Death Panels are inevitable in a public option

B_VinylBoy

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The summary responses to my pointing out of the facts have been 1) calling me bigot,

Which you are.

2) Blaming it on Bush

Which nobody has, alas, you instantly assumed was the case since I mentioned the year 2008. You think anyone here would have a problem blaming something on Bush outright if that was the point we were trying to make? But I understand your plight... Cry, you pathetic conservative victim, CRY! :rolleyes:

3) citing Obama being only about 1/4 of the way through with his presidency.

Because we are.

How surprising.

So sorry that you can't deal with the facts. And to think, you get three more years at least to whine, bitch and moan about it. Oh the joy! :rolleyes:
 
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Ericsson1228d

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Which you are.



Which nobody has, alas, you instantly assumed was the case since I mentioned the year 2008. You think anyone here would have a problem blaming something on Bush outright if that was the point we were trying to make? But I understand your plight... Cry, you pathetic conservative victim, CRY! :rolleyes:



Because we are.



So sorry that you can't deal with the facts. And to think, you get three more years at least to whine, bitch and moan about it. Oh the joy! :rolleyes:

You really can't help yourself can you?
_____________________________________________________
“You ain't heard nothing yet, folks!”
 
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thadjock

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well while vinyl and eric grudge fuk each other in the corner,

i'm gonna try to get this thread back on topic:

death panels aren't the enemy or the problem.

the problem is a society that's emotionally unequipped to deal with death in any form. Why isn't anybody able to accept that death is a part of life and recognize that even though medicine makes it possible to take heroic measures and keep loved ones alive decades longer than they otherwise would have lived, doing that only deprives that person a dignified and natural death.

so called medical "miracles" have robbed us of the simple (and frankly elegant) ways humans used to die. I'd choose a fatal heart attack (at 65 or any age for that matter) any day over spending the last 20 yrs of my life in a nursing home on oxygen and hooked up to a dialisys machine, not recognizing any of my own family. Yeah, losing a loved one is hard, but is it fair to make them suffer because you can't let go?

Kevorkian gets ridiculed but we're on the path to where mercy killing (assisted suicide if you prefer) will become commonplace.
 
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D_Smidley Smelliepits

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death panels aren't the enemy or the problem.

the problem is a society that's emotionally unequipped to deal with death in any form. Why isn't anybody able to accept that death is a part of life and recognize that even though medicine makes it possible to take heroic measures and keep loved ones alive decades longer than they otherwise would have lived, doing that only deprives that person a dignified and natural death.

so called medical "miracles" have robbed us of the simple (and frankly elegant) ways humans used to die. I'd choose a fatal heart attack (at 65 or any age for that matter) any day over spending the last 20 yrs of my life in a nursing home on oxygen and hooked up to a dialisys machine, not recognizing any of my own family. Yeah, losing a loved one is hard, but is it fair to make them suffer because you can't let go?

Kevorkian gets ridiculed but we're on the path to where mercy killing (assisted suicide if you prefer) will become commonplace.

Completely agree. We should stop thinking about it as a way of saving money and considering it as a way of respecting people's right to die (yeah, a right).
 

Bodaddio

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True, we give our dogs and cats more compassion and dignity when they have a fatal disease than we do our loved ones. Sometimes people are just better off being dead than having to live through some of the torture we put them through in the name of medicine.

Cheers
 

seterwind

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Easy to preach hard to do. I'm all for it myself, my father died in a horrible undignified way. However I am still thankful that I had the time to cope with the situation it, made his transition into death easier (not easy but less difficult) since I literally saw him degrade slowly until his last breath. I saw his death coming.

Honestly I would rather have died instantly then put through the pain that he was in. But he wanted to try to live through the next few birthdays of his children, even if he was only there in body. While he had the mental fortitude to decide this and we did everything we could to keep him alive, I know in the last few months he would have rather simply given up.

Before he got ill, he had always said that he never wanted to go out the way he did. However when the time came he decided otherwise.

Personally I think it would be better to have a cold hearted government "Death Panel" decide it wasn't feasible to keep him alive, say our good byes and not have had the option of 4 months of torment, however grateful I am for that time.
 

D_Davy_Downspout

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Personally I think it would be better to have a cold hearted government "Death Panel" decide it wasn't feasible to keep him alive, say our good byes and not have had the option of 4 months of torment, however grateful I am for that time.

The "death panel" you have in mind doesn't exist, and was never planned to exist.

The Death Panels that people were all up in arms about was a bizarre interpretation of end-of-life counseling, something we already do. A doctor discusses with the patient how they would like to end their life, such as DNR orders or choosing to hang on with every treatment possible, like your father. They're completely non-controversial and allow people to die with every bit of dignity that they want.

No nation with a socialized healthcare system has death panels. Stephen Hawking had an incredibly expensive and debilitating condition years before he ever became important or famous, and the NHS in the UK did not decide it wasn't cost effective to keep him going.

The closest thing that exists to the widely feared "death panels" is the medical review boards of insurance companies, which often decide that life saving treatments may not be covered.
 

midlifebear

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Hey folks, isn't it as obvious as the noses on your faces that the OP just pulls poop out of his rectum and slings it to see it if sticks. He has yet to post anything with an ounce of truth to it.

Heed the signs in the National Park and do not feed the animal(s). They will eventually go away.