bisexuality in females and heterosexual men

[B_Stronzo]

I suspect the same is said of you.

 

[dong20]

EDIT: Silly comment (which had no bearing on this thread) removed by me as it was, well, silly.

 

[sares]

So much to respond to here, must have missed this when it first went up. Funny because I was mentioning my annoyance with the female bisexual chic on another thread. Since there are obviously more men than women on this board, I feel the need to chime in. (& I think I will have to be less lazy about my caps and punctuation... lol.)

For the above reasons I don't think that watching 2 guys enjoying each other's bodies would give much cerebral stimulation to women. That is why they don't encourage it.

Chiming in that this is total bollocks. My porn collection is almost exclusively gay-male. I love seeing miles of manflesh and men touching each other.

This is also because gay porn isn't as mainstream (read: plastic and boring) as het porn, so you're more likely to see a really good blowjob, a gentle touch, some real passion. Sometimes amateur het is good when the girl is really into it.

My point is, women don't dislike porn because they're "cerebral," they dislike porn because most porn is really shitty.

...No one knows how "all women feel" on any given subject, so it would do us all some good to take a step back and realise that women are individuals, just like men... Of course women have as many partners as men! Who do you think the men are fucking? Men don't like to think that the woman they are fucking has been with other men and knows the difference between good sex and bad, and this is the basis for every cultural injustice we suffer...

I wanted to quote this whole post. Mme. Zora, you are officially a hero of mine.

If she continued her sexual activities with women without other men present or encouragement from other men, then i'd say she's most likely bisexual. If she's continuing to carry on FFM's, then i'd question her bisexuality.

mercurialbliss was also right on the money with the brother's "introductions to bisexuality." If these girls continued putting on shows for straight guys, that does not make them bisexual, that makes them calculating. They know they'll get attention and a reaction, so they pursue it.

 

[Ethyl]

Chiming in that this is total bollocks. My porn collection is almost exclusively gay-male. I love seeing miles of manflesh and men touching each other.

This is also because gay porn isn't as mainstream (read: plastic and boring) as het porn, so you're more likely to see a really good blowjob, a gentle touch, some real passion. Sometimes amateur het is good when the girl is really into it.

My point is, women don't dislike porn because they're "cerebral," they dislike porn because most porn is really shitty.
quote]

There it is in writing. Thank you, Sares.

 

[B_Stronzo]

Welcome sares.

My fear is that our detractors are skipping over the posts written by the females in our midst. Your input is sorely needed.

Thanks, Stronzo

 

[faceking]

I dig chicks, especially old phat ones with mullets

 

[madame_zora]

Welcome sares.

My fear is that our detractors are skipping over the posts written by the females in our midst. Your input is sorely needed.

Thanks, Stronzo

Ugh, I didn't really expect a lot of hetero chest beating, but I'm not surprised in the least. There are no small number of straight men that leave us women running for the comfort of our gay friends who can hold conversations beyond "What's for dinner, bitch?"

A flaming asshole hasn't been laid in over a year? What are the odds...


Sares, welcome to the site, I hope to hear more from you. We women need reinforcements! :biggrin1:

 

[pichulon]

Chiming in that this is total bollocks. My porn collection is almost exclusively gay-male. I love seeing miles of manflesh and men touching each other.

This is also because gay porn isn't as mainstream (read: plastic and boring) as het porn, so you're more likely to see a really good blowjob, a gentle touch, some real passion. Sometimes amateur het is good when the girl is really into it.

My point is, women don't dislike porn because they're "cerebral," they dislike porn because most porn is really shitty.
quote]

There it is in writing. Thank you, Sares.

Mercurialbliss:
may I ask you a question??
I can read in this thread, that some women say that they watch male gay porn, and, they would like to encourage their male lovers to engage in homosexual encounters w other males .
I am straight, and never heard of such a thing. I am not here to insult no one ( I can read what is been thrown around ) , I am interested in bringing my point of view.
Never , a girl has asked me to engage in homosexual acts , never heard of something like that, I have 4 sisters, and, I can hear comments they make about guys that they found attractive, but to their dissappointment, were found to be gay. straight women , from what I know , would dump a BF that was found to do things like that.
It is not putting no one down, it is different sexual preferences. From what I know, most ( if not all ) straight women would not even entertain a thought like that.
Mercurialbliss, I ask you because I read your replies, you seem to be a very well balanced and , a woman that is sure about herself.
Would you encourage your BF to engage in something like that for your amusement?
Does it appeal to you? the notion of your BF and another man??
Would you enjoy seing him engaged with another man?

Not that I need to know, I believe I heard about it extensively. But I want to hear the opinion of straight women.
More over, it is a dead end proposition, both ways, I do not think, a woman can compell me to engage in homosexual acts , because simply I can not, will not ,and , do not want, to do it. That would be like asking me to jump of the empire state building, just because.
Same the other way around. I would not ask my GF to get into lesbian sex, for my pleasure. And, I do not expect a straight woman to comply.
If the man in the example, or the woman, complies to such a request, these two that are complying, are doing so because they want to do it.
Honestly, I can not imagine a straight woman, that is not bi, nor likes women, to go down on another woman, and kiss her, just to please a BF.
It just does not fly.

 

[B_Stronzo]

Same the other way around. I would not ask my GF to get into lesbian sex, for my pleasure. And, I do not expect a straight woman to comply.
If the man in the example, or the woman, complies to such a request, these two that are complying, are doing so because they want to do it.
Honestly, I can not imagine a straight woman, that is not bi, nor likes women, to go down on another woman, and kiss her, just to please a BF.
It just does not fly.

You need to first acknowledge the inequity of this thing pichulon. If you refuse to acknowledge that the false "bisexualiy chic" phenomenon exists then there's no reason to ask.

I'm very interested to read mercurialbliss's reply to you.

And of course it'd be like "jumping over the Empire State Building" to you. I know of too many young women who have been pressured in to precisely the behavior you say you'd never willingly participate in. So now you see the reason I've brought up this topic. Imagine those very women having the same revulsion to that act as you'd have to going along with your girlfriend suggesting you bring a male into the mix.

Of course it 'flys'. Read LinitanyLion's first response in this thread. It's a known phenomenon which occurs all too often especially in a society which still requires women "find a man" and "make him happy".

Please attempt to understand the dynamic of this thing in a societal context rather than only applying it to what you "would" and "wouldn't" do. It's larger than that.

 

[Ethyl]

Mercurialbliss:
may I ask you a question??

Of course.

I can read in this thread, that some women say that they watch male gay porn, and, they would like to encourage their male lovers to engage in homosexual encounters w other males .
I am straight, and never heard of such a thing. I am not here to insult no one ( I can read what is been thrown around ) , I am interested in bringing my point of view.

Pichulon, 85-90% of pornography is created for heterosexual men. There is pornography for heterosexual women but most women find it boring because it's based on preconceived notions of what women find sexually enticing. Gay male porn is on the rise and heterosexual women often find this more palatable because the sex involved in gay male porn is more egalitarian. Everyone is pleasured in gay male porn, whereas in hetero porn the focus is on the pleasure of the man, or what he/they are doing TO the woman not FOR her. If anyone can find hetero porn with a woman having an actual orgasm, please let me know. Ive yet to see a woman have a real orgasm in hetero porn. And yes, we can tell if it's fake.

As for desiring male lovers engaging in homosexual encounters, it's a fantasy like any other. Women, like men, have fantasies. Madame Zora's already addressed this point. Not only about men performing on each other either. The problem is that if you ask a woman about her fantasies, she may feel uncomfortable divulging that information for fear of what others may say (as I addressed earlier). When society keeps drilling into you that fantasies are a no-no, you will keep them to yourself. Heterosexual men haven't experienced this which makes it more difficult for them to understand.

Never , a girl has asked me to engage in homosexual acts , never heard of something like that, I have 4 sisters, and, I can hear comments they make about guys that they found attractive, but to their dissappointment, were found to be gay. straight women , from what I know , would dump a BF that was found to do things like that.
It is not putting no one down, it is different sexual preferences. From what I know, most ( if not all ) straight women would not even entertain a thought like that.

Let's clarify a few things here. This thread is about women who are pressured into performing single sex acts from hetero men. Women won't ask you to perform same sex acts for their benefit because they are afraid you, like other many other men, would dump them in an instant for suggesting it. This isn't about being attracted to another man and discovering he's gay, that's another issue. But straight women are kowtowing to men's desires to have two women in the same bed, which has to stop if the men aren't willing to reciprocate in kind. If a man has two women who aren't gay and they're present to pleasure him and not each other, that's fine (that was my MFM situation. They weren't even remotely interested in each other, only me). The problem lies with men who are pressuring their sexual partners to perform on each other when they're not gay. The women who perform on each other are highly praised for doing so; therefore, they keep performing. My experience, as you read, was the exact opposite.

Mercurialbliss, I ask you because I read your replies, you seem to be a very well balanced and , a woman that is sure about herself.
Would you encourage your BF to engage in something like that for your amusement?
Does it appeal to you? the notion of your BF and another man??
Would you enjoy seing him engaged with another man?

I wouldn't encourage it unless he were bisexual and desired it for himself as well. And even then, the "talk" about the repurcussions on the relationships would be necessary at that point. But to directly answer your question, no. Most hetero men don't want to perform same sex acts and I respect their wishes. My amusement is not the most important part of the equation; however, our mutual desires are.

Honestly, I can not imagine a straight woman, that is not bi, nor likes women, to go down on another woman, and kiss her, just to please a BF.
It just does not fly.

Pichulon, you may not be able to imagine or believe it but it exists. Don't even take my word for it. Do your research. Talk to women. Develop relationships with them and question them. They may not tell you everything right away. When you develop a level of trust, then they'll spill the beans. Take away the veil of fear and you might be surprised. Buckle up. You're in for a wild ride.

 

[B_Stronzo]

mb?

Well said. "la risposta perfetta"!!

 

[Ethyl]

There is one more aspect of this topic that crossed my mind. Heterosexual men are encouraged to indulge in their fantasies while women aren't. This is ever-so-slowly changing for the better, but only recently have women become more vocal about their desires. Thus, some heterosexual men are taken aback when they're told women share the similar sex drives and fantasies and disbelieve us when we tell them otherwise. This is why all women need to speak loudly and clearly about their desires.

 

[madame_zora]

There is one more aspect of this topic that crossed my mind. Heterosexual men are encouraged to indulge in their fantasies while women aren't. This is ever-so-slowly changing for the better, but only recently have women become more vocal about their desires. Thus, some heterosexual men are taken aback when they're told women share the similar sex drives and fantasies and disbelieve us when we tell them otherwise. This is why all women need to speak loudly and clearly about their desires.

I think I love you!

I have no doubt there are plenty of men who think they really know what's going on with women, but they honestly haven't a clue. We don't talk much about our desires for fear of being called a slut, or out of grace because we know how fragile our men's eogs are, so we let them believe they're doing a great job, whether or not it's true.

Most men actually would prefer we continue to lie rather than have to reevaluate their own opinions (and performance). When I hear a man denying that women could possibly have such fantaises, all I can think is "Man, I feel sorry for YOUR girlfriend".

 

[rob_just_rob]

I must be missing a few pages in my "Manual of things to ask your girlfriend to do". I've never, other than jokingly, suggested to any of my girlfriends that we invite another woman to join us.

On the other hand, I did have one bisexual girlfriend who hinted that she wanted to see me with another guy. This didn't turn me off, and we talked about it a bit, but it never happened - and neither did the MFF threesome, despite her already being bi. Why not? Well, even though we were both bi in varying degree, we were a couple, and I think most couples still have a sense of fidelity that would be impinged on if a third party joined the mix.

Or maybe I'm hopelessly old fashioned.

 

[B_Stronzo]

Finally.

Really objective input from a predominantly heterosexual male.

Thanks Rob.

 

[sares]

I can read in this thread, that some women say that they watch male gay porn, and, they would like to encourage their male lovers to engage in homosexual encounters w other males. I am straight, and never heard of such a thing.

Since you quoted me, I figured I should clarify as well. Like mercurialbliss, I like gay male porn for visual fantasy stimulation, but:

I wouldn't encourage [my partner to have a MMF] unless he were bisexual and desired it for himself as well.

I like watching men, but I don't want to see my own partner in bed with another man, because I know that doesn't turn his crank. Knowing he would be performing only for my benefit would be a massive turnoff. I absolutely make the distinction between enjoying pornography with bisexual overtones and expecting my husband to act out.

Really, I would probably prefer some really good heterosexual porn, that showed more of beautiful men and beautiful women having sex, rather than disembodied cocks and uninterested girls pretending to come. One of my favourite clips is of a woman riding a Sybian, not because I like girls, but because she is very clearly having a real orgasm and I can identify with her.

Honestly, I can not imagine a straight woman, that is not bi, nor likes women, to go down on another woman, and kiss her, just to please a BF. It just does not fly.

Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it isn't happening. The linked article is all about girls performing public "lesbian" acts for the benefit of male admirers.

 

[dong20]

Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it isn't happening. The linked article is all about girls performing public "lesbian" acts for the benefit of male admirers.

Ha, I've seen this same 'argument' a thousand times, here and elsewhere, I've not seen it first hand, therefore it doesn't exist. Well, I've never seen a Lion chase, catch and eat a Zebra first hand yet I'm pretty sure it happens.

Lesbian 'acts' are just that; acts, and thus have little if any relevance to this thread as they have little if any relevance to bisexuality beyond the skewed perception of those watching them. The participants already know this of course and well.

I very seldom watch porn, for the reason yourself and MB have so ably said; it's 95% formulaic, boring tripe, if you like; the sexual equivalent of trainspotting. The remaining 5% that 'works' for me really falls more into erotica than porn. For me it's because I think the mind can create a scenario far more erotic than the eye. That 5% can just help get the process started and as often as not even that is unnecessary. All it takes is the right person and a little imagination. Rob, on this, I guess I may be fashioned too.

Two women 'together' is only really appealling in the context of an MFF aimed at my pleasure, and as MB says I agree that's not really two women 'together' in that sense anyway. That's probably selfish but there you go. It's never happened, except, on occasion in my warped and twisted mind and it probably never will. I expect in reality it would be somewhat less satisfying, riddled with perfomance anxiety and unrealistic expectations.

I may be atypical but certainly, for me, lesbian porn also has only minimal appeal and I suspect even that is only a subconsious attempt at transposing myself into the 'mix'. I've watched little of it for the simple reason that as an end in itself, it's of no real interest, fails to punch my buttons and often is actually quite boring. I get zero sexual response from watching two men 'together', it simply holds no interest for me, it never has. I have no interest in an MFM, perhaps I don't share well, perhaps I'm repressed, or most likely my mind is simply not wired that way. In some ways it's true, men don't multi-task...

As for the issue of coercion, for whatever reason, well, it's a no no. Dongalongs 'brother' is truly deluding himself if he believes he 'introduced' those girls into experiencing anything beyond his beery breath and misplaced ego.

If I ask a girl to do something and she refuses point blank (not refusal as in "Sorry, I'm not in the mood for that now, maybe tomorrow") as in; "no, end of story" well, that's the end of it. I would be mortified and dissappointed if she acquiesced merely out of misplaced loyalty or fear of 'losing' me. This works both ways of course and if either party doesn't like the others refusal, well, they know where the door is.

I mean the above without condemnation because I do understand what can make someone do something for such reasons, I have done so myself, though never in the sexual realm. It's not wrong to put someone elses needs above ones own but it should be an informed, balanced and conscious decision, free from direct emotional pressure. Sadly it doesn't always work that way.

 

[rawbone8]

Ha, I've seen this same 'argument' a thousand times, here and elsewhere, I've not seen it first hand, therefore it doesn't exist. Well, I've never seen a Lion chase, catch and eat a Zebra first hand yet I'm pretty sure it happens.

Lesbian 'acts' are just that; acts, and thus have little if any relevance to this thread as they have little if any relevance to bisexuality beyond the skewed perception of those watching them. The participants already know this of course and well.

I very seldom watch porn, for the reason yourself and MB have so ably said; it's 95% formulaic, boring tripe. The remaining 5% that 'works' for me really falls more into erotica than porn. For me it's because I think the mind can create a scenario far more erotic than the eye. That 5% can just help get the process started and as often as not even that is unnecessary. All it takes is the right person and a little imagination. Rob, on this, I guess I may be fashioned too.

Two women 'together' is only really appealling in the context of an MFF aimed at my pleasure, and as MB says I agree that's not really two women 'together' in that sense anyway. That's probably selfish but there you go. It's never happened, except, on occasion in my warped and twisted mind and it probably never will. I expect in reality it would be somewhat less satisfying, riddled with perfomance anxiety and unrealistic expectations.

I may be atypical but certainly, for me, lesbian porn also has only minimal appeal and I suspect even that is only a subconsious attempt at transposing myself into the 'mix'. I've watched little of it for the simple reason that as an end in itself, it's of no real interest, fails to punch my buttons and often is actually quite boring. I get zero sexual response from watching two men 'together', it simply holds no interest for me, it never has. I have no interest in an MFM, perhaps I don't share well, perhaps I'm repressed, or most likely my mind is simply not wired that way. In some ways it's true, men don't multi-task...

As for the issue of coercion, for whatever reason, well, it's a no no. Dongalongs 'brother' is truly deluding himself if he believes he 'introduced' those girls into experiencing anything beyond his beery breath and misplaced ego.

If I ask a girl to do something and she refuses point blank (not refusal as in "Sorry, I'm not in the mood for that now, maybe tomorrow") as in; "no, end of story" well, that's the end of it. I would be mortified and dissappointed if she acquiesced merely out of misplaced loyalty or fear of 'losing' me. This works both ways of course and if either party doesn't like the others refusal, well, they know where the door is.

I mean the above without condemnation because I do understand what can make someone do something for such reasons, I have done so myself, though never in the sexual realm. It's not wrong to put someone elses needs above ones own but it should be an informed, balanced and conscious decision, free from direct emotional pressure. Sadly it doesn't always work that way.

dong20:
I agree with you 100%. As usual, you've articulated it eloquently and clearly.

I'd add that my experiences have been relatively the same as what you mentioned. FMF fantasy is just that, fantasy. And even when partners have shared that they are interested in hearing about a fantasy, or talking about it as a fantasy scenario, it has never gone beyond verbal titillation. Though I have had several bisexual partners initiate the suggestion (believe it or not :biggrin1 we never stayed together long enough for it to occur. Generally these bisexual women prefered one on one encounters with other women, but would have made an exception if the conditions were ideal. Hetero women never entertained the idea as a viable experience, and kept it to the fantasy realm.

The problem with young men and and immature selfish older ones seems to be that there is a degenerative sliding scale of what fetishes and kinks people pick up from porn and add to the repertoire. The entitlement they feel is a measure of their self-importance is measured against porn.

Sure, there are selfish guys who insist on facials. Sure there are selfish guys who insist on anal. There are selfish guys who insist on party drugs. There are guys who insist on swinging. There are guys who insist on S&M and watersports. The world in the past 20 years has elevated these sex acts to trophy status.

The fact that these acts can be degrading to the partner, or that she (or he in the case of gay couples) is coerced into participating speaks to the selfishness of the instigator. I think it also can be viewed as an angry hetero backlash, at the changes feminism has brought to society. Revenge in bed.

But it is too easy to state that most hetrosexual males endorse this. Just because the media jumps on it as a problem for some does not make it endemic. I acknowledge that it is a real and serious problem. I don't believe that it is the behaviour of the majority.

The weak minded and insecure female (or male) who can not say no and tell the asshole to fuck off is a pitiable soul. Young women are more likely to be in this position. Pop kulture maven Madonna kisses Britney, so it must be like um hawt, right? Many hip hop and rap lyrics are rife with misogyny. Pink has a great rebuttal pop message for them.

The faux bisexual will be out of fashion soon enough, like tattoos and thongs and navel piercings. Selfishness never seems to go out of fashion, however, so I expect the underlying power struggle between the sexes to continue to be manifested in unhealthy ways.

 

[Ethyl]

The fact that these acts can be degrading to the partner, or that she (or he in the case of gay couples) is coerced into participating speaks to the selfishness of the instigator. I think it also can be viewed as an angry hetero backlash, at the changes feminism has brought to society. Revenge in bed.[/QUOTE]

This statement spooked me. How unnerving if it's true. Small wonder as to why the bisexual chic phenomenon exists.

But it is too easy to state that most hetrosexual males endorse this. Just because the media jumps on it as a problem for some does not make it endemic. I acknowledge that it is a real and serious problem. I don't believe that it is the behaviour of the majority.

Real and serious problems of this nature were once the opinions of the majority, unfortunately. Some people just can't let go and their attitudes prevail regardless. Personally, I believe the problem doesn't appear to be widespread because the behavior is subtle, not overt.

The weak minded and insecure female (or male) who can not say no and tell the asshole to fuck off is a pitiable soul. Young women are more likely to be in this position. Pop kulture maven Madonna kisses Britney, so it must be like um hawt, right? Many hip hop and rap lyrics are rife with misogyny. Pink has a great rebuttal pop message for them.

So sad, but true.

 

[madame_zora]

Rawbone, that was an amazing post, thanks for sharing your insights. I believe you hit the nail on the head on several counts.