Bloody hell mate! That's one fucked up situation they put you in. Hope all is well now.
Does anyone actually still believe in God?
- Thread starter B_HappyHammer1977
- Start date
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(HappyHammer1977 @ Nov 3 2005, 02:38 PM) [post=357871]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
Bloody hell mate! That's one fucked up situation they put you in. Hope all is well now.
[/b][/quote]
Thanks Happy Hammer. No, things aren't all back to normal, but getting there, getting there. I think it is time for me to withdraw from this particular thread - my feelings are just too strong, my experiences too nasty. The discussion is very worthwhile, I fear I am taking it in a direction it needn't go.
My thanks to everyone who has written me, also personally.
Bloody hell mate! That's one fucked up situation they put you in. Hope all is well now.
[/b][/quote]
Thanks Happy Hammer. No, things aren't all back to normal, but getting there, getting there. I think it is time for me to withdraw from this particular thread - my feelings are just too strong, my experiences too nasty. The discussion is very worthwhile, I fear I am taking it in a direction it needn't go.
My thanks to everyone who has written me, also personally.
D_Cliebert_Chodechoker
Experimental Member
<span style="font-family:Arial Black"> </span>
WOW.
I first want to feild some questions that one memeber of the forum was asking. He does seem to have hate in his heart.
This should anwser a lot of questions so please be patient and read. Why do we praise God? We praise God bc he is the creator and with out him we would NOT be here to to even decide if we wanted to praise him or not. What kind of love does God want? God wants Unconditional love the same he has shown us. God sent his only son down to be tourted and die for us so that we can have eternal life after death. If God did not love us unconditionally he would of let us hang out with lucifer and be tourtured for all eternity. The members whose questions im anwsering said he admires lucifer bc he made his own choices. Do you realize that the greatest trick the devil pulled was making man believe he did not exsist. The exact life style your living is one lucifer(the fallen angel of God) wants you to live. You gotta understand that he left God and lucifer was conqured and condemned to hell. He wants more people in hell than God has in heaven. Bc he is one of Gods creations and hates God, lucifer is trying to be greater than God. He wants more followers than God, and most of the world is following him living the lifestyles they are living.
Why should we be punished for not loving God? We do deserve to be punished for not loving God be he is the reson we exsist. Do you have any idea how complicated your body is, its a miracle that everything works the way it does. Even if you want to throw evolution at me when the evolutionary chain is traced back to its basic elements on earth you are left with gases. So where did the gases come from. God. As far as physically being punished on earth for not loving God we are punished when we are judged by God in heaven not on earth. He created you and he can judge you.
Does God being creator give him the right to be loved? YES i can't say this enough if God didn't want us here then we would not exsist. GOD CREATED MAN! Why does God let bad things happen to good people? Have you ever heard that suffering has value to God. The more you suffer and offer your suffering to God the greater your reward in heaven will be. As a cathloics we believe suffering has value to God. Hasn't anyone heard any stories of children with cancer or deadly diseases seeing angels when they are close to death. This is to comfort them bc angels are beautiful beyond belief.
Now that I have fielded a few questions i want to make a statement. God has the absolute right to judge and do what he does the way he does it bc he is creator. Even being creator their is one thing God can not make us do. God can not make us love him. We have to choose to love God and live our lives in devotion to him he can't make us. This is where satan comes in he makes sinning more appealing bc its physically pleasurable. God knows we fall to sin bc we are man and we struggle to control our physical urges. This is why we have confession. This is when we confess to God through a priest our sins, and if we are truley sorry for having sinned against God He will forgive us. We have the sacrament of confession the ability to have God save us from our sins bc Jesus died on the cross for us.
As far as being a memeber of faith. If anyone on this forum has been around a true believer of God you will feel some kind of comfort in being around them bc we are suppose to love one another (this is all people nonbelievers or believers) like God has loved us. The more and more you pray to God the better you begin to feel about yourself and the better your life will end up being. Bc you are putting so much positive out in the world you will receive positive in return.
Im not here to force my beliefs on anyone bc just like God i cant make you love God its your decision. Im just here to help you understand the faith more. Please ask questions if you feel like it. Im not always on the net so if i dont anwser just give me some time ill book mark this post.
Thank you for reading and may God bless you.
Ben
WOW.
I first want to feild some questions that one memeber of the forum was asking. He does seem to have hate in his heart.
This should anwser a lot of questions so please be patient and read. Why do we praise God? We praise God bc he is the creator and with out him we would NOT be here to to even decide if we wanted to praise him or not. What kind of love does God want? God wants Unconditional love the same he has shown us. God sent his only son down to be tourted and die for us so that we can have eternal life after death. If God did not love us unconditionally he would of let us hang out with lucifer and be tourtured for all eternity. The members whose questions im anwsering said he admires lucifer bc he made his own choices. Do you realize that the greatest trick the devil pulled was making man believe he did not exsist. The exact life style your living is one lucifer(the fallen angel of God) wants you to live. You gotta understand that he left God and lucifer was conqured and condemned to hell. He wants more people in hell than God has in heaven. Bc he is one of Gods creations and hates God, lucifer is trying to be greater than God. He wants more followers than God, and most of the world is following him living the lifestyles they are living.
Why should we be punished for not loving God? We do deserve to be punished for not loving God be he is the reson we exsist. Do you have any idea how complicated your body is, its a miracle that everything works the way it does. Even if you want to throw evolution at me when the evolutionary chain is traced back to its basic elements on earth you are left with gases. So where did the gases come from. God. As far as physically being punished on earth for not loving God we are punished when we are judged by God in heaven not on earth. He created you and he can judge you.
Does God being creator give him the right to be loved? YES i can't say this enough if God didn't want us here then we would not exsist. GOD CREATED MAN! Why does God let bad things happen to good people? Have you ever heard that suffering has value to God. The more you suffer and offer your suffering to God the greater your reward in heaven will be. As a cathloics we believe suffering has value to God. Hasn't anyone heard any stories of children with cancer or deadly diseases seeing angels when they are close to death. This is to comfort them bc angels are beautiful beyond belief.
Now that I have fielded a few questions i want to make a statement. God has the absolute right to judge and do what he does the way he does it bc he is creator. Even being creator their is one thing God can not make us do. God can not make us love him. We have to choose to love God and live our lives in devotion to him he can't make us. This is where satan comes in he makes sinning more appealing bc its physically pleasurable. God knows we fall to sin bc we are man and we struggle to control our physical urges. This is why we have confession. This is when we confess to God through a priest our sins, and if we are truley sorry for having sinned against God He will forgive us. We have the sacrament of confession the ability to have God save us from our sins bc Jesus died on the cross for us.
As far as being a memeber of faith. If anyone on this forum has been around a true believer of God you will feel some kind of comfort in being around them bc we are suppose to love one another (this is all people nonbelievers or believers) like God has loved us. The more and more you pray to God the better you begin to feel about yourself and the better your life will end up being. Bc you are putting so much positive out in the world you will receive positive in return.
Im not here to force my beliefs on anyone bc just like God i cant make you love God its your decision. Im just here to help you understand the faith more. Please ask questions if you feel like it. Im not always on the net so if i dont anwser just give me some time ill book mark this post.
Thank you for reading and may God bless you.
Ben
GottaBigOne
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In regards to my statement about admiring Lucifer, you pretty much sealed the deal with that explanation of christianity. I was watching this program about north norea the other day and the God you describe sounds like Kim Jong Il, defaming his adversaries in order to steer his sheep away from a dissenting point of view, you damn Luicifer not because anything is inherently wrong with making your own decisions, it is simply wrong to go against god, the sign of a true tyrant. God asks us to follow him unconditionally no matter what he asks of us, he could ask us to kill children and that would be good, he could ask us to rape, steal, whatever and it would be good. What kind of morality is that?
And God values suffering??????? That is truly the most evil thing I've ever heard admitted about anyone's religion. If your God exists, and he values suffering, then thats more reason for me not to follow him, because I don't value suffering. How can you seriouslt agree with that? God created us so that we could suffer because he likes suffering??????? You ever seen Bruce Almighty? God is a little kid with a magnifying glass hovering over an ant hill, fuck your god, if he exists and I'm going to hell for not agreeing with him then so be it, i would rather be righteous in hell, than be a house-nigga in heaven.
And God values suffering??????? That is truly the most evil thing I've ever heard admitted about anyone's religion. If your God exists, and he values suffering, then thats more reason for me not to follow him, because I don't value suffering. How can you seriouslt agree with that? God created us so that we could suffer because he likes suffering??????? You ever seen Bruce Almighty? God is a little kid with a magnifying glass hovering over an ant hill, fuck your god, if he exists and I'm going to hell for not agreeing with him then so be it, i would rather be righteous in hell, than be a house-nigga in heaven.
D_Cliebert_Chodechoker
Experimental Member
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(GottaBigOne @ Nov 3 2005, 02:28 PM) [post=357995]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
In regards to my statement about admiring Lucifer, you pretty much sealed the deal with that explanation of christianity. I was watching this program about north norea the other day and the God you describe sounds like Kim Jong Il, defaming his adversaries in order to steer his sheep away from a dissenting point of view, you damn Luicifer not because anything is inherently wrong with making your own decisions, it is simply wrong to go against god, the sign of a true tyrant. God asks us to follow him unconditionally no matter what he asks of us, he could ask us to kill children and that would be good, he could ask us to rape, steal, whatever and it would be good. What kind of morality is that?
And God values suffering??????? That is truly the most evil thing I've ever heard admitted about anyone's religion. If your God exists, and he values suffering, then thats more reason for me not to follow him, because I don't value suffering. How can you seriouslt agree with that? God created us so that we could suffer because he likes suffering??????? You ever seen Bruce Almighty? God is a little kid with a magnifying glass hovering over an ant hill, fuck your god, if he exists and I'm going to hell for not agreeing with him then so be it, i would rather be righteous in hell, than be a house-nigga in heaven.
[/b][/quote]m
Wow that was extremely hateful. I didnt Mean God values suffering like he enjoys us suffering which is what it seems you understood me to say. Im saying if you suffer in this life and offer it to God he will repay for your suffering in the afterlife. As far as agreeing with it how do you not agree with it. Thats incredible news. Some people suffer bc of choices they make in their life but they can be reconciled for their choices by following God. God wouldnt ever ask to kill or rape or any of the other things youve mentioned bc those are inhumane things. God calls us to love one another. Gods message is a message of peace love and justice.
It really upsets me to hear that you have so much hatred for a God that loves you so much. I mean what really happened man. I feel like i wanna help you understand this more. I dont want to sound like im better than you for my beliefs bc im not God loves you just as much as he loved his son Jesus, who is a historical figure that has been recorded in other places than the bible. As far as your view of being a house N**** in heaven your letting your pride get in the way of the love you should have for God and your fellow human being. The best thing you can do is humble yourself. You will be much better off in life bc trust me theirs always someone bigger badder and meaner out their then you.
Also being righteous in hell is an oxymoron. How can you be righteous, which means without guilt or sin, when thats exactly what hell is a place filled with sinners who refuse to accept Gods love and forgiveness. You are the exact opposite of a righteous person. I dont want to force God on you i wan you to choose God bc i care about what happens to people who just dont know any better.
Please respond if you have any questions to ask.
Thank you and God bless
Ben
In regards to my statement about admiring Lucifer, you pretty much sealed the deal with that explanation of christianity. I was watching this program about north norea the other day and the God you describe sounds like Kim Jong Il, defaming his adversaries in order to steer his sheep away from a dissenting point of view, you damn Luicifer not because anything is inherently wrong with making your own decisions, it is simply wrong to go against god, the sign of a true tyrant. God asks us to follow him unconditionally no matter what he asks of us, he could ask us to kill children and that would be good, he could ask us to rape, steal, whatever and it would be good. What kind of morality is that?
And God values suffering??????? That is truly the most evil thing I've ever heard admitted about anyone's religion. If your God exists, and he values suffering, then thats more reason for me not to follow him, because I don't value suffering. How can you seriouslt agree with that? God created us so that we could suffer because he likes suffering??????? You ever seen Bruce Almighty? God is a little kid with a magnifying glass hovering over an ant hill, fuck your god, if he exists and I'm going to hell for not agreeing with him then so be it, i would rather be righteous in hell, than be a house-nigga in heaven.
[/b][/quote]m
Wow that was extremely hateful. I didnt Mean God values suffering like he enjoys us suffering which is what it seems you understood me to say. Im saying if you suffer in this life and offer it to God he will repay for your suffering in the afterlife. As far as agreeing with it how do you not agree with it. Thats incredible news. Some people suffer bc of choices they make in their life but they can be reconciled for their choices by following God. God wouldnt ever ask to kill or rape or any of the other things youve mentioned bc those are inhumane things. God calls us to love one another. Gods message is a message of peace love and justice.
It really upsets me to hear that you have so much hatred for a God that loves you so much. I mean what really happened man. I feel like i wanna help you understand this more. I dont want to sound like im better than you for my beliefs bc im not God loves you just as much as he loved his son Jesus, who is a historical figure that has been recorded in other places than the bible. As far as your view of being a house N**** in heaven your letting your pride get in the way of the love you should have for God and your fellow human being. The best thing you can do is humble yourself. You will be much better off in life bc trust me theirs always someone bigger badder and meaner out their then you.
Also being righteous in hell is an oxymoron. How can you be righteous, which means without guilt or sin, when thats exactly what hell is a place filled with sinners who refuse to accept Gods love and forgiveness. You are the exact opposite of a righteous person. I dont want to force God on you i wan you to choose God bc i care about what happens to people who just dont know any better.
Please respond if you have any questions to ask.
Thank you and God bless
Ben
GottaBigOne
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CokecanBen9 @ Nov 3 2005, 08:54 PM) [post=358000]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
Wow that was extremely hateful. I didnt Mean God values suffering like he enjoys us suffering which is what it seems you understood me to say. Im saying if you suffer in this life and offer it to God he will repay for your suffering in the afterlife. As far as agreeing with it how do you not agree with it. Thats incredible news. Some people suffer bc of choices they make in their life but they can be reconciled for their choices by following God. God wouldnt ever ask to kill or rape or any of the other things youve mentioned bc those are inhumane things. God calls us to love one another. Gods message is a message of peace love and justice.
It really upsets me to hear that you have so much hatred for a God that loves you so much. I mean what really happened man. I feel like i wanna help you understand this more. I dont want to sound like im better than you for my beliefs bc im not God loves you just as much as he loved his son Jesus, who is a historical figure that has been recorded in other places than the bible. As far as your view of being a house N**** in heaven your letting your pride get in the way of the love you should have for God and your fellow human being. The best thing you can do is humble yourself. You will be much better off in life bc trust me theirs always someone bigger badder and meaner out their then you.
Also being righteous in hell is an oxymoron. How can you be righteous, which means without guilt or sin, when thats exactly what hell is a place filled with sinners who refuse to accept Gods love and forgiveness. You are the exact opposite of a righteous person. I dont want to force God on you i wan you to choose God bc i care about what happens to people who just dont know any better.
Please respond if you have any questions to ask.
Thank you and God bless
Ben
[/b][/quote]
I don't have a hatred for a god that loves me, because if you're god exists in the way that you say then i don't believe what he feels for me is reallym love, nor do I want it.
What's so bad about pride? why must I humble myself unjustly? If god gave me this faculty of reason, then why is it bad to use it and be proud of it? Or maybe god didn't give me reason but adam and eve stole it from the tree of knowledge, and it was bad to do that right?? its bad to use your brain, better to be a robot that follows all of god's whims.
My point wasn't that god says kill innocent people, although he has done a lot of that in the bible, just read exodus and you will see how he kills innocent children. My point about that morality is that it isn't moral, because a morality based on "i said so" can be anything. it could be, feed the homeless because I said so, or kill the homeless because I said so.
I can be righteous in hell if god is not righteous and is evil. Just because he's god doesn't mean he is immune to judgment.
Wow that was extremely hateful. I didnt Mean God values suffering like he enjoys us suffering which is what it seems you understood me to say. Im saying if you suffer in this life and offer it to God he will repay for your suffering in the afterlife. As far as agreeing with it how do you not agree with it. Thats incredible news. Some people suffer bc of choices they make in their life but they can be reconciled for their choices by following God. God wouldnt ever ask to kill or rape or any of the other things youve mentioned bc those are inhumane things. God calls us to love one another. Gods message is a message of peace love and justice.
It really upsets me to hear that you have so much hatred for a God that loves you so much. I mean what really happened man. I feel like i wanna help you understand this more. I dont want to sound like im better than you for my beliefs bc im not God loves you just as much as he loved his son Jesus, who is a historical figure that has been recorded in other places than the bible. As far as your view of being a house N**** in heaven your letting your pride get in the way of the love you should have for God and your fellow human being. The best thing you can do is humble yourself. You will be much better off in life bc trust me theirs always someone bigger badder and meaner out their then you.
Also being righteous in hell is an oxymoron. How can you be righteous, which means without guilt or sin, when thats exactly what hell is a place filled with sinners who refuse to accept Gods love and forgiveness. You are the exact opposite of a righteous person. I dont want to force God on you i wan you to choose God bc i care about what happens to people who just dont know any better.
Please respond if you have any questions to ask.
Thank you and God bless
Ben
[/b][/quote]
I don't have a hatred for a god that loves me, because if you're god exists in the way that you say then i don't believe what he feels for me is reallym love, nor do I want it.
What's so bad about pride? why must I humble myself unjustly? If god gave me this faculty of reason, then why is it bad to use it and be proud of it? Or maybe god didn't give me reason but adam and eve stole it from the tree of knowledge, and it was bad to do that right?? its bad to use your brain, better to be a robot that follows all of god's whims.
My point wasn't that god says kill innocent people, although he has done a lot of that in the bible, just read exodus and you will see how he kills innocent children. My point about that morality is that it isn't moral, because a morality based on "i said so" can be anything. it could be, feed the homeless because I said so, or kill the homeless because I said so.
I can be righteous in hell if god is not righteous and is evil. Just because he's god doesn't mean he is immune to judgment.
D_Cliebert_Chodechoker
Experimental Member
[/quote]
I don't have a hatred for a god that loves me, because if you're god exists in the way that you say then i don't believe what he feels for me is reallym love, nor do I want it.
What's so bad about pride? why must I humble myself unjustly? If god gave me this faculty of reason, then why is it bad to use it and be proud of it? Or maybe god didn't give me reason but adam and eve stole it from the tree of knowledge, and it was bad to do that right?? its bad to use your brain, better to be a robot that follows all of god's whims.
My point wasn't that god says kill innocent people, although he has done a lot of that in the bible, just read exodus and you will see how he kills innocent children. My point about that morality is that it isn't moral, because a morality based on "i said so" can be anything. it could be, feed the homeless because I said so, or kill the homeless because I said so.
I can be righteous in hell if god is not righteous and is evil. Just because he's god doesn't mean he is immune to judgment.
[/quote]
Whats so bad about pride, that mean you think of yo9urself before you think of others if you think of others at all. What can stem from pride? Ego. Ego is the reason for killing someone bc you didnt like what they said about you. Pride, Ego gets what the individual wants not what is good for the whole. thats whats really wrong with society today. We are so worried about ourselfs, not that we shouldnt take care of ourselves bc we should, that we dont care at all about others unless it effects us.
Being able to reason comes from God choosing how to reson comes from the individual. Your correct man did fall when they ate the apple.
Their are problems about your refrence in exodus. First exodus is found in the old testemate. The old testemate is like a history book as far as we today are concerned. We use the new testemate as our guidelines and teachings today. The oldtestemate is their to let us know what we as Cathloics have been through. What I think your referring to is passover when God killed all the people whose doors werent marked with lambs blood, correct. Those people werent innocent they were slave owners and slave owners familys who were givin opportuntiny to set Gods people free so they could pass Gods message of peace love and in this case justice, bc what happened was just., on to others. The people killed had many chances to and were warned about what was going to happen to them if they didnt set Gods peoploe(their slaves) free.
Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?
When you type something about morals being what i said so then say that God says to kill your forgetting that Gods message isnt kill. Its love, peace, and justice.
And as far as you last comment about you being able to judge God i will ignore it bc you seem to be uneducated in the faith soI wont say anything about how completely redicilous that is to say. I could not physically make those words come out of my mouth.
God bless
Ben
I don't have a hatred for a god that loves me, because if you're god exists in the way that you say then i don't believe what he feels for me is reallym love, nor do I want it.
What's so bad about pride? why must I humble myself unjustly? If god gave me this faculty of reason, then why is it bad to use it and be proud of it? Or maybe god didn't give me reason but adam and eve stole it from the tree of knowledge, and it was bad to do that right?? its bad to use your brain, better to be a robot that follows all of god's whims.
My point wasn't that god says kill innocent people, although he has done a lot of that in the bible, just read exodus and you will see how he kills innocent children. My point about that morality is that it isn't moral, because a morality based on "i said so" can be anything. it could be, feed the homeless because I said so, or kill the homeless because I said so.
I can be righteous in hell if god is not righteous and is evil. Just because he's god doesn't mean he is immune to judgment.
[/quote]
Whats so bad about pride, that mean you think of yo9urself before you think of others if you think of others at all. What can stem from pride? Ego. Ego is the reason for killing someone bc you didnt like what they said about you. Pride, Ego gets what the individual wants not what is good for the whole. thats whats really wrong with society today. We are so worried about ourselfs, not that we shouldnt take care of ourselves bc we should, that we dont care at all about others unless it effects us.
Being able to reason comes from God choosing how to reson comes from the individual. Your correct man did fall when they ate the apple.
Their are problems about your refrence in exodus. First exodus is found in the old testemate. The old testemate is like a history book as far as we today are concerned. We use the new testemate as our guidelines and teachings today. The oldtestemate is their to let us know what we as Cathloics have been through. What I think your referring to is passover when God killed all the people whose doors werent marked with lambs blood, correct. Those people werent innocent they were slave owners and slave owners familys who were givin opportuntiny to set Gods people free so they could pass Gods message of peace love and in this case justice, bc what happened was just., on to others. The people killed had many chances to and were warned about what was going to happen to them if they didnt set Gods peoploe(their slaves) free.
Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?
When you type something about morals being what i said so then say that God says to kill your forgetting that Gods message isnt kill. Its love, peace, and justice.
And as far as you last comment about you being able to judge God i will ignore it bc you seem to be uneducated in the faith soI wont say anything about how completely redicilous that is to say. I could not physically make those words come out of my mouth.
God bless
Ben
GottaBigOne
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lol. That last part was funny.
In exodus, god kills the children of the egyptians, those who aren't respob\nsible for the enslavement of the jews. That reveals that god thinks its ok to punish children for the acts of their parents, punish people for the acts of others. He also is in favor of rewarding people for the acts of their ancestors, he promises abraham that his lineage will be blessed. What kind of justice is that? Should I be punished because my father is a mass murderer? She I be rewrded fopr things I did not do, or had no control over, i.e. the family i was born into??
I guess we have a disagreement over what the definition of "pride" is. You seem to think that it means only the total disregard for anyone else.
pride Audio pronunciation of "pride" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prd)
n.
1. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect.
2. Pleasure or satisfaction taken in an achievement, possession, or association: parental pride.
3. Arrogant or disdainful conduct or treatment; haughtiness.
4.
1. A cause or source of pleasure or satisfaction; the best of a group or class: These soldiers were their country's pride.
2. The most successful or thriving condition; prime: the pride of youth.
5. An excessively high opinion of oneself; conceit.
When I talk of pride, I am talking about the first,second, and fourth definitions. I would elaborate on the others as being irrational pride. Being proud of one's self does not necessitate the breaking down of others, i would call that flase pride; lifting yourself up by lowering everyone esle. We are in agreement that that kind of "pride" is wrong. But the god of the bible doesn't seem to be against that type of pride, but all pride. One can't be proud of one's achievements on this earth because ultimately this world doesn't count. That is what I dislike, totally disregarding this life in favor of the next. This is the onyl life I know that I will have, there is no evidence whatsoever of an afterlife, actually the working of consciousness seem to say that when we die our consciousnesses vanish.
"Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?" -Coke-
How are we to judge that god's morality truly is for the better??? The only justification i've heard is that since its in the bibnle, then its true, because god says so. What is really better for people??? I say it is better for people to live rationally, and do away with superstition, deal with reality instead of convincing themsleves of the unreal. There would be no killing if people did that either. All of todays problems do stem from evil, but not the evil that is defined as "anti-god", instead rationally defined evil.
One last thing, don't assume I'm uneducated about the faith simpyl because I don't agree, that is a great disservice to debate. Realize that even those that know a lot of your faith dont agree with you automatically.
In exodus, god kills the children of the egyptians, those who aren't respob\nsible for the enslavement of the jews. That reveals that god thinks its ok to punish children for the acts of their parents, punish people for the acts of others. He also is in favor of rewarding people for the acts of their ancestors, he promises abraham that his lineage will be blessed. What kind of justice is that? Should I be punished because my father is a mass murderer? She I be rewrded fopr things I did not do, or had no control over, i.e. the family i was born into??
I guess we have a disagreement over what the definition of "pride" is. You seem to think that it means only the total disregard for anyone else.
pride Audio pronunciation of "pride" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prd)
n.
1. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect.
2. Pleasure or satisfaction taken in an achievement, possession, or association: parental pride.
3. Arrogant or disdainful conduct or treatment; haughtiness.
4.
1. A cause or source of pleasure or satisfaction; the best of a group or class: These soldiers were their country's pride.
2. The most successful or thriving condition; prime: the pride of youth.
5. An excessively high opinion of oneself; conceit.
When I talk of pride, I am talking about the first,second, and fourth definitions. I would elaborate on the others as being irrational pride. Being proud of one's self does not necessitate the breaking down of others, i would call that flase pride; lifting yourself up by lowering everyone esle. We are in agreement that that kind of "pride" is wrong. But the god of the bible doesn't seem to be against that type of pride, but all pride. One can't be proud of one's achievements on this earth because ultimately this world doesn't count. That is what I dislike, totally disregarding this life in favor of the next. This is the onyl life I know that I will have, there is no evidence whatsoever of an afterlife, actually the working of consciousness seem to say that when we die our consciousnesses vanish.
"Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?" -Coke-
How are we to judge that god's morality truly is for the better??? The only justification i've heard is that since its in the bibnle, then its true, because god says so. What is really better for people??? I say it is better for people to live rationally, and do away with superstition, deal with reality instead of convincing themsleves of the unreal. There would be no killing if people did that either. All of todays problems do stem from evil, but not the evil that is defined as "anti-god", instead rationally defined evil.
One last thing, don't assume I'm uneducated about the faith simpyl because I don't agree, that is a great disservice to debate. Realize that even those that know a lot of your faith dont agree with you automatically.
[quote name='HappyHammer1977' date='Oct 20 2005, 03:17 PM' post='232796']
THINK ABOUT THE UNIVERSE AND HOW IT CAME INTO BEING. CAN AN EXPLOSION JUST HAPPEN AND DRY LAND APPEAR ,HUMAN JUST START WALKING ONTHE LAND, BIRD O FTHE AIR. IF A GOD DOES NOT EXIST WHY DOES PEOPLE IN THERE DYING STATE CRY "LORD HAVE MERCY" HOW COMES THERE ARE SEASONS INTHE YEAR AND SOMETIMES THER IS STORM IN PART OF TEH COUNTRY AND RAGING HEAT INTHE OTHER . IF THERE IS NO GOD WHY SCIENTIST TRY TO PROVE THAT NOAH ARK DID EXIST. IF THERE IS NO GOD WHY MAN CANNOT MAKE BABIES OR HUMAN AND BREATHE INTHEN THE BREATHOF LIFE. THEY MAKE ROBOT BUT NOT HUMAN. THERE ARE SO MANY THINGS AROUND US TO PROVE THAT THERE IS A HIGHER SUPER NATURAL BEING THAT GOVERNS THE ATMOSPHERE AND THE WORLD.
ANOTHER QUESTION SCIENTIST SAYS THE WORLD HANGS IN SPACE wow!! WHO HOLDS THE WORLD IN SPACE. THINGS ON THESE THINGS CAN REVOLUTION MAKE ALL THESE THINGS HAPPEN? CAN MAN DO ALL THESE THINGS? THERE MUST BE A GOD SOMEWHERE HE GAVE US A FREE CHOICE WE CAN ACCEPT HIM OR REJECT HIM ITS UPS TO US. WE CAN SAY HE DOES NOT EXIST OR WHY SHOULD WE LOVE HIS OFFER
. THERE IS A RACE TO RUN WE CAN PARTICIPATE INTHE RUN OR TURNIT DOWN OR WE CAN RUNTHE RACE BUT WE DONT WE DONT HAVE TO PUT OUR ALL INIT SO WE DONT NEED A REWARD. THE CHOICE IS DONE TOUS REJECT OR ACCEPT BUT THER IS A GOD WHETHER WE WANT TO A BELIVE IT OR NOT
THINK ABOUT THE UNIVERSE AND HOW IT CAME INTO BEING. CAN AN EXPLOSION JUST HAPPEN AND DRY LAND APPEAR ,HUMAN JUST START WALKING ONTHE LAND, BIRD O FTHE AIR. IF A GOD DOES NOT EXIST WHY DOES PEOPLE IN THERE DYING STATE CRY "LORD HAVE MERCY" HOW COMES THERE ARE SEASONS INTHE YEAR AND SOMETIMES THER IS STORM IN PART OF TEH COUNTRY AND RAGING HEAT INTHE OTHER . IF THERE IS NO GOD WHY SCIENTIST TRY TO PROVE THAT NOAH ARK DID EXIST. IF THERE IS NO GOD WHY MAN CANNOT MAKE BABIES OR HUMAN AND BREATHE INTHEN THE BREATHOF LIFE. THEY MAKE ROBOT BUT NOT HUMAN. THERE ARE SO MANY THINGS AROUND US TO PROVE THAT THERE IS A HIGHER SUPER NATURAL BEING THAT GOVERNS THE ATMOSPHERE AND THE WORLD.
ANOTHER QUESTION SCIENTIST SAYS THE WORLD HANGS IN SPACE wow!! WHO HOLDS THE WORLD IN SPACE. THINGS ON THESE THINGS CAN REVOLUTION MAKE ALL THESE THINGS HAPPEN? CAN MAN DO ALL THESE THINGS? THERE MUST BE A GOD SOMEWHERE HE GAVE US A FREE CHOICE WE CAN ACCEPT HIM OR REJECT HIM ITS UPS TO US. WE CAN SAY HE DOES NOT EXIST OR WHY SHOULD WE LOVE HIS OFFER
. THERE IS A RACE TO RUN WE CAN PARTICIPATE INTHE RUN OR TURNIT DOWN OR WE CAN RUNTHE RACE BUT WE DONT WE DONT HAVE TO PUT OUR ALL INIT SO WE DONT NEED A REWARD. THE CHOICE IS DONE TOUS REJECT OR ACCEPT BUT THER IS A GOD WHETHER WE WANT TO A BELIVE IT OR NOT
GottaBigOne
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Shawn, I think I speak for all theists when I say that you should keep your thoughts to yourself, it makes them look bad.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(GottaBigOne @ Nov 3 2005, 05:57 PM) [post=358034]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
Shawn, I think I speak for all theists when I say that you should keep your thoughts to yourself, it makes them look bad.
[/b][/quote]
Got a Big One,
You and I have always respected each other. Please acept the fact that all who profess to be Christians do not agree on a lot of things including many parts of the Bible.
I believe that msot of genesis is allegory, myths and legends. Saure there is truth there, but not all the stories are factual. the Israelite people are like most other ancients, they spun stories to tell around the camp fire. Just because they told the stories doesn't make the stories factual.
There is a middle ground though betweeen being atheist and believing like the very orthodox believe. I beleive in the progressive revelatin of God. God is still reveling. And humans are still misunderstanding. I have no doubt God is perfect. But some poeple's discription of God and their belief in God is way off base.
To me, this is what God is: honesty, character, love, kindness, unselfishness and etc. These are eternal truths. God encompases all of these. God is not dishonest, does not hate, and only wants the best for all the creatures.
This world is not perfect. Heaven is described as a place of perfection. This is the God I believe in.
I share your disdain for the picture of God that many believe in. And I recognize the Bible for being what it is. It has value. But let's not put that much emphasis particularly on the Old Testament. The ancients didn't understand God. And anyone who would persecute anyone in the name of God is just wrong in my book.
I am sorry you weren't exposed to the concept of God that I was. Perhaps you might feel differently. I don't know.
I still think that God has more respect for you than for some of the false prophets that parade around in his name. To me God is all about forgiving and making us perfect people who can live forever without any faults.
I would have very much trouble worshipping the kind of God you have described that you understand him to be. If I believed about God what you believe, I couldn't worship him either.
BTW, I still plan on seeing you in heaven. Sorry, I don't want any part of hell. Even the Bible says that hell wasn't for humans. Not sure any humans will be there.
Oh no, here comes the wrath of the fundies on me now. GTW I may need your help
![<]()
Shawn, I think I speak for all theists when I say that you should keep your thoughts to yourself, it makes them look bad.
[/b][/quote]
Got a Big One,
You and I have always respected each other. Please acept the fact that all who profess to be Christians do not agree on a lot of things including many parts of the Bible.
I believe that msot of genesis is allegory, myths and legends. Saure there is truth there, but not all the stories are factual. the Israelite people are like most other ancients, they spun stories to tell around the camp fire. Just because they told the stories doesn't make the stories factual.
There is a middle ground though betweeen being atheist and believing like the very orthodox believe. I beleive in the progressive revelatin of God. God is still reveling. And humans are still misunderstanding. I have no doubt God is perfect. But some poeple's discription of God and their belief in God is way off base.
To me, this is what God is: honesty, character, love, kindness, unselfishness and etc. These are eternal truths. God encompases all of these. God is not dishonest, does not hate, and only wants the best for all the creatures.
This world is not perfect. Heaven is described as a place of perfection. This is the God I believe in.
I share your disdain for the picture of God that many believe in. And I recognize the Bible for being what it is. It has value. But let's not put that much emphasis particularly on the Old Testament. The ancients didn't understand God. And anyone who would persecute anyone in the name of God is just wrong in my book.
I am sorry you weren't exposed to the concept of God that I was. Perhaps you might feel differently. I don't know.
I still think that God has more respect for you than for some of the false prophets that parade around in his name. To me God is all about forgiving and making us perfect people who can live forever without any faults.
I would have very much trouble worshipping the kind of God you have described that you understand him to be. If I believed about God what you believe, I couldn't worship him either.
BTW, I still plan on seeing you in heaven. Sorry, I don't want any part of hell. Even the Bible says that hell wasn't for humans. Not sure any humans will be there.
Oh no, here comes the wrath of the fundies on me now. GTW I may need your help
GottaBigOne
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freddie, i was in now way equating you with shawn, that was my point of the last post even though it was tongue in cheek. I was saying that people like him should keep their mouths shut, and let the christians who can actually make arguments speak.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(GottaBigOne @ Nov 3 2005, 08:05 PM) [post=358065]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
freddie, i was in now way equating you with shawn, that was my point of the last post even though it was tongue in cheek. I was saying that people like him should keep their mouths shut, and let the christians who can actually make arguments speak.
[/b][/quote]
Thanks. I know you weren't equating me with them. I was speaking as much to them as you. Still, you will help me when they come to get me for blasphemy? It will be easier facing the gallows when I know I have a friend there with me.
![<]()
It's OK. They killed Jesus too.
freddie, i was in now way equating you with shawn, that was my point of the last post even though it was tongue in cheek. I was saying that people like him should keep their mouths shut, and let the christians who can actually make arguments speak.
[/b][/quote]
Thanks. I know you weren't equating me with them. I was speaking as much to them as you. Still, you will help me when they come to get me for blasphemy? It will be easier facing the gallows when I know I have a friend there with me.
It's OK. They killed Jesus too.
GottaBigOne
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D_Cliebert_Chodechoker
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(GottaBigOne @ Nov 3 2005, 04:21 PM) [post=358029]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
lol. That last part was funny.
In exodus, god kills the children of the egyptians, those who aren't respob\nsible for the enslavement of the jews. That reveals that god thinks its ok to punish children for the acts of their parents, punish people for the acts of others. He also is in favor of rewarding people for the acts of their ancestors, he promises abraham that his lineage will be blessed. What kind of justice is that? Should I be punished because my father is a mass murderer? She I be rewrded fopr things I did not do, or had no control over, i.e. the family i was born into??
I guess we have a disagreement over what the definition of "pride" is. You seem to think that it means only the total disregard for anyone else.
pride Audio pronunciation of "pride" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prd)
n.
1. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect.
2. Pleasure or satisfaction taken in an achievement, possession, or association: parental pride.
3. Arrogant or disdainful conduct or treatment; haughtiness.
4.
1. A cause or source of pleasure or satisfaction; the best of a group or class: These soldiers were their country's pride.
2. The most successful or thriving condition; prime: the pride of youth.
5. An excessively high opinion of oneself; conceit.
When I talk of pride, I am talking about the first,second, and fourth definitions. I would elaborate on the others as being irrational pride. Being proud of one's self does not necessitate the breaking down of others, i would call that flase pride; lifting yourself up by lowering everyone esle. We are in agreement that that kind of "pride" is wrong. But the god of the bible doesn't seem to be against that type of pride, but all pride. One can't be proud of one's achievements on this earth because ultimately this world doesn't count. That is what I dislike, totally disregarding this life in favor of the next. This is the onyl life I know that I will have, there is no evidence whatsoever of an afterlife, actually the working of consciousness seem to say that when we die our consciousnesses vanish.
"Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?" -Coke-
How are we to judge that god's morality truly is for the better??? The only justification i've heard is that since its in the bibnle, then its true, because god says so. What is really better for people??? I say it is better for people to live rationally, and do away with superstition, deal with reality instead of convincing themsleves of the unreal. There would be no killing if people did that either. All of todays problems do stem from evil, but not the evil that is defined as "anti-god", instead rationally defined evil.
One last thing, don't assume I'm uneducated about the faith simpyl because I don't agree, that is a great disservice to debate. Realize that even those that know a lot of your faith dont agree with you automatically.
[/b][/quote]
God wasnt punishing the children, he was punishing the parents who were responsible for the enslave ment of Moses and his people. He didnt kill the baby children he killed the first born. The first born was believed to be the best child of a family. They got all the graces and riches of the family when the parents passes away. Thats why he killed the first born it was irrelivant weather or not you believe they were innocent bc they were sinnerslike all people were, but they had broken and rejected the covenant with God. So ou feel Gods wrath. You have to understand that this was a just God and at this time Jesus hadn't died for our sins so their was no forgiveness. Thats why Jesus dieng for our sins was such a big deal.
I will agree with you in saying theirs nothing wrong with self respect, or being proud of something we have accomplished. I was speaking of pride that has disreguard for others which you seemed to have at the time i responded, and mabye you still do your just controlling your temper more now.
We do not totally disreguard this life for the next at all. We completely reguard this life, but you dont consider following God a life. What do you consider a life, truley? Bc you can follow God have a family be successful and still live by Gods guide lines. What more could do you want other than to sin and be against God? It sounds like from reading your posts you want to have a life that is pleasurable to the flesh instead of to the soul. Anwser these questions for me please.
If you truley want to know the anwser to the question "how are we to judge that Gods morality is truley for the better?" Live your life according to Gods teaching for one day just one day and see how much easier life is to live. See how much people offer you more respect bc you have offered it to them first.
Also you say that if people live rationally and dont believe in superstition, and deal with what is their then their would be no killing either. Theirs a problem with that what might be rational to one person might not be rational thinking at all to the next. For someone who grows up broke and makes a living stealing then stealing is the rational thing to do bc thats how they have done things. Now if you follow in Gods guidelines then stealing is a sin and you would of never learned to steal in the first place.
Any action that is evil is anti God.
Evil- Morally bad or wrong
-Causing ruin, injury, or pain
-The quality of being morally bad or wrong
-That which causes harm misfortune or discomfort.
Arent all those things anti God.
I say you dont know a lot about your faith when i should say you cant clearly understand the faith and how it works together, and how much God love you. You dont seem to be grasping that when I type it
GOD LOVES YOU!
Why do you live a lifestyle against him. What routine have you gotten in or what has happened in your life that you hate God so much as to say fuck him, you said this literally.
Listen to me God loves you........ Love him back if you chose to. Also explain to me why you are so hateful mabye you are anti God bc you dont understand something that has happened to you and youblame God for it. Have you ever been completely peaceful and happy in your life with out sinning while you felt that way.
Please respond and God Bless
Ben
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dr Rock @ Nov 3 2005, 10:23 PM) [post=358101]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
wheee. just when I thought this thread had gotten irretrievably boring, a new shortbusload of mentally-challenged god-goons pulls up to spread the word. freddie and gottabigone, could you two like stand aside for a minute so i can get a better view of this performance?
[/b][/quote]
God-goons who are you to lable any one. Yet alone a follower of Christ. Do not discriminate bc you dont have the discipline to disreguard sins of the flesh that the morally weak individuals fall victim to.
lol. That last part was funny.
In exodus, god kills the children of the egyptians, those who aren't respob\nsible for the enslavement of the jews. That reveals that god thinks its ok to punish children for the acts of their parents, punish people for the acts of others. He also is in favor of rewarding people for the acts of their ancestors, he promises abraham that his lineage will be blessed. What kind of justice is that? Should I be punished because my father is a mass murderer? She I be rewrded fopr things I did not do, or had no control over, i.e. the family i was born into??
I guess we have a disagreement over what the definition of "pride" is. You seem to think that it means only the total disregard for anyone else.
pride Audio pronunciation of "pride" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prd)
n.
1. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect.
2. Pleasure or satisfaction taken in an achievement, possession, or association: parental pride.
3. Arrogant or disdainful conduct or treatment; haughtiness.
4.
1. A cause or source of pleasure or satisfaction; the best of a group or class: These soldiers were their country's pride.
2. The most successful or thriving condition; prime: the pride of youth.
5. An excessively high opinion of oneself; conceit.
When I talk of pride, I am talking about the first,second, and fourth definitions. I would elaborate on the others as being irrational pride. Being proud of one's self does not necessitate the breaking down of others, i would call that flase pride; lifting yourself up by lowering everyone esle. We are in agreement that that kind of "pride" is wrong. But the god of the bible doesn't seem to be against that type of pride, but all pride. One can't be proud of one's achievements on this earth because ultimately this world doesn't count. That is what I dislike, totally disregarding this life in favor of the next. This is the onyl life I know that I will have, there is no evidence whatsoever of an afterlife, actually the working of consciousness seem to say that when we die our consciousnesses vanish.
"Morality isnt based on "I said so" its based on whats best for the poeple as a whole and as a whole if everyone on earth lived as God intended and followed his teachings their would be no war or killing or death over oil. All of the problems today stem from evil. Right or wrong? Im asking you what you think. are todays problems based on evil , pride enduced decisions about one country or person worring about only themselves?" -Coke-
How are we to judge that god's morality truly is for the better??? The only justification i've heard is that since its in the bibnle, then its true, because god says so. What is really better for people??? I say it is better for people to live rationally, and do away with superstition, deal with reality instead of convincing themsleves of the unreal. There would be no killing if people did that either. All of todays problems do stem from evil, but not the evil that is defined as "anti-god", instead rationally defined evil.
One last thing, don't assume I'm uneducated about the faith simpyl because I don't agree, that is a great disservice to debate. Realize that even those that know a lot of your faith dont agree with you automatically.
[/b][/quote]
God wasnt punishing the children, he was punishing the parents who were responsible for the enslave ment of Moses and his people. He didnt kill the baby children he killed the first born. The first born was believed to be the best child of a family. They got all the graces and riches of the family when the parents passes away. Thats why he killed the first born it was irrelivant weather or not you believe they were innocent bc they were sinnerslike all people were, but they had broken and rejected the covenant with God. So ou feel Gods wrath. You have to understand that this was a just God and at this time Jesus hadn't died for our sins so their was no forgiveness. Thats why Jesus dieng for our sins was such a big deal.
I will agree with you in saying theirs nothing wrong with self respect, or being proud of something we have accomplished. I was speaking of pride that has disreguard for others which you seemed to have at the time i responded, and mabye you still do your just controlling your temper more now.
We do not totally disreguard this life for the next at all. We completely reguard this life, but you dont consider following God a life. What do you consider a life, truley? Bc you can follow God have a family be successful and still live by Gods guide lines. What more could do you want other than to sin and be against God? It sounds like from reading your posts you want to have a life that is pleasurable to the flesh instead of to the soul. Anwser these questions for me please.
If you truley want to know the anwser to the question "how are we to judge that Gods morality is truley for the better?" Live your life according to Gods teaching for one day just one day and see how much easier life is to live. See how much people offer you more respect bc you have offered it to them first.
Also you say that if people live rationally and dont believe in superstition, and deal with what is their then their would be no killing either. Theirs a problem with that what might be rational to one person might not be rational thinking at all to the next. For someone who grows up broke and makes a living stealing then stealing is the rational thing to do bc thats how they have done things. Now if you follow in Gods guidelines then stealing is a sin and you would of never learned to steal in the first place.
Any action that is evil is anti God.
Evil- Morally bad or wrong
-Causing ruin, injury, or pain
-The quality of being morally bad or wrong
-That which causes harm misfortune or discomfort.
Arent all those things anti God.
I say you dont know a lot about your faith when i should say you cant clearly understand the faith and how it works together, and how much God love you. You dont seem to be grasping that when I type it
GOD LOVES YOU!
Why do you live a lifestyle against him. What routine have you gotten in or what has happened in your life that you hate God so much as to say fuck him, you said this literally.
Listen to me God loves you........ Love him back if you chose to. Also explain to me why you are so hateful mabye you are anti God bc you dont understand something that has happened to you and youblame God for it. Have you ever been completely peaceful and happy in your life with out sinning while you felt that way.
Please respond and God Bless
Ben
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dr Rock @ Nov 3 2005, 10:23 PM) [post=358101]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
wheee. just when I thought this thread had gotten irretrievably boring, a new shortbusload of mentally-challenged god-goons pulls up to spread the word. freddie and gottabigone, could you two like stand aside for a minute so i can get a better view of this performance?
[/b][/quote]
God-goons who are you to lable any one. Yet alone a follower of Christ. Do not discriminate bc you dont have the discipline to disreguard sins of the flesh that the morally weak individuals fall victim to.
GottaBigOne
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So its ok for god to kill anyone he wants at anytime, because we are all sinners?? I see. Why then do you follow a morality that is impossible to practice, what does that accomplish? Only your perpetual feeling of guilt for being human, something you have no control over.
Rationality is not subjective, living by stealing is not rational no matter what the thief thinks.
Yes, there has been things in my life that have been fucked up. I am not mad at god because of these things, nor do I disbleiev for those reasons. I disbleieve because the idea of god doesn't make sense to me. Its not a choice, I am unable to believe in him. I said fuck "your" god because you said he values suffering, you elaborated, but at that time you used the words "values suffering."
Any action that is evil is anti God.
Evil- Morally bad or wrong
-Causing ruin, injury, or pain
-The quality of being morally bad or wrong
-That which causes harm misfortune or discomfort.
The first premise rests on the assumption that god is all good. If he is all good then it would be impossible for him to do evil, because evil as you define it is anti-god.
The last three premises pretty much sum up most of the actions of the god of the bible. He caused a lot of pain and discomfort to Jesus up on that cross. So you're discription of evil is self contradictory, and we can now judge and say that your god is evil, by your definition. Either that, or causing harm and discomfort isn't evil, pick one.
There can only be pleasures of the flesh or pleasures of consciousness. I don't believe in souls.
I've been very peaceful and happy during times which I have not believeed in god, which is a sin, so yes!! Fornicating is pretty fun too.
Rationality is not subjective, living by stealing is not rational no matter what the thief thinks.
Yes, there has been things in my life that have been fucked up. I am not mad at god because of these things, nor do I disbleiev for those reasons. I disbleieve because the idea of god doesn't make sense to me. Its not a choice, I am unable to believe in him. I said fuck "your" god because you said he values suffering, you elaborated, but at that time you used the words "values suffering."
Any action that is evil is anti God.
Evil- Morally bad or wrong
-Causing ruin, injury, or pain
-The quality of being morally bad or wrong
-That which causes harm misfortune or discomfort.
The first premise rests on the assumption that god is all good. If he is all good then it would be impossible for him to do evil, because evil as you define it is anti-god.
The last three premises pretty much sum up most of the actions of the god of the bible. He caused a lot of pain and discomfort to Jesus up on that cross. So you're discription of evil is self contradictory, and we can now judge and say that your god is evil, by your definition. Either that, or causing harm and discomfort isn't evil, pick one.
There can only be pleasures of the flesh or pleasures of consciousness. I don't believe in souls.
I've been very peaceful and happy during times which I have not believeed in god, which is a sin, so yes!! Fornicating is pretty fun too.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CokecanBen9 @ Nov 3 2005, 08:17 PM) [post=357976]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>
<span style="font-family:Arial Black"> </span>
WOW.
I first want to feild some questions that one memeber of the forum was asking. He does seem to have hate in his heart.
This should anwser a lot of questions so please be patient and read. Why do we praise God? We praise God bc he is the creator and with out him we would NOT be here to to even decide if we wanted to praise him or not. What kind of love does God want? God wants Unconditional love the same he has shown us. God sent his only son down to be tourted and die for us so that we can have eternal life after death. If God did not love us unconditionally he would of let us hang out with lucifer and be tourtured for all eternity. The members whose questions im anwsering said he admires lucifer bc he made his own choices. Do you realize that the greatest trick the devil pulled was making man believe he did not exsist. The exact life style your living is one lucifer(the fallen angel of God) wants you to live. You gotta understand that he left God and lucifer was conqured and condemned to hell. He wants more people in hell than God has in heaven. Bc he is one of Gods creations and hates God, lucifer is trying to be greater than God. He wants more followers than God, and most of the world is following him living the lifestyles they are living.
Why should we be punished for not loving God? We do deserve to be punished for not loving God be he is the reson we exsist. Do you have any idea how complicated your body is, its a miracle that everything works the way it does. Even if you want to throw evolution at me when the evolutionary chain is traced back to its basic elements on earth you are left with gases. So where did the gases come from. God. As far as physically being punished on earth for not loving God we are punished when we are judged by God in heaven not on earth. He created you and he can judge you.
Does God being creator give him the right to be loved? YES i can't say this enough if God didn't want us here then we would not exsist. GOD CREATED MAN! Why does God let bad things happen to good people? Have you ever heard that suffering has value to God. The more you suffer and offer your suffering to God the greater your reward in heaven will be. As a cathloics we believe suffering has value to God. Hasn't anyone heard any stories of children with cancer or deadly diseases seeing angels when they are close to death. This is to comfort them bc angels are beautiful beyond belief.
Now that I have fielded a few questions i want to make a statement. God has the absolute right to judge and do what he does the way he does it bc he is creator. Even being creator their is one thing God can not make us do. God can not make us love him. We have to choose to love God and live our lives in devotion to him he can't make us. This is where satan comes in he makes sinning more appealing bc its physically pleasurable. God knows we fall to sin bc we are man and we struggle to control our physical urges. This is why we have confession. This is when we confess to God through a priest our sins, and if we are truley sorry for having sinned against God He will forgive us. We have the sacrament of confession the ability to have God save us from our sins bc Jesus died on the cross for us.
As far as being a memeber of faith. If anyone on this forum has been around a true believer of God you will feel some kind of comfort in being around them bc we are suppose to love one another (this is all people nonbelievers or believers) like God has loved us. The more and more you pray to God the better you begin to feel about yourself and the better your life will end up being. Bc you are putting so much positive out in the world you will receive positive in return.
Im not here to force my beliefs on anyone bc just like God i cant make you love God its your decision. Im just here to help you understand the faith more. Please ask questions if you feel like it. Im not always on the net so if i dont anwser just give me some time ill book mark this post.
Thank you for reading and may God bless you.
Ben
[/b][/quote]
Sorry, pal. But I didn't read all of that. Got about half way before I just had to say this - have you got any opinions of your own??? You've just spouted out a sermon straight from the mouth of your local vicar! Tell me what YOU think. I bet inside that head you have a free thinking mind. One that thinks for itself and makes it's own mind up. Come on mate! You know you can do it!
<span style="font-family:Arial Black"> </span>
WOW.
I first want to feild some questions that one memeber of the forum was asking. He does seem to have hate in his heart.
This should anwser a lot of questions so please be patient and read. Why do we praise God? We praise God bc he is the creator and with out him we would NOT be here to to even decide if we wanted to praise him or not. What kind of love does God want? God wants Unconditional love the same he has shown us. God sent his only son down to be tourted and die for us so that we can have eternal life after death. If God did not love us unconditionally he would of let us hang out with lucifer and be tourtured for all eternity. The members whose questions im anwsering said he admires lucifer bc he made his own choices. Do you realize that the greatest trick the devil pulled was making man believe he did not exsist. The exact life style your living is one lucifer(the fallen angel of God) wants you to live. You gotta understand that he left God and lucifer was conqured and condemned to hell. He wants more people in hell than God has in heaven. Bc he is one of Gods creations and hates God, lucifer is trying to be greater than God. He wants more followers than God, and most of the world is following him living the lifestyles they are living.
Why should we be punished for not loving God? We do deserve to be punished for not loving God be he is the reson we exsist. Do you have any idea how complicated your body is, its a miracle that everything works the way it does. Even if you want to throw evolution at me when the evolutionary chain is traced back to its basic elements on earth you are left with gases. So where did the gases come from. God. As far as physically being punished on earth for not loving God we are punished when we are judged by God in heaven not on earth. He created you and he can judge you.
Does God being creator give him the right to be loved? YES i can't say this enough if God didn't want us here then we would not exsist. GOD CREATED MAN! Why does God let bad things happen to good people? Have you ever heard that suffering has value to God. The more you suffer and offer your suffering to God the greater your reward in heaven will be. As a cathloics we believe suffering has value to God. Hasn't anyone heard any stories of children with cancer or deadly diseases seeing angels when they are close to death. This is to comfort them bc angels are beautiful beyond belief.
Now that I have fielded a few questions i want to make a statement. God has the absolute right to judge and do what he does the way he does it bc he is creator. Even being creator their is one thing God can not make us do. God can not make us love him. We have to choose to love God and live our lives in devotion to him he can't make us. This is where satan comes in he makes sinning more appealing bc its physically pleasurable. God knows we fall to sin bc we are man and we struggle to control our physical urges. This is why we have confession. This is when we confess to God through a priest our sins, and if we are truley sorry for having sinned against God He will forgive us. We have the sacrament of confession the ability to have God save us from our sins bc Jesus died on the cross for us.
As far as being a memeber of faith. If anyone on this forum has been around a true believer of God you will feel some kind of comfort in being around them bc we are suppose to love one another (this is all people nonbelievers or believers) like God has loved us. The more and more you pray to God the better you begin to feel about yourself and the better your life will end up being. Bc you are putting so much positive out in the world you will receive positive in return.
Im not here to force my beliefs on anyone bc just like God i cant make you love God its your decision. Im just here to help you understand the faith more. Please ask questions if you feel like it. Im not always on the net so if i dont anwser just give me some time ill book mark this post.
Thank you for reading and may God bless you.
Ben
[/b][/quote]
Sorry, pal. But I didn't read all of that. Got about half way before I just had to say this - have you got any opinions of your own??? You've just spouted out a sermon straight from the mouth of your local vicar! Tell me what YOU think. I bet inside that head you have a free thinking mind. One that thinks for itself and makes it's own mind up. Come on mate! You know you can do it!
CHRISTIAN LETTER:-
There was a man who worked for the Post Office whose job it was to process all the mail that had illegible addresses. One day, a letter came addressed in a shaky handwriting to God. He thought he should open it to see what it was about. The letter read:
Dear God,
I am an 83yr old widow, living on a very small pension. Yesterday someone stole my purse. It had £100 in it, which was all the money I had until my next pension cheque. Next Sunday is Christmas, and I had invited two of my friends over for dinner. Without that money, I have nothing to buy food with. I have no family to turn to, and you are my only hope. Can you please help me?
Sincerely,
Edna
The postal worker was touched. He showed the letter to all the other workers. Each one dug into his or her wallet and came up with a few pounds. By the time he made the rounds, he had collected £96, which they put into an envelope and sent to the woman. The rest of the day, all the workers felt a warm glow thinking of Edna and the dinner she would be able to share with her friends.
Christmas came and went. A few days later another letter came from the old lady to God. All the workers gathered around while the letter was opened. It read:
Dear God,
How can I ever thank you enough for what you did for me? Because of your gift of love, I was able to fix a glorious dinner for my friends. We had a very nice day and I told my friends of your wonderful gift. By the way, there was £4 missing. I think it must have been those thieving bastards at the Post Office.
Sincerely,
Edna
There was a man who worked for the Post Office whose job it was to process all the mail that had illegible addresses. One day, a letter came addressed in a shaky handwriting to God. He thought he should open it to see what it was about. The letter read:
Dear God,
I am an 83yr old widow, living on a very small pension. Yesterday someone stole my purse. It had £100 in it, which was all the money I had until my next pension cheque. Next Sunday is Christmas, and I had invited two of my friends over for dinner. Without that money, I have nothing to buy food with. I have no family to turn to, and you are my only hope. Can you please help me?
Sincerely,
Edna
The postal worker was touched. He showed the letter to all the other workers. Each one dug into his or her wallet and came up with a few pounds. By the time he made the rounds, he had collected £96, which they put into an envelope and sent to the woman. The rest of the day, all the workers felt a warm glow thinking of Edna and the dinner she would be able to share with her friends.
Christmas came and went. A few days later another letter came from the old lady to God. All the workers gathered around while the letter was opened. It read:
Dear God,
How can I ever thank you enough for what you did for me? Because of your gift of love, I was able to fix a glorious dinner for my friends. We had a very nice day and I told my friends of your wonderful gift. By the way, there was £4 missing. I think it must have been those thieving bastards at the Post Office.
Sincerely,
Edna
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CokecanBen9 @ Nov 4 2005, 05:13 AM) [post=358115]Quoted post[/post]</div><div class='quotemain'>God-goons who are you to lable any one. Yet alone a follower of Christ. Do not discriminate bc you dont have the discipline to disreguard sins of the flesh that the morally weak individuals fall victim to.[/b][/quote]
go fuck yourself with a burning cross, you self-righteous reptile. I shit on your filthy christ.
go fuck yourself with a burning cross, you self-righteous reptile. I shit on your filthy christ.
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