1. Thirdlegproduction

    Thirdlegproduction Formerly WhiteMonst3r
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    I heard and read several stories about people (including friends) coming out of the closet.

    Usually they have been walking around with the tought that they are gay for a long period of time and then they want to tell the world about it.

    Maybe I'm just indifferent or have no ability to relate to gay/bisexual people but the idea of coming out to the world is just ridiculous to me.

    By no means am I saying that you should hide your orientation but why do you feel the need to tell the world about what sex you prefer.
    If I'm interest in your sexual orientation I will ask you about it.

    For example I had a friend of mine who told me and all her friends to come to her house because she had something very important to tell.
    She told us she was gay which didn't really come as a surprise but I was like "this is why you called all of us to come here?"

    It's not any of my business who you share your bed with, you could fuck a horse or have massive orgies for all I care what you do in your bedroom and who you do it with is alllll your business.


    To me it feels like those people on the corner of the street preaching to you about god, and I'm like why would you force your shit uppon me in my daily life if I have any interest in religion I will come find you.

    So I might have stepped on a few toes here but I have no intention of insulting anyone I'm just curious why someones sexual orientation has to be known to the world.
     
  2. unabear09

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    interesting post. Hope you don't get raked over the coals for it
     
  3. bigbull29

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    I think sometimes people see it as "secret" they're hiding, and they feel major relief once they reveal it to certain people (family, friends etc). Some people just think that asserting their sexuality is very important. Most heterosexuals do everyday, so some gays believe they need to as well. They shouldn't hide it, they think, but rather affirm it. And I say, "More power to you."

    On the other hand, I really don't think anyone ever has to disclose his or her true sexuality to anyone. And, I, too, find it silly and degrading when people disclose their homosexuality to the media/public. Why does it care in the first place? It is a way to brand people with an insignia, as if they have a lepresy? So a gay person can give a subtle apology for being so and kindly ask for permission to become a second-class citizen and the butt of everyone's jokes? So, not at all a fan of public disclosure one's sexuality, unless you buy the argument that celebritys' coming-out helps to fight discrimination against gays (which it does, to some degree).

    I have issues with my sexuality. I'm 33 and very confused, and things haven't got easier for me over the years, but to the contrary. I do the best I know how to handle my situation (meditation, clean lifestyle, etc).
     
    #3 bigbull29, Oct 6, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  4. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    Easy answer for me. When I'm around friends and family I really do not want to have to be guarded about what I say and how I phrase what I do say. Coming out removes that necessity. I don't care at all about what they think of my sexuality just as I don't give a damn about their's.
     
  5. bigbull29

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    Fair enough.:smile:
     
  6. unabear09

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    I'm not quite sure I understand what you're saying here. I'm always getting in trouble for saying whatever pops into my head (one of the many wonderful symptoms of having ADHD....that filter is broken). I guess maybe because I'm not gay and I haven't ever had to come out of the closet, I find it hard to understand why one should filter what one says in certain company.
     
  7. Industrialsize

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    I think it's important for people to come out. Perhaps gay teenagers would stop committing suicide at alarming rates if they had more role models who are gay and realized that they are not alone. 30% of all teen suicides involve gay teenagers.
     
  8. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    OK lets say you are in the closet to workmates and part of a serious relationship too. Whenever you talk to colleagues about anything social you have to remember to say "I" and not "we". If you forget and say "we" then the inevitable questions will start and you then have to lie then the trail of deceit begins. Being straight you have probably never even contemplated this. You have never had to think carefully before you speak in case you give your "secret" away.
     
  9. unabear09

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    Gotcha. Haven't ever thought about it like that
     
  10. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    Plus there is the other aspect. The more people hide their sexuality the more it says to others that it is wrong or not normal (Whatever normal is).
     
  11. Chase1600

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    Hope you’re not raked over the coals, it seems like an honest question. You make good points. Mostly I believe gay people are better off being open. I am. I don’t practice any notion that I have to insist you understand how I’m queer. Mostly, not lying differs from insisting you know intimate details.

    There is something you may never have had reason to experience. Some people are sharks – bad ones. My not blabbing and minding my business is not permitted. The ways in which some people engage their homophobia is aggressive, prying, manipulative, and exploitative. They will not let it be.

    If your are gay and closeted and in a work, or comparable, situation in which you are being subjected to something nasty, being closeted will not keep your secret and indeed your efforts to hide become a weakness like blood in the water. Show weakness and die. Your best defense is some equivalent of “fuck yeah.” Tell everyone. “See that snake over there, what’s his problem. Do you care if I suck dick, why does he?”

    It can be even more insidious. As a person who was reasonably competent and respected and who has not been closeted for decades but is quite private, it occurs to me – latest a couple years ago – that someone suggests I be a party to something slimy being reminded that I am a queer and by no means in a position to pretend that I am respectable. Obviously, it is attempted on the QT assuming I will succumb to a combined shame about being gay and about being so disrespected.

    Being out – it an antidote to this kind of underhanded exploitation. When it happens, I do what I always do. I go mega public with my sexuality and the sleaze behavior. Of course, I got to watch my back.

    All said. I think people need to take time coming out. I don’t think others should be pressured to do it. And I have know people who would better have remained closeted.
     
  12. Thirdlegproduction

    Thirdlegproduction Formerly WhiteMonst3r
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  13. SouthernSpunk

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    Honestly, the worst of all worlds is being bi.

    I grew up "straight" but in my 30's had a very good friend that showed me what it was like to be physically and emotionally close to a man. Both of us were/are blue collar, so there was no "tea and roses" moments, it just boiled down to two solid buddies that went camping, bowling, and frequently sucked each other off.

    I was living in a Blue state at the time, surrounded by lots of liberals. I thought, "Ok, let me be out about this, silence = death ... la la la." Things went profoundly wrong. I discovered that all these Blue People were not too fussy about the difference between bi and gay... and I got publicly labeled "gay". Women now ran from me. Literally, relationships that had been warm (and non-sexual) turned funny and cold. Women I was having sex with stopped for fear I would give them "something".

    Worst was the wives. I lost all of my married buddies cause the wife didn't want me around them. The wives also got paranoid about all of my friends' other buddies... I'm about as un-gay as you could want, and if I could be gay... That witch hunt didn't help things.

    There were also big problems at work, I was a shop supervisor and my authority had collapsed under me. I had a lesbian working on the floor: she was the worst of them all.

    So I went back home to my Redneck Red State and keep my personal life personal. Good friends know the score with me, cause I won't lie about stuff. I've never lost a friend who knew that I dig the Puss and the Cock. The difference is of course they were all "pre screened" as friends, the situation was not broadcast to passing acquaintances and co-workers.

    Very rarely, somebody is watching my eyes and notices that my glance followed the little Japanese secretary going down the street and Kenny the Plumber coming back... and put two and two together. The brave ones will ask if I'm gay or something.

    I just say "Try to suck my dick and find out. If I'm gay you get a mouth full of sperm. If I'm straight, you get a mouth full of fist." The subject always drops dead.
     
    #13 SouthernSpunk, Oct 6, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  14. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    Thanks for explaining as I had not considered it from your angle.
     
  15. Chase1600

    Chase1600 Member

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    Southern, sorry to read about it.

    You post might make a good thread in its own right. Have other bi-identified people [especially guys] shared your experience?

    Maybe it’s a regional and cultural thing, but I’m not convinced. It seems to me you describe a genuine risk that is hardly geographic. You decided moving to a “blue state” meant that people would be different. They are, but not like that.

    Regardless of geography, if a woman thinks you are bi-sexual, she might have a variety of reasons to no longer be interested in you. She might think bi-sexual is a euphemism for gay. She might associate sex with men and HIV to avoid you. She might be looking for a real relationship and decide you are not relationship material.

    Your approach where you are is smarter.

    Also, I am hardly surprised by the reaction of the wives. As a gay man who is widely social in a straight world, I am also widely just not invited lots of places even though I don’t make any insisting effort that people have to acknowledge they know I’m gay. Of course they do; there’s no possibility otherwise. I’m not “coupled” and even a special lady friend would not suffice where I’m not invited anyhow.

    So why not start a separate thread and let’s read what people have to say.
     
  16. D_Evita_Zane

    D_Evita_Zane New Member

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    The feeling of relief by telling someone is something you can't understand unless you're in the situation. For me personally it was as if a huge weight had been lifted off my shoulders.

    I told my parents this past summer. I figured they had a right to know, plus I felt uneasy keeping it from them.

    That being said, I don't make my sexuality anyone's business. I'm only "out" to a few people who figured would benefit from knowing. I won't bring it up unless I'm asked though. I don't wear the blue and pink flag all over myself either.
     
  17. ericbythebay

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    Someone tells you they are gay and your response is that you don't care what they do in bed? I suppose you also are tired of seeing straight people with their children and hearing about their kids, because you don't want to know what they do in bed either.

    The sooner you stop reducing sexual orientations to sex acts, the sooner you will understand the answer to your question.

    Why do we come out? We have to, how do we not, when people make heterocentric assumptions about us? People see my wedding ring and ask me my wife's name, when I tell them his name is Joe, am I flaunting what I do in the bedroom or should the asker have asked for my spouse's name or not asked at all?
     
  18. DV8

    DV8
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    I will go ahead and say that I can understand exactly what you're saying- too bad not everyone feels that way. If everyone was cool with homosexuality/bisexuality,hell, sexuality in general, it wouldn't be an issue. It's not just about who you sleep with, but you want to be able to be honest about those you decide to date and fall in love with; you just don't want it to be a shock to anyone. Not everyone is blessed with the luxury of being able to bring someone of the same sex home and say "this is my partner I've been dating for 4 months, and they're having dinner with us" and everyone is just excited about it.

    I will tell you that my experience wasn't quite like that, but it was right after my father died(1999). My parents were apart for 12 years, and I always lived with my mother. My mother wasn't homophobic to the outside world, just with her family. She was conservative and very religious. I was 14 at the time, and I told her that I was bisexual. She went ape-shit and called me a fag just like my father. It was that very school night that I learned that the reason of my parents' separation and her hatred, her anger was because my father was gay. I learned that it wasn't cancer that took my father, but AIDS. I was devastated, and hurt. My mother, the one person I would never question would love me, would say such hateful things to a young boy, her only child.

    I felt very alone, and I thought that since my mother knew, that was the worst of it. I kept it to myself. I went to school and I would hang out with my friends like normal. We had a discussion about girls, and which ones we'd like to date. When it came to me, I just stated that I thought I wanted to try dating guys. I got the awkward stares and I told my friends that I believed that I was gay/bi. I told 3 people. By the time of my first period class, my entire class knew. And I was pretty sure that by the end of the school day, my entire school knew (over 1800 students). When you live in the bible belt, such information spreads like wildfire. I was terrified, sad, and felt very lonely. At school I heard the whispers and saw some of my "friends" laugh at me when they thought I wasn't looking. Strange and evil looks came from members of the football and wrestling teams in the locker room during gym class. At home it wasn't much better. The silence and lack affection or concern was pretty hard to get used to; my mom's cold shoulder could give you shivers.

    I contemplated suicide. I was just tired of being so sad and so scared- reading about queer bashing on the internet and the papers, never knowing if you were going to be the next top story. I was terrified during the school day for 2 whole weeks. After being sick and tired of being sick and tired, I made a decision- to prey on my predators. Someone could make a joke about homosexuality, and I'd go for the throat. I learned that I was worth fighting for, and like anyone else, I deserve happiness.

    Since then, everything's been fine. I'm very honest about my life and very free. I don't lead a double-life. The point of the story was to show you that even though you're cool with such things, not everyone is. It can be a very scary time for someone, and coming out is an empowering experience for that person; families have been destroyed over such a thing and you're taking a risk when you express honesty. You may or may not be able to empathize with such a fear, now or ever, and I hope you don't.

    So I'm glad that it's not an issue with you, and I hope more and more people start to feel the way you do. Maybe then we'll live in a society where people aren't afraid to be who they are, and no explanation will be required.
     
    #18 DV8, Oct 6, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  19. Thirdlegproduction

    Thirdlegproduction Formerly WhiteMonst3r
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    @ericbythebay

    thats not really what i said.

    and yes i dont care about peoples kids either, if i want to know about their kids i will ask them about it.

    my point was more towards the people who have a need to tell the world without the world asking them are you gay or straight?
     
    #19 Thirdlegproduction, Oct 6, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2010
  20. scottredleter

    scottredleter New Member

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    People come out to offset the enormous amount of time and energy they have expended covering up the fact that they were gay. I agree that probably isn't a need for some big 'intervention-like' gathering, but the fact that they did this and included you should be taken as a sign of how important they feel you are to them. It's great that more and more people are seeing this as no big deal. But let me just say that I got out of the Army under 20 years ago when I told them I was gay... I was arrested, put in hand-cuffs, brought to the MP station and fingerprinted and had my mug shot taken. then I was investigated for 6 months while being held in restriction until I was released with no benefits.
    Gay people still get assaulted at an alarming rate by people who don't have quite the same open-minded ideas about sexual orientation that you do.
    You were included in a very important part of this persons life. I could say that I don't see why people want to have this great big gathering with a party and a ceremony just to tell everyone that they are married... who cares? Well, the people who are important to them and people who care about them.
    So maybe you really don't care about your friend, or she made a mistake thinking that you do. If you do care then just let her know that you support her and leave it at that. If not than you shouldn't pretend to be her friend.
     
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