Dr. Phil and his ex-wife Oprah Winfrey

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by B_Stronzo, Aug 18, 2006.

  1. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    The thread title is a take off on a David Letterman joke. But I love Letterman's take on these two.

    But beyond all the silliness:
    I'm interested to learn the board views of these two icons of the new American Moral Standard.

    Do either of these individuals (given the media power they wield) have the right to dispense the "common good"?

    It's my considered opinion that they have too much influence on an ever-willing audience of people hungering to have their social and moral standards dictated by a couple of people whose credentials are, shall we say, less than credible to the positions they hold and the audience they reach.

    How many people know who the late Joseph Campbell is by comparison?

    How many people know who Oprah and Dr. Phil are??

    Curious phenomenon that.

    I have nightly telephone conversations with my two best friends. Recently in both instances when they've said "Dr. Phil said" or "I heard Oprah say..." I've had to say "I don't want to know!" I don't either!

    What the fuck is going on here? :33:
     
  2. Lex

    Lex
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    I really have nothing bad to say about either of them. Actually, I am an unapologetic Oprah LOVER.

    Oprah is powerful--no doubt. She is the most powerful person in America, hands down. And her heart is in the right place. Her Angel Network is the only charity where 100% of what you give goes to help since she covers 100% of all admin costs of the organization. Her website is ad-free becasue she is Oprah.

    I watched her show yesterday. Do you know she offers $100,000 rewards to ANYONE who helps catch a child molester/abuser who is wanted and at large?

    She uses her influence to help, from what I see.

    Dr. Phil is a poor man's therapist. And I work with a lot of therpaists. They dispise him. The simple fact is that while much of that he says is common sense, common sense ain't common. I have read one of his books and it was really a very good exercise in relflecting on myself. So few of us do that.

    In the end, the both HELP people. And I can't really tear them down based on their popularity when I think that deep down, their hearts are really in what they do and given that what they are doing seems to actually HELP people.
     
  3. Wonderboy

    Wonderboy New Member

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    If people didn't watch their shows, didn't buy their books then they would be unknowns. They are only so eminent and almost deified because there is a market and an audience for them.

    I myself don't watch them. I have seen maybe three Dr Phil shows and zero Oprah. I prefer Jerry Springer.

    The difference between me watching it and the average American is I only watch it to make myself feel better (haha) and don't take anything they say as Gospel and a lot of the times I think 'that's not a word' when they come out with words that don't actually exist. George Bush is another one. And I watch it a few times a year when I stumble on the channel by accident and just see what the situation is.

    Anyway, I supppose its just 'the state of America today'. Looking for morals on TV chatshows is bad. You would expect that kind of thing to be instilled at home. I myself got my morals from Quantum Leap and reading a lot of books.

    Not that this affects me, although maybe the same thing is happening over here with 'The Jeremy Kyle Show'?

    Dr Phil just seems really condescending a lot of the time too...just the way he talks and stuff...seems quite pompous and almost theatrical. I just don't like his style.

    Anyway I should clarify - everyone should think for themselves. I think a lot of times you're tempted to just believe the chatshow host. To just sit back and watch...and to then quote them in conversation.
     
  4. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    I hope this much is true. I'm not always convinced. I stopped watching her when she became more interested in judging people than listening to them. It was at about this time she began dispensing her unschooled wisdom as if it were some higher knowledge. I think there's a dangerous piece to her.

    Good for her. I wish she championed all good causes equally. But I can see she has her pet ones.

    I think (hence the thread Lex) that perhaps too my stock is put in her influence and power.

    ...and made himself a damned rich one in the process.


    Yes I agree. They appear to. He appeals to the lowest common denominator.

    Certainly anyone who reads this thread is familiar with Phil and Oprah "straight from the television". So I'm putting up a bit of parody for consideration in the youtube links I've posted here.

    But in my initial post I made a comparision to someone I revere beyond most human beings living and dead: Joseph Campbell.

    I'd encourage all thinking people to at LEAST watch his Bill Moyers interviews with him.

    I disagree with this last paragraph of yours Lex. I find both of them arrogant in the most mundanely mediocre way. Mad TV does a wonderful Oprah take-off from time to time and this parody seems about right.

    Here's Phil being lampooned too. But there's some truth in both.

    I think too many take their cues from these two for the answers to things when "Phil" is the first person to say 'I don't want to replace your logic with mine..." which is of course is what, precisely, he's attempting to do.

    I do, in the larger picture, recall Oprah fawning all over "Tell it like it is Phil" back on her weekly stints with him on the show. For me there's something very dangerous when the American public begins taking its moral and ethical cues from a couple of t.v. hosts who've manipulated the public (by pure wealth and popularity) into believing their reality is the actual one.


    Joseph Campbell

    No wonder we're all so caught up in the trivialities of life when no one knows who the late Joe Campbell is........
     
  5. CUBE

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    Oprah is just too much for me. I do watch the show at the gym because it is on. Yes, she does lots of good so that is a good thing. When she was in Costco getting the real world experience I just couldn't get over it. She came off as so out of touch. She and Gail going to the "village" back in time and wondering if anyone was going to call them the "N" word....like that was ever going to happen. She has become so garsh darn enlightened that she is now the expert giving advice...most of the time.

    Favorite interview. Babs is on singing to her dead dog's picture all in white. She is talking of how the flowers changed colors on her balacony because she needed them to match the rest of the room...she awoke the next morning to find it had happened. Can you imagine the poor chabermaid that was lowered on a piano wire down the top of the building to replant the flowers in the night to make Babs think it was God. To say nothing of the fact Babs got red lipstick on her white Donna Karen durring the interview. She almost wigged out. Love it.

    Dr. Phil is the devil...I'm positive. When he tied the weight loss books into the whole picture it just got way to Amway. Plus his voice grates
     
  6. Lex

    Lex
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    I don't expect anyone to champion everything equally--how could you? People have certain things that feel "closer" to them than others. Certainly you have your own "pet causes." As I have mine. Oprah should be held to no higher standard than to champion that which she cares most for. As I have said--her heart is in it. And her charity is what it claims to be--unlike any other American charity.

    I see the things "close" to her as:

    Female empowerment
    Self improvement
    Children
    Education
    Anti-drugs
    Relationships

    I really don't see anything wrong with those.

    Stronzo--I think you should write to her. Outline the causes you think are her "pet" ones and the ones you think she does not give enough attention to. Outline why giving those under-attended ones would be beneficial. I bet, if you took the time, you might even get a response.

    I'm probably not a good person to debate this with as I could name 500 poeple with power and fame who don't do half of what she does and my opinionof her is not going to change anytime soon. I think she is a good person overall. It's tough to be popular. And good.
     
  7. DC_DEEP

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    His son is a cute little hottie, though.
     
  8. Expando1

    Expando1 New Member

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    Anyone has a right to "air" their opinion so long as it doesn't infringe upon the rights of others. The popularity of these icons of American sensibility and morality bespeaks of a more concerning cultural inadequacy...Generation X are now adults and we got here without adequate parenting, guidance, and with socially interactive skills formed behind the pale glow of a monitor. Our poor dietary habits makes us the first generation ever expected to have a life expectancy shorter than that of our parents. It is with this skill set that we are charged with the parenting and guidance of the next generation...wouldn't you be a bit nervous and eager to seek counsel from any icon dispensing it?
     
  9. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    No.. they're fine and respectable charities and certainly mainstream in their attractiveness.

    Oh boy have I! (But to date no response...) I've written to both her and to "The Phil" on numerous occasions. Oprah's "people" (you probably know this) reject out of hand any letter which is over one page long.

    I don't have any wish to change anyone's mind. I couldn't if I tried. I'd simply wish the world would look a bit deeper than these people who are so visible to the large television audience. I don't view money and visibility as real power but only perceived. But that's just my take.

    I realize it's a tough thing to ask but really valuable knowledge is out there if anyone cares to look.
     
  10. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    Which one?

    The baby one?:33:
     
  11. Mr. Snakey

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    Phil is a smuck! I love Oprah. I think she is so sexy. I would love to try turn her around. But i think she is spoken for already . Gayle would kick my ass!
     
  12. JustAsking

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    Tyra Banks is the new Oprah.
     
  13. D_Martin van Burden

    D_Martin van Burden Account Disabled

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    I never could stand to listen to Dr. Phil too long myself. I've heard an occasional client discuss how that guy can be spot on sometimes, and I think that it's his popularity that makes him sound a hell of a lot smarter than he really is. If I remember correctly, Dr. Phil gave up "traditional counseling," if you will, because the results just weren't there. He didn't have the patience, energy, or maybe even the training to handle some of the more pervasive, emotional wreckage that people need to work through. He's very much a cognitive-behavioral type, so much so that a lot of his treatments sound like rehearsals of putting yourself in the right frame of mind, cheering yourself on, etc.

    Effective? Sure. There's a time and a place for it, which is why I think Dr. Phil self-selects the quick-fixes on his show, to make himself look good. I think I'd put more stock in the guy if he really extended himself on his cases. Otherwise, he's just another schmuck marketer posing as a psychologist.
     
  14. Mr. Snakey

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    You are right Dee! I aso feel very sorry for the people who listen to so called doctors like Phil Also nice pics Dee!:wink:
     
  15. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    Well yes. That is the fear.
     
  16. JustAsking

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    Dee,
    Is there any value to Dr. Phil in that he makes counseling look doable for those people who might not ever consider it? I have known so many people who have been so afraid of counseling that it would be the last thing they would do.

    Although he is pretty lightweight and all "cognitive therapy", like you say, he does manage do project a kind of message to an otherwise reticent person who might be watching that it might be doable. His fatherly arrogance is just what some people gravitate to in their unfortunate choices, that he might help them make the choice to get counseling. What do you think about that?

    Otherwise, he is not really that much more effective on TV than Tyra is when she is just counseling bulimics from her heart.
     
  17. Hatched69

    Hatched69 Member

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    I say we cross Dr. Phil with Red Forman (from That 70's Show) and see who out-dumbasses or out-stupids each other, given their favorite quotes....
     
  18. D_Martin van Burden

    D_Martin van Burden Account Disabled

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    Sure, he's a charismatic guy. He's on television for a reason; he's got a knack, a following. I don't doubt that he's a good guy. I just doubt his ability to do counseling any longer than the few minutes of air time required.

    No matter how you slice it, counseling just isn't a "doable" thing. Lest we not forget, the guy has people writing in who automatically respond to him in particular -- as opposed to the act of seeking active counseling. That's a self-selecting bias. These people want to meet the guy and get his POV. An opinion isn't the same as a counseling experience.

    He's obviously not in it for the long haul with these folks, and what bothers me is that people look to him as a professional representing (but not really representing) this field. I'd imagine that someone might have been starstruck by the show, thought to stop in an office to get some help, only to be sorely disappointed that, no, the counselor won't give you a few quick one-liners and tell you what to do. Or he might if that's his style; chances are, training-wise, it's not.

    Oh, no doubt. Counseling is a scary, frightening, and terrifying process simply because it's not easy and quick. It's a lot of work that involves getting down to and drudging up some issues, some of which have been deep-seated and buried for a long time.

    A one-liner just doesn't cut it, and that, along with the reality of the counseling journey, is something that a counselor's gotta soften a family into accepting. That's why you spend the first few sessions getting to know them, icebreaking, debriefing, previewing, and getting a perspective on what got them into the office in the first place. Obviously, the Dr. Phil approach doesn't work very well.

    Ultimately, I'm more concerned with people getting help and relief through what emotionally ails them, and whatever way works for you, let it be so.
     
  19. jeff black

    jeff black <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    Considering "DR. Phil" isn't actually a doctor, I question his ability to properly help those on his stage.

    Quite honestly, I feel that his "tough love" concepts are bullshit.
     
  20. Heather LouAnna

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    My sister loves Dr Phil. She'd force me top watch him on her fucking Tivo whenever I'd come to vist her condo in San Antonio. Like the stench of curry, simply seeing his face makes my gag reflex spasm and dance like a squirrel that's just been run over.

    His advice is general and empty. He speaks but none of it makes sense. It's just meant to give you this overall sense of false security.

    I enjoy watching Martha Stewart more than listening to him talk. She makes a mean crabcake too.
     
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