Buffett says Obama needs to couch healthcare as a national emergency

Pitbull

Sexy Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2006
Posts
3,659
Media
0
Likes
51
Points
268
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
"Right-wing authoritarians tend to exhibit cognitive errors and symptoms of faulty reasoning. Specifically, they are more likely to make incorrect inferences from evidence and to hold contradictory ideas that result from compartmentalized thinking. They are also more likely to uncritically accept insufficient evidence that supports their beliefs, and they are less likely to acknowledge their own limitations.

"Authoritarian politicians are more likely to be in the Conservative or Reform party in Canada, or the Republican Party in the United States. They generally have a conservative economic philosophy, are highly nationalistic, oppose abortion, support capital punishment, oppose gun control legislation, and do not value social equality.

"Authoritarians are generally more favorable to punishment and control than personal freedom and diversity. . . They tend to be ethnocentric and prejudiced against racial and ethnic minorities,and homosexuals."

Right-wing authoritarianism - Wiki

Democracy Now! of the NC High Country: Authoritarian Mindset

t r u t h o u t | Democracy and the Threat of Authoritarianism

Seems like they's alot of em round here.


Quoting Left Wing Authoritarians with their opinions of people who disagree with them like it is science.

I bet it makes you feel good.


 

BiItalianBro

Sexy Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2006
Posts
1,195
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
268
Location
Chicago & Louisville KY
Sexuality
60% Gay, 40% Straight
Gender
Male
Frankly, I continue to hope that peaceful reform, arrived at through the legislative process continues to fail... I can't wait to see the look of utter horror on the faces of our sociopathic Rightwing Overlords™ when the country is shut down due to widespread rioting in a few years, and its their homes and businesses that are looted and burned down.

This...i am afraid...is exactly where it is all headed :confused:
 

1kmb1

Expert Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Aug 26, 2006
Posts
770
Media
0
Likes
175
Points
363
Location
Tucson (Arizona, United States)
Verification
View
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
I believe the point that Buffett makes is this:

Essentially the government is already paying for the cost of the uninsured - as most need to use the emergency room as their primary doctor.

That being said, why do we need to rob Medicare of $500 billion and tax the public another $500 billion to $1 trillion to implement this new bill?

Between current healthcare costs and costs incurred by the uninsured - shouldn't a new and improved system be able to reduce the cost of healthcare by adding new efficiencies and standards?

We are already paying more than everyone else, have less beds/patient and less doctors/patient than other developed countries. So why are we keeping those low ratios and adding still more costs????

There was an doctor on CNN late last week that said that a patient comes in - and essentially they perform one test which the patient needs, and three other tests simply to keep in the file so that they don't get sued. Four tests instead of one - a quadrupling of cost to avoid lawsuits.

where are you getting a trillion dollars from?
 

Pitbull

Sexy Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2006
Posts
3,659
Media
0
Likes
51
Points
268
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
where are you getting a trillion dollars from?

It is in a lot of places:

http://www.nypost.com/f/print/news/...health_plan_that_costs_p8PNdwJxzy8FX1opiHedqJ

Obama Health Plan Costs $950 Billion - WSJ.com

Signs of Life: Congress Stirs, And Health Care Has a Pulse - The Note

The original source is the White House

From the ABC source above:

“White House adviser Nancy-Ann DeParle estimated that the changes proposed by the White House would increase the cost of the overall health care bill to $950 billion over 10 years"

But also from ABC source:

“CBO cannot provide a cost estimate for the proposal without additional detail, and, even if such detail were provided, analyzing the proposal would be a time-consuming process that could not be completed this week.”

Considering how frequently we get new proposals that no one has read and congress is being asked to vote on in a big hurry, it would be too much to ask if anyone has really studied and analyzed the cost and impact of any of the proposals. They have not.

If the Obama White House is saying $950 Billion the cost will probably be much much higher.
 

1kmb1

Expert Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Aug 26, 2006
Posts
770
Media
0
Likes
175
Points
363
Location
Tucson (Arizona, United States)
Verification
View
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
It is in a lot of places:

http://www.nypost.com/f/print/news/...health_plan_that_costs_p8PNdwJxzy8FX1opiHedqJ

Obama Health Plan Costs $950 Billion - WSJ.com

Signs of Life: Congress Stirs, And Health Care Has a Pulse - The Note

The original source is the White House

From the ABC source above:

“White House adviser Nancy-Ann DeParle estimated that the changes proposed by the White House would increase the cost of the overall health care bill to $950 billion over 10 years"

But also from ABC source:

“CBO cannot provide a cost estimate for the proposal without additional detail, and, even if such detail were provided, analyzing the proposal would be a time-consuming process that could not be completed this week.”

Considering how frequently we get new proposals that no one has read and congress is being asked to vote on in a big hurry, it would be too much to ask if anyone has really studied and analyzed the cost and impact of any of the proposals. They have not.

If the Obama White House is saying $950 Billion the cost will probably be much much higher.

so that would be 95 billion a year then?
 

B_talltpaguy

Experimental Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Posts
2,331
Media
0
Likes
17
Points
123
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
^That's the dumbest part in all of this... The idiot trolls here howl that it will cost a trillion dollars... They leave out the part where that is over a DECADE. During that same time frame, the Federal government will spend somewhere around $35-45 TRILLION dollars on the total budget. This entire issue is over something that is only ever going to amount to 2-3% of the budget. That's it. We can cover 30 million people and dramatically slow the growth in healthcare costs for everyone else with just 2% of the budget... Oh, and the plan won't contribute a dime to the deficit over that time, because the bill is revenue neutral (it actually pays off a small amount of debt)

For a comparison of what a "trillion dollars over ten years" buys you, remember these spending bills from the Bush Years? The Republican Medicare Part D scam will cost taxpayers something like $700 Billion over 10 years (did you get that? Their 'free market' solution costs almost as much, yet it only covers a small facet of overall healthcare, for just a small fraction of the population (prescription drug subsidy for seniors). And they borrowed to pay for it)... The Bush tax cuts for the rich cost the rest of us $1.3 Trillion over 10 years, and was also paid for on credit... The Iraq War will cost something along the lines of $2 Trillion dollars over 10 years, and that too was paid for with credit.
 
Last edited:

B_VinylBoy

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Posts
10,363
Media
0
Likes
68
Points
123
Location
Boston, MA / New York, NY
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
^That's the dumbest part in all of this... The idiot trolls here howl that it will cost a trillion dollars... They leave out the part where that is over a DECADE. During that same time frame, the Federal government will spend somewhere around $35-45 TRILLION dollars on the total budget. This entire issue is over something that is only ever going to amount to 2-3% of the budget. That's it. We can cover 30 million people and dramatically slow the growth in healthcare costs for everyone else with just 2% of the budget... Oh, and the plan won't contribute a dime to the deficit over that time, because the bill is revenue neutral (it actually pays off a small amount of debt)

It's little details like this that further illustrates how purposely dishonest some of the ranting really is. Then, when the details are presented they all make a rebuttal as if their name was Joe Wilson. How can anyone reason with someone who maintains such belligerence?
 

B_talltpaguy

Experimental Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Posts
2,331
Media
0
Likes
17
Points
123
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
There's no reasoning with such people... This is at a point now where the rest of us will be dragging them forward, kicking and screaming. They might come peacefully, they might just die off of old age, or we might have a few riots and have to knock some sense into them. Either way, they're out numbered and out of time.


But this is ALWAYS how it has gone in the history of American society... The progressives push the country forward, and the wingnuts do everything they can to stop it... Think about every domestic social issue we have ever faced in this country... The pattern is consistent and without exception. The conservatives always wind up on the wrong side of history. Slavery, women's rights, Native rights, prohibition, education, medicine, workers rights, economic regulation, discrimination... They've been wrong about ALL of it, without fail, 100% of the time.
 
Last edited:
3

392847

Guest
There's no reasoning with such people... This is at a point now where the rest of us will be dragging them forward, kicking and screaming. They might come peacefully, they might just die off of old age, or we might have a few riots and have to knock some sense into them. Either way, they're out numbered and out of time.


But this is ALWAYS how it has gone in the history of American society... The progressives push the country forward, and the wingnuts do everything they can to stop it... Think about every domestic social issue we have ever faced in this country... The pattern is consistent and without exception. The conservatives always wind up on the wrong side of history. Slavery, women's rights, Native rights, prohibition, education, medicine, workers rights, economic regulation, discrimination... They've been wrong about ALL of it, without fail, 100% of the time.

I've always wondered how those people that you see in the videos and documentaries hosing and beating people during the Civil Rights movement feel now. Some of those people are still alive and if I were them...I'd feel really ashamed and embarrassed.

The GOP and their teabagging puppets should take note. This could be you in 20-40 yrs...old, outdated and embarrassed :frown1:
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Pitbull

Sexy Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2006
Posts
3,659
Media
0
Likes
51
Points
268
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
there is a big difference between 100 billion a year and 1 trillion a year (which is what was being implied) how many useless things do we spend that much on? the money is there, its just being wasted.

Trouble with math and economics?
The numbers are big so they might not seem real to you.

If the money is there and being wasted, I would love to see $100 billion in spending cuts. Where are the spending cut proposals?

(This is not an endorsement of the Obama Health Care Plan if $100 Billion could be found. There is way too much wrong with his plan. The whole thing needs to be scrapped. Real solutions involve tackling the issue one problem at a time and not replacing the whole system with a new one.)
 

B_VinylBoy

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Posts
10,363
Media
0
Likes
68
Points
123
Location
Boston, MA / New York, NY
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
I've always wondered how those people that you see in the videos and documentaries hosing and beating people during the Civil Rights movement feel now. Some of those people are still alive and if I were them...I'd feel really ashamed and embarrassed.

The GOP and their teabagging puppets should take note. This could be you in 20-40 yrs...old, outdated and embarrassed :frown1:

It won't even take 20-40 years for that to happen... thanks to today's technology. This is one of the very first election cycles where we have such a robust system of communication in place and many people utilizes it. Anything can be recorded, uploaded and distributed within moments. It's never been this easy to be this informed and connected to what people in Government are saying or doing.

By the time Obama is out of office in 2012 or 2016, there will be enough deplorable comments and actions to use to prove the very point. Hell, I'm sure you could do it right now with just 2 years of random footage and quotes.
 
3

392847

Guest
It won't even take 20-40 years for that to happen... thanks to today's technology. This is one of the very first election cycles where we have such a robust system of communication in place and many people utilizes it. Anything can be recorded, uploaded and distributed within moments. It's never been this easy to be this informed and connected to what people in Government are saying or doing.

By the time Obama is out of office in 2012 or 2016, there will be enough deplorable comments and actions to use to prove the very point. Hell, I'm sure you could do it right now with just 2 years of random footage and quotes.

Good observation, VB. I didn't even take that into consideration...
 

B_talltpaguy

Experimental Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Posts
2,331
Media
0
Likes
17
Points
123
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
^What kind of idiot leaves their finger in the way when closing a window?... lol, you're such a dork.

The whole thing needs to be scrapped. Real solutions involve tackling the issue one problem at a time and not replacing the whole system with a new one.)
lolol... I would love to go into work one day and tell my boss that... Sorry sir, but I can't design this whole project all at once. I can only design one small part at a time, then we'll build it and see how it turns out, and then we'll build another part... And in 20 years, our client will have the office building they paid us to design and build!

Here's a better suggestion, if you're incapable of comprehending the complexities of such an issue, then step aside so that the rest of us who are capable, can handle our business. Once you've educated yourself enough that you are capable of functioning like a normal grown adult, get back to us and we'll let you in on the decision making process too.
 
Last edited: