Bisexuality

Discussion in 'Relationships, Discrimination, and Jealousy' started by Lex, Oct 7, 2005.

  1. Lex

    Lex
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    So lately, I keep getting told how GREAT it must be to be BI and how I'm "having my cake and eating it to" and I was honestly a bit taken aback. For some reason, I lot of people look at the idea of bisexulaity as this land of sexual Prime Real Estate with the big yard, 3 car garage, mirrored ceiling bedroom and sex toy dungeon. Nope. Sorry.

    In my experiences a lot of people assume that is has to do with sex. It has very little to do with sex. And it is not this be-all, end-all definition of ME.

    Bisexuality as a label does not define who I like to have sex with. Rather it attempts to characterize my capacity to enter into deep, meaningful, lasting and weathered relationships with both men and women on personal, physical, spiritiual, and emotional levels. Within the context of those relationships, we may have sexual contact or not. If we don't--I am no less connected to those people, as our connection has less to do with penis-vagina-anus contact than with our shared ability to conjoin mentally on a plane of shared existence that we find mutually beneficial, rewarding and comforting. I like to call it Love.

    Certainly not the most fun-filled path to walk, but it is my path, and I will travel it as best I can and with all my might. I constantly ask myself--why was I born this way: Neither 100% hetero- or homosexual? Why am I blessed (cursed?) with the capacity to love and be energized by both sexes? Wouldn't it be easier if I got off on Goldberg and Kurt Angle but NOT Jennifer Connelly and Charlise Theron? (maybe it WOULDN'T--Lord knows *I'll* never know).

    Those who think bisexuals are "having their cake and eating it too" truly have no clue. I want so much to ask of those with this perspective: Have you ever considered how secure a partner must be when you are bi? Have you any idea how much saftey their must exist within a successful relationship when everyone you meet (male and female) is potential competition to your partner? Have you ever considered how difficult it is to feel as if you may not fully fit into either the straight or the gay world? Geez. I take comfort in knowing that I have a loving man and woman who attempt every day to understand me and give me their unyielding support. For that I am grateful.

    Ah...better now. :)
     
  2. B_HungSpermBoy

    B_HungSpermBoy New Member

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    Lex,

    This is an amazing post. I don't think of myself as bisexual but I feel many of the same emotions that you describe about the girls and guys I care about and love. It's too bad there isn't another word for the emotional, physical and spiritual bonds that exist with people I love that may or may not include sexual expression. For some reason we're not educated about the truth of what you're saying, that as human beings we have the capacity to have relationships with anyone at that deeper and more fulfilling level. It's sad to me that the word "friend" doesn't do justice to how we are so strongly connected to certain women & men. At the same time bisexuality only describes the sexual aspect of what's happening.

    I want to thank you for being so honest with us here about your experiences. The path you've travelled is obviously more difficult than most of us can imagine, but also a roadmap for people open enough to understand your words. I'll tell you this....your post touched something deep down inside me, and I'm thinking that you're a fantastic man to be able to share yourself this way with me,with all of us.
    Thank you.

    Jeff
     
  3. Dr. Dilznick

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    Home-schooling, I reckon.
     
  4. kilbasadad

    kilbasadad Member

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    Jeff and Lex,

    I think that both of you are very articulate intelligent men with a great since of values and integrity. I hope I have chance to become friends with both of you. It would be my pleasure to call you both friends. Thank you both for expressing such warm, open and heartfelt feelings.
     
  5. kilbasadad

    kilbasadad Member

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    Type o's sorry
     
  6. dlcs

    dlcs New Member

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    That is the most dead-on, beautiful definition of Love anyone has ever written.
    wow. Just wow.
     
  7. Matthew

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    I really liked this post a lot. I found it very real and in-depth. A pleasant contrast to the trolls and goofballs who seem to be everywhere (OK maybe I'm a goofball too). Also it's different from my own personal experience and so it was instructive and gave me new things to think about. Thanks Lex.
     
  8. drambone2001

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    Ditto, Matthew! Beautiful thoughts. Fantastic!




    I really liked this post a lot. I found it very real and in-depth. A pleasant contrast to the trolls and goofballs who seem to be everywhere (OK maybe I'm a goofball too). Also it's different from my own personal experience and so it was instructive and gave me new things to think about. Thanks Lex.
    [post=349889]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]
     
  9. SoFla8

    SoFla8 New Member

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    This also made me consider things in a different light, but still leaves confusion for others. Am I to tell people, who ask, that I'm a straight guy who likes to give men head? And if I do must I make it clear that I could never love a man the same as I could love a woman? That Giving oral is it?....no kissing or receiving?

    It&#39;s just such an ambiguos <sp?> term..."Bi". Then the whole double standard issue comes up. It&#39;s ok for women to be bi, but men are just "gay" for doing that.

    What a frustration it is for me. I&#39;m not confused about what I like at all, but it still is frustrating.
     
  10. spl98006

    spl98006 New Member

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    Oh, did you ever hit the nail on the head, Lex&#33;

    I&#39;ve met several gay men who refuse to date bisexuals. And that&#39;s if they even recognize that bisexuals exist, as opposed to the tired old line about not having accepted yourself as gay yet. (There&#39;s one professor at Northwestern who keeps trying to give this crap a thin veneer of academic legitimacy.)

    Every guy that I have dated has had insecurities about the fact that I&#39;ve had several girlfriends and the fact that I still sometimes find myself attracted to women I meet. My current bf is 100% gay and gets grossed out if I even bring up the fact that I&#39;ve had sex with women.

    Interestingly, the women seem to be less insecure, or maybe I&#39;ve just been lucky in the ones that I&#39;ve met. My last girlfriend used to bring home Ryan Phillippe movies for us to watch in bed together. The woman I dated senior year, even after we broke up, used to go out clubbing with me, and we&#39;d compare notes on which guys we thought were cute. If I was single, I&#39;d hook up with her again in a second - she&#39;s only gotten sexier in the last 10 years.

    And it&#39;s not just about sex, either. The most painful breakup I&#39;ve ever had - and I mean literally painful, as in stomach cramps so bad I couldn&#39;t go to work for two days - was with a woman I dated the year after I graduated. You have to be pretty deeply in love with someone for that to happen.
     
  11. spl98006

    spl98006 New Member

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    Another thing: being attracted to both sexes makes it that much harder to come out of the closet, especially to parents, in my experience.

    For at least the first year after I told my folks, even after they had come to grips with the fact that I dig guys, they wanted to know why, if I was also attracted to women, I couldn&#39;t just date women. "Can&#39;t you get married and just buy beefcake magazines?"
     
  12. Slamdunk_dude

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    Lex,
    That post was so great, thanks for sharing it with us all :yourock:

    spl98006, i totally agree with what you are saying. I recently told two very close friends that I was attracted to men and women and while they were both so supportive they both seemed to think it was a phase or something I was doing to make myself stand out. I don&#39;t know, if and when the time comes when I choose to tell my family I will have to choose my words very carefully.
    The thing with me is I doubt myself too often, some days I feel like I&#39;m not bi at all and other days I feel like I&#39;m totally gay, I make myself feel like a fraud. Anyway I want to have it all figured out myself before I tell anyone. I have seriously considered just telling people I&#39;m gay so that they ask less questions, but I guess that is just another proverbial closet to enter :(

    Sorry I&#39;m Rambling, I&#39;m so glad there are other people here to talk about it with though

    Slamdunk_Dude
     
  13. Slamdunk_dude

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    actually spl98006, may i ask how you told your parents you were bi? Any tips to make it less awful than it has to be? :)
    Thanks,

    Slamdunk_Dude
     
  14. steve319

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    Mmm. Wow. That really sets it out clearly. I&#39;ve never even considered that, Lex. While I&#39;ve always felt the "having it all" quip to be particularly flippant and dismissive to those who are truly wrestling with this type of situation, I never thought about this particular little complication.

    <!--QuoteBegin-Lex
    @Oct 7 2005, 04:57 PM
    Have you ever considered how difficult it is to feel as if you may not fully fit into either the straight or the gay world?
    [post=349734]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/quote]
    And that&#39;s certainly not helped by the fact that so many on both sides of that divide refuse to acknowledge the legitimacy of the attractions felt by those of us living in the middle ground. There&#39;s almost a "you&#39;re either with us or against us" mentality in both camps.

    Lex, buddy, I don&#39;t envy you the path you&#39;re walking, but remember that we support you on the journey. :pals:
     
  15. Lex

    Lex
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    Steve--I always know I can count on you, big guy. Love the .sig, even if I don&#39;t love the sentiment. Here is poster of what you are saying:
    http://cte.jhu.edu/ELC/Uploads/ELC_4/dysfunction.jpg

    I found them on a website a while back and snatched a few for my own use.



    I&#39;ll have to remember that one. Sad story but great line anyway. Thanks for sharing this&#33;


    <!--QuoteBegin-Slamdunk_dude
    @Oct 8 2005, 11:27 PM
    ...
    The thing with me is I doubt myself too often, some days I feel like I&#39;m not bi at all and other days I feel like I&#39;m totally gay, I make myself feel like a fraud. Anyway I want to have it all figured out myself before I tell anyone. I have seriously considered just telling people I&#39;m gay so that they ask less questions, but I guess that is just another proverbial closet to enter :(

    Sorry I&#39;m Rambling, I&#39;m so glad there are other people here to talk about it with though

    Slamdunk_Dude
    [post=349976]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/quote]

    SlamDunk--what you feel is absolutely normal. I, too, have days when I feel so verile and hetero that I just want to pounce on every fine woman I see and I have other days when all I want is to be held close in the arms of atalls, big, rugged man and play in his chest/facial hair. My older cousin would always say: "Some times you feel like a nut; sometimes you feel like TWO&#33;" (he&#39;s Gay and at the time, I was much too young to out it all together other than to think he was bastardizing the Almond Joy/Mounds commercial).

    I feel that part of "figuring it all out" is realizing that your urges as a bisexual are fluid--that just as a 100% hetero guy may want to give head (to a woman), get head, have vaginal and/or anal sex with a woman (or any other combination including prefering one act over all the others on any given day), as a bisexual, your urges simply have more sexual combinations from which to pull. I know that makes it confusing becaue it confounds matters--but it&#39;s okay.

    As most who have been here over the past few years know--I am a sharer and a talker. Part of why these fora exist--beyond being a pornographic playground for some--is so that we who have experieced some things can share those experiences with others with the hopes of helping (at least that is partof what keeps me here). If you ever wanna chat about this, let me know.
     
  16. madame_zora

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    Lex, you are an amazing person, and I admire the way you&#39;ve found a way to make your life work inside the framework of your existing realtionship. I know it took a lot of courage to do what you did, knowing what was at risk. I remember when it was going on, and you were prepared to accept her decision either way, that was impressive. I&#39;m glad it worked out, we like to see the good guy win sometimes&#33;

    Here&#39;s a thought, guys. As tough as it is for you to figure out your own sexuality, it is just as tough for the people in your life to adjust their expectations accordingly, it&#39;s a process on both sides. I feel a great deal of chagrin to admit this, but when Julianna first told me about her bisexuality, I thought maybe it was a phase too. I gave her my unqualified support, as I believe a parent always should, but I held onto the notion that she&#39;d probably outgrow it someday. I had no idea at that time about the complexity of the issue because I had never experienced it myself, my sexuality was rather clear to me. What has helped me more than anything was finally giving myself permission to investigate my own issues wrt sex that I had not seriously contemplated in the past.

    Honestly, it wasn&#39;t until we moved the site to Invisionboard last year that I began to see it better. When Mark gave us the option of listing percentages, it opened up a lot of conversations about why that was a good idea. I thought there were three categories- gay, straight and bi. I thought bi meant 50/50. I now believe that there is an unlimited spectrum of possibilities, but I could not have understood that without the help of so many honest voices on this site. Most of the people in your lives will not have that opportunity, so you have the onerous task of educating them if you want them to actually understand. If you just "drop the bomb" and expect then to react gracefully, it probably won&#39;t happen. This is not a conversation- it is an education process, and an ongoing one at that.

    Julianna and I are lucky. We have decided a long time ago what kind of relationship we want to have and all other things are secondary to that, but most people never have THAT conversation, so every little thing seems like a big deal. To many, something that upsets the paradigm threatens the relationship. your parents might feel "If my son isn&#39;t going to marry a girl and give us grandchildren, then who is this person we raised?" It&#39;s not that they don&#39;t love you, it&#39;s that they don&#39;t know how to relate to you. Parents, being older, may feel insecure to let you see them uneasy so they react negatively thinking it makes them appear strong. Of course, they are completely unaware of their own motivations because this is all so subconscious, but it&#39;s there nonetheless. Another thing is that they&#39;ve become accustomed to their role in your life as being the one who makes the rules, so clearly this is an area where you have "disobeyed" to an extent, their natural reaction deep inside may be to tell you you&#39;re not allowed to be gay&#33;

    My best advice is to take the leadership role from the start. Give them lots of praise for the job they did of raising you (there have to be SOME good things, right?) and reassure them that nothing has changed in your relationship because of this. You are only telling them because you want to be closer and let them in. Don&#39;t give them an opportunity to believe they have a choice in the matter and they will have an easier time with it. The most frighteneing thing in the world for most people is the fear of having to make a decision. They are terrified that they will choose wrong, so don&#39;t make them feel that way. Don&#39;t ask "How do you feel about that?", this is not the place for an open ended question. Tell them that you&#39;ve appreciated them making you feel loved and that&#39;s why you felt comfortable enough to talk about this with them. Tell them you knew they&#39;d be good about it, and they probably will be. Lead them into being nice and you&#39;ll have a better chance.
     
  17. Andy-on-Sea

    Andy-on-Sea New Member

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    Lex,

    Thanks for starting this discussion. While reading your post, my eyes got a tad misty for it really hit home, in some ways it’s my own story. Most of the time I feel as if I have one leg in each of two worlds and don’t actually fit in either. The 100% guys don’t really understand what the bi guys go through. They know that they are either straight or gay, that’s it, and there is no in-between, no shades of gray. The revelations don’t come as easy for the bisexual. One moment you feel that you are straight, the next you’re gay, and the succeeding moment you don’t know what you are. It has taken me years, several relationships, and a marriage to realize that no, these feelings are not going to change nor, despite counseling, prayer, or denial, will they go away; this is the way I am and I have got to deal with it as best I can. The few times that I have shared my feelings with others, I have gotten one of two reactions. The straight guys give the impression of “he’s really queer, he doesn’t want to admit it, and he wants in my pants”. The gay guys seem to respond “he’s another married straight, he wants to see what the other side is like, and he wants in my pants”. The truth is that I am painfully shy when it comes to intimacy of all types and therefore not very aggressive. The response I really want is “he’s a decent enough looking guy, sensitive and intelligent, honest enough to say he is attracted to both sexes, and I’d like to have a loving, caring friendship with him and maybe, just maybe, to get in his pants but we’ll deal with that later”.

    You are a very intelligent and insightful man and very fortunate to have a loving and understanding woman and man with which to share your life. They must be truly special people. Thanks again for sharing your feelings. I am fortunate to have a wonderful, loving, and caring lady in my life that has put up with me for more years than she should and I am truly thankful. My other 50% has, unfortunately, gone lacking for far too long. The emptiness hurts and causes many sleepless nights. It is true, however, that hope does spring eternal in the human spirit. Perhaps tomorrow he’ll get down off his white horse and say: “Let’s do lunch and then go for a long walk and talk on the beach, and, by the way, nice bulge in those jeans, big guy&#33;” The sun breaks through the clouds.

    Andy
     
  18. KidBrown

    KidBrown New Member

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    I had a conversation with one of my friends that was pretty similar to some of your thoughts in this thread Lex. I just figured it must be awesome to be attracted to members of both sexes, but he was telling me about how hard it is to find acceptance in either the straight or gay community sometimes. And yeah, he&#39;s been rejected by guys simply because they don&#39;t want to be in a relationship with someone who finds women sexually attractive as well.....the world doesn&#39;t seem fair in that aspect.

    One funny thing he did tell me though happened in a gay dance club last week. Apparently he was dancing with this amazing looking girl, and she made the comment that he was extremely sexy and funny, but "it was too bad he was gay". He laughed and said that he liked women, they ended up going back to her place and having a lot of fun, haha.

    I can only imagine what it would be like to be attracted to both sexes though, it&#39;s tough enough being of a mixed ethnic background for god&#39;s sake &#33;&#33;

    Where are you at in B-More Lex? I used to live on North Clinton street, that&#39;s about 7-8 blocks from Johns Hopkins hospital, right off Route 40. I was going to apply for a teaching job in the city, but after visiting some of the high schools, I&#39;m almost ashamed to say that it looks like a lost cause for a lot of the kids.
     
  19. Cosota

    Cosota Member

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    In my life I have had sexual relationships with hundreds (if not thousands) of men and a handful of women. In numbers I am much more gay than bisexual.
    I annoy myself often because I have so many doubts that refrain my actions and so many questions for which I find no answers. In terms of my latent bisexuality however I have been very lucky in that I have never felt anxious or confused.
    It just happens that each individual person I meet or come across produces a different impression on me. I don’t have a specific type of man or woman I go for. Different people stimulate different neurons. People fascinate me, and the unclear reasons why some turn me on and others don’t, just make the whole thing more exciting.
    The day I find a partner and if we both chose to have a monogamous relationship, then I don’t see why it should trouble my partner that I am sexually attracted to men and women. If I have committed to have sex only with him or her then the rest is inconsequential.

    I find amazing the speed with which some cultures are becoming more and more acceptant of gay people. In England same sex couples will be able to marry from December this year. Something gay men here fifty years ago wouldn’t have dreamt possible.
    If a big part of society is starting to accept that people can be gay, I think that the obvious next step will be a further understanding of the other different amalgams of sexual desire and loving relationships.
    My impression is that attitudes towards bisexuality are changing for the better although at a less frantic pace.

    On another subject, Lex your comment about the forum being a ‘pornographic playground’ for some, seemed to have a slight derogatory connotation. It reminded me that I often read comments about other posts as being less worthy than others. What makes the forum so dear to me is that you can find in it from the heartfelt thought-provoking argument to the silliest thread.

    I think that even if people hide themselves behind a false identity, an annoying personality, a fake photograph or a stupid remark, they are sharing with us part of their true selves. They are exposing in a degree or other their interests, obsessions, fears, passions, etc.
    I really enjoyed this thread and found it very stimulating but sometimes I feel more like reading the ones about ‘how far do you shoot?’ or ‘my teacher keeps staring at my 15 inch penis&#33;’ or just looking at the galleries.
    I love this group because it is all of those things silly, pornographic, profound, etc. All those things that form part of who we are.

    There will always be people who feel a natural curiosity or sexual stimulation about the subjects touched in this forum, and this curiosity and tension might result in fictional stories, incoherent rambling, repetitive subjects, people asking for photos etc. It is the nature of the internet to give a voice to every John and Peter and we might as well welcome them all.
    We are a funny bunch here at lpsg and maybe that&#39;s why we keep coming back for more.
     
  20. spl98006

    spl98006 New Member

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    Sorry it took me so long to reply, Slam, but I was away for a few days.

    Thankfully, Madame Zora posted some sound advice yesterday, probably better than what I would have written anyway.

    If I could augment her thoughts at all, it would be to point out that based on some of your previous posts, it sounds like you&#39;re not even sure yourself about your feelings toward men vs. your feelings toward women. And guess what? At eighteen, there&#39;s a lot of things about life that you shouldn&#39;t be sure of&#33;

    But this also means that it would most likely be premature to announce to your parents that you are bi, which will almost certainly lead to your having to answer detailed questions about exactly how you feel about men vs. women. You are still figuring that out; therefore, you are not really ready to answer such questions.

    You may also want to think about the following:

    (1) Do you want your parents to be involved in your process of self-discovery, or would you rather keep things to yourself until you have them figured out? The answer to that depends a lot on your existing relationship with your parents - whether they have been there for you in the past when you have faced difficult decisions - as well as how they feel about sexualities other than purely straight. Make sure you do a thorough job of ascertaining this last point. I didn&#39;t, and I got blindsided.

    (2) How independent are you? Are you still living with your folks, are you away at school but still dependent on them financially, or are you completely on your own? Basically, to what extent do you have the ability to make "command decisions" (hi Bruce&#33;) about your life?

    (3) Beyond finances, how geographically independent are you? It&#39;s a lot easier to explore dating different people, both men and women, if you don&#39;t have to worry about running into people you know when you&#39;re out on the town. But you may not have as much access to an established support network of friends.

    (4) How important is it really, for you to be expending mental energy on this right now? I started suspecting that I was into guys when I was 16, but made a semi-conscious decision not to worry about it until several years later. Call it living in the closet if you want, but at that point in my life, I was a lot more concerned with finishing my schooling, working my internships, and getting my career off the ground than I was with dating or sleeping with anyone of either gender.

    I saw another thread floating around the board tonight where some guy was talking about how his active sex life in college caused him to fail out. That&#39;s an extreme, obviously, but consider that maybe, just maybe, this might not be the most important issue for you to be focusing on at this point in your life.
     
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