are fairy tales a crime against feminism?

Discussion in 'Women's Issues' started by dolfette, Sep 9, 2011.

  1. dolfette

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    1, all the girl need do is be pretty for a prince to fall hopelessly in love with her. all her value, all is affection, is based upon her looks.
    2, she wins by being helpless, naive and waiting for a man to save her.
    3, sexual assault is shown as romantic. often the girl is unconscious when the prince kisses her. this assault 'awakens' her and she instantly loves the man who assaults her.
    4, they encourage the belief that meeting mr right fix all your problems. ''he fell instantly in love with her and they lived happily ever after''.
    5, the girls have no goals or aspirations other than marrying a man of sufficiently high status.

    *waits to be told she's being a silly, silly woman*
     
  2. fun21

    fun21 New Member

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    Whoa, whoa, whoa. Not all girls are like that in fairy tales! Some of them are very intelligent and assertive. Some of them have lots of power and influence and make very strong characters. I am of course speaking of the evil stepmothers and queens that plague the stories. Not only do these stories encourage docility in women, but they also discourage empowered women by casting them as evil corrupt characters.

    Over the course of about 100 years, from the Victorian era to the 80s and 90s female characters have made huge bounds in what a little girl can look up to in a book. Every era has its own morals and values that tend to get immortalized the literature. The same goes for racial prejudices as much as gender roles. I'm sure people will being saying 'tisk tisk' to the things we write now in about 100 years time.
     
  3. dolfette

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    6,
    good addition.
     
  4. dolfette

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    i remember the first time i heard ''the paperbag princess''.
    The Paper Bag Princess - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    i absolutely loved it! it appealed far more than the traditional tales i had been read. in 100 years they will slate her for attacking endangered reptiles :cool:
     
  5. D_Sam Rockswell

    D_Sam Rockswell New Member

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    I dunno....i might have to go ahead an say...yes? And thats my final answer :) Naw i'm kidding. They are, and i've seen the damage first hand. The sheer amount of disappointment from these stories last generations long.
     
  6. D_ Jack_Soffalotte

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    They are a product of the times they were written in I guess. If I ever have a daughter I plan to be careful about what I read to her.

    Have you ever read Angela Carter?
     
  7. dolfette

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    truth. it might look harmless on the surface, but we read these to toddlers and upwards. that drip feed of ideals, constantly, from such an early age must help shape young minds.

    7, good girls kiss ugly, slimy frogs and stay true to bullying, kidnapping beasts.
     
  8. dolfette

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    never heard of her.
     
  9. D_ Jack_Soffalotte

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    She was a post-war feminist writer. If you like fairy stories, but don't like the gender stereotypes, you might find her interesting. Think Virginia Woolf meets Brothers Grimm.

    From Amazon UK:

    Once upon a time fairy tales weren't meant just for children, and neither is Angela Carter's Book of Fairy Tales. This stunning collection contains lyrical tales, bloody tales and hilariously funny and ripely bawdy stories from countries all around the world- from the Arctic to Asia - and no dippy princesses or soppy fairies. Instead, we have pretty maids and old crones; crafty women and bad girls; enchantresses and midwives; rascal aunts and odd sisters. This fabulous celebration of strong minds, low cunning, black arts and dirty tricks could only have been collected by the unique and much- missed Angela Carter. Illustrated throughout with original woodcuts.
     
    #9 D_ Jack_Soffalotte, Sep 9, 2011
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2011
  10. ManlyBanisters

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    I agree - Angela Carter is well worth reading. Read Heroes and Villians for a post-apocalyptic retelling of a Wuthering Heights type tale, too.

    Fairy tales do, generally suck in the gender equality department. I'm much more into the older myths - there are some strong female characters in the likes of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. And if you can sort through the wishy-washy 'romantic' retellings of the Arthurian legends there's some great stories in there too. Those were my favourites when I was a kid.
     
  11. vibrationzzz

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    And what is it when the princess kisses the ugly green frog? Or Cinderella battles against her evil step sisters... Or Snow White and the little guys, battling against the evil Queen and her bad apples? Or Little Red outsmarts the wolfman...

    Fairy tales are for everyones personal interpretation. Why do they call them Fairy Tales?
     
    #11 vibrationzzz, Sep 9, 2011
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2011
  12. VernalTiger

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    I blame some of it on the Disneyfication of fairy tales. Disney's loose adaptations tend to push the happy-ever-after line too hard, and will conveniently erase any pesky sour endings.

    Another good compilation is Clarissa Pinkola Esté's Women who run with the wolves. From memory, she collated as many 'old' versions of the popular fairy tales as possible - speaking to old storytellers and consulting old manuscripts in an effort to compile the most "authentic" version of the old tales - which were dark as fuck.
     
  13. dolfette

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    kissing frogs for toys, like pg rated prostitution. and then she falls in love with this creepy git who tries to buy sexual favours from obviously repulsed young women, just because he turns out to be quite good looking.

    cinders... an older woman makes her look pretty so that some prince will come along and rescue her.

    snow white is saved by the queen's henchman, then runs away and hides until a prince saves her.

    red ridinghood was saved by a big, brave man with an axe.
     
  14. dolfette

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    absolutely true.
    these disneyfied versions are now the norm.
     
  15. ManlyBanisters

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    Cinderella does not battle against her step-sisters - she does as she is told. Snow White does not battle the Queen - she runs away (because a man tells her to). Little Red does not out-smart the wolf - in some versions she is eaten (raped) and in other she narrowly avoids being eaten (raped) because the wood-cutter intervenes and saves her. I think dolfette explained the frog=John situation.
     
  16. dolfette

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    8, obedience. cinders scrubs floors when she is told to. beauty agrees to her father giving her away to some monster.
     
  17. sykray

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    These stories originated from a time when women were chattels (possessions) belonging to fathers, parents and eventually husbands.
    It is true that they do not empower women and i have always hated the idea of "They got married and lived happily after". Forming a committed relationship is the beginning of an ongoing process of sorting out each other's emotional baggage and maintaining a good quality relationship. It's hard work though worthwhile if you do it.
    A further problem with fairy stories is that we have cosmeticised them (not just Disney but that is a notable culprit).
    In the original story of Cinderella, for example, once she is a princess she makes her ugly step-sisters and step mother dance at her wedding. She has the palace servants heat up three pairs of red-hot iron shoes and these are fitted to the three women who enslaved and oppressed her and they dance until their feet are burnt off - and in some versions until they die of pain, shock and exhaustion.
     
  18. B_Nia88

    B_Nia88 New Member

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    Fairy tales are beautiful stories about traditional gender roles. Thank god they haven't been destroyed by feminists
     
  19. dolfette

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    violence, revenge and torture. what a delightful girl.
    but at least she's pretty.
     
  20. dolfette

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    in fairy tale land you'd have stayed wearing trousers and married woman.
     
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