Americans know nothing of the world - the evidence

[Calboner]

We're going to invaded Buttkrakistan? Well, it's about time! I've never heard of the place, but you're either with us or you're with the terrorists, and we're just defending ourselves by invading . . . what was the name of that place again?

 

[D_Gunther Snotpole]

FWIW, here's info from the World Tourism Organization about international travel. Note that North America has only about 10.7 percent of international travel. I would assume that more than 9 percent of that represents travel by Americans, leaving about 1 percent for Canadians and a much smaller amount for Mexicans.
Europe, on the other hand, has over 54 percent of the international travel; this has to reflect the fact that a European can in many cases cross an international border by traveling 50 or 100 miles, very different from the geographic reality in North America.

Region 2006 - market share
Europe 54.4%
Northern Europe 6.5
Western Europe 17.7
Central/Eastern Europe 10.8
Southern/Mediterranean Europe 19.5
Asia and the Pacific 19.8
Northeast Asia 11.1%
Southeast Asia 6.4
Oceania 1.2
South Asia 1.0
Americas 16.1
North America 10.7
Caribbean 2.3
Central America 0.8%
South America 2.2
Africa 4.8
North Africa 1.8
Subsaharan Africa 3.0
Middle East 4.9
Source: World Tourism Organization (WTO). Web: www.world-tourism.org

 

[DC_DEEP]

I'm pressed to consider why thought is praised as such. Humans are the most thoughtful animals and seem to be the most discontent. I've never seen a raccoon commit suicide. Thought puts us above AND below the other animals on the planet because 9 out of 10 think erroneously. I could probably ponder this further if you could offer a LM interpretation of what thought is. Thinking seems basic to me so I imagine it could be summed up in a few sentence, by you of all people DC. I mean that in a good way. Break it down for Marley. If not, instead of offering sarcasm for the ignorant notion that thought can be simplified, serve me up some of that DC sarcasm or satire. I've had a rough couple of weeks.

Gee, thanks.

True enough, "thinking" is basic. That still doesn't mean you can't be trained to do it well. Almost everyone "thinks," but not everyone does it correctly.

Consider singing. Most people have the physical apparatus to sing, and most people think they do a fairly decent job of it, with or without training. Lots of people also do it without even really thinking about it. But most people don't have formal training, and most of the people who do receive formal training do, in some way, sing better than people without training. You can learn to better control your breathing, to use better diction, increase your range, to effectively use vibrato.

You can also learn to organize your thoughts, to use logical constructs to develop ideas, make accurate statements and defend them, use various techniques and devices to make comparisons, juxtapose contrary concepts to emphasize, formulate proofs. I can't even really begin to scratch the surface in one long post.

One thing I certainly would NOT have done in my Logic & Philosophy class, would be to present the class with a video clip of some stupid Europeans, then claim that as proof that all Europeans are ignorant. I would have been laughed out of the room. Equally so by stating that possessing a passport makes one superior. (I do, incidentally, have a passport, but never thought of that as something that made me "special," it's just my identification.)

 

[Beauxbatons]

Right... You aren't going over there. Your neighbor's kid is. You're not sending others. Great, no blood on your hands. By the time you get off your butt and learn anything it'll be too late. You will however, get to pay for it with your tax dollars.

So go do something better with your time. It probably involves bitching about $140.00 oil...

[Insert deity/deities of choice here] grant me the strength to change the things I can, the serenity to accept the things I cannot, and the wisdom to know the difference.

The average American citizen has no power in this pretend democracy. If I, for example, become truly unhappy with the state of affairs in this country, about the only recourse I have is to go somewhere else (e.g. back to France, from whence I came). Until that time, all I can do is suffer patiently.

You will notice, I hope, that I'm not bitching about anything. I'm merely being realistic. Whatever this oligarchy that calls itself "our" government decides to do, I'm powerless to stop them.

It seems to me as though we've given up on logic altogether. These rabid anti-American sentiments are so inculcated in certain persons that they tend to take on a fanatical flavor.

 

[marleyisalegend]

Consider singing.

2 free erotic Marley-spankings for giving vocalists a shoutout. I loathe proper technique cuz I'm a baritone and can rarely record myself at an audible level without a mic that cost more than $100. It's much more effective to just wail in a false(read=phony, not falsetto) tenor!!!

One thing I certainly would NOT have done in my Logic & Philosophy class, would be to present the class with a video clip of some stupid Europeans, then claim that as proof that all Europeans are ignorant. I would have been laughed out of the room.

That's because people in an L&P class are using logic. The average person posts with 3% logic 97%sensationalism and emotive response. That's a scientific truthiness.

 

[Beauxbatons]

I'll begin by saying that "Buttkrakistan" is racist, offensive, and only reinforces the negative stereotypes about Americans that have been brought up in this thread. But for a guy who claims to know so much about syllogisms, yours is false, too.

As of 2006, the median American family:

• has no money saved up for retirement.
• still owes 60% of the cost of their primary residence.
• could manage for one month, possibly two, definitely not three if they were to lose their job. (source for this and the above two statements)

Meanwhile,

• the price gasoline, food, and basic utilities continues to escalate.
• the national debt is increasing at the rate of $1.33 billion dollars per day (source), over half of which is directly attributable to an ongoing war in ... you guessed it ... Buttkrakistan. (source)
• As the national debt rises, the value of the dollar drops, which contributes even further to higher prices for goods and services.

By having "no reason to know" what goes on in the rest of the world, Americans were easily duped by unscrupulous leaders. Not just about the military intelligence, which might not have been available even to a better-informed electorate. But they duped us about broader topics such as how receptive their people were to a military intervention (we'd be "greeted as liberators"!), and how easy it is to secure a country the size of Iraq (at most "six months").

Americans who pay no attention to world events are more susceptible to exploitation and pwnage.

Obviously, you've never heard of "playing devil's advocate." To be fair, an argument has to have both sides presented.

I have a question for you: how can "Buttkrakistan" possibly be racist? It is an imaginary place, used for illustrative purposes only, and therefore has no inhabitants against whom to discriminate. Furthermore, surely you realize that "racism" is a myth, as there is only one--the human race. You might have accused me of bigotry or ethnocentrism... however, those charges would be equally unfounded, for the reason given above.

Now, on to the logic... I must protest that my logic is sound. The evidence you have provided is a red herring--it has no bearing on the topic at hand. Even if I were well-versed in the affairs and inner-workings of all 200+ countries in the world, I still would have no savings, a huge mortgage, and be screwed if I lost my job. Meanwhile, my intimate knowledge of international affairs would have no impact upon the skyrocketing cost of commodities, the runaway national debt, or the cluster-fuck that is happening in Iraq. There's simply no logical connection between any of these things and how well-informed the populace is on world events.

When you say that the American people were "duped," you seem to be operating from a faulty premise--that the administration actually gives a damn about what we the people think. Governor Bush (that's right, I said "governor," because that's the only office he was ever legally voted into) has the lowest approval rating in the history of this nation, and it hasn't stopped him from doing exactly what he pleases.

I will not say that the administration didn't mislead, bamboozle, and outright lie to us, because they clearly did. However, the government placates the masses simply because it is expedient to do so. Even if the American people had been 100% against invading Iraq from the word "go," I firmly believe that we would still be exactly where we are right now.

 

[bstexas]

Hey man, no need to be so jealous of Europeans.

But it is true that we have achieved a level of civilisation that allows our people to enjoy life to the fullest.

In our culture, we work to live.

You are still stuck in the 16th century protestant work ethic, which forces you to believe you live to work.


The ultimate goal of civilisation is to have a society in which as many highly educated and healthy people can be as lazy as they want. :biggrin1:

Europe has succeeded.

I've been reading this thread. There is a little truth and a little deception in a lot of the posts. But there are so many generalizations it's nuts. I've been to South America a dozen times and Europe almost as many. Doesn't make me an expert though. Just as the original video post doesn't isn't the almighty God's truth. It is a video capture just like any other sound bite.

OK, what id I say ALL English people have bad teeth and their food is crap? Well, some of you may agree and other's not.

There are many things wrong with this big country and there are many things wrong with MOST countries. But we're not picking on those countries, posting a thread about them, etc.

But at least this is getting us to exchange info, thoughts, charges or whatever. Yes, this site is about big cocks, but having these discussions are good sometimes. I's like having good makeup sex after a fight!

 

[sammywoof]

I really don’t like these attacks on a whole country so lets top being ANTI-American.
We don't tolerate racism, or Homophobia this is no different. This is a forum where people get upset easily!
We all have opinions so why can't we just be constructive in any critisms?
It's also wrong to vilify a whole country just because of the narrow minded minority members of its society. Let’s face it we all have the ‘jerry Springer’ type of people in our towns.
[FONT='Times New Roman','serif'][/FONT] :smile:I like America and the people I have been lucky enough to meet have been interesting well balanced and have become some of my best friends. We have had many heated discussions :tongue: on each other’s country’s short comings. She is so patriotic it’s unbelievable, even though she dislikes Bush she still defends him for his actions taking on Iraq, even though he lied about the WMD’s. But that’s another story. :tongue:[FONT='Times New Roman','serif'][/FONT]
What most surprised me is when my US friend dis-agreed with me on the issue of freedom of speech. In England as the USA we all are free to demonstrate against what we dislike; minority groups that even I dislike do it, e.g. Muslims who want Sharia Law implemented in the UK held a big rally in London some time ago. My US friend said why’d they let them do that? Simple I told her it’s their right – Freedom of Speech! If you believe in that principal then you have to be able to let people who disagree with you voice their opinions no matter how angry it makes you it’s THEIR RIGHT TO DO SO. She still thought it was wrong to let them. But you only have to Look at Zimbabwe for instance...
No one fighting for freedom of speech gets you a dictator. Sadly the only information I have read about in the USA is if you speak out against the majority you’re sworn down, ridiculed for your beliefs, ostracised and most frequently driven into hiding. :redface:
Take the DIXIE CHICKS for instance. The spoke out and said they were ashamed of President Bush came from TEXAS. For that one sentence they were black listed from radio stations, and their CD’s burned and were told on numerous occasions to just ‘Shut UP & SING’. Oh they also had Death threats. The media had a lot to answer for, It was their shit stirring that wound the people up to become so blind to see the full picture, it was frequently the less educated people that were baying for blood, because of their extreme views any sane person had to agree with them or be considered unpatriotic that they did not love the USA. so it escalates and becomes more extreme.
As to those US citizens who don’t have passports, there are many of our people here in the UK and elsewhere in Europe who don’t have one, some of our citizens don’t even know where the US is on a map. I sincerely hope that with the Internet that the peoples of the US read other countries News channels. To assume they don’t would be ignorant on our part. Many of the poorer people in the US can’t afford foreign holidays especially with the exchange rate so bad for them at the moment.
All our countries have flaws, it seems that most people on LPSG pick on the USA because it’s an easy target.
Shame on all of us.

 

[marleyisalegend]

It's like having good makeup sex after a fight!

Except nobody busts a nut. Good analogy though cuz sex is 99.9% selfish, .01% giving a damn about the other party. The people posting here enjoy the internet version of "hearing their own voice" singularly and collectively. The only person who's going to read a 15 paragraph post that starts with "Americans are so dumb" is someone who agrees. If your intent was to communicate with the opposing side, you lost them at the first sentence.

PS People are not (entirely) stupid. We know the difference between discussion and discreet hatred.

 

[mattflanders]

From what I've seen in the United States, a lot of people ARE well informed about the world. They listen to NPR, etc but those people seemed to be the people who weren't yelling the loudest - so to speak - to spread their opinion on things.

And about this passport thing, now every American needs a passport to fly. EU-citizens don't need one to fly, they just need an ID for inside EU-traveling.

 

[marleyisalegend]

Ya know? That baby smoking a cigarette makes a lot of sense. See! Live proof that smoking makes you smarter!

 

[THEDUDEofDestiny]

our country is larger than the EU. stop generalizing about us.

 

[THEDUDEofDestiny]

alisa miller is fat. alisa miller is an american. americans are fat.

 

[Calboner]

I really don’t like these attacks on a whole country so lets top being ANTI-American.

Et cetera.

Does anyone feel like reading a whole long message printed in such tiny type? I'm certainly not going to bother.

Bomb Buttkrakistan!

 

[marleyisalegend]

I saw a Mexican with a buzz cut earlier. Buss cuts are only used the military. All Mexikans are militents.

Damn it feels SO empowaring to be able to create simple truthes based on minimul facts. It's like I'm God, except better!

 

[splitface]

And i am sorry. Although I am a Canadian citizen, I am a Dual citizen still, and I have strong ties to the States. When I am old enough i WILL move back.

Anywho. I still think that the rest of the world likes to blow things ut of proportion, just because it's America. That chick in the vid may have been right, but if similar polls were cast on other nation's news outlets, I am sure that similar results would surface. The only reason things like this happen is because many, many people think Americans are dumb asses everywhere. Yes, there are morons in the States. Tonnes of them. But there will always be people who don't qualify as the sharpest tools in the shed.

Woops. Rant. sorry. '

PEACE

 

[2322]

I don’t think in any strict sense, Jason.
Principalities are ancient as a rule, and Vatican City only came into sovereign existence in 1929.
Sure, the cardinals are ‘princes of the church,’ but in a loose sense.
Principalities call themselves such in their formal names … the Principality of Monaco, of Liechtenstein, etc.
Vatican City calls itself ‘The State of the Vatican City.’
Andorra, Liechtenstein, Monaco … these are principalities. Wales is sometimes called one. Vatican City, no.

The Pope's investiture is still called, "Coronation Day," and he wields the absolute power of a monarch within its confines. That he does this as the will of God, rather than the people or his own initiative, makes him a prince in my book. Still, I find nothing in the Vatican Constitution of 1969 which refers to the pope as prince of Vatican City so I will concede the point. I do take issue with there was no sovereign existence before 1929. The Holy See was only without physical territory for 59 years prior when the Papal States were taken over by Italy. I'd call that period an interregnum.

 

[2322]

So basically, the people with the real skills, power and access don't do anything but engage in Tea Time and Dance Rituals. Where those who are less fortunate have to do the dirty work of others for much less and even less credit.

Oh yeah. That's the definition of Utopia.

Yeah, that's what happens however the less fortunate get the last laugh as soon as the idle beautiful begin to refer to themselves as, 'Eloi.' :biggrin1:

 

[B_johnschlong]

It's an interesting video, to be sure...

However, it (and you) seem to be relying on faulty logic to make your arguments.

Let me start with the "Americans are blind, deaf, and indoctrinated" bit. In the real world, there are no absolutes, and any syllogism whose major premise is "All A are..." is bound to fall apart. Unless you've personally visited with all 250 million of us, you can't possibly know or prove the truth of this statement. Please remember that, from a logical standpoint, all stereotypes are wrong, necessarily and by definition. It sounds to me as though you are the one who is indoctrinated...

Allright, economics, sociology, anthropology, historiography, - these sciences talk about cultures and systems in general. It's ridiculous to say that there isn't such a thing as "American culture" or as "the American" who watches the news, because obviously it exists.

I happen to live in the country that invented "l'homme moyen" and thus social statistics.

So any statements about America's socio-economic system as a whole, can be entirely valid. The scientific methods underlying sociology and social history are pretty strong and well established.

It's the argument of the weak to say that one can't say anything about cultures, societies or states when one hasn't spoken to all the citizens that entity contains.

So once again, I can safely repeat:

-"Americans" (as compared to, e.g. South Koreans or Europeans) get to see crap on TV, they don't know anything about the world, and they score bad on basic education. This has all been researched very well.

Now, on to the video... the implied argument (that Americans should be receiving more international news coverage) is predicated on a faulty premise--namely, that there is in fact something wrong with the news coverage that we in America receive. In formal terms, it would look something like this:
Major Premise: Good news reporting involves a great deal of international news coverage.
Minor Premise: American news reporting does not involve a great deal of international news coverage.
Conclusion: American news reporting is not good news reporting..

No need to try to be professorial here.

Nobody makes a moral judgement here. We can simply see, from the analysis made, that Americans don't know anything of the world.

Because all the possible media that they use to learn about the world, don't show anything about that world.

It's really quite clear cut.


Real professors (not you that is) have counted every single second that Americans could see on TV, on radio, in newspapers, on the internet news banks, and then compared these hard data with what Americans say their sources for news are.

The result is what Alisa Miller shows.

The problem here is that the major premise (which is, by the way, never stated outright, but merely implied) is faulty logic. Why? The simple answer is that it makes perfect sense for the majority of a given country's news to focus upon that country rather than the rest of the world. In other words, we live in America, so we want to know, first and foremost, what's going on in America. That's not to say that international news is not important, because it most assuredly is... however, for those who desire them, there are copious sources of international news at our disposal. Media, like everything else in America, is consumer-driven, which means that the only successful (read: profitable) media outlets are those that provide their customers what they need and want. Socialist rhetoric notwithstanding, capitalism actually works.

Well, nobody is defending any grand system here.

We just look at what Americans get to see, at what they think they see, and can then conclude some basic things, like: Americans don't know anything about the world.

Whether that's a good or a bad thing is another debate.

The fact is, the average American has no reason to know what's happening in Buttkrakistan.

I think some Americans, and most of the world tends to disagree for several reasons:

1. you are the planet's major pain in the ass, because of your populace's ignorance about the world.

2. it is this ignorance that allows a clique of powerful people to treat Americans like crappy idiots who can be sold the most ridiculous lies about the world.

3. which they consequently use to treat you like cannon fodder (I would be quite furious if the people I elect were to treat me like a dumb fuck who can be spat and crapped on like some dirty chunk of worthless meat. -- that's how they treat you, but you don't seem to mind.)

4. after that disastrous war (because all your wars have been disastrous) you get another round of faeces poured over your head, so that you think you have done something good and that you are something special (hence your perpetual kiddie-patriottism).

5. in the meantime, you have slaughtered millions of innocent people (of which you don't know the slightest thing - not a single American, not even your president, knew the difference between Shia, Sunni and Kurds when you started wrecking that country and its people); the world hates you, you have become the pariah of the international scene, and your entire nation is out of touch with reality.

We call it America's autism.

You don't seem to care. And that's why your nation is going down the gutter faster than you can say Walmart.


The Iraq war would be a good example: Americans were treated like shit by their elected congress men and their government, and they didn't give a damn.

They didn't give a damn, not because they didn't care, but because they were ignorant about what was going on, so they even *couldn't* give a damn; they were totally incapable of even beginning to formulate the word "damn". Had Americans known more about reality and the world, they would have protested, and known why. This is already implied when one knows the basics of how this world works.

In the meantime, the rest of the world - more than 4 million people even came out to march - protested against they way Americans received huge amounts of shit over their heads and weren't able to do anything about it.

We didn't merely protest the fact that you elected fascists (twice); we protested because you were being treated like ignorant bums (which you are, but nobody likes to see fellow human beings being humiliated in such a way).



In short, I think some Americans, as well as the rest of the world, thinks it might be a good thing to stay informed about what's going on.

But hey, nobody's going to force you. If you want to see your nation go down like the most stupid and ridiculous empire in history, then go ahead.

I, and many others, think it's not too late for the U.S. to grow up and become an adult nation people and history will think highly of.

It's your call, really.

 

[Swordie]

With grammar and spelling like that, you're DEFINITELY not educated in America. AND that's certainly not the Queen's English...

So, I ask the question one more time - Where are YOU from, JOHNSCHLONG, or are you too embarrassed to say? Who is "we" exactly?