Did Homo Sapiens Eat Neanderthals?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by joshua_ste, Apr 30, 2011.

  1. joshua_ste

    joshua_ste New Member

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    Somewhere over the past few months I learned that humans and Neanderthals could interbreed. This had been in dispute. But anyone with red hair and freckles definately has Neanderthal genes because the genes for red hair and freckles were not present in human beings in Africa.

    Neanderthals, Humans Interbred

    Pre-humans came out of Africa first. Homo erectus (Peking Man) evolved in the east (China) and Neanderthals evolved west (Europe). Both made sophisticated stone tools, made fire, and possibly cooked. The primates that would become humans evolved in Africa and migrated out about 50-60,000 years ago.

    Living as hunter-gatherers and moving place to place we must have occasionally interacted with Neanderthals. The genetic evidence already proves we interbred. But Neanderthals suddenly died out about 30,000 years ago and there's some evidence we ate them.

    How Neanderthals met a grisly fate: devoured by humans | Science | The Observer
     
  2. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    I'd say that's a credible theory.
     
  3. DaveyR

    DaveyR Retired Moderator
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    You would know better than most :wink:
     
  4. maxcok

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    Another reason to feel sad for the poor oppressed gingers.
     
  5. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    That statement is more accurate than you may know.
     
  6. Bbucko

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    I think it's a little more complicated than that, though there are cannibalistic behaviors among indigenous, tribal peoples still practiced today. The issue regarding cannibalism is that, as it's currently practiced, it's a spiritual thing where you absorb the essence of the person being eaten. It's usually not a question of nutrition, though there are plenty of examples of Africans eating primates for food.

    I just don't see how:
    1) We could have hunted down and killed for food the same people with whom we were interbreeding;
    2) We could have devoured an entire population, especially when they were greater in number than we were.

    Personally I believe that there must have been a genetic trait that favored homo sapiens at the expense of Neanderthals: perhaps a more extended range of language articulation, perhaps we were just more efficient (or fiercer) hunters.

    And bear in mind that Europe's climate (where Neanderthals had evolved for more than 100,000 years) was rapidly changing as the last Ice Age was ending. That would definitely have favored homo sapiens, who evolved in Africa, where it was much warmer.
     
  7. D_Principle Pumped

    D_Principle Pumped New Member

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    this seams more credible i also dont think it would have been a sudden extinction, probably over a few hundred years which in relative terms is quite fast. Could be due to a genetic flaw, lack of food, competition, changing environment, could even be if the homo sapiens were stronger females my have preferred to mate with the strongest, maybe germs from different environment effected them more with the two parties coming together, many different reasons
     
  8. lucidbass

    lucidbass New Member

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    Source? It could've been a genetic trait that mutated after humans left Africa.

    Not saying we don't have Neanderthal genes, though.

    Neanderthals weren't creative for the most part. There's no cave art from Neanderthals and their technology barely evolved since they first developed it. They didn't ceromonially bury the dead or wear jewelry either until after they came in contact with humans, so it's believed that they merely copied humans for whatever reason.

    Overal, though, they were more intelligent than humans. But I suppose being good at learning old things isn't as important as being able to think of new things.

    Doesn't help that Neanderthals were overly specialized either.

    Extinction is one of those things that can rarely be attributed to a single factor. Or at least, rarely to such a widespread and successful species.
     
  9. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    *belch*
     
  10. maxcok

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    ..:confused:
     
  11. lucidbass

    lucidbass New Member

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    Bigger brains overal and relative to body size.

    Basically, if Neanderthals were alive today, they'd probably be chess champions. But they wouldn't have been capable of inventing the game.
     
  12. maxcok

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    Maybe I'm incapable of following your logic. But then, I'm a mere human, not a Neanderthal.
     
  13. lucidbass

    lucidbass New Member

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    Well, we're creative. As I said before, we made cave art, Neanderthals didn't.

    I know it's hard to explain. But let's say..... teach a class of Neanderthals math and teach a class of humans. The Neanderthals will likely pick it up better than humans will. But humans would be more likely to develop it further while Neanderthals would likely still be stuck with the same formulas and theory.

    Depends on how you define 'intelligence' I suppose. Actually, the way you phrased it was interesting because yeah, the fact that we ARE humans would make it pretty hard for us to seperate 'intelligence' and 'creativity'.

    I don't know. I'll just say that Neanderthals were believed not to be able to 'imagine' things, only follow what they already know. But they were more capable of learning things.
     
  14. maxcok

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    Thanks for trying, but most likely the fault is in my limited capacity to understand what you're saying.

    After all, I'm a mere human.
     
  15. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    I'm not. Now will you please figure out what we're having for dinner? I'm running out of ideas. What? NO, NOT MEEEEEEEE!!!
     
  16. joshua_ste

    joshua_ste New Member

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    Some Neanderthals were redheads - Technology & science - Science - LiveScience - msnbc.com

    This is a 2007 link. Red hair and freckles have now been conclusively proven to enter homo sapien DNA via Neanderthals.

    Native Africans living in Africa today do not have this gene. The homo sapien population that migrated from Africa 50,000 years ago intermixed with other primates. The population that stayed in Africa did not receive the genetic diversity.
     
  17. maxcok

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    Doesn't apply to "less than". :rolleyes:

    I'm always down for pork barbeque. * fires up the grill *
     
  18. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    Well, you are the creative one after all. Wee! Wee! Wee!
     
  19. maxcok

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    ^ Ha! Thought you could outsmart me, dintcha?

    Now quit that weeweeing. You're making a mess.
     
  20. B_Hickboy

    B_Hickboy New Member

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    ...all the way home...
     
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