Christianity and sexual beliefs

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670145

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Every..and I do mean every christian sect puts the man as the head of the household in a marriage...just as christ is suppose to be head of the church.

So oh yes.....you can pull made up terms like "complementarianism" out of your butt and talk about supporting each other but in actual fact as far as christian marriages are concerned that only works so long as the man is in charge.

The snake oil your selling about equality in a christian marriage doesn't wash.

Nice to meet you Dragonfly20.

You say Jesus is the head of the Church. Well ... Jesus died for his church. Apparently that's what called for when you are the head. And specifically, Christian men are called to love their wives as Jesus loves the church. That's quite a love. I mean, if a Christian man is willing to put his very life on the line for the woman he loves ... I don't think he's going to treat her very badly. In fact I think he's going to treat her quite nicely if he's a real follower of Christ.

I mean, Jesus summed up the whole ball of wax in Matthew 22:37-39 when he said "love God" and "love others". Nothing about making your wife do pushups in the mud.

Anyway, not looking to fight over this. Believe what you want. Be in charge if you want to be in charge. Or even better - take turns being in charge. Or maybe some things you be in charge, and some things your partner be in charge - split it up that way. Whatever works best for you.

Thanks.
 

The Dragon

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So..I was right the man is the head of the household like christ is the head of the chruch....putting some bullshit spin on it won't make it go down any better.

There can be no equality in a marriage if someone's in charge!
 
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There can be no equality in a marriage if someone's in charge!


I have no idea what you mean by "in charge".

I mean, let's say a married couple wants to go out to dinner. I'm guessing they mutually decide on a place, or maybe they take turns picking a place. Or let's say they want to paint a room a new color. How do they decide the color? They either agree on a color, or they take turns, like "you picked the color of the last room, so I will pick the color of this room". Right? I mean, isn't that how mature people that love each other do things?

So by "in charge", do you mean that the man gets to pick every restaurant they eat at, and pick every color of paint for every room?

Because ... that's definitely not a Christian marriage. But, I don't think your issue is with Christians so much as it is with males in general, because "boys are stupid, throw rocks at them".

Anyway, we can agree to disagree, and move on. There's no point in arguing this on a big penis message board. I hope you are "in charge", or do everything 50-50, or however it works best for you. I never said I was a Christian, and I thought my Taoist avatar was a dead give-away.

Thanks.
 

The Dragon

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It was pretty obvious that you had and have no idea what you were talking about when it came to christian teaching and it's basic tenants and now you've proven it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Thanks.
 
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And you have demonstrated to me your sheer mastery of the subject matter. I should have known better than to even open my mouth. I stand here a humbled man. Thank you for educating me. :wink:

Thanks again.
 

D_Rosalind Mussell

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I just checked that link. I think if I started acting like a "surrendered wife" he would think I had lost my mind. I'd also like to point out that my feisty, passionate nature is what he first fell in love with. I'll tell my husband about this phenomena and relate his response. I can guarantee you it will be something along the lines of "Is that woman smoking crack?"
 

D_Rosalind Mussell

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Okay, I just told my husband about this surrendered wife business. Here is how our conversation went after I explained it to him:

Me: What would you think if I started acting like that?
He: I would wonder what the hell you had been smoking and where you got it.
Me: You mean you don't want me to act like that?
He: NO, no thank you.
Me: I thought you'd appreciate the break.(jk) Really, though, don't you think a lot of men would love this?
He: Some maybe, but not me.
Me: Why do you say that?
He: Some men are just weak and can't handle women.

There you go.
 
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670145

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I asked my wife if she would be a "surrendered wife" and she gave me "the look". Hey, after 20 years, it was worth a try. She does let me think I am in charge, but I know who is really the boss!

Kind of turning the tables here, but I wonder if the whole "cuckold and hotwife" thing is like having a "surrendered husband"?
 

petite

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I don't understand how it's supposed to be emasculating for a wife to tell her husband that she believes he's capable of making more money and he deserves it, so he should ask for a raise. I would think that's showing that she believes in him. It's not submissive, but it's supportive, which I think is a lot more important in a life partner.
 
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If I stoop down and lower myself to give you a boost up, some might say I am being submissive, while others would say I am being supportive.

If I am above you and I reach down to give you a hand up, some might say I am being "dominant" or "in charge", while others might say I am being helpful and supportive.

It's all a matter of perspective, I've learned. Some people are coming from a negative place; others from a positive one.

Thanks.
 

petite

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Okay, I just told my husband about this surrendered wife business. Here is how our conversation went after I explained it to him:

Me: What would you think if I started acting like that?
He: I would wonder what the hell you had been smoking and where you got it.
Me: You mean you don't want me to act like that?
He: NO, no thank you.
Me: I thought you'd appreciate the break.(jk) Really, though, don't you think a lot of men would love this?
He: Some maybe, but not me.
Me: Why do you say that?
He: Some men are just weak and can't handle women.

There you go.

I would think that men who want that from their wives are weak, too.

I asked my hubby and he said he thought the book ought to be called How to Become a Stepford Wife and that only men who would truly be happy with an android would want his wife to act like that. He said he'd rather have a friend.
 
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paneros

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Rather that waste your money on a book like that I recommend all men and women should read David Shade's 'The Secrets of Female Sexuality' .... it's hilarious and actually useful.

This isn't an exact quote, but there was a bit in this book that said that a man wants a women who 'is a slave in the kitchen, a lady in the living room and a slut in the bedroom' and that a woman wants a man who is 'a gentleman in the living room, a workhorse at the office and an animal in the bedroom'.

His book explained male and female dynamics and how we complement eachother such as the Shiva/Shakti design (or Yin/Yang etc)... and this dynamics holds true for gay and lesbain couples two.

Lovers/life partners are complementary to one another and should support eachother in such a way. No surrendering required!

Must read that one and see!

Another good one is: Mating in Captivity - Unlocking Erotic Intelligence by Esther Perel. As interesting and informed read, though her writing style gets a bit tedious, as she's fairly self-congratulatory throughout.

Then there's the unbelievably psychologically unhealthy
"The Rules (TM): Time-Tested Secrets for Capturing the Heart of Mr. Right" by Ellen Fein and Shelly Schneider. My girlfriend at the time, a psychologist, got it to see what all all the hype was about, as it was taking America by storm. She couldn't believe it, as it boils down to ... manipulation and subterfuge are how to establish and hold onto a successful marriage.
I read a few chapters of it too, and really thought it was a tongue-in-cheek satire - I could not believe anyone was touting this stuff as being useful to establish intimate relationships, as it sounded like 1950's agony aunt advice. It makes for unintentionally hilarious and appalling reading, and I laughed so much at it that I had tears coming out of my eyes at the bizzareness of the suggestions in it.

The reviews on Amazon.com will give you an idea of how it polarises readers -
"Radon for the soul" says one;
"Sexist garbage", another;
"Every girl needs this book";
"Fun Reinforcement";
"This is a must read"
"I'd say this is just about the worst book ever written" .. and so on for 588 reviews.

Here's a few of the rules (paraphrased - I don't have a copy) - read and weep!:

"Never let a man see you iwthout make-up. Get up about an hour before he does to put on your face."

"Don't make eye contact or chase men and they will want to chase you."

"Rarely return his calls"

"If you stay over at his place (and never before the 3rd date) get up early and say: "Oh my God I've got so many interesting things to do today!". This gives the impression you have an active and fulfilled life, and are not just waiting around for him to call".


So... good if you need at laugh, terrible if you were actually looking for advice on having real fulfilling relationships with authentic men.

Did any of the contributers on this thread read it? Any idea why was it such a bestseller in the states? Are a large enough section of the population so disconnected in their ability to form fulfilling relationships that, from their perspective, it seemed like useful advice?
 

D_Rosalind Mussell

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I don't understand how it's supposed to be emasculating for a wife to tell her husband that she believes he's capable of making more money and he deserves it, so he should ask for a raise. I would think that's showing that she believes in him. It's not submissive, but it's supportive, which I think is a lot more important in a life partner.

I wholeheartedly agree, Petite. I think this type of communication is essential in a marriage. Spousal opinion is important because they know us in a way that no one else does and vice versa, therefore affording us a perspective no one else has. Hubby and I communicate this way all the time and it works very well for us, no "submission" required.
 

D_Rosalind Mussell

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I would think that men who want that from their wives are weak, too.

I asked my hubby and he said he thought the book ought to be called How to Become a Stepford Wife and that only men who would truly be happy with an android would want his wife to act like that. He said he'd rather have a friend.

Stepford Wife, the perfect analogy to this surrendered wife business. I agree with TheBF, I would rather have a friend than someone who "surrendered" themselves to me and held back everything that makes them who they are.