Digital Gay Life?

travis1985

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If there was more open activism 30 years ago, it's because it was less known and accepted then. There is less (note I said less, not zero) need for demonstrations to raise awareness. We all know about gay people. I think of a bit from The Simpsons where the participants in a gay pride parade chant, "We're here, we're queer, get used it it," and Lisa of all people replies, "We are used to it. We see this parade every year."

I don't see anything wrong with the current trend of people being a little more private about their sex life. Not everyone wants to be "out," and of those who do, not all wish to make a production of it. You talk about a "gayer world" as though society needs constant reminders. It doesn't. Gay people are a part of everyday life. The novelty has worn off.

And hasn't everything gone more online in recent years? There's nothing new about commentary on how so many people only "see" a lot of the people they consider friends on facebook anymore. It might be a shame that real social interaction is less than it was previously, but I don't see it as a gay shame issue. I see it as a cultural trend that is affecting a lot of different people ... equally. Now that gay and straight people have an aspect of their lives in common, an aspect that has only risen up AFTER being gay stopped being some bizarre thing that surprised everyone, do we now have to combat that sameness by making sure we do it differently?
 

Smaccoms

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You act as if current homophobia is negligible. The overall vibe I get from our society is that people of my community are no longer treated as they were 10 or 20 years ago; therefore it is no longer a problem. It no longer deserves attention or thought. I strongly disagree with this assessment due to the fact that gays, lesbians, and others are still excluded and ostracized across the country. There remains to be a strong lack of representation of our community within the venues where the definitions of masculinity, femininity, and other cultural values are decided upon. Sports for example: the four most popular sports in America (Football, baseball, basketball, and hockey) have yet to have any out pro players during their careers. DADT was only just repealed this year, and homophobia is definitely still strongly represented within our military. How many openly gay or lesbian politicians can you name? Precious few compared to the number this country has.

I believe dismissing the topic due to public opinion is wrong. There is more here than meets the eye. Here are a couple of articles I found while briefly browsing google:

Hate Crimes Statistics - Number of Hate Crimes Motivated By Sexual Orientation Bias

Gay & Lesbian Hate Crime Articles, Information & Statistics

Anti-Gay Hate Crimes: Doing the Math | Southern Poverty Law Center
 
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cruztbone

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Smaccoms, you need to visit california. Gay life is outdoors, year round. But you are a sweet young thing, apparently, and havent lived too long. And massachusetts is cold much of the year and then hot in the summer. I recommend santa cruz county.
 

earllogjam

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Really?

I'd say there are more Gay Pride events, parades etc than in the 70's/80's I'd also say that there are more gay events than ever before. I view most of the 70's as being totally club/bath house centered. Now a days there are more gay groups popping up everywhere.

I think the OP is referring to cruising. Cruising outside in real life and real time and in the flesh as opposed to shopping from photographs of guys on line.

I agree. It's much more fun cruising in the flesh than on line. But maybe there just isn't a critical mass of gay guys in most places anymore to make this possible.
 

avg_joe

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As anyone noticed lately how gay life is increasingly limited to being online? I recently watched documentaries about gay life in the 70's and 80's, back when it was out in the open. Shouldn't we bring it back outside into the world again? Besides, my computer is beginning to die and I for one cannot afford a new one...

You know what amazes me is a lot of celebrities remain closeted although everyone knows they are gay.
 

Smaccoms

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You know what amazes me is a lot of celebrities remain closeted although everyone knows they are gay.

I believe it's due to the venues in which we [as a culture] decide what defines masculinity/femininity and gender roles (among other societal concepts) in our culture. Deviant sexuality and gender still lack proper representation in much of these venues (such as popular sports and politics). Identifying with a sexual deviant nature therefore excludes one from interacting with others at this cultural level; it creates a 2nd class citizenship. It is unseen due to it's subtle nature. It can become obvious when examining micro-cultures within American Society; these micro-cultures (such as San Francisco and P-town) use the same venues to create new standards for masculinity/femininity and gender roles. This is why they are construed as "bizarre" and "undesirable" by the majority when compared to American Society as a whole.

While they are sanctuaries to those of us who are sexually and gender deviant, in my eyes they prove the continued existence of homophobia in our culture at a significant level. If gays and lesbians achieved equality in our society, we would have less need to flock to these "micro-cultures" to experience 1st class citizenship. Though San Francisco would retain it's unique cultural footprint, it would exist in a different vein (like Florence or Venice in Italy).

Anyways by "denying the truth", I believe these celebrities think they can avoid full 2nd class treatment. They believe the benefits of remaining in the closet outweigh the benefits of coming out, even if everyone already knows. This allows homophobic attitudes to exist more pervasively in our culture than they would otherwise. In other words, these celebrities are one of the venues in which concepts in our culture are defined.

This is THE reason why homophobia remains a problem in our society despite advancement of public opinion. America hasn't had one openly gay professional sports player during his career in it's four most popular sports (football, basketball, baseball, and hockey). The 2008 Beijing Games had 10 openly gay athletes (only one was a man) out of almost 11,000 (approximately 0.1% of the population). Remember Johnny Weir? Everything in this particular venue describes homosexuality as not being tolerable, never mind acceptable.

This extends into almost every aspect of our society, despite outside public opinion. I believe one of the symptoms is a "digitalization" of gay life, such as this forum. Even though I AM thankful for them, I recognize them for what they are: outlets.

Hopefully everything here makes sense, even if it took this long to say it all.
 

Smaccoms

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I think the OP is referring to cruising. Cruising outside in real life and real time and in the flesh as opposed to shopping from photographs of guys on line.

I agree. It's much more fun cruising in the flesh than on line. But maybe there just isn't a critical mass of gay guys in most places anymore to make this possible.

Do you think it creates somewhat of a glass ceiling to our current community? Cruising online prevents live interactions, which leads to greater community exploits. The 70's eventually built community ties outside it's sexual exploits, right? They say that's where the strength seen in the same community during the 80's came from in the first place.

I suppose the complaint I was trying to voice was the fact that the gay community in the 70's had this deep-felt connection from what I gather; something our same community today seems to lack. I gather you didn't necessarily need to personally know someone in order to have a social connection with them. There was an automatic understanding between individuals within the community. I don't know, maybe I'm just being crazy.
 

Smaccoms

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Smaccoms, you need to visit california. Gay life is outdoors, year round. But you are a sweet young thing, apparently, and havent lived too long. And massachusetts is cold much of the year and then hot in the summer. I recommend santa cruz county.

In fact, I want to move to San Francisco for a time if I could manage it. I started another thread about it:

http://www.lpsg.org/282676-moving-to-the-frisco.html
 

erratic

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As anyone noticed lately how gay life is increasingly limited to being online? I recently watched documentaries about gay life in the 70's and 80's, back when it was out in the open. Shouldn't we bring it back outside into the world again? Besides, my computer is beginning to die and I for one cannot afford a new one...

I would forward that those documentaries are about the few places in the world where gay life could be open, and that - as most histories do - they are condensing a great deal of events into a short time span so they can be digested as a 90 minute (or so) narrative. I, for one, believe that the gay world is much more out in the open than it was in the 70s and 80s, in most Western countries, anyway. The need for angry political protest may not be quite as pressing as it was, but when I think of how many business fly rainbow flags, how many same-sex couples hold hands, how many queer-run social and sports clubs there are, how many GSAs there are, how many cities have gay districts...I mean I don't think those things could have been supported in the 70s and 80s in the numbers they are now. Some not at all.

That said, I agree that a lot of interaction happens on line now, especially regarding dating, but I wouldn't call it "limited" to the internet at all. I think that gay life has gotten a hell of a lot bigger, and that it's embraced the internet as another way for queers to meet and band together. Because of that, actually, I would argue that we're even more represented in real life than we ever have been before. Because of our presence online people all over the world, in big cities and rural villages alike, are getting exposed to gay people and learning that we're just regular folks. And that makes it easier for gay life to happen safely in the real world.

Anyway, blah, blah, blah. I can't agree more, though, that homophobia is still virulent and endemic. The polyannas out there who pretend to tell us that things are all better and the world is used to gay people clearly don't know what it's like to live life outside of the closet. Thankfully, it is better than it used to be (in some parts of the world), so that makes room for a lot more queer life IRL.
 

Smaccoms

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Anyway, blah, blah, blah. I can't agree more, though, that homophobia is still virulent and endemic. The polyannas out there who pretend to tell us that things are all better and the world is used to gay people clearly don't know what it's like to live life outside of the closet. Thankfully, it is better than it used to be (in some parts of the world), so that makes room for a lot more queer life IRL.

This is why I want to move to San Francisco. There, I can more actively explore and build my self-identity and become a healthier version of myself. Also, it would be a lot of fun. Only in places like San Francisco or P-town can we truly be free in this society. Even then there are limitations...
 

TurkeyWithaSunburn

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I think the OP is referring to cruising. Cruising outside in real life and real time and in the flesh as opposed to shopping from photographs of guys on line.

I agree. It's much more fun cruising in the flesh than on line. But maybe there just isn't a critical mass of gay guys in most places anymore to make this possible.

Oh I guess it threw me that this thread is in Politics....
 

TurkeyWithaSunburn

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This makes no sense.
I shouldn't post when I'm tired :redface: :biggrin: I meant online vs in real life.

Is what you are asking is, Why is gay life and hookup/cruising going online, shouldn't gay dudes get out to the parks and bushes for some hot nookie?
 
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Smaccoms

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Im trying to refer to gay life and it's community overall. Naturally, cruising is going to be a part of that. Also, it doesn't have to be in the parks and bushes. Why should we be so ashamed of ourselves? Straight people have sex right out in the open over in Europe!
 

TurkeyWithaSunburn

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Im trying to refer to gay life and it's community overall. Naturally, cruising is going to be a part of that. Also, it doesn't have to be in the parks and bushes. Why should we be so ashamed of ourselves? Straight people have sex right out in the open over in Europe!

Do you live in Europe?