support his sires. Man isn't like GOD.



If an unborn child is 'her' body and a father's wishes to terminate are ignored, what right do women have to demand support from men for a child they didn't want and a woman chose to keep?

Women do deserve support from the fathers of their children. He helped create the kid. Use rubbers and a spermicide the next time you fuck a woman.

If you know that you aren't ready for fatherhood, then, don't have unprotected sex with a woman.

 

[Rugbypup]

Unwanted pregnancy seem to be assumed as the actions of either irresponsible fuck happy men or baby on the brain, sperm stealing women.

Issues of stupidity aside.

Hypothetically, if I had a one night stand with a woman, for no other reasons than mutual sex and we took precautions but they failed.

She ended up pregnant and wanted to keep the child for the sake of wanting a baby but I did not want to be a father and wanted a termination.

Where do you stand? Precautions were taken!

I have chosen and acted not to be a father, she has chosen to be a mother... why would she have any right to expect me to support her?

 

[mitchymo]

I think Incognito replied best to this thread.

I don't see abortion as wrong and there needs to be a better education on the subject for the women involved, and not just after conception.

 

[col1974]

I was once very much pro-choice until a member of my family chose to terminate a pregnancy. Termination of pregnancy is the preferred term in the UK amongst healthcare professionals although some Doctors still referr to miscarriages as abortions as well!

After my experience my opinion moved toward the middle ground. I felt very uneasy to begin with that this had happened. As a 19 year old or there abouts I had the typical chauvenistic attitudes but over time and now that I work with pregnant women, I see that no matter what anyone else says, thinks or believes, the right of a woman to choose what happens to her body is fundamental.
Like it or not, and in the UK, the period of viability is considered as at the beginning of the 24th week of gestation. In some parts of the Europe, many fetal screening tests are not offered and terminations of pregnancy are not offered for ANY reason.

Some of the serious fetal anomalies that can occur are:
Anencephaly and Holoprosencephaly. Go look them up. In a world where a woman has no choice - she can deliver these babies not knowing what to expect and be confronted with what the medical profession in it's less-enlightened years would have called "monsters".
I'd agree with a previous poster in that Termination of Pregnancy (abortion) should be legal, safe and rare. Unfortunately the frequency with which they occur is far far too high. The UK teenage woman population is an example of a group where this is too high.
Do we really want a return to backstreet unsafe terminations with a bottle of gin and a knitting needle? I think not.
As commendable as offering adoption services is, a woman's choices should fulfill any of her needs when it comes to reproductive rights. This should include legal terminations and advice and services for women that need contraceptive and sexual health advice.

My personal opinion is that terminations shouldn't be seen as a quick fix or an alternative to contraception, but that they shouldn't be difficult to access so that women make unsafe choices. Being judgemental is not going to make a safe choice an easy choice.

A very basic definition of a competent person in the eyes of healthcare is one that has the facilities to hold and understand information long enough to make a decision, whether we agree that it is the best decision or not.

 

[B_Stronzo]

Hypothetically, if I had a one night stand with a woman, for no other reasons than mutual sex and we took precautions but they failed.

She ended up pregnant and wanted to keep the child for the sake of wanting a baby but I did not want to be a father and wanted a termination.

Where do you stand? Precautions were taken!

One more time with feeling THIS is "where I stand":

If you don't believe in abortion? Don't have one.