Depression and ED in young guys

[DuvalinCT]

Hi Everyone-
So, I've been on depression medication for a little over 3 months now (I had a major breakdown and subsquent depression caused by finally dealing with a trauma that had happened on long time ago). I've been feeling better, and the meds hadn't caused any side effects. Now, I've met a new guy - we've gone a few dates. Whenever things started to get heated, though, my erection kept coming and going. It was as if my penis was suddenly unreliable! I still came eventually, but I began to get worried that the guy thought I didn't find him attractive (which I most certainly do - my body just won't respond).

Now, some of it might be coming from my issues - I was abused as a child. However, I also have, in the last two weeks, not even had morning wood. It's like the plumbing isn't working at all.

Anyways, my question is mostly - what the heck can I do about it? I mean, i don't think my doctor would believe that I need Viagra (I'm 21). Perhaps I need to switch depression medication, I'm not sure. Any suggestions?

 

[joyboytoy79]

First, what med are you on? Sexual disfunction, in some form or another, is a common side effect for most SSRI's. However, just becuase you experience problems with one SSRI doesn't mean you will with another. Talk to your doctor (the one who prescribed the anti-depressant). He should be able to let you know what your options are. Whatever you do, do NOT stop taking your meds without first talking to your doctor. Some SSRI's have very serious withdrawal symptoms.

 

[Ed69]

You got it right,go back to your doctor and tell him whats happening.I've been through this too and switching meds solved it.

 

[ospice05]

Talk to your doc, and get on another medication. I was on Cymbalta and it did the same. Now I'm on Lexipro and it works fine.

 

[tripod]

You gotta love the medical industry. This gentleman has experienced mental, physical, and emotional trauma in the past that has left him somewhat scarred. Said individual sees a therapist for this. The therapist then recommends that he see a psychiatrist to get a presription for a Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitor or God forbid, something stronger! The gentleman does not fucking have anything wrong with the way Seratonin is being metabolized by the body, but that's all the medical industry can do for depression so they convince him to take his meds religiously. That individual then notices that his libido has taken a dive and he can't count on his erections anymore. That man goes back to the therapist and he then refers him again to the psychiatrist who then gives the man a prescription for Viagra or Cialis.

Viagra can make you blind and Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitors are like bleeding patients or putting leaches on them to solve their illness. Prozac and it's brethren (the stronger stuff is even worse) actually do a great job in deteriorating your body's natural processes so you are left barren and wasted for months or years after you stop the medication. Confront your fears, abolish the darkness by adding more light to your life, and for God sakes stop taking the medication and embrace your "Sacred Self".

 

[baseball99]

You gotta love the medical industry. This gentleman has experienced mental, physical, and emotional trauma in the past that has left him somewhat scarred. Said individual sees a therapist for this. The therapist then recommends that he see a psychiatrist to get a presription for a Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitor or God forbid, something stronger! The gentleman does not fucking have anything wrong with the way Seratonin is being metabolized by the body, but that's all the medical industry can do for depression so they convince him to take his meds religiously. That individual then notices that his libido has taken a dive and he can't count on his erections anymore. That man goes back to the therapist and he then refers him again to the psychiatrist who then gives the man a prescription for Viagra or Cialis.

Viagra can make you blind and Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitors are like bleeding patients or putting leaches on them to solve their illness. Prozac and it's brethren (the stronger stuff is even worse) actually do a great job in deteriorating your body's natural processes so you are left barren and wasted for months or years after you stop the medication. Confront your fears, abolish the darkness by adding more light to your life, and for God sakes stop taking the medication and embrace your "Sacred Self".

uhm right. SSRI's are amazing drugs with a huge safety record and their effects on improving depression, anxiety and a few other things are absolutely amazing. I dont think you have ever worked in a psychiatry office and seen the actual benefits of SSRI's. Are they perfect? No, of course not. THe main concern is that SSRI's give you an energy boost for about 2 weeks prior to relieving depression, which could actually make people slightly suicidal during that time period. It has nothing to do with serotonin metabolism.....its the reuptake. It is proven that people with depression either have too little serotonin or it does not stay in the synaptic clefts (areas between neurons) for long enough.....an ssri keeps it there longer. Serotonin, however, is also utilized by the body in more areas than just the brain, which is why some people gain weight and some people have anorgasmia or ED. No doctor in his right mind would prescribe this guy viagra. Switch the medications, there are plenty to choose from. Your "suck it up and deal with it approach" may have worked for you but does not work for 99.99999% of everyone else. Depression causes such horrible physiology to a persons body, its as if they are addicted to drugs. Also, I should note the "blindness" with viagra is still up for debate. FIrst of all most of the studies pointed out that men who take viagra are usually also hypertensive and or diabetic.....the two leading cuases for blindness. Viagra may just push those people over the limit a couple years faster HOWEVER in the vast majority of people viagra will not cause that. The bigger concern is the heart, which is actually what it was developed for and the erection was just a side effect

 

[rich-9.8]

You gotta love the medical industry. This gentleman has experienced mental, physical, and emotional trauma in the past that has left him somewhat scarred. Said individual sees a therapist for this. The therapist then recommends that he see a psychiatrist to get a presription for a Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitor or God forbid, something stronger! The gentleman does not fucking have anything wrong with the way Seratonin is being metabolized by the body, but that's all the medical industry can do for depression so they convince him to take his meds religiously. That individual then notices that his libido has taken a dive and he can't count on his erections anymore. That man goes back to the therapist and he then refers him again to the psychiatrist who then gives the man a prescription for Viagra or Cialis.

Viagra can make you blind and Seratonin Re-Uptake Inhibitors are like bleeding patients or putting leaches on them to solve their illness. Prozac and it's brethren (the stronger stuff is even worse) actually do a great job in deteriorating your body's natural processes so you are left barren and wasted for months or years after you stop the medication. Confront your fears, abolish the darkness by adding more light to your life, and for God sakes stop taking the medication and embrace your "Sacred Self".

Feeling barren and wasted is what depression does to you, not anti-depressants. The use of SSRIs is backed up with reliable evidence from trials with large numbers of patients. The quasi-religious bullshit you are reeling off is nothing more than opinion. No-one is claiming that antidepressants will make your life better or totally cure your depression.

I would agree on the point that dealing with negative feelings and emotions and just general problems in life has become too medicalised. The bad press these drugs get is because a lot of the time they are given to people who do not suffer from genuine clinical depression. When given to the people who need them they work, at least some of the time.

Duvalin - I don't know whether you are genuinely depressed or just trying to deal with the various traumas in your life, and I am not about to second-guess your mental state over the internet and give you some bullshit advice based on my own prejudices, and I hope this doesn't degenerate into a thread where people pop off at each other when someone has genuinely asked for advice.

As far as what you were asking about is concerned, your lack of morning wood suggests that the problem is not simply psychological, and could well be a side-effect of medication, or due to another physical cause. Are you very overweight or do you have diabetes? Have a talk with your doctor about changing or stopping medication if you feel this is appropriate, and to rule out other causes of ED.

If your ED was due to your mental state, you should still get morning wood, but part of this may still be your nervousness. At least by ruling out physical illness you will know if your own mind is the problem and you ca face down your problems, as I'm sure you have done admirably before now. See your doctor and good luck :smile:

 

[dudepiston]

I've been on more than one anti-depressant med in my life. My first was "Pamelor" which is still sometimes prescribed but usually doctors think SSRI's are more advanced than drugs like pamelor, desiprimine, and others. I was off the Pamelor and other meds for YEARS before a different doc tried Desiprimine. (My spelling might be off, there.) That one had several sexual side effects - not only could I not reliably get hard but when I did, I usually came within 20 seconds of stimulation. That was ending things a bit SOON, and the sensation, while nice, was not the normal orgasm I was used to all obviously. I was on other SSRI's but had a very bad reaction to one. It can & does occur, esp. if you forget a dose or your body doesn't metabolize the dose the same one day as it does the rest. In other words, any SSRI should be taken under a doctor's careful supervision....and I'm not 100% sure they're very careful about this aspect of treatment at all. I'm not completely in agreement with that one gentleman's quasi-religious "bullshit" (since I'm agnostic) BUT, there is something to be said for attempting to deal with our problems, particularly psychological ones, in a therapeutic setting as opposed to simply popping a pill & hoping that makes life "ok." It doesn't usually work that way. But I digress....

A lack of morning wood or night-time erections is indicative of ED....at least according to my urologist. That was when he prescribed Cialis for me...and it did do the JOB, but I had side effects from it as well, so had to leave that behind. I do have a circulatory issue (heart problem) and that probably contributes greatly to my ED. Might be worth checking out.....make sure the SSRI (or any other med you're on) is not affecting your body's blood flow in any way.

 

[mtguy1972]

I don't think an ED drug (like Viagra) is usually indicated in younger guys without medical conditions causing the ED. Depression, stress, emotional issues from past abuse, relationship/intimacy issues and medications can all cause arousal/climax issues. i'd steer away from the Viagra and stuff until you get some of the other issues worked through, maybe in counseling. It's likely not a permanent problem, so try not to stress about it too much! Good luck!

 

[tripod]

Also, I should note the "blindness" with viagra is still up for debate. FIrst of all most of the studies pointed out that men who take viagra are usually also hypertensive and or diabetic.....the two leading cuases for blindness. Viagra may just push those people over the limit a couple years faster HOWEVER in the vast majority of people viagra will not cause that. The bigger concern is the heart, which is actually what it was developed for and the erection was just a side effect

Awesome point baseball99, very informative. I think that people suffering from depression are, probably more often than not, atheistic. I have a huge problem with the pharmacuetical industry as if my post didn't indicate that. I step on the toes of people involved in the medical industry all the time on this. Drugs to fight depression are just adding a chemical dependency to the depressed person's negative state. The medical community has an understanding of the chemical and electrical processes of depression, but does not actually know how it begins or how to actually stop it. They have some techniques that they can throw on the patient, and then see what sticks. It's just a science that is still in it's infancy. The only AGREED biological definition of depression is the cessation of nuerogenisis.

I understand the problems with the re-uptake of Seratonin, but don't you in the medical communities think that the receptor sites get worn down with constant stimulation? Can't the receptor sites be damaged? The answers to these questions are not known because the makers of these drugs DO NOT WANT TO KNOW WHAT THEIR DRUGS ARE ACTUALLY DOING TO THE PATIENT's PHYSIOLOGY IN THE LONG TERM. Is Seratonin the ONLY chemical involved in depression?

The answer to depression is CONTROLING YOUR OWN FUCKING MIND, not in a pill that has a "questionable" safety record. People with depression need to GET A GRIP AND KEEP IT, not a chance to foul up their already delicate nervous system. It's always better to do things the "natural" way, and if you don't have some type of spirituality, you are fighting depression with one hand tied behind your back.

 

[dannymawg]

The answer to depression is CONTROLING YOUR OWN FUCKING MIND, not in a pill that has a "questionable" safety record. People with depression need to GET A GRIP AND KEEP IT, not a chance to foul up their already delicate nervous system. It's always better to do things the "natural" way, and if you don't have some type of spirituality, you are fighting depression with one hand tied behind your back.

Word fuckin up. I know of two people that are pretty much zombies now due to their meds for depression. Reliance on pharmaceuticals is too great nowadays. But it also seems to be too great of a shift for most folks (myself included) to adopt a healthier lifestyle, when the Burger King drive-thru is just a flick of the steering wheel away.

I have issues, albeit minor compared to most others, and have come to realize I've adopted a quote of Kurt Vonnegut: "I am committing suicide by cigarette". Which is a pretty lameass and agonizingly slow way to go, making Phillip Morris/Kraft stockholders richer all the while. After my layoff, I'm now up to three packs of cowboy killers (reds) a day.

So in talking with my doctor during my yearly physical this week (whom I recently sussed out after a fairly hard search for someone I felt comfortable with), he recommended Wellbutrin. ("Talk with your doctor about [insert brand here]... ) I was told it makes the taste of cigs so nasty you quit, while having an effect on your mental balance.

I spent the rest of this week (indeed, the last year) looking inside me for the mental fortitude to quit cold turkey and not rely on a crutch. I'm unable to find it. I have a bottle of Wellbutrin strategically displayed on my bureau that I haven't touched since it was placed there. But then I think of my friends that can barely hold a job or a conversation now after being drugged up for so long... then I think of the six or seven digit bills headed my way (with no current health insurance) if I don't do something. Then I light up.

Funny thing is... since stumbling onto LPSG and subscribing to various online dating (read: hookup) sites, I've come to also realize the damage that smoking is doing to my sexual health/lifestyle... I find more and more folks turn me down when they find out I smoke. Plus looking at the laundry list of reasons to quit (lifted from the last laser smoking cessation clinic site I hit):

•Yellow teeth
•Bad breath
•Smelly clothes
•Stained hands
•Ashes in your car
•Stale air in your house
•Constant cough
•Shortened life span
•Pasty complexion
•Pregnancy
•"Smoker's" mouth (wrinkles from inhaling)
•Lack of energy
•Loss of taste
•Loss of smell
•Being socially unacceptable
•Being sent out to smoke in the cold
•Premature aging
•Wanted money ($1500 - $5000/year/person)
- Mortgage or car payment
- Holiday etc.
•Disapproval of loved ones
•Risk of developing life threatening, incurable diseases.

All of this is so true. OK, maybe not pregnancy in my case. You can throw ED in its place - speaking from experience here. Or constant coughing - in fact, it freaks me out that I rarely cough now, and when I do it's weak.

So I posit: where does one find spirituality? (oh man the fundies are gonna come out of the woodwork on that one) Can I get it OTC? Can one find spirituality in a moderately explicit porn site? :biggrin1:

 

[mephistopheles]

Hi Everyone-
So, I've been on depression medication for a little over 3 months now (I had a major breakdown and subsquent depression caused by finally dealing with a trauma that had happened on long time ago). I've been feeling better, and the meds hadn't caused any side effects. Now, I've met a new guy - we've gone a few dates. Whenever things started to get heated, though, my erection kept coming and going. It was as if my penis was suddenly unreliable! I still came eventually, but I began to get worried that the guy thought I didn't find him attractive (which I most certainly do - my body just won't respond).

Now, some of it might be coming from my issues - I was abused as a child. However, I also have, in the last two weeks, not even had morning wood. It's like the plumbing isn't working at all.

Anyways, my question is mostly - what the heck can I do about it? I mean, i don't think my doctor would believe that I need Viagra (I'm 21). Perhaps I need to switch depression medication, I'm not sure. Any suggestions?

Hi, I was in a simliar boat that you are in... I was diagnosed with depression a few years ago, though it wasnt so much the anxiety or panic attacks, it was that but also anger. I hadta take anger management and all kinds'a shrinks wanted to talk t me and all that!

They put me on Paroxetine HCL (which is just generic Paxil) and I had no erectile disfunction. Though when I first started taking it I turned suddenly very suicidal... So I wouldnt recommend that. Anyway, It's all in your mind. It's depression, its a state of mind, and you are the only one that can change your state of mind, just like Tipod said, a pill cant fix t, you have to do it yourself

Ease up on the pills and get a grip on you, yourself, and your reality.

 

[baseball99]

Depression is not all just "in your mind". People who are trully depressed have no more control over it than someone with any other disease. It's like telling a person with HIV to wash their hands bc if their hands are clean they wont get bacteria on them that will kill them. If someone says "I'm depressed" and then the next day theyre not depressed.....they didnt trully have depression. We are learning more and more every day about the physiology of depression. Its like telling someone who has genetic predisposition to high cholesterol that diet is enough......thats stupid advice that will kill someone. Also along the same lines as a 5'10" 160 pound guy who has blood pressure of 180/100 and telling him exercise will work.....no chance in hell. Depression is physiological. I'm lucky enough not to suffer from it but I have seen numerous patients who have. It is not just in their heads......thats an insult to them. Think of it like telling a gay person that them liking the same sex is "a choice". Depression is probably over-diagnosed and pharmaceutical companies are aggressive however, its up to the patients and their doctors to determine the best treatment. If a doctor diagnoses you with severe depression and says you can just talk about it.....walk out the door.....theyre retarded. SSRI's have some side effects but they are generally mild and severe side effects are very rare (just highly advertised). I dont work in the psychiatric field but i do write scripts for some SSRIs and refer to psychiatrists. Also there was some research a while back about some depressions may be induced by viral infections in susceptible individuals.....its interesting but horrible for the people going through it and I have yet to have a single patient give up on all forms of treatment

 

[Ineligible]

He jests at scars that never felt a wound.

If someone can "get a grip", that person does not have clinical depression.

The only AGREED biological definition of depression is the cessation of nuerogenisis.

Neurogenesis?!! Depression is a syndrome, and is defined by symptoms, not causally. It has nothing to do with neurogenesis. Perhaps you saw the word "depression" in the general sense of "inhibition of an activity" in some piece of writing about neurogenesis, but that's a completely different use of the word.

The definition of depression in the US, and most of the English-speaking word, is as defined in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. There are alternatives in the International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems and the Chinese Classification and Diagnostic Criteria of Mental Disorders, but they are similar.

Twenty or more years ago most drugs were discovered empirically, but drug design now is usually based on biochemical knowledge of target illnesses. It's not fair to say that drug companies are uninterested in what drugs do - their PR people may be concerned to minimise bad publicity, but their researchers very much want to know.

It is unfortunate that the biochemical basis of depression is as yet very little understood. That it is largely biochemical is evidenced by the very poor record of talking therapy treatment compared with drug therapy. But norepinephrine and dopamine as well as serotonin receptors seem to be involved, and the delay of several weeks between taking the pills and feeling the effect shows that the antidepressant effect is due to a slow, indirect, reaction to the changes in neurotransmitter levels.

The sexual side-effects of SSRIs (poor libido and anorgasmia) were not taken seriously enough by researchers for a long time. My impression is that they are the largest reason for not taking antidepressants by people who need them. Fortunately there are now a number of antidepressants that don't have this problem, including buproprion (Wellbutrin, Zyban), reboxetine (Edronax, Norebox, Prolift, Solvex, Vestra), mirtazepine (Remeron, Zispin), tianeptine (Stablon), and agomelatine (Valdoxan).

 

[Rikter8]

I feel your pain Brother. (And sisters when they post)

I too have depression and a limp dick when it comes to sex.
The come and go is typical. I am not on medications for my depression because I have found none that work.
My doctor prescribed me Levitra after I gave him the list of meds that i've been on. He gave up, and so did I. Works ok, but erection loss is common, unless im REALLY into it.

Most medications I found had serious side effects, and my body rejected them.
HOwever, everyone is different and hopefully you will find one that works for you.

I took Lexapro, and stopped it cold turkey (Which many advise not to do).
I couldnt take the misery and stomach pains of taking that med, and have a laundry list of other meds that had similar effects. The small side effects of coming off the meds wasn't nearly as bad as the pains from the meds.

Good Luck to you, as it's not an easy road to walk.
Luckily you have a nice body, so your already ahead of the game.
C

 

[hungthickdc]

DuvalinCT,

Sorry to hear about your depression and subsequent ED. Several years ago I suffered from depression and suicidal thoughts. I first sought counselling and after several months, started discusing the idea of medications with my therapist. I did a ton of research and came to the conclusion that Wellbutrin (bupropion HCL... also marketed as Zyban for smoking cessation) would be my best bet. It seems to be in a class by itself when it comes to treating depression. It's not used to treat anxiety... just depression. As a matter of fact, it can make you more anxious... so it's not for everyone. And unlike most SSRI's, it can actually increase your libido. It did for me. I was on Wellbutrin for about a year, and during that time I continued my therapy. I discontinued counselling/medication about 7 years ago and have never suffered depression since.

Tripod,
Where on earth did you come up with the atheist/depression correlation? That's funny!!!!


To all of you telling him to just "get a grip". As someone who was very close to ending his own life... it's not that simple. Medicines, WHEN USED CORRECTLY, can be an effective tool in fighting depression. I was very reluctant to take drugs to treat my symptoms. But I am here today because of them. Anti-depressent drugs DO NOT cure depression. For many they treat the symptoms and allow for the successful treatment of the depression via counselling/therapy/prayer... whatever works best. Don't be so quick to discount anti-depressent drugs just because many have misused them.

The key to remember is that the drug is a tool to assist in the treatment ... it is not a cure. I firmly believe, from my own experience, that when an anti-depressent drug is used correctly, it is an awesome tool.

just my 2 cents...

 

[DuvalinCT]

To everyone (well, ALMOST everyone) who has responded, thank you all for your support - indeed, I used to be just on Wellbutrin, and I was a randy little tiger ... the addition of Prozac recently (b/c, while making me horny, Wellbutrin was only half-helping with my moods), is what has precipitated the ED. I can't go on SSRI's alone, because they mess with my digestive system, and sitting on the toilet every 30 minutes is no fun.

To those of you who say I should just "control my own fucking mind" - well, more power to you if you can, but some of us are human. I've spent nearly the last decade of my life hiding what happened to me lest anyone think I was not "normal" - and my mind just couldn't take it anymore. I had an absolute emotional collapse. After 10 years of being in control of EVERYTHING - from every little action to every big emotion - I was in control of NOTHING. My mind didn't work the way I wanted it to. It didn't even work half the time. I went from being the proverbial "golden boy" - with everything in my life perfect - to not being able to do much more than wake up, maybe eat a little, sleep ... nearly catatonic. My nervous system, my muscles, my very being had been overcompensating so much it couldn't move on. I was like the Greek soldier who finally made it to Marathon, collapsing because I had pushed myself beyond what I was supposed to do.

I know that's a good bit of personal history, but you know what? Mental health IS personal. Some people can control their moods. I certainly thought I could. Others, however, cannot. Try telling a bipolar person to just calm the shit down. Ain't gonna work, okay?

Housekeeping: I've talked to my doctor, and we're going to see perhaps about getting rid of the Prozac, or at least lessening the dose. It's all give and take, trial and error, because we are all so different chemically. Thanks to those who have been supportive. And to those who have so much power in their lives (and everyone else's), I have one thing to say: to those who have much, much is expected.

So, I'm expecting a lot from you.

 

[tripod]

The lpsg is soooooo AWESOME! A very well rounded set of opinions has been set forth in this thread. It seems like most of the sides and facets to this young man's questions have been considered thoughtfully. Baseball99 seems to have the most professional opinion among the post-ers, his last post was very informative. The first hand experience from Mephistopholes and others is extremely valuable.

Just one word about the "get a grip" thing. I feel I came off rather flippant and want to clarify myself. If someone was climbing a mountain and was very tired and starting to slip, they need to "get a grip and keep it", not let go and fall. It is about survival. The statement about controlling one's own FUCKING mind was a sensational statement and I meant it to be, but again, it was not aimed at Duvalin, I am not insensitive.

Therapy has had a bad track record because there is usually a lack of recapitulation and an overabundance of repetitious self loathing.

I thought that I would detail what I was saying earlier, it was not actually meant for Duvalin per se, but when we post here, it is usually something that we share collectively, as a group.


Depression DOES start in the conscious mind, not the body.
What goes on in the conscious mind?
The contents of the conscious mind is thoughts.
What are thoughts?
Thoughts are "objects" that appear on the screen of the mind.
Where do they come from?
They are causually related to the last thought that appeared on the screen.
One thought leads to another and so on.
It is nearly impossible to stop this never ending stream of thoughts since even in our sleep we continue to think (the unconscious mind is made up of thoughts as well).
When we breathe, we think... in comes the breath, in comes the thought.
Can we stop breathing? No.
Can we control our breathing? Yes.
Where do negative thoughts come from?
They come from fruit from the virtual "negative trees" that exist in your soul.
Where do the "negative trees" come from?
They come from the same seeds that EVERYONE is born with.
How do the seeds become trees? By watering and nurturing them.
When we control our breathing, do we in turn, have some control over our thoughts as well? Yes.
Can anxiety be mitigated simply through the slowing down of one's breathing cycles? Yes.
Are there "positive trees" in one's soul? Yes. They should be cared for and watered.
Is the glass half full or empty? Which image will you CHOOSE to place your attention on?
What objects on the screen of the mind will you pay attention to?
Are they negative or positive?
If they are negative, you have just watered your "negative tree", and it will in turn bear fruit if you keep placing your attention on the negative thought.


The keys to overcoming mild forms of depression and anxiety are:
1). Practice conscious breathing, be aware of your breath as it goes in and out. Put the emphasis on the exhale. Fill your diaghram completely with air on each breath. Watch your belly expand as you breath deeply. DO NOT PRACTICE COSTAL BREATHING, use your diaghram, not your upper ribs for the expansion of your lungs. Correct breathing is a valuable skill, anyone that has practiced martial arts seriously will know what I am talking about.

2). Recapitulate your life's events, this will take a while. The emphasis is on forgiveness and letting go.

3). Water the positive seeds of your soul as often as possible. Do the opposite for your negative seeds.

4). Choose positivity even if you don't FEEL like it. DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!

5). Choose medication if you are so far out of whack, you have a problem with reality itself and are incapable of a MORAL COMPASS of any sorts, These people are truly SICK and need all that the medical community can provide.

 

[hungthickdc]

Just one word about the "get a grip" thing. I feel I came off rather flippant and want to clarify myself. If someone was climbing a mountain and was very tired and starting to slip, they need to "get a grip and keep it", not let go and fall. It is about survival. The statement about controlling one's own FUCKING mind was a sensational statement and I meant it to be, but again, it was not aimed at Duvalin, I am not insensitive.

Therapy has had a bad track record because there is usually a lack of recapitulation and an overabundance of repetitious self loathing.

I thought that I would detail what I was saying earlier, it was not actually meant for Duvalin per se, but when we post here, it is usually something that we share collectively, as a group.


Depression DOES start in the conscious mind, not the body.
What goes on in the conscious mind?
The contents of the conscious mind is thoughts.
What are thoughts?
Thoughts are "objects" that appear on the screen of the mind.
Where do they come from?
They are causually related to the last thought that appeared on the screen.
One thought leads to another and so on.
It is nearly impossible to stop this never ending stream of thoughts since even in our sleep we continue to think (the unconscious mind is made up of thoughts as well).
When we breathe, we think... in comes the breath, in comes the thought.
Can we stop breathing?No.
Can we control our breathing?Yes.
Where do negative thoughts come from?
They come from fruit from the virtual "negative trees" that exist in your soul.
Where do the "negative trees" come from?
They come from the same seeds that EVERYONE is born with.
How do the seeds become trees?By watering and nurturing them.
When we control our breathing, do we in turn, have some control over our thoughts as well?Yes.
Can anxiety be mitigated simply through the slowing down of one's breathing cycles?Yes.
Are there "positive trees" in one's soul?Yes. They should be cared for and watered.
Is the glass half full or empty?Which image will you CHOOSE to place your attention on?
What objects on the screen of the mind will you pay attention to?
Are they negative or positive?
If they are negative, you have just watered your "negative tree", and it will in turn bear fruit if you keep placing your attention on the negative thought.


The keys to overcoming mild forms of depression and anxiety are:
1). Practice conscious breathing, be aware of your breath as it goes in and out. Put the emphasis on the exhale. Fill your diaghram completely with air on each breath. Watch your belly expand as you breath deeply. DO NOT PRACTICE COSTAL BREATHING, use your diaghram, not your upper ribs for the expansion of your lungs. Correct breathing is a valuable skill, anyone that has practiced martial arts seriously will know what I am talking about.

2). Recapitulate your life's events, this will take a while. The emphasis is on forgiveness and letting go.

3). Water the positive seeds of your soul as often as possible. Do the opposite for your negative seeds.

4). Choose positivity even if you don't FEEL like it. DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!

5). Choose medication if you are so far out of whack, you have a problem with reality itself and are incapable of a MORAL COMPASS of any sorts, These people are truly SICK and need all that the medical community can provide.

Tripod,

I can't help but take offense at your poorly disguised judgement that people who are depressed are atheists with no moral compass. That's some weird shit.

You sprinkle your judgements with feel-good "buck-up" sentiments that are meaningless to someone suffering real depression.

And please, if you are going to throw out one line statements of "fact", such as "Therapy has had a bad track record...", "Depression DOES start in the conscious mind, not the body"... the least you could do is try to back it up.

And I hate to belabor the point, but what does a moral compass have to do with depression?

 

[tripod]

Tripod,

I can't help but take offense at your poorly disguised judgement that people who are depressed are atheists with no moral compass. That's some weird shit.

You sprinkle your judgements with feel-good "buck-up" sentiments that are meaningless to someone suffering real depression.

And please, if you are going to throw out one line statements of "fact", such as "Therapy has had a bad track record...", "Depression DOES start in the conscious mind, not the body"... the least you could do is try to back it up.

And I hate to belabor the point, but what does a moral compass have to do with depression?

I was just quoting what another member had said earlier when talking about therapy's track record and attempting to explain a reason that I thought was valid.

Where in the body do you think depression comes from? I am curious to know. Does it start in the liver, or maybe the spleen?

I was referring to someone who is so ill they cannot distinguish right from wrong, those people are dangerous to themselves and society. The prison system is full of them.

My opinions are meant to provide a more balanced perspective on depression. I don't think that natural methods should be eschewed in favor of more invasive methods such as therapy or drugs. People should always give the natural route an honest try before drugs or therapy (only if they are not too far gone). Severe trauma is usually impervious to natural methods, I am not stupid. But my opinions are just one small part of this thread, and I am sorry to offend anyone (HungThick and Duvalin). They did however, provoke strong reactions, and for that I am NOT sorry.