BF won't give oral... thoughts?

secondbest69

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well there are men and women out there that oral isn't there cup of tea and there's is no talking about it that's going to change there view on it. everyone likes and dislikes different things that's what makes life so fun going out in the world finding someone that's on the same page as you.
 

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When I was married to my ex-wife I wouldn't go down on her either. The reason I woudn't was because her pussy smelled so bad that I absolutely could NOT.

That may not be the problem mentioned here but it's possible. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and didn't tell her for years, then one day in the heat of a bad argument about sex I told her. I have no idea why she didn't realize it smelled so bad; I mean this odor would stagger lightening..! At any rate after I told her she began regular douching and it didn't smell anymore.
 

yoursgetsmine

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Sexual gratification shouldn't be bartered IF the person who is reluctant to do something has a very valid reason for NOT doing it as just opposed to not doing it because it's something they don't normally enjoy doing. Sometimes it's just a matter of that person realizing WHY they have a hang up....and if they finally over come their personal objections through UNDERSTANDING and not threats and try it, they may see how much pleasure they are providing the other partner which usually stimulates the reluctant individual to do it even more for the other person and then they BOTH get into more.

If I like doing something BUT hold back because my partner won't return the favor, then I'm cutting my nose off to spite my face. I'd rather have HALF of something I like than ZERO to prove a point......and then IF I cower my partner into doing it because I withheld something....then that means they are doing it reluctantly and not only won't get into it, they probably won't be very good at it either which still will leave the other person "wanting"
 
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Intrigue

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Sexual gratification shouldn't be bartered IF the person who is reluctant to do something has a very valid reason for NOT doing it as just opposed to not doing it because it's something they don't normally enjoy doing. Sometimes it's just a matter of that person realizing WHY they have a hang up....and if they finally over come their personal objections through UNDERSTANDING and not threats and try it, they may see how much pleasure they are providing the other partner which usually stimulates the reluctant individual to do it even more for the other person and then they BOTH get into more.

If I like doing something BUT hold back because my partner won't return the favor, then I'm cutting my nose off to spite my face. I'd rather have HALF of something I like than ZERO to prove a point......and then IF I cower my partner into doing it because I withheld something....then that means they are doing it reluctantly and not only won't get into it, they probably won't be very good at it either which still will leave the other person "wanting"

Quoted for truthitude.
 

ConstantComment

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Sexual gratification shouldn't be bartered IF the person who is reluctant to do something has a very valid reason for NOT doing it as just opposed to not doing it because it's something they don't normally enjoy doing. Sometimes it's just a matter of that person realizing WHY they have a hang up....and if they finally over come their personal objections through UNDERSTANDING and not threats and try it, they may see how much pleasure they are providing the other partner which usually stimulates the reluctant individual to do it even more for the other person and then they BOTH get into more.

If I like doing something BUT hold back because my partner won't return the favor, then I'm cutting my nose off to spite my face. I'd rather have HALF of something I like than ZERO to prove a point......and then IF I cower my partner into doing it because I withheld something....then that means they are doing it reluctantly and not only won't get into it, they probably won't be very good at it either which still will leave the other person "wanting"
How then would you resolve this particular issue? In my case, he never told me that he didn't want to do it. HE simply danced around the issue with tangential remarks like:
1. I'm sexually inexperienced.
2. All the other women I ever had sex with never needed nor wanted direct clitoral stimulation. (complete with hand gesture palm facing down and parallel to the floor.)
3. I will do down on you AND engage in digital stimulation once you get an HIV test. a) We had been having sex for the past 16 months.; b) he was ready to have sex with me for the first time without a condom; c) he reassured me that he regularly gets HIV (what the fuck for since he told me he hadn't sex for 4 years); d) and who the hell ever got aids from giving hand jobs.

Can you really have an open honest intelligent conversation with someone who darts and hides from the issue like this?
 

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When I was married to my ex-wife I wouldn't go down on her either. The reason I woudn't was because her pussy smelled so bad that I absolutely could NOT.

That may not be the problem mentioned here but it's possible. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and didn't tell her for years, then one day in the heat of a bad argument about sex I told her. I have no idea why she didn't realize it smelled so bad; I mean this odor would stagger lightening..! At any rate after I told her she began regular douching and it didn't smell anymore.

Did you know this before you married her? This is why I advocate sex before marriage.
 

Intrigue

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How then would you resolve this particular issue? In my case, he never told me that he didn't want to do it. HE simply danced around the issue with tangential remarks like:
1. I'm sexually inexperienced.
2. All the other women I ever had sex with never needed nor wanted direct clitoral stimulation. (complete with hand gesture palm facing down and parallel to the floor.)
3. I will do down on you AND engage in digital stimulation once you get an HIV test. a) We had been having sex for the past 16 months.; b) he was ready to have sex with me for the first time without a condom; c) he reassured me that he regularly gets HIV (what the fuck for since he told me he hadn't sex for 4 years); d) and who the hell ever got aids from giving hand jobs.

Can you really have an open honest intelligent conversation with someone who darts and hides from the issue like this?


Probably not. That fellow sounds like a habitual liar. Prone to covering up issues with erroneous facts and or excuses. Not someone in whom I would place a great deal of trust.
 
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This probably falls into the realm of not information to develop a sound answer given all of the possible scenarios and possibilities.

I personally have a hard time rationalizing how a man cannot make love to a healthy woman that practices good hygiene, without going down on her. But that's just me personally. Going down or eating pussy is like an absolute for me. I can't imagine myself trying to stick my dick in something I haven't already licked and tongued.

Now moving right along I will say that many cultures, and I believe some people with certain religious beliefs have issues regarding anything outside the realm of sex for the sake of reproduction as being a taboo. This could be one of those circumstances as well. I don't like it and I don't agree with it but you still may see it.

If he enjoys being on the receiving end, but doesn't reciprocate then I would say it's more like him being a selfish ass.

If they love each other they may get around it; if not, then sooner or later it will be a showstopper.
 

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Another message board, I noticed a guy saying that a woman who did not go down on him would definitely be a deal breaker. He did say he was a giver himself. After my experience above, I really have trouble understanding why anyone would not engage sex before marriage or before any other important milestone like moving in together.
 

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...... Most of all, the thing about it that hurts the most is that it makes her feel unattractive.

And I do think based on what she's said that she's the driving force behind their sexual relations. It seems that he would just as well flop over and fall asleep as fuck her (or let her fuck him as seems to be the case).
It sounds like the problem could be more than just his refusal to lick her.

Apologies if I've missed this from the thread, but has she asked him why he won't go down on her? Is he squeamish about pussy generally, or just hers? Does he know how much she loves receiving oral?

I've been in a relationship where our sex drives didn't match and I can sympathise with her feeling less attractive as a result. Constantly being the initiator of sex made me feel like he was doing me a favour. In my case, his lack of libido was due to a previously undiagnosed but treatable medical issue. Unfortunately his unwillingness to discuss it, coupled with his lack of desire, meant that I'd already moved on long before the diagnosis.



Do you think I should say something to him? Honestly, it's more awkward for men to talk about that kind of thing than women, but at this point I've heard about it enough that I feel like I could.
How would you feel if your gf's guy-friend made suggestions on how you could give her more pleasure? Does he know that his gf is talking to another guy about intimate details of their sex life? I think it's a bad idea for you to approach him. Regardless of your good intentions, he could see you as a threat.




I think women give men far too many breaks and allow us to be pricks. I don't want to get into deep discussions, but basically it comes down to insecurity and the feeling that sometimes it's better to be wanted by a jerk than to be alone.

We all know someone who is with a guy who demeans them and treats them like dirt, yet they won't leave them. And sometimes they marry them.
This isn't exclusive to females. I have a friend who put up with physical beatings from his gf. But that's a whole different thread.




............

I think what I'm trying to get here is a little bit of clarity of what other women would do in the same situation.

The scenario would be that you love this guy, the sex is good, but him not ever going down on you is a significant point of contention. How do you think you would handle that? Ultimatum? Conversation?

My personal feeling is conversation. Direct discussion of the issue--expression that oral sex is very important to her. But also expression that there are consequences if it doesn't happen.

Because, honestly, she's afraid of being left. She won't threaten leaving him because she has no follow through and he knows it. That said, I think he would do it if she pushed the issue. But she doesn't seem willing to for fear of him leaving her.

......

I'm not a fan of ultimatums. Discussion and making my views known, sure. If the other person is interested in the possible consequences, they'll get the message or ask.
 
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curious_angel

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I meant to add to my previous post....

Guy-jin, you're obviously a good friend to her. And a good friend with a tongue and an enthusiastic approach to using it.

Is it possible that she's angling for you to provide the oral she's missing from her bf? Or, that she wants you to replace her bf?
 

molotovmuffin

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When I was married to my ex-wife I wouldn't go down on her either. The reason I woudn't was because her pussy smelled so bad that I absolutely could NOT.

That may not be the problem mentioned here but it's possible. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and didn't tell her for years, then one day in the heat of a bad argument about sex I told her. I have no idea why she didn't realize it smelled so bad; I mean this odor would stagger lightening..! At any rate after I told her she began regular douching and it didn't smell anymore.
I think your an ass...Did you ever think that you being gay, might of had something to do with not wanting to go down on her or not liking the smell?
 

yoursgetsmine

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How then would you resolve this particular issue? In my case, he never told me that he didn't want to do it. HE simply danced around the issue with tangential remarks like:
1. I'm sexually inexperienced.
2. All the other women I ever had sex with never needed nor wanted direct clitoral stimulation. (complete with hand gesture palm facing down and parallel to the floor.)
3. I will do down on you AND engage in digital stimulation once you get an HIV test. a) We had been having sex for the past 16 months.; b) he was ready to have sex with me for the first time without a condom; c) he reassured me that he regularly gets HIV (what the fuck for since he told me he hadn't sex for 4 years); d) and who the hell ever got aids from giving hand jobs.

Can you really have an open honest intelligent conversation with someone who darts and hides from the issue like this?


I think you're in a tough position because you may be wondering if something is "wrong" with you and that's why he won't pleasure you orally......and we all seem to opt for "what's wrong with me?" when we deflect the real problem....which in this case may be he A. Does not like it B. Does not really know how to do it C. Has some sexual abuse in his past that reminds him of something very negative regarding his doing it D. He's selfish and it's not about your pleasure at all E. Considers it beneath him F. Would rather suck a cock than eat a pussy G. Does not know what he's missing and what he's causing you to miss H. Has to do it OR will ONLY do it with somebody he's in love with I. Is waiting to do it ONLY with his wife when he gets married (some virginal thing in his head)


Anyway....you get the point....to many variables, but I don't think withholding head from him will stimulate him into eating you......and from my experience if my partner...either a guy or a gal won't suck my dick....it SURE won't stop me from enjoying what I get off on....and that's using my mouth on their sexual organs and orffices....
 
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Guy-jin

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Thanks for all the replies, guys. I promise I've read every single one. I cannot respond to every point made or every post directly, but know that I read them. A lot of great input, and I agree with much of what you guys have recommended.

I know the typical response of a friend is to advise or help when we believe it to be necessary but I think, personally, after many years and trying to help people that most people say they want help but don't really want it. ...

Oh trust me, I understand that. I'm an experienced "Cassandra". Doesn't mean I still won't give advice to my best friend, though. :smile: Still, I understand no matter what I say, it may be futile advice.

...Its a series of actions and behaviors that on some level signal the man that its ok to be a douche or to treat her in a way that is unacceptable to many but is perpetuated by the things she may or may not do. This is not to imply that your good friend is like this but it was something that a very well educated female therapist said to me that I thought perhaps might have some correlation to this thread. Hope that helps in some small way.

To the contrary, I think that has happened. Not only that, but she's well aware of it and this week even conveyed exactly that to me--that when they started their relationship, she was so desperate that she let him do whatever he wanted without any demands for reciprocation. It's been four years since then and I actually like him quite a bit, and she says that he has become much more considerate (and I believe her because I've seen the change myself). Anyway, she does need to handle that, but she does not necessarily have the most sturdy mental fortitude.

In other words, and this is in response to the many replies saying she should stop putting out, she probably wants to do that, but is too insecure to actually pull it off. She says she "wishes" she could do that, but when push comes to shove, she lets herself get shoved.

Unless she develops the confidence and self esteem to follow through on her demands with him and make it clear this is important, there's not much you can do to advise her. Sad, but true.
You could suggest they try some couples/sex therapy, but he doesn't sound like the type who'd go for that.
Exactly. And actually, I hadn't suggested such a thing. Sex therapy may not be a bad idea and he may go for it. Hard to say, he's an ironically insecure guy in some ways too.

My experience and reaction is very similar to Petite. My first husband lost interest after the birth of our daughter... The kicker was that the infrequent times when we were intimate I would give him the full monty, you know. I should have recognized sooner that we were on the skids. A year later we separated. Good riddance.
Your story here is exactly what happened with her ex-husband, actually. He basically lost attraction for her when she was pregnant with their second child. Different story, but amazingly similar experience between you and her. Something happens to some dudes I guess.

Sounds more like he has an unhealthy attitude toward reciprocal pleasure. I don't know what it would take to "expand his palate," but I would make sure I was squeaky clean and neatly trimmed. Prep it like a shiny used car at the front of the lot. I wouldn't paint big numbers with shoe polish, though. That's just going overboard. But if I would I'd probably put '69 or bust.'

Hilarious. :biggrin1: I do think reciprocal pleasure is an issue. She gets off on penetration easily, apparently, so I think to him it's a combination where he knows he can just plow her and she'll get off and he for whatever reason doesn't want to go down.


If it were my friend, I'd do as you've done and tell her to talk to him about it honestly. If she wasn't willing to do that (or to go to more extreme measures), but kept complaining about it, I'd do as Dragon suggested and tell her to STFU. Only I'd probably be a little more polite about it. In fact, I've done that in the past. If it's not important enough for them to talk to their partner about it, they certainly don't need to talk about it so much to me.
Yeah, it does get annoying for me. I do want to say, "why don't you just handle your shit," but this is my best friend and, honestly, a lot of it is venting. People vent. I'm a good listener. And I have basically told her exactly what you guys are all suggesting--that she needs to handle it, that she needs to talk to him frankly, that she needs to not allow him to be evasive, et cetera. So it's great seeing that so many others agree (I feel like showing her this thread).

Continued...
 

Guy-jin

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And about talking to the guy . . . I'm not sure there's a way you could do it without both of you feeling really uncomfortable. Maybe you could begin a conversation about oral in a more general sense and try to feel out why he doesn't like to do it?

Well now, this goes back to why we ever started talking about the state of oral in their relationship at all. The reason is goofy but interesting. Basically, the three of us plus another good friend were hanging out at their house and her boyfriend made a comment to the effect of, "Sure, I'll go down" in response to whether we were going to go down the street to the store. So I said, in classic form, "I bet you'll go down!" The other friend chuckled, but my best friend basically turned to her boyfriend with one of those, "SEE!" looks and he turned red and averted his eyes from her. And then she says, "Actually, probably not!"

So yes, we do talk about our sex lives in pretty specific detail with each other but not typically in front of our significant others that way. But the box was now open and the devil already got out, so now we talk about it.

As for talking to him about it, that's not likely. He doesn't want to talk about it with me, I'm sure, and honestly I don't want to talk about it with him.

Regarding the possibility of a yeast infection or something, that's not the issue. Yes, I asked. Yes, she laughed and said no, she was sure she didn't have some kind of infection and that she didn't smell/taste bad. So no more 90% gay dudes need to ask about it. :tongue:

Sometimes it's just a matter of that person realizing WHY they have a hang up....and if they finally over come their personal objections through UNDERSTANDING and not threats and try it, they may see how much pleasure they are providing the other partner which usually stimulates the reluctant individual to do it even more for the other person and then they BOTH get into more.

Oh, I agree. I did say something similar to her, that she needs a frank conversation (as I said earlier). She told me that she has tried it but he gets evasive and doesn't want to talk about it. He says that his ex basically told him he was bad at oral and didn't ask for it after he tried it a couple times. He basically told her that he doesn't want to do it because he thinks he's bad at it, but he's good at sex otherwise, so he'd rather do that.

The thing is, that's not good enough for her, and I agree it shouldn't be. He should be willing to get over his insecurity for her. And it's not like she'll be judgmental--she'd help him if he were doing it wrong or something. So I honestly think the whole story is a pretty flimsy excuse for some other reason he doesn't want to do it (but I have no idea what that reason could be outside a control issue).

It sounds like the problem could be more than just his refusal to lick her.
Apologies if I've missed this from the thread, but has she asked him why he won't go down on her? Is he squeamish about pussy generally, or just hers? Does he know how much she loves receiving oral?
I agree. I just told you the answer to the first question. She has asked and he gets evasive and has some weird sob story about a traumatic cunnilingus experience.
He may well be squeamish about pussy generally. That, in fact, is a big possibility. Combine that with a weird control issue where he wants to be "the man" in bed and you have a recipe for "no pussy licking".
And yes, he's well aware how much she loves receiving oral.

I've been in a relationship where our sex drives didn't match and I can sympathise with her feeling less attractive as a result. Constantly being the initiator of sex made me feel like he was doing me a favour. In my case, his lack of libido was due to a previously undiagnosed but treatable medical issue. Unfortunately his unwillingness to discuss it, coupled with his lack of desire, meant that I'd already moved on long before the diagnosis.
Same here. I've had that exact situation. I do think they're in a bit of that, but he does want to have sex every other day or so. She's more on the daily plan, but is willing to skip because, frankly, every other day is still pretty good compared to nothing at all. I think that's the thought process, though.

How would you feel if your gf's guy-friend made suggestions on how you could give her more pleasure? Does he know that his gf is talking to another guy about intimate details of their sex life? I think it's a bad idea for you to approach him. Regardless of your good intentions, he could see you as a threat.
Oh, I agree. I don't want to have such a conversation with him and I don't think he'd like it himself.

He does know that we talk about our sex lives intimately. We're best friends, and we do talk about everything. I've known her four times longer than he's known her, you know? I admit it's a rare relationship for a straight man and a straight woman to be such close friends without being in a relationship. But part of it is certainly that we're not very compatible. :smile:

Guy-jin, you're obviously a good friend to her. And a good friend with a tongue and an enthusiastic approach to using it.

Is it possible that she's angling for you to provide the oral she's missing from her bf? Or, that she wants you to replace her bf?

Haha! I've offered and she's said no thanks. She will not "cheat" even if it's with her best friend and just trading oral. Her loss. Then again, it means my mouth is available for certain other (gorgeous) individuals. Hint hint.
 

curious_angel

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I admit it's a rare relationship for a straight man and a straight woman to be such close friends without being in a relationship. But part of it is certainly that we're not very compatible. :smile:
That sounds like an interesting new thread topic.



Haha! I've offered and she's said no thanks. She will not "cheat" even if it's with her best friend and just trading oral. Her loss. Then again, it means my mouth is available for certain other (gorgeous) individuals. Hint hint.
You've already offered? What a good friend. :tongue:

We should discuss this in more detail. :smile:
 

D_Hillary_Clitton

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Wow! I wish I could say I was surprised, but I'm not. I know women like that. I was sort of a woman like that.

I've personally never been in that situation. I've never been committed or devoted to a man who wouldn't lick me or who actually never went down on me.

This is the closest I've ever gotten to a similar situation... One of my four LTR was with a man who wasn't very creative or interesting in bed. Our sex life started out steamy, but by ~3 months into the relationship, we had settled into a pattern that would remain for the next few years. I felt like he tricked me, being so passionate in the very beginning, when that wasn't really what he was like. He wasn't interested in oral sex, either receiving or giving, although he gave it sometimes, more often than he let me give him oral sex, and he preferred having sex in the missionary position. I tried everything to spice up our sex life. I talked to him. I told him what I wanted directly. I read him erotic stories in bed. I suggested books with erotic themes and passages to read together, which he enjoyed, but he focused his discussion with me on literary criticism and seemed immune to being aroused by them. I suggested that we each write down fantasies and trade them. Mine he criticized for it's failure to be literature, and his wasn't fantasy at all. I took him to dirty bookstores with me and shopped for toys. I tried all of those things in the first six months of the relationship. Nothing worked. Yet, despite all my frustration with him, he kept me satisfied enough that I didn't consider leaving him over it. He regularly gave me orgasms and we had sex three times a week, without fail. It was the bare minimum for me. I loved him and I considered the good parts of our relationship to be good enough that our boring sex life wasn't a deal-breaker for me.

There were consequences. His apparent lack of lust for me made me feel very unattractive. I often suspected that he only had sex with me regularly to keep me from complaining, and I suspected that if I stopped coming on to him that we wouldn't have sex at all. That was a terrible feeling. I don't think anyone should have to feel like that, and I wish that I didn't blame myself. We simply had incompatible sex drives.


This situation is somewhat reminiscent of my own, and I hope I won't come to resent anything with him because I am trying to hold back my sexuality to make him comfortable...
 

AlteredEgo

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This situation is somewhat reminiscent of my own, and I hope I won't come to resent anything with him because I am trying to hold back my sexuality to make him comfortable...
I had to hold back a lot of my sexuality to make my husband comfortable for a long time. It is working out because my husband actively works to improve our sexual connection. It was just that a lot of things frightened him at first, especially the intensity of my orgasms. Despite my husband's efforts and progress, I am sometimes regretful, sometimes resentful. I'm not sure I would recommend that anyone else do as I have done.