Coronavirus

[Jjz1109]

The hatred of Trump is well justified, not irrational in some way as the statement 'you hate Trump' is thrown around. I respected many presidents - even when I did not agree with them at times, they earned that respect. I hate Trump for what he has done to the country and the world. He's earned that too.

We have seen this pandemic overrun Italy, Spain, UK, US . . . the world leaders are taking unique and different approaches to responding. The UK was very late in implementing social distancing, only starting very recently. Boris was shaking hands until he was rushed into the hospital. Sweden has done very little, experimenting with its population with a hands off approach. Denmark is now allowing the reopening of hair dressers and tattoo parlors (thank God, I was wondering when I could get that new tattoo!). Does any country have the single answer? As Jason said in his post # 2499:

• Our politicians may or may not be making the right decisions and the scientific evidence may or may not be correct.
• When this is over there is a 100% guarantee that politicians will be found to have taken sub-optimal decisions.

So, in this context, putting aside your strong held biases of trump, are the posts attacking his handling irrational in relation to the rest of the world? Doubtful anyone here sees it that way. Again, it’s all part of the agenda. That point is not missed.

 

[deleted15807]

So out of curiosity, how much does the US government pay towards medical care for someone with a treatable medical condition, so as to save their life? How many million dollars each?

The US government only insures individuals over the age of 65 via the Medicare program. What is covered can be found here. And the value of your life here. You have your data. Let's see where you go with it.

 

[Jjz1109]

Deaths per millions? Percentages? Statistics are totally irrelevant when the public hears 40,000 people are dead that otherwise would not be. And like I posted here. It's quickly becoming #1 cause of death in the US and yes it may just be a spike but thanks to social distancing it may not maintain it's newfound status.

The brutal reality is coronavirus will have zero impact on the exploding human population count. "We are plague mammals, and plague mammals multiply fantastically until just before the last generation".

Nevertheless, for those who are interested in statistics.

Coronavirus deaths per million by country 2020 | Statista

 

[keenobserver]

We have seen this pandemic overrun Italy, Spain, UK, US . . . the world leaders are taking unique and different approaches to responding. The UK was very late in implementing social distancing, only starting very recently. Boris was shaking hands until he was rushed into the hospital. Sweden has done very little, experimenting with its population with a hands off approach. Denmark is now allowing the reopening of hair dressers and tattoo parlors (thank God, I was wondering when I could get that new tattoo!). Does any country have the single answer? As Jason said in his post # 2499:

• Our politicians may or may not be making the right decisions and the scientific evidence may or may not be correct.
• When this is over there is a 100% guarantee that politicians will be found to have taken sub-optimal decisions.

So, in this context, putting aside your strong held biases of trump, are the posts attacking his handling irrational in relation to the rest of the world? Doubtful anyone here sees it that way. Again, it’s all part of the agenda. That point is not missed.

I really don't concern myself too much with that other countries did or did not do. Trump downplayed the virus from the beginning, even though he was credibly warned sometime previous. My 'agenda' here is calling his failure what it is - a failure - and showing the hypocrisy of the so called pro life people who support him, who are now fine with the idea of killing grandmothers and 3 % of children so IHOP can start filling booths and underpaying their workers all in the name of the economy. My hatred of Trump is not a bias - bias implies something irrational or unfair. There is nothing unfair or irrational about my understanding of Trump's failures. He is giving lie to the old saying that even a broken clock is right at least once a day. If he manages to do something right, something that puts the US above his own financial or political wants, I will be sure to applaud him. I'll even give you notice so you can gather a crowd to watch it.

Trump's determination to undermine the governors he does not like and incite crowds in the face of real danger is irresponsible in the highest. He is not even capable of leading on that simple issue. Nothing he has done here has been right. People calling him out and putting pressure of Congress to do something is the only recourse we have. The Trump lovers here have put the people's right to assemble in a pandemic on pedestal, they praise Trump's resolve to kill people to get re-elected (not a good plan, but it is his) in the name of the economy and throw in some immigrant racism just for old times sake, and you're complaining that I am using the First Amendment unkindly. Ok, we'll just file that.

 

[deleted15807]

Nevertheless, for those who are interested in statistics.

Coronavirus deaths per million by country 2020 | Statista

Hilarious! Be sure to remind voters in November how it was only 100,000 dead. And you have a sudden desire to post links and statistics? Here's one for you.

COVID-19 is rapidly becoming America’s leading cause of death

And as a Foxy News viewer something you can be proud of:

How Fox News has shifted its coronavirus rhetoric​

 

[deleted15807]

My hatred of Trump is not a bias - bias implies something irrational or unfair. There is nothing unfair or irrational about my understanding of Trump's failures.

The quest for truth is now "bias" if the quest leads you outside the Foxy News-Trump-GOP axis of evil disinformation loop.

 

[Industrialsize]

Nevertheless, for those who are interested in statistics.

Coronavirus deaths per million by country 2020 | Statista

Statistics:

 

[dandelion]

When a society regrets the economic loss more than the loss of life, it doesn't need a virus, it is already sick.

When a society fails to regard the economic cost and looks only at the loss of life, it isnt sick, its dead. Destroyed by foreign powers or simply nature.

Statistics are totally irrelevant when the public hears 40,000 people are dead

If Industrialsize has a say, then yes. The only way to respond is to explain 40,000 is not a big number, and why.

The US government only insures individuals over the age of 65 via the Medicare program. What is covered can be found here. And the value of your life here. You have your data. Let's see where you go with it.

A quick google gives me US spending on medicare in 2018 as 700 billion dollars. US population 320 million, so thats about $2000 each. That the value placed on you by the US government. I take it the spending on unde 65s is actually $0, which is an interesting valuation, so maybe multiply x10 and they value a pensioner's life at $20,000?

 

[Industrialsize]

When a society fails to regard the economic cost and looks only at the loss of life, it isnt sick, its dead. Destroyed by foreign powers or simply nature.

If Industrialsize has a say, then yes. The only way to respond is to explain 40,000 is not a big number, and why.

A quick google gives me US spending on medicare in 2018 as 700 billion dollars. US population 320 million, so thats about $2000 each. That the value placed on you by the US government. I take it the spending on unde 65s is actually $0, which is an interesting valuation, so maybe multiply x10 and they value a pensioner's life at $20,000?

How much would your family take in exchange for YOUR life?

 

[halcyondays]

 

[deleted15807]

WThe only way to respond is to explain 40,000 is not a big number, and why.

Don't even bother explaining to the public as your political career is over if your belief is 40,000 dead is not a big number and can be explained away. You're done. Turn on Netflix or something. 40,000 dead is not an acceptable number in politics.

A quick google gives me US spending on medicare in 2018 as 700 billion dollars. US population 320 million, so thats about $2000 each. That the value placed on you by the US government. I take it the spending on unde 65s is actually $0, which is an interesting valuation, so maybe multiply x10 and they value a pensioner's life at $20,000?

Firstly that's not how health care and Medicare works in the US. Secondly, what does the cost of what the government may pay in a single year for health insurance have to do with the value of a person over a lifetime?

 

[Jjz1109]

I really don't concern myself too much with that other countries did or did not do. Trump downplayed the virus from the beginning, even though he was credibly warned sometime previous. My 'agenda' here is calling his failure what it is - a failure - and showing the hypocrisy of the so called pro life people who support him, who are now fine with the idea of killing grandmothers and 3 % of children so IHOP can start filling booths and underpaying their workers all in the name of the economy. My hatred of Trump is not a bias - bias implies something irrational or unfair. There is nothing unfair or irrational about my understanding of Trump's failures. He is giving lie to the old saying that even a broken clock is right at least once a day. If he manages to do something right, something that puts the US above his own financial or political wants, I will be sure to applaud him. I'll even give you notice so you can gather a crowd to watch it.

Trump's determination to undermine the governors he does not like and incite crowds in the face of real danger is irresponsible in the highest. He is not even capable of leading on that simple issue. Nothing he has done here has been right. People calling him out and putting pressure of Congress to do something is the only recourse we have. The Trump lovers here have put the people's right to assemble in a pandemic on pedestal, they praise Trump's resolve to kill people to get re-elected (not a good plan, but it is his) in the name of the economy and throw in some immigrant racism just for old times sake, and you're complaining that I am using the First Amendment unkindly. Ok, we'll just file that.

Well, for proper perspective, in the context of this global pandemic, this is one time you really should concern yourself with what’s going on in other countries. Or, at a minimum, be aware of the statistics around the world so you understand the big picture. Otherwise, basing your opinion purely on your hatred of trump could very well be viewed as irrational.

I never really liked IHOP myself.

Hilarious! Be sure to remind voters in November how it was only 100,000 dead. And you have a sudden desire to post links and statistics? Here's one for you.

COVID-19 is rapidly becoming America’s leading cause of death

And as a Foxy News viewer something you can be proud of:

How Fox News has shifted its coronavirus rhetoric​

So, this is the second time you posted this. It’s sad. But not totally surprising where we are on the curve at the moment. Hope we can conquer this soon.

 

[Jjz1109]

Don't even bother explaining to the public as your political career is over if your belief is 40,000 dead is not a big number and can be explained away. You're done. Turn on Netflix or something. 40,000 dead is not an acceptable number in politics.

?

Dude. It’s like you’re rooting for these numbers to go up. That’s sick. I suppose this is why you chose to ignore the global statistics earlier? You said they’re “totally irrelevant” since they don’t fit into your agenda. More politicizing. That’s just wrong.

 

[Jjz1109]

If Industrialsize has a say, then yes. The only way to respond is to explain 40,000 is not a big number, and why.

It was Sargon who said statistics were totally irrelevant. Just to clarify.

40,000 is a staggering number. That said, it places the US death rate per million below several other countries at the moment. The original “best guest” estimate by the CDC was 100k-200k deaths, and 1-2million if no efforts were taken to head off the spread. At present, the 40,000 is below the estimate. We can only hope that number doesn’t grow much more, and if the final tally comes in below the estimate, we should be thankful. But the point here, that is not missed, is that it’s being made Into a political issue. And those are egregious motivations.

 

[keenobserver]

Well, for proper perspective, in the context of this global pandemic, this is one time you really should concern yourself with what’s going on in other countries. Or, at a minimum, be aware of the statistics around the world so you understand the big picture. Otherwise, basing your opinion purely on your hatred of trump could very well be viewed as irrational.

I never really liked IHOP myself.



So, this is the second time you posted this. It’s sad. But not totally surprising where we are on the curve at the moment. Hope we can conquer this soon.

I got no problem with IHOP. I do have a problem that IHOP and Shake Shack and a lot of other big chains were considered 'small' by Trump and the Senate and drained the aid for mom and pop stores. The same loophole allows Trump properties to dig into a special 450 million dollar fund, pretty much with no oversite. There is no tragedy he will not use as an excuse to pillage the country for himself. Hating that is not in any way irrational, ignoring orc dismissing it totally is.

 

[deleted15807]

It was Sargon who said statistics were totally irrelevant. Just to clarify.

Misquote and taken out of context. Is that the way you roll now? Not going to last long I guess.

Dude. It’s like you’re rooting for these numbers to go up. That’s sick. I suppose this is why you chose to ignore the global statistics earlier? You said they’re “totally irrelevant” since they don’t fit into your agenda. More politicizing. That’s just wrong.

So you don't deny you left this thread alone while Trump mocked, denied the coronavirus threat? And it wasn't until he acknowledged it's reality that you decided to wade in here and start posting?

 

[Shrume]

Confused or too brain dead from watching Fox. It really makes stupid people feel good about themselves.

Trump denies saying things he previously said about the coronavirus

And no matter how much they try to downplay the severity it's going to be tough even with Foxy News on your side to hide a new #1 way to die. Local news stations reports of death and mayhem aren't under the Murdoch empire will not be in on the gaslighting.

COVID-19 is rapidly becoming America’s leading cause of death​

View attachment 15467981

So Fox News makes you stupid? Yes, I agree. What about ABC, CBS, and NBC?

 

[Jason]

The media is full of comparisons of deaths per nation, and deaths per million per nation. One of the few things we do know about Covid19 is that "nation" is an inappropriate geographical unit.

We need to be looking at units the size of cities, or even smaller. In Spain the figures are grim for Madrid and Barcelona, but low for the rest of the country. In Italy deaths are mainly in Milan and the cities of the north. UK has grim figures in London, Birmingham and Manchester but not in many other places. USA seems to be showing clear hot spots.

 

[bar4doug]

The media is full of comparisons of deaths per nation, and deaths per million per nation. One of the few things we do know about Covid19 is that "nation" is an inappropriate geographical unit.

We need to be looking at units the size of cities, or even smaller. In Spain the figures are grim for Madrid and Barcelona, but low for the rest of the country. In Italy deaths are mainly in Milan and the cities of the north. UK has grim figures in London, Birmingham and Manchester but not in many other places. USA seems to be showing clear hot spots.

The virus has spread to and continues to spread most easily in:

1. Places with high population densities.
2. Places where a large portion of the population takes mass transit.
3. Popular tourist locations.
4. Places that see a lot of business travel.
5. Places where the population can't easily isolate themselves.

Doesn't really matter what nation you are in...

 

[deleted15807]

The media is full of comparisons of deaths per nation, and deaths per million per nation. One of the few things we do know about Covid19 is that "nation" is an inappropriate geographical unit.

We need to be looking at units the size of cities, or even smaller. In Spain the figures are grim for Madrid and Barcelona, but low for the rest of the country. In Italy deaths are mainly in Milan and the cities of the north. UK has grim figures in London, Birmingham and Manchester but not in many other places. USA seems to be showing clear hot spots.

The “media” sell what homo sapiens want to hear or is simply irresistible to not hear. It is what it is.