This may seem strange but a friend and I were sitting around the other day and something was mentioned on TV about the Amish and their customs. We got to wondering if they circumsize their males at birth? I figured someone here might know.
Amish circumcision
- Thread starter Mighty Joe
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Knight-7x6
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But there is also no reason for non-Jewish families to have their children circumcised, but they seem to have just followed the trend. Maybe the Amish havent though, they seem more isolated. www.google.com can probably resolve the issue. I don't get why children are Christened at birth if they're not Catholic either...Probably following a trend as well but it just seems unnecessary to me.
- Donk,
If by "christened" you mean baptized (which is the more common term in Protestant churches), the reason is simple: Jesus commanded that his followers be baptized. For Christians of any denomination, baptism is not simply a "trend", it is a sacrament commanded by the founder of the religion as a symbol of the cleansing of sins. Of course, many non-Catholic churches practice "adult" baptism by immersion rather than infant baptism by sprinkling, but many Protestant churches practice infant baptism, and every Christian church has some form of baptism. So baptism/christening is not just a Catholic thing, it is (at least) a Christian thing. (Of course, John the Baptist was a Jew, but I have no idea if baptism is practiced by any modern Jews or any other religion.)
Back on topic, I have no info. on what the Amish do with their penises.
ashlar
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I live in the midsts of amish and menonites, in the middle of nowhere pennsylvania. From what I understand, although it's not been my experience, I've been told that typically men of these groups are uncut. This knowledge has been passed onto me by others who have dated/had intimate relationships with amish partners.
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I would guess that since most of the Amish/Mennonite people stem from Swiss and German heritage, and stick to "old world" customs, that being uncut is probably the norm, although, I'm sure that some of them are cut, but that it's probably few and far between.
As to baptism, it's a sacrament in some churches, an ordinance in others. In "non-conformist" churches which are churches that stem from the anabaptist belief that only people who have confessed their faith as adults should be baptised, we believe that baptism is not a sacrament, but an ordinance. So for churches of Baptist heritage, as well as Disciples of Christ, Church of Christ, Bible Churches, and other churches of the ilk, and the historical Anabapist churches--Mennonite, Amish, Brethren--baptism would not be a sacrament as it is in the mainline Protestant churches or in the Catholic or Episcopal Church.
To further explain the differences here is an explaination from Merriam-Webster and Dictionary.com:
Ordinance:
1 a : a Christian rite (as baptism or the Eucharist) that is believed to have been ordained by Christ and that is held to be a means of divine grace or to be a sign or symbol of a spiritual reality b : a religious rite or observance comparable to a Christian sacrament
An authoritative command or order.
A custom or practice established by long usage.
A Christian rite, especially the Eucharist.
A statute or regulation, especially one enacted by a city government.
Sacrament:
1 a : an authoritative decree or direction : b : a law set forth by a governmental authority; specifically : a municipal regulation
2 : something ordained or decreed by fate or a deity
3 : a prescribed usage, practice, or ceremony
An ordinance is more of a testimony of an action that God has performed in one's life. A Sacrament is a means that God conveys grace.
Ok didn't want to get off on that tangent... But there is a total difference, and being a Baptist, it's a major point of interest to me. BTW, Baptists and the Amish/Mennonites share common Anabaptist heritage--it's how we have lived out things that have greatly varied--obviously--AND, not all Baptists are Southern Baptists. Some of us are Baptists who are in the South, but we are not all of the same mindset as the Southern Baptist Convention. There has been a mass exodus from the SBC because of the extreme views that are espoused.
Just a little Baptist info...
As to baptism, it's a sacrament in some churches, an ordinance in others. In "non-conformist" churches which are churches that stem from the anabaptist belief that only people who have confessed their faith as adults should be baptised, we believe that baptism is not a sacrament, but an ordinance. So for churches of Baptist heritage, as well as Disciples of Christ, Church of Christ, Bible Churches, and other churches of the ilk, and the historical Anabapist churches--Mennonite, Amish, Brethren--baptism would not be a sacrament as it is in the mainline Protestant churches or in the Catholic or Episcopal Church.
To further explain the differences here is an explaination from Merriam-Webster and Dictionary.com:
Ordinance:
1 a : a Christian rite (as baptism or the Eucharist) that is believed to have been ordained by Christ and that is held to be a means of divine grace or to be a sign or symbol of a spiritual reality b : a religious rite or observance comparable to a Christian sacrament
An authoritative command or order.
A custom or practice established by long usage.
A Christian rite, especially the Eucharist.
A statute or regulation, especially one enacted by a city government.
Sacrament:
1 a : an authoritative decree or direction : b : a law set forth by a governmental authority; specifically : a municipal regulation
2 : something ordained or decreed by fate or a deity
3 : a prescribed usage, practice, or ceremony
An ordinance is more of a testimony of an action that God has performed in one's life. A Sacrament is a means that God conveys grace.
Ok didn't want to get off on that tangent... But there is a total difference, and being a Baptist, it's a major point of interest to me. BTW, Baptists and the Amish/Mennonites share common Anabaptist heritage--it's how we have lived out things that have greatly varied--obviously--AND, not all Baptists are Southern Baptists. Some of us are Baptists who are in the South, but we are not all of the same mindset as the Southern Baptist Convention. There has been a mass exodus from the SBC because of the extreme views that are espoused.
Just a little Baptist info...
- jonb,
Actually, the Anabaptist sects are defined by their belief that baptism only counts as an adult. That's how they got their name, because they were going through baptism a second time. (Ana means "again" in Greek.)
Oh, and for future reference, only one denomination (to my knowledge) requires circumcision, the Coptic Church. And they were denounced at the Council of Florence. But there are a myriad of Protestant sects, so I could be wrong.
Oh, and for future reference, only one denomination (to my knowledge) requires circumcision, the Coptic Church. And they were denounced at the Council of Florence. But there are a myriad of Protestant sects, so I could be wrong.
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Regarding the Anabaptists, that's why they felt that the the reformers like Luther, and then Calvin, Zwingli, and the others did not go far enough, because they still allowed pedo-baptism. That's why those religions that feel that baptism is an Ordinance all stem from the Anabaptist line of thought. We all have to be baptized once we make a public profession of faith, usually as an adult, but often as a teenager--sort of like the "coming of age" of a Bar/Bat Mitzvah or Confirmation.
When a person joins a church that baptizes by immersion, they will have to be rebaptized if they were baptized as a child, as that baptism is not recognised as being valid. Taking that even a step further, when a person joins a church of a Pentecostal faith (Church of God, Assembly of God, Pentecostal Holiness) those denominations don't even recognize baptisms from non-Pentecostal denominations.
No Protestant church requires circumcision, only Judaism and Islam and the Copts.
The Coptic (Egyptian) Church was denounced at the Council of Chalcedon regarding the reasons for their fallout with the Roman Church and the Orthodox Churches.
Here is a brief exceprt taken from the Coptic.Net website:
"The Coptic Church has never believed in monophysitism the way it was portrayed in the Council of Chalcedon! In that Council, monophysitism meant believing in one nature. Copts believe that the Lord is perfect in His divinity, and He is perfect in His humanity, but His divinity and His humanity were united in one nature called "the nature of the incarnate word", which was reiterated by Saint Cyril of Alexandria. Copts, thus, believe in two natures "human" and "divine" that are united in one "without mingling, without confusion, and without alteration" (from the declaration of faith at the end of the Coptic divine liturgy). These two natures "did not separate for a moment or the twinkling of an eye" (also from the declaration of faith at the end of the Coptic divine liturgy). "
When a person joins a church that baptizes by immersion, they will have to be rebaptized if they were baptized as a child, as that baptism is not recognised as being valid. Taking that even a step further, when a person joins a church of a Pentecostal faith (Church of God, Assembly of God, Pentecostal Holiness) those denominations don't even recognize baptisms from non-Pentecostal denominations.
No Protestant church requires circumcision, only Judaism and Islam and the Copts.
The Coptic (Egyptian) Church was denounced at the Council of Chalcedon regarding the reasons for their fallout with the Roman Church and the Orthodox Churches.
Here is a brief exceprt taken from the Coptic.Net website:
"The Coptic Church has never believed in monophysitism the way it was portrayed in the Council of Chalcedon! In that Council, monophysitism meant believing in one nature. Copts believe that the Lord is perfect in His divinity, and He is perfect in His humanity, but His divinity and His humanity were united in one nature called "the nature of the incarnate word", which was reiterated by Saint Cyril of Alexandria. Copts, thus, believe in two natures "human" and "divine" that are united in one "without mingling, without confusion, and without alteration" (from the declaration of faith at the end of the Coptic divine liturgy). These two natures "did not separate for a moment or the twinkling of an eye" (also from the declaration of faith at the end of the Coptic divine liturgy). "
Knight-7x6
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No I meant people who are Christened Protestant but that's as for as their religion goes, a lot of people here are like that, including myself.
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We do the same sort of thing--babies are "dedicated" which is what we call our blessing, it's a prayer and annointing of the child, and a prayer for the parents, too, that the child will be raised in a Christian home, and eventually make a public profession of his or her faith in Jesus as Lord and Savior, and will be baptized following that profession. It's very different from Christening or Baptism of an infant. At my church, our pastor does the blessing, assisted by one of the deacons, in other churches, just the pastor does it...it can vary, but the pastor is always the one who does it, sometimes assisted by an elder or deacon, sometimes not, sometimes assisted by other clergy on staff, sometimes not.
My pastor always makes it clear in his little talk about what a baby dedication is that it is very different from Christening or baptism, and that a blessing in no way imparts any kind of salvific power on the baby. People do get confused and wonder why we as Baptists bless and dedicate babies, but then require people to be baptized all over again as adults--then we have to go into this long explanation that the baby was never baptized, so no one was being rebaptized. Ah, it's so confusing LOL.
My pastor always makes it clear in his little talk about what a baby dedication is that it is very different from Christening or baptism, and that a blessing in no way imparts any kind of salvific power on the baby. People do get confused and wonder why we as Baptists bless and dedicate babies, but then require people to be baptized all over again as adults--then we have to go into this long explanation that the baby was never baptized, so no one was being rebaptized. Ah, it's so confusing LOL.
As someone who has participated as a healthcare provider to Amish families, including newborns, each family decides upon the circumsision individually, and many of them do circumcise. It has more to do w/ variances per regions of the US more than general Amish customs. Meaning there's more circumsision in areas where it is generally practiced more, even among the non-Amish.
