Can Obama and Clinton repair the rift?

Industrialsize

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i think Kennedy is supporting a needed change in politics. while I do like Hillary, her electability is of concern to me. Obama I think is more electable at this time.

If I stand to be corrected...let me know
Obama polls better against any of the republican contenders than Hillary.....I agree he has a better shot in the general..........but I'm sure someone will correct me..:eek:
 

swordfishME

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A lot of it may be all hype, but one thing I have noticed is that Democrats have this nasty way on inadvertently destroying themselves. Both Obama and Clinton want to be President so badly, that they're willing to get a little too dirty with the politics. The verbal bashing and personal attacks are bound to turn off a lot of undecided voters.

One thing I do give Republicans credit for is how they manage to rally behind their candidate. Even if they don't win the nomination, they all support the one that does have it. They realize that in the end, all they want is a Republican in office for that would mean they would have a better chance in having their conservative voices and opinions heard. Keep in mind, this is the ONLY thing I give Republicans credit for. :biggrin1:

I just hope that after the smoke clears, the Dems can put aside their differences and focus on the real prize. I'm more than ready to vote for either Obama or Clinton, as soon as they can figure out who they want to lead the party.

Well said.

At the end of the day, the republican base will go and vote for the republican candidate even if he is a pro-choice, pro-gay liberal conservative.

Dems whose candidate is not on the ticket will stay home instead of supporting the party's nominee.

Who will Win? You do the math.
 

Principessa

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There are a significant number of voters who will never vote for a black man.

There's also a significant number of voters who will never vote for a woman.

Thus my comment about throwing what looks to be a very important election.

That has been my concern since the beginning.
 

davec94

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it's not that significant, especially given the political situation. if there ever was a time that a female or black Democrat could fly past such prejudices and into the Whitehouse it will be this election.
 

rob_just_rob

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it's not that significant, especially given the political situation. if there ever was a time that a female or black Democrat could fly past such prejudices and into the Whitehouse it will be this election.

That's the thing. There was not ever such a time. And even if the time is now, why add a degree of difficulty to what ought to be a slam dunk election win?

Time will tell, I suppose.
 

davec94

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That's the thing. There was not ever such a time. And even if the time is now, why add a degree of difficulty to what ought to be a slam dunk election win?

Time will tell, I suppose.

Because they are the candidates who are winning the delagates. It's not like Dean points at his choice for Democratic candidate and says 'you're the man.' A woman, a black man, and a bunch of white dudes are the ones campaigning and the American democratic community has by and large decided that one of these two will be the one to contest the next presidential election on the virtues of the candidates. If that doesn't speak to their electability then i don't really know what will.
 

Industrialsize

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Well said.

At the end of the day, the republican base will go and vote for the republican candidate even if he is a pro-choice, pro-gay liberal conservative.

Dems whose candidate is not on the ticket will stay home instead of supporting the party's nominee.

Who will Win? You do the math.
I think you may be underestimating the Depth of Bush hatred by democrats that started with him being crowned president over Gore by the Supreme Court. It has been festering and growing in the heart of Democrats for the past 7 years. Hatred is a POWERFUL motivational force, exhibit the RECORD turnout of Democrats and Independents in every caucus and primary held thus far. The Democrats and democratically leaning Independents WILL turn out in record numbers come November.
 

dong20

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That's the thing. There was not ever such a time. And even if the time is now, why add a degree of difficulty to what ought to be a slam dunk election win?

Time will tell, I suppose.

Perhaps they believe it's a slam dunk election despite these 'difficulties'. Also, if they're right they may (depending on who one supports of course) have the added bonus end result of a competent administration. I suspect they're right, on the first point at least.

As you say, time will tell, quite a lot can go hideously wrong between now and November.
 

swordfishME

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Because they are the candidates who are winning the delagates. It's not like Dean points at his choice for Democratic candidate and says 'you're the man.' A woman, a black man, and a bunch of white dudes are the ones campaigning and the American democratic community has by and large decided that one of these two will be the one to contest the next presidential election on the virtues of the candidates. If that doesn't speak to their electability then i don't really know what will.

I firmly believe that a party's candidate should only be chosen by voters affiliated with that party. In most of these primaries anyone is allowed to vote for candidates for either party. So it is happening that republicans are crossing over and voting or Obama because he would be easier to beat in an general election and democrats are voting for McCain because he will look like a fossil compared to the dem candidate.
 

davec94

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Well said.

At the end of the day, the republican base will go and vote for the republican candidate even if he is a pro-choice, pro-gay liberal conservative.

Dems whose candidate is not on the ticket will stay home instead of supporting the party's nominee.

Who will Win? You do the math.

This is the problem with the current state of American politics. Obama is campaigning on a platform of inclusion and of unity across party lines. Whether or not he will be able to acheive that remains to be seen, but he's the only one who i can see making a real attempt to do this on the Democratic side, and probably the only one who can really inspire outside of his base enough to accomplish it.
 

davec94

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I firmly believe that a party's candidate should only be chosen by voters affiliated with that party. In most of these primaries anyone is allowed to vote for candidates for either party. So it is happening that republicans are crossing over and voting or Obama because he would be easier to beat in an general election and democrats are voting for McCain because he will look like a fossil compared to the dem candidate.
it varies by state to state. Some require you to register as a democat the previous year. Republicans are not, in any meaningful amount switching over to Obama to sabotage the Democratic candidacy. In fact many republicans are actually switching to Obama because they believe in Obama, which speaks even more to his electability. I strongly disagree that Obama would be easier to beat than Hillary - in fact even the GOP pundits are speaking to their fear of an Obama candiacy, because he would extremely difficult to beat.
 

swordfishME

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it varies by state to state. Some require you to register as a democat the previous year. Republicans are not, in any meaningful amount switching over to Obama to sabotage the Democratic candidacy. In fact many republicans are actually switching to Obama because they believe in Obama, which speaks even more to his electability. I strongly disagree that Obama would be easier to beat than Hillary - in fact even the GOP pundits are speaking to their fear of an Obama candiacy, because he would extremely difficult to beat.

Obama would be easier to beat because he has more negatives that would get the republican party base out to vote in droves. You really think that if Obama was that difficult to beat republican pundits would be praising him to high hells rather than tearing him to shreads? At the end of the day each party wants the other to nominate a weak candidate and IMO Obama is the weaker candidate on the democratic side. Obama can one day in the future make a good president but my fear is that he will get nominated this election and loose it and will not get another shot.
 

Industrialsize

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Obama would be easier to beat because he has more negatives that would get the republican party base out to vote in droves. You really think that if Obama was that difficult to beat republican pundits would be praising him to high hells rather than tearing him to shreads? At the end of the day each party wants the other to nominate a weak candidate and IMO Obama is the weaker candidate on the democratic side. Obama can one day in the future make a good president but my fear is that he will get nominated this election and loose it and will not get another shot.
I'm at a loss.......what are Obama's higher negatives as compared to the baggage that any Clinton comes with, and If i'm not wrong, in the last republican debate, the Candidates talked solely about senator Clinton as if she was the presumptive nominee.
 

davec94

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Obama would be easier to beat because he has more negatives that would get the republican party base out to vote in droves. You really think that if Obama was that difficult to beat republican pundits would be praising him to high hells rather than tearing him to shreads? At the end of the day each party wants the other to nominate a weak candidate and IMO Obama is the weaker candidate on the democratic side. Obama can one day in the future make a good president but my fear is that he will get nominated this election and loose it and will not get another shot.

More negatives that would get the republican base what? You realize that Hillary is a Clinton right? That's like carrying a bag of brains in zombie city.
 

swordfishME

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I'm at a loss.......what are Obama's higher negatives as compared to the baggage that any Clinton comes with, and If i'm not wrong, in the last republican debate, the Candidates talked solely about senator Clinton as if she was the presumptive nominee.

She is a Clinton but he has a muslim father and a muslim middle name. Guess which one irks the fundie christian base of the republican party more?

This election is going to be won on how well the parties can get their bases out to vote for them. If Condi Rice joins the republican ticket, all of Obama's advantage with the black voters is gone.
 

Industrialsize

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I'd say the name Clinton irks ALL republicans more......he wasn't going to get nor does he need the Evangelical vote to win anyway.........and from what I've read, Condi is not exactly highly regarded in the Black Community.,I've read they see her as the water carrier for GW and Cheney and supressed her OWN views on the war and other foreign policy issues.
 

davec94

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She is a Clinton but he has a muslim father and a muslim middle name. Guess which one irks the fundie christian base of the republican party more?

This election is going to be won on how well the parties can get their bases out to vote for them. If Condi Rice joins the republican ticket, all of Obama's advantage with the black voters is gone.

His name is not a bigger detriment than Clinton's history and husband, not to mention the fact that Obama has so much more charisma...enough to provoke JFK allegories from...JFK's daughter.
Condi wouldn't change anything. Blacks vote democrat in force anyway so that really won't budge anything - especially since she would be behind a white man.
 

Whopper-lee

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For the sake of the D-party...they are no choice but to mend this rift and move forward for the good of the people who will vote in this important election year.
"United We Stand...Divided We Fall"
"If You Don't Stand for Something...You'll Fall for Anything!"