Are foreign workers taking your jobs?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by dolf250, Mar 11, 2007.

  1. dolf250

    dolf250 New Member

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    I was reading a thread on social security and started with this reply until I decided it needed a thread of its own. I get very worked up and pissed off, so please bear with my ranting.

    Both the U.S and Canada have very little manufacturing base anymore because jobs get shipped overseas because people there will work for a few dollars a day. The only thing that Canada had going for it was that we did not have to compete with them for jobs building our highways, oil refineries, or jobs at Canadian tire... until recently. Now we issue work permits and there is a huge number of immigrant workers (in Alberta) who are building the plants and we are competing against them for wages and jobs. These were among the highest paying jobs out there for us (especially if you did not have a university education.) The companies needed the workers to get things built and the workers demanded fair compensation to move their families to a new city and work 12 hour shifts in Canada's North.

    Our new premier in his speech last week outlined that despite having a 7 billion dollar surplus we would receive none of it in tax relief as the increased number of people moving here has put stress on our infrastructure and the money needed to be spent there. In his NEXT sentence he promised to make it easier for companies to import labour from other countries. Apparently these people do not need infrastructure to be built for them. Why the fuck should I have to compete with a Cuban or Somalian for my job? They can come here, live in camp for 2 years, have everything provided , make 20 dollars a day and return to their native country a very rich man. I can't live on that wage so I loose out to them. In case you are thinking I am bitter and unemployed, I am gainfully employed and making a good wage (for now.)

    For now there are very few rules governing the use of imported labour. They do not need to pay them a fair wage (putting it into law that they are paid the same as the trade union rate would go a long ways towards leveling the field- then the companies would not gain a huge economic advantage useing them.) There are not many rules that bennifit them directly either. As I understand it they can't change employers. As you can imagine this amounts to many companies treating them very poorly- somewhat like slave labour. You want a good paying job- then do what we say and don't complain!.

    The companies in Fort McMurray have laid off construction labour as the plants get done. Any guess as to the nationality of the first people laid off? Yes, CANADIANS. They keep their imported labour and lay us off because they can. This means that while the companies rake in the savings we are stuck paying Unemployment insurance for Canadians who would otherwise still be working. And this crap about a labour shortage? The electrical union has nearly 1500 men on it books who are presently unemployed and seeking work.

    Bring in another immigrant worker and put another one of us out of work or at least ensure that you can drive down wages. It is brilliant.

    Anyhow, I am pissed off and need to stop for now.
     
  2. Hatched69

    Hatched69 Member

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    Seems the problem isn't localised to the US. What chaps my ass so much is that the foreign workers (I'm referring to the ILLEGAL ones) DON'T pay taxes, DON'T appreciate the country they live in :mad: (see Michelle Malkin: THE AMERICAN FLAG COMES SECOND for details.) DON'T receive the same swift punishment as a LEGAL citizen for committing a crime (oooh, deportation....so they can try again...) , but can draw from our benefit pool, receive food free of charge, lodging free of charge and get preferential health care. It's bullshit!! Then to hear complaints of "unequal treatment" while ILLEGALLY residing in the country my forefathers fought and died for?!?! More BS! Now, if these SAME folks came to the US via LEGAL means, there'd likely not be the argument there is right now, but the government is so wrapped up in the "War On Terror" that they're turning away from other more important issues. It boils down to my tax $$ and savings going towards funding illegal aliens so they can have a decent life. I don't begrudge anyone the chance at a "better life", but have the decency to realize things need to be done LEGALLY and RESPECTFULLY!! I am tired of being treated as "second-rate" in the very country I was born in. There's more to this, but, like you, I am getting PO'd. :mad: :rolleyes:
     
  3. Mr. Snakey

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    Yes Key word ILLEGAL..........:mad:
     
  4. Hatched69

    Hatched69 Member

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    EXACTLY the point I was making. :smile:
    Thanks!
     
  5. Dave NoCal

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    Colorado has gotten really tough on undocumented workers and now the crops aren't getting picked. They are considering having prisoners do it. If INS actually rounded all of these people up and deported them, we would have nothing to eat. They work the fields and the slaughterhouses.
     
  6. transformer_99

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    This bothers me less than the failure's of NAFTA, Capitalism denegrating Communism and then turning to that very communist labor model for virtually everything sold in the USA being made in China.

    Not long ago, we were facing a port deal with Dubai, now Haliburton is moving it's HQ there. F*cking Bush-Cheney !

    "http://money.excite.com/jsp/nw/nwdt_rt_top.jsp?news_id=ap-d8nqad203&"
    "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubai_Ports_World_controversy"

    Our leadership sells America out every chance they get. Those factory jobs in Mexico that were supposed to be NAFTA successes, those same workers can cross the border and make more stocking shelves and cleaning Wal-Marts.
     
  7. viking1

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    You guys have hit the nail dead on the head. Oh boy, don't get me started.
    I get furious when I think of whats being do to the working people now.
     
  8. Hatched69

    Hatched69 Member

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    NAFTA was signed into being by William Jefferson Clinton, so some of the blame should rest on his shoulders, not just Bush's. Not that I have much love for Bush, but Clinton isn't "squeaky clean" in this mess. No doubt the other countries got the better end of the deal and the US is left with the barn door open.
     
  9. transformer_99

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    "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Free_Trade_Agreement"

    Actually Daddy Bush and his administration had this one cooked up and signed off on before Clinton took oath, it was an inheritance like most President's get walking thru the door.
     
  10. SpeedoGuy

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    Consumers in the U.S. and many places elsewhere have made it abundantly clear they value low prices on goods above all other considerations. To satisfy that demand, industry (frequently with the tacit approval of government) continually exploits new sources of cheap labor: robotics or automation, illegal immigrants, offshore sweatshops, etc. Its all about lowering labor costs, by hook or by crook.
     
  11. dolf250

    dolf250 New Member

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    Yes, you have the illegal immigrant problem, but we now have a legal immigrant problem. If they were immigrating permanent I have very little problem. They would need to move here, bear the costs of raising a family here and they would be contributing in all ways to society. The immigrants are granted 2 year work cards and the only people truly benefiting from this is the large companies.

    The huge difference between Canada's legal immigrant problem and Americas illegal immigrant problem is that in almost all cases the illegal immigrants are taking the lowest paying jobs- they are not taking the jobs that people currently are paid $20 and hour or more to fill.

    The rest is pretty much the same except that the U.S. Is actively discouraging illegal immigration (no matter how little they are doing about it) and Canada is actively encouraging what should be illegal immigration.

    Again, I am not against immigration nor people looking for better lives here; but I hate that their families continue to live in their native countries and they send the cash away and will return to their native countries in a couple of years. (yes they pay taxes, but earning less than a Canadian worker they pay far less tax. If you don't pay tax on the first $9000 of your income and you make $18000 then you are paying half as much as somebody making $27000 and you are using just as much.)
     
  12. rawbone8

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    They decided to do something decisive coz we don't have enough billonaires here in North America. And China. And Mexico.

    When there are more billionaires the world is a better place. :rolleyes:

    For billionaires.
     
  13. highlander4life

    highlander4life New Member

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    To dolf250. I'm not sure if you're aware of the immigration laws in Canada (same goes for States), but in order for a company to get foreign workers they have to have some really good reason to do so, education, experience etc. You can find out more in the Human Resources and Skills Development Canada website. One of my best friends works as a director for the foreign workers program, in the policy department.

    I happen to be a foreign worker myself, and the process of getting a work visa is very long and unless you have really good credentials and something that makes you unique in comparison to other Canadian citizens, the chances of getting a work visa are really slim. I for one happen to have something that not many people have not just Canadian but other nationalities, good education, and a great experience in financial systems, as well as speaking many different languages which makes me pretty much invaluable, but I still had to go through the lengthy process which sometimes can be very frustrating too. For example this year I couldn't go home for Christmas as my passport was with the consulate in process of my work visa and it took them not more than 4 months to process it!!!

    With regards to taxes, I pay taxes and I happen to be in the highest tax bracket, due to my high income. But, for up to 25,000$ which is considered low income family you pay very little to no tax at all, depending on your expenses and family and kids etc., again depends from the province (for example in Quebec you get a tax break up to a certain amount plus a bonus for each kid). I'm not so sure why you're so bitter when all of the work in Canada is done in a legal way and as I said, in order to get a work visa you have to have some really good background and experience in a particular field that you're applying for.

    Maybe the immigration should do what they did with medical profession in Canada by monopolizing it. A doctor coming from Europe, even countries like, Switzerland for example where medical education is superior to many countries including Canada, cannot practice medical profession as a doctor, has to start as a nurse or similar and after many years and many exams might, just might be able to get to the doctor level.

    I for one don't get bitter when my tax money is going to keep some of the Canadians and Native Americans of the street, most of them (in Canada) are on the street simply by choice, because Canada has one of the best social systems after Scandinavian countries.

    Whatever is legal I don't have a problem with. After all it was made legal for a good reason.
     
  14. Heather LouAnna

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    There's that whole rumor thing that if you want support on your computer, you're going to be talking to someone from India. It's a rather outdated assumption, :rolleyes: especially if you paid money for a higher contract. Everytime my phone rings at work, someone paid $70 to talk to me. I'm not worried about losing my job at all to foreigners or aliens.
     
  15. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    I AM a foriegn worker. So fuck you... Korean person whose job I am taking. There are several hundred thousand of your friends currently living in and near my hometown of Centreville so I don't feel too bad about it. There aren't nearly that many Americans here.
     
  16. Full_Phil

    Full_Phil New Member

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    Both the Dem's and the Rep's get that the above is true, hence NAFTA on Bill's watch, and no real outrage now. Jobs are removed/replaced when they no longer fit in the equation of the economy we have. The balance between how many jobs we keep and how many we do away with is as complicated as the Fed slotting interest rates, although both are basically determined by the global marketplace. Socialist countries have attempted to artificially peg labor rates, and have always failed regardless of their good intentions. I temporarily live in a town that lost its main industry. Many fine hard working people who deserved to continue to do their jobs were put out of work because the company would never have survived if it had met local wage requirements (not "demands", just "needs" to get a living wage). Foreign workers are pricing themselves into the jobs that are available, and as unfair as that is, it is the natural result of natural selection.
     
  17. D_Garmanswait Glassnads

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    It's the same in the UK, luckily I live up north where there is less competition. The north has a large asian population but they've been here for nearly half a century. The south has alot of people heading to towns where they can commute to london, alot of people from eastern europe and africa have moved over.

    At the moment I'm ok though because I'm in full time education but sooner or later this problem might effect me.
     
  18. D_Humper E Bogart

    D_Humper E Bogart New Member

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    Heck, I need GCSEs to pick garbage!
     
  19. shuerte

    shuerte New Member

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    that means the US will be more and more lagging behind their european counterparts culturally(many immigrants are not equipped with a good educational background and even they are, they are often the most snobbish in their social class.)
     
  20. Matthew

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    I find that highly suspect, but even if it were true, there are plenty of immigration issues in Europe as well as the U.S. - it seems to me immigration puts them on a similar playing field, rather than disadvantaging the U.S. And, if it's education quality and snobbishness we're worried about, we've got plenty of work to do among native-born americans.
     
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