at LPSG do "manners" count?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by B_Stronzo, Jul 16, 2006.

  1. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    I've been watching a volley between three posters which appears to suggest by two of them that manners per se are nothing more than a manifestation of socialization and in fact "veil" (dare I say?) the real viciousness we all must (by nature) feel inherently.

    I've stated during my nine months here that I've enjoyed particularly two posters from whom I've attempted to learn much. One was our now-departed "EnglishGentleman" who's sorely missed by this poster. The other is "dong20" (another fine English fellow) who shares his countryman's ability to state his case with eloquence and considered verbiage which (without rancor) is able to convey his emotion beautifully.

    Admittedly I'm a "Yank" in my "take no prisoners" approach often.

    However I got a lovely pm late last night on this board from a valued friend who said, and I quote:

    I asked this friend kindly not to (especially since I knew the idea was facetious) but appreciated the intended sentiment entirely.


    My point in beginning this thread is:

    Should there be a standard for how one person's methodology in posting is interpreted over another's? Certainly I see conviction and a resolute stance in nearly everything my good friend madame_zora writes. But I think there's much to be said for dong20's reasoned approach too. But lately I've seen the more considered in our ranks being accused of being ingenuine since they attempt to maintain a level of civility.

    I'll go a bit further to say that the very last thing I see d20 doing is "veiling his emotions" to remain civil. I believe he is civil. And I'm quite sure were I to meet him in front of Liberty's in London he'd be as charming as he appears on this board. I defy anyone on this board to show me where he's ever "torn anyone a new arse-hole".

    Personally I'd like to learn a bit from his reserve and I take personal issue with anyone who says the more thoughtful and considered posters among us have an "agenda" since they don't do as I do often and 'tear them a new arse-hole'.

    So - No. I don't think there's anything veiled in considerate and kind behavior. I'll go on to add that I think we can all learn a bit from it too given that the board's been in a bit of an "us and them" funk lately and I'm as much a part of the problem as I am the solution.

    As our good friend Lex says we're lucky to have the place so I'm interested in seeing how everyone values their membership here.

    So here's my feeble attempt at solution.

    Thanks for reading,

    Stronzo
     
  2. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    I personally find all the different styles on the board make it a very interesting place.

    Yes manners do count however for me I think they have to be earned like respect.

    Having been a member for only a few weeks I am only just starting to understand the characters of some of the regular posters such as yourself Stronzo. What some might see an an attack I prefer to see as a reality check.
    It's healthy to be challenged on your own opinions as surely that is how we learn and develop ourselves.

    Why try and change? Are you comfortable with your style of posting? If you are then fine don't change it.
     
  3. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    http://www.lpsg.org/et-cetera-et-cetera/30535-want-answers.html, option "V".

    But seriously... It's option "U" - it always is.

    {{Stronzo}}}

    I read somewhere that a gentleman is "a man who never hurts anybody by accident". When somebody needs to be "torn a new arsehole", a gentleman will step up and do it.

    But I think in our culture we tend to use verbal abuse as a first, rather than last, resort.
     
  4. naughty

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    Workin' up a good pot of mad!
    Ooooh Hickboy,

    Are you sure you want to use that sort of terminology with this crowd? They might suddenly think finding a gentleman is a very good thing! LOL!







     
  5. Nelly Gay

    Nelly Gay New Member

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    Other web-sites (that shall remain nameless) can be much more hostile with open homophobia, racism, ageism, ad nausea.
    A lot of posters would not dream of being so aggressive in a face-to-face situation...
    Sadly, such web-sites tend to lose members at a rate of knots leaving only the hard-core afficinados.
     
  6. yhtang

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    I would say that being civil to each other is a reflection of one's value one puts on one's self respect.

    As Daverock said, "...all the different styles on the board make it a very interesting place..." and I agree with him. If a poster is abusive, perhaps the best thing to do is to ignore that post. Should this continue, perhaps it would be time for the moderators to step in to do something.

    While I respect the freedom of speech, this freedom is not unconditional. I believe it is up to the moderators to decide and determine the quality of this site. After that, it would be up to us to decide if this place is suitable for us.

    My two cent's worth.
     
  7. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree? Sex
    manners?! but we have enormous penises!
     
  8. dongalong

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    I find you and madame_zora have a similar approach - sometimes I can hear you shouting through my screen! Sometimes your emotions dominate the message that you are trying to get accross.
    I have to use a dictionary or thesaurus to understand the sense of some messages because of the rarely used words you use to convey them. I think that your vocabulary is too well developed for the average person on this site.

    dong20's posts use basic language to consicely get the message accross in the most succinct manner. I have no doubt what he means after a post.

    I believe my upbringing in Yorkshire taught me to have an even more direct approach. (Yorkshiremen have a reputation for being blunt and to the point)
     
  9. rawbone8

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    I agree with Madam Zora that respect is earned on merit, however I think in the general exchange of ideas a modicum of respect should be present, as in real life. Politeness in itself means nothing. It's a veneer that can mean anything and seldom what is literally spoken. It greases the wheels in our social contract.

    Disagreements are the heart of discussion and debate and occasionally lead to flaming. FLAMING erodes any real communication. But it can be very amusing since that's what many come here to enjoy — drama. Childish drama, not so much. It gets tedious. But it is ultimately harmless cuz it never comes to fisticuffs, knifings, shootings, rape, flaying, disembowelment, garrotting, castration or any of the gruesome outcomes possible in real life. :wink:

    Blood may boil and feelings will get hurt. We are adults and should be able to handle it.

    Stronzo, you have a lot of thoughtful offerings, are clearly passionate about issues that concern you, and are well above average intelligence. But your ego (as viewed in this forum, which is not admittingly not real life) appears so huge it prevents me from seeing you as truly open minded. There is an ugly side to you that slips out when you descend to name calling and insults that seems really childish and ultimately diminishes you and your argument.

    Now you can tell me to please fuck off. :biggrin1: I'm torn about you stronzo

    PS Canadians seem laughably polite like our cousins in the UK.
     
  10. Nelly Gay

    Nelly Gay New Member

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    Pray, what use is an enormous donger when you do not know which knife is the fish knife, Sir ?!!
     
  11. AlteredEgo

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    In my opinion, manners are for when you mean them. I detest insincerety more than rudeness. Rudeness bothers me not because it's rude, but because I don't want the person to feel that way. However, once I see how they feel, I can easily make peace with their feelings and either leave them alone, or try to sway them. Or antagonize them. I am admittedly antagonistic under certain circumstances.
     
  12. Pecker

    Pecker Retired Moderator
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    Rock's protestation fits every situation:

    "Of course I know that the fingerbowl doesn't contain cold, clear soup! I have a big dick!"

    "Sorry, ma'am, I don't have to give you my seat on the bus. I have a big dick."

    "Professor, you have no right to give me a failing mark on this math test. I have a big dick!"

    Back to the subject at hand...I have always felt that good manners help one communicate with the least amount of effort.

    In an online forum, however, just as IRL, we rub elbows with all kinds of people whose ability to express themselves varies according to their own experience. The aromas of the pot pourri of personalities here can range from rosey to roadkill but one who cares to will learn how to handle each one.

    At worst, there's always the Ignore button.
     
  13. Shelby

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    But with all due respect BBS, you seem to believe everyone's insincere i.e., veiled. Or at least your radar's always on red alert.
     
  14. AlteredEgo

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    That's not true. There are many who I do not feel are being insincere. You, for example. I'm not on alert for anything. I see what I see.
     
  15. rawbone8

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    I agree Bronxy. We all know the when gloves ought to come off.

    Puerile name calling and baiting is sometimes appropriate to a situation. More often than not though, it is about a lack of real ammunition, because everything meaningful has already been said. Then it's the "I'm only human" pleasure of over-the-top personal attacks.

    I really like your contributions.:wink:
     
  16. Gisella

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    Interesting...i see bad manners as insensibility not much as rude words...bcause u can be rude talking with sweet politness...i 'feel' behind words the sincerity or unique ways the person express themselves...or i think i can 'fell', yeh right.. :biggrin1: ...

    I dont use strong words to express my point bcause it does not come naturally to me expressing this way...but i think i'm pretty much sincere my own way to express things and i do apreciate autenticity in anyone being just them - sometimes take little more time to understand their ways others i just can read and ignore, what i can't swallow easy and its sooo irritating are bullying manners and pomp.

    The respect i give is to be sincere and thats all. And anyways many times i do not get the many nuances of things being said in English...and can miss many points and seem rude too.:rolleyes:
     
  17. Ethyl

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    Those who are truly well-mannered do it for others, not themselves. I've met people, both online and IRL, who were despicable individuals hiding behind a facade of courtesy and politeness. What's often frustrating is the time it takes to unearth and expose the real individual underneath. Insincere behavior is insulting to one's intelligence and it infuriates me to no end. I don't prefer rudeness by any means, but everyone expresses themselves differently and I try to remain open to understanding others despite the differences. People who are insincere use their manners as a means of getting what they want from you and they make my skin crawl. People who are truly sincere will always have my respect.
     
  18. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    Intersting

    Don't be torn.

    And don't over-work your brain on my account. You've given me a great deal more "air time" than I've ever thought of giving you rawbone.

    I wouldn't tell you to "fuck off". My ego is what it is. If it's 'huge' as it may well be it's the result of years of earning that right. If that answer fucks with your sensibilites so be it. An identically monstrous ego of which you speak, however, goes largely unaddressed in other equally egotistical posters though I'll note. This is curious to me but not surprising.

    There's an 'ugly' side to all of us I'll warrant. But at least mine's not 'veiled':biggrin1:. And what you perceive as childish may well be but I only give in return what's afforded me. Should you treat me with kindness and decency I can assure you you'll be afforded the identical courtesy. If that's egotistical then I'll wear that adjective willingly.

    This is what I mean about manners. You've given this thread a perfect example of just that lack of which I spoke. Thanks for the illustration.


    Beyond that rawbone - my intent was in composing this thread not to self-aggrandize. Why you felt it necessary to choose to critique my persona would be something I'd have preferred you took to private pm. But since you appear to need to egotistically pronounce it to the whole board you've accomplished your end.

    And I'll say one thing further since it feels oddly as though I've been put in a postion of defending my approach (see rawbone's take on me above):

    I think it's reasonably safe to say that I've only taken drastic measures in my approach when I've been singled out by members as their token board racist or when I see overt homophobia. Both referenced issues will result in a knee-jerk response. Count on it. Beyond that I think you'll find me fairly introspect and considered.

    Call me an East Coast snob, an elitist, and arrogant. Those apply. But I'm proudly those things because of an unapologetic love for my background, my history, my intelligence, and the relentless perseverence I have to survive in a society that often would take issue with who I am on a very primal level.

    Now you all should be able to identify with that last sentence.

    __________________


    This is one of the reasons I initiated this thread.

    It's this very 'on alert' sentiment that means the "p.c." polce are ever-on patrol. Though it's tedious to those on the receiving end it must be exhausting for those who find themselves looking for it around every corner.

    I think you mistake all posters for our late pichulon. The points of views and variety of opinions is as varied as the posters at this site rawbone. Before snapping to judgment why not try sitting back and using your powers of observation and perhaps you may just well be pleasantly surprised.... (that is unless you want conflict).

    This is a very telling thread so far.
     
  19. rob_just_rob

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    I am generally polite here (and elsewhere) so long as others are polite to me. I will generally ignore rudeness, ill-considered stereotyping, and close-mindedness (although I tend to make a mental note about the poster and be on guard when I see more of his posts) except where directed at me - when I will be equally rude (but twice as clever) in return. :smile:
     
  20. Heather LouAnna

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    I stand ten feet tall in front of my monitor.
     
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