Board homophobes

[B_Stronzo]

Then answer me this... should they be kicked off? Not trying to pigeon-hole anyone here... but given the freedom of ______________ that goes rampant here, should a homophobe, heterophobe (which I think you may be Strozno.... KIDDING) or racist be able to post as such (so long as they commonly attempt to do so with logic and not attack ppl PERSONALLY)?

No. No one should be 'kicked off' for ignorance. And yes everyone should be able to post. I agree with the mods about that. However I'll restate this as clearly as I can faceking.

I think (much as racism needs due exposure) bias towards homosexuals needs it equally. I hope that's clear.

And I adore heterosexual women which would preclude my being a hetero-anything per se - though I have dabbled in heterosexuality. And I'm not "afraid" of narrow-minded heterosexual men so I'm no kind of "phobe". But I do dislike heartily the thinking of many heterosexual men who appear to think that their sexual orientation ought to dicate global sexuality among all sorts of peoples.

To that degree I'm suspect of what Mr. Moore calls "Stupid White Men".

 

[B_Stronzo]

I find racism and homophobia abhorent here and anywhere else.

Yes you do JustAsking.

I've been educated and heartened by my close connection with two of our heterosexual male posters who seem to "get it" in that way that most heterosexual males in this American society appear do not.

You're in that group too for me. I've found you always considerate and never threatened. To that end you instruct me that all's not lost to those who'd seek to downplay the impact of real bias toward my "fellows".

 

[rawbone8]

I think it's just as natural to be homosexual, or bisexual as it is to be straight, and it is all part of the broad spectrum of sexuality that Kinsey identified as human behaviour and identity. It is offensive to me that people cannot or will not accept others for who they are, and think it is a form of deviancy that justifies their disgust, or pity, or leads to mistreatment and injustice.

 

[Wonderboy]

I accept everyone for who they are.

I thought it was a debate on whether homosexuality was natural or not. Oh, how wrong I was.

This my last post in this thread.

I've explained myself many a time yet people seem to have a hard time reading or recalling the true meanings of words and make their own up. Natural does not imply or state superiority. It means inherited ie born with.

 

[Lex]

One of the interesting set of events of the veiled racism thread was that some hidden people exposed themselves pretty early on by posting in the thread.

Interesting to say the least.

 

[faceking]

No. No one should be 'kicked off' for ignorance. And yes everyone should be able to post. I agree with the mods about that. However I'll restate this as clearly as I can faceking.

Nope, gotcha... loud and clear.

But I do dislike heartily the thinking of many heterosexual men who appear to think that their sexual orientation ought
to dicate global sexuality among all sorts of peoples.

Um.... now given your attacks upon thine, ....although it may be instegating me (and others) to engage in threading.... but given the threads I've particpated in, my friends, my workplace, my candor, a few certain videos, the fact that 90% of my PMs are from boiz (um..........less than 100/0) ...and that I repsond to mostly all [fellow citizens can vouche], and on and on.

If I was one of the 4 homophobes you claim... actually, why am I bothering....

 

[dcwrestlefan]

There are different levels of homophobia.

If someone comes in here and starts name calling, then toss their ass. "Person X is a cum licking AIDS spreading faggot". BUBBYE.

"Gays are unnatural and abnormal and you can't change my mind". My ignore flag works well after explaining once why this is dumb. But perhaps they can be educated. I'm not really up for it anymore. Too old I guess. Should they be banned? Leaning toward no, but don't care alot one way or the other.

"I don't know any gay people but have some questions that might sound stupid..." Perfect. They are sincerely looking for answers, at least I assume so.

Overall, I don't find homophobia to be a problem on the board. There's just a few select people that need to be spanked.

 

[DaveyR]

There are different levels of homophobia.

If someone comes in here and starts name calling, then toss their ass. "Person X is a cum licking AIDS spreading faggot". BUBBYE.

"Gays are unnatural and abnormal and you can't change my mind". My ignore flag works well after explaining once why this is dumb. But perhaps they can be educated. I'm not really up for it anymore. Too old I guess. Should they be banned? Leaning toward no, but don't care alot one way or the other.

"I don't know any gay people but have some questions that might sound stupid..." Perfect. They are sincerely looking for answers, at least I assume so.

Overall, I don't find homophobia to be a problem on the board. There's just a few select people that need to be spanked.

Absolutely spot on DC

 

[B_Stronzo]

It means inherited ie born with.

Wonderboy?

I don't want to throw out your comment out of hand but what does the sentence I've quoted mean? Would you explain it?

What do you mean by 'inherited ie born with'?

 

[mainer1]

From what I've been seeing, homophobes here are relatively rare. But when they do spew, though, I think some of us transfer power to them by over-reacting to their childish rants. Who cares if a few haters use this as a place to act out being 14 again? In my experience, str8 and gay people can get along and tolerate eachother's existences as long as neither group tries to impose it's will on the other. The exceptions can go fuck themselves.

 

[faceking]

One of the interesting set of events of the veiled racism thread was that some hidden people exposed themselves pretty early on by posting in the thread.

Interesting to say the least.

I honestly believe that every human being has some iota of "dscirimination"... it's inherent. Not going to go into biological and evolutionary reasons why (a la neanderthal clans, on down to females in the office space.... the latter being an INCREDIBLE sociological observation, for the record.... could being caddy be worse than racist... I certainly am not sure ;-) ).

It's the "civilized" human being that is accepting of not only others, but that they inherently have a preference for one person/creed/sexuality vs another and identify with a particular group. ONCE this happens.... not matter what... it makes other groups not unfavorable, but not as favorable... ergo, there is some sort of heirarchy of preference for one group vs another. I loathe the thought of all-encompassing human species that is everything to everyone and amogst ourselves. Individuality makes ppl what they are, and thusly provides the grain of sand in the sociological pearl. Anyone who sez they are 100% Ivory-soap pure on all colors, creeds, political backgrounds, sexes, sexuality and so forth... is lying to themselves (which is worse than lying here).

It's the tolerance thereof that counts...


(that hurt, time for bed.... or a Lagavulin)

 

[B_Stronzo]

.

If I was one of the 4 homophobes you claim... actually, why am I bothering....

I think if I can refer to Bronx and several others who championed her thread that you're responding because you are unable to see it in yourself and to be accused of it fucks with your notion of yourself. In other words the louder you decry that you're guilty of it the more guilty you become of it faceking. That's what I inferred from that thread.

Is that it Lex? Am I close to the message there?

I'd address the validity of that notion but I'll wait for a bit. I don't think of you per se as a homophobe faceking. You're not the one or two who immediately spring to mind.

Pichulon is the most obvious with his great rant about the inclination to pass on our DNA when we fuck. Ugh. Quite honestly I don't know why he finds this board so attractive since it's riddled with homosexual men. But stranger things have occured.


I just don't like that you're so unconsidered in so many of your replies and you seem to want generally to diminish anything that makes you address a reality that's not your own. In other words; "fucks with your comfortable reality". Beyond that I have no quarrel with you. I just don't think we like each other very much and we'd not probably get on very well were we to meet in public. That's all.

 

[faceking]

I think if I can refer to Bronx and several others who championed her thread that you're responding because you are unable to see it in yourself and to be accused of it fucks with your notion of yourself. In other words the louder you decry that you're guilty of it the more guilty you become it faceking. That's what I inferred from that thread.

I'm going to assume you meant "the more I decry I'm not, the more I am"?

If so, I figured I wouldn't have to, but I gave it the college try, and the fact that you are calling me again... I'm not going to bother.

Stronzo, it's the notion of myself... and I'm seguing out on other threads where 100/0's seem to homophobes and so forth. Or polictically conservatives... or whomever. It actually can happen... sometimes your threads don't take a negotiable stance.... and given the population of the board, what are trying to achieve... a giant name-calling session with everyone on your side. Not going to say ignorance is bliss... but when/where appropriate, you should relish in a CIVIL (and I can't fucking repeat that enough with you) debate, whether right or wrong.

I've never minded the way someone voted, spoke, decided, felt... so long as they were concrete, civil and thought-out on their subject. Otherwise, if you keep their opinion in the closet, the end-result usually winds up far worse (and you can imagine or have seen how that turns out).

 

[faceking]

I'm going to assume you meant "the more I decry I'm not, the more I am"?

If so, I figured I wouldn't have to, but I gave it the college try, and the fact that you are calling me again... I'm not going to bother.

Stronzo, it's the notion of myself... and I'm seguing out on other threads where 100/0's seem to homophobes and so forth. Or polictically conservatives... or whomever. It actually can happen... sometimes your threads don't take a negotiable stance.... and given the population of the board, what are trying to achieve... a giant name-calling session with everyone on your side. Not going to say ignorance is bliss... but when/where appropriate, you should relish in a CIVIL (and I can't fucking repeat that enough with you) debate, whether right or wrong.

I've never minded the way someone voted, spoke, decided, felt... so long as they were concrete, civil and thought-out on their subject. Otherwise, if you keep their opinion in the closet, the end-result usually winds up far worse (and you can imagine or have seen how that turns out).

that was awful grammer... excuse absence of propositions and what-not.

 

[faceking]

that was awful grammer... excuse absence of propositions and what-not.

spelling has gone awry... time to go ;-)

 

[GoneA]

Everything is always worse when you're on the receiving end. It's unfortunate, but I'm sure some straight people who experience racism, personally, think it's worse than homophobia. In fact, some may go a step further and say homophobia really isn't an issue at all and the people who fight against it are essentially making much ado about nothing.

Conversely, I'm sure there are gay men and women who feel that racism simply can't hole a candle to the impact of homophobia. Much like their straight counterparts, some may even go the extra mile and say, "Racism? C'mon, that shit's old!"

While each group may be building the same tower, they do speak very different languages. The plight of the homosexual, quite obviously, is more intense from a homosexual’s perspective and the blow of racial discrimination always comes down harder and faster on those who are directly in its path. However, at least we can take pride in the fact that we are working towards a central goal and, possibly, enjoy each other’s company while doing it.

 

[B_Stronzo]

I'm going to assume you meant "the more I decry I'm not, the more I am"?

Yes. That's the logic that was presented to me.

Stronzo, it's the notion of myself... and I'm seguing out on other threads where 100/0's seem to homophobes and so forth. Or polictically conservatives... or whomever. It actually can happen... sometimes your threads don't take a negotiable stance.... and given the population of the board, what are trying to achieve... a giant name-calling session with everyone on your side. Not going to say ignorance is bliss... but when/where appropriate, you should relish in a CIVIL (and I can't fucking repeat that enough with you) debate, whether right or wrong.

I'm sorry you've lost me in the first section of the above quote.

'negotiable stance'? There's no negotiating ignorance. If that's something you're willing to negotiate we have nothing further to discuss (which may easily be the case).

And I'd ask you not to critique your opinion of me here. I'm available to you in pm if you'd care to take issue with me personally. And I think my civility in cases where it's due speaks for itself. You're pure reaction fk but I didn't begin this thread to denounce your character. Show me the same courtesy. I'm addressing your indifference to a very specific phenomenon. That's all.

I've never minded the way someone voted, spoke, decided, felt... so long as they were concrete, civil and thought-out on their subject. Otherwise, if you keep their opinion in the closet, the end-result usually winds up far worse (and you can imagine or have seen how that turns out).

I agree.

So why do you take direct aim so often without any real reason or civility in your approach?

 

[B_Stronzo]

Everything is always worse when you're on the receiving end. It's unfortunate, but I'm sure some straight people who experience racism, personally, think it's worse than homophobia. In fact, some may go a step further and say homophobia really isn't an issue at all and the people who fight against it are essentially making much ado about nothing.

Conversely, I'm sure there are gay men and women who feel that racism simply can't hole a candle to the impact of homophobia. Much like their straight counterparts, some may even go the extra mile and say, "Racism? C'mon, that shit's old!"

While each group may be building the same tower, they do speak very different languages. The plight of the homosexual, quite obviously, is more intense from a homosexual’s perspective and the blow of racial discrimination always comes down harder and faster on those who are directly in its path. However, at least we can take pridne in the fact that we are working towards a central goal and, enjoy each other's company while doing it.

You present the situation exactly.

The part I made bold is idealism. I don't see the 'cental goal' in play. That's why I'm addressing this thing GoneA. But nonetheless your ability are perspective and logic is profoundly "spot on" as my friend Daverock would say.

 

[mtguy1972]

ugh...where to begin...

this board is a cross-section of the larger culture, and as such, will be representative of that culture (e.g. gay, straight, bi, educated, ignorant, open-minded, closed-minded). it stands to reason that the same anti-gay rhetoric found in society would show up here.

anti-gay comments and beliefs are still tolerated by much of the U.S. culture, where racist ones are not. for example, how many threads have you seen entitled: "Is being black unnatural?" and how many comments do you see that say "I can say that being black/latino/asian is unnatural without being racist." it's ludacris.

i think the term "homophobic" might be a bit of a misnomer. it seems what we're really talking about is "heteronormativity," which means marginalizing gays/lesbians by saying that heterosexual is the only way to be. we see it all the time in the U.S. (anti-marriage amendments, adoption, etc.) this speaks to the privelage that heterosexuals have, many of whom prefer to remain ignorant, bury their head in the sand and call anyone who works for social change "whiners." i love the people that have never traveled outside of their town or state who have all of these grand ideas about what's right and wrong and the way the world "should" be when they have about as much world experience as a newt. (nothing against newts).

read a book. go to school. go to a diversity seminar. open your mind. listen. be willing to learn. make an effort.

don't just sit there and spew hurtful comments and act like they're not hurtful and profess your right to say them.

 

[B_Stronzo]

ugh...where to begin...

this board is a cross-section of the larger culture, and as such, will be representative of that culture (e.g. gay, straight, bi, educated, ignorant, open-minded, closed-minded). it stands to reason that the same anti-gay rhetoric found in society would show up here.

hi mtguy,

I don't think this board's representative in the least. It's too populated by gay men to be so.

"Is being black unnatural?" and how many comments do you see that say "I can say that being black/latino/asian is unnatural without being racist." it's ludacrous.

You've just illustrated the reason I felt it necessary to begin this topic anew. Thank you.

I think the term "homophobic" might be a bit of a misnomer. it seems what we're really talking about is "heteronormativity," which means marginalizing gays/lesbians by saying that heterosexual is the only way to be.

I think the irrationality of the thing is fear-based so I think "phobic" applies.

we see it all the time in the U.S. (anti-marriage amendments, adoption, etc.) this speaks to the privelage that heterosexuals have, many of whom prefer to remain ignorant, bury their head in the sand and call anyone who works for social change "whiners." i love the people that have never traveled outside of their town or state who have all of these grand ideas about what's right and wrong and the way the world "should" be when they have about as much world experience as a newt. (nothing against newts).

I despise newts! :wink: Yes. World experience is essential. Insularism is deadly.