Every GOP Debt Plan Leaves Us With More Debt

Phil Ayesho

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Hahaha! Instead of discussing who and how to get out of our debt crisis, we point at each side of the aisle and say "You caused more debt than we did!" "No! You caused more debt than we did!!!". Meanwhile we ignore the fact that both sides caused oppressive national debt, inflation, and war.

"You killed more people than we did!! So we are better!" "No, you killed more people than we did, so we are better!"

It's inane, but many here are so attached to party lines they cannot fathom that their flavor of government is still bad government.


Judge Napolitano.How to get fired in under 5 mins - YouTube



That is not the argument... try working your brain some... the point is WHICH POLICIES worked and which did NOT work.

De-regulation did NOT work, it did not make for a better economy, it made for a kleptocracy.

Cutting taxes on the rich did NOT create jobs, Jobs creation fell, and wages utterly stagnated... Poverty GREW and the middle class Lost ground.

The invisible hand of the market only resulted in trillions of dollars being invisibly disappeared into offshore accounts of a small group at the very top.
And left the rest of us with the check.
 

Phil Ayesho

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There's it is...the typical insult again by you and your party! Whoever criticizes this president is a raciest! I'm not even going to read your response it doesn't deserve my attention...This is coming from the party that CREATED RACISM.

God you're dumb.

Your racism is revealed by the fact that your criticism of the president is predicated entirely on LIES and Misinformation.
Everything you Claim he has done is absolutely wrong... ergo you are not basing your dislike of him on Actual things he has actually done...

That leaves his color. And, hey, being conservative, and therefore, verifiably less bright, I can understand that you might not have enough self knowledge to comprehend your own feelings or their sources...

But hating the guy for things that he had no hand in.... that's just stupid.


And I have NO problem with criticism of Obama, when it is VALID and based on his actual actions.

If you were claiming that he wanted to increase US stimulus spending and that you believe that is a bad policy... then I would argue against your policy and it would not occur to me that you were a racist.

Or hey... attack him on not closing down Gitmo, like he promised... on his preserving presidential powers that violate the constitution, or say that disagree with his policy of drone strikes...

Hell, attack him on the fact that he is pandering to the right and not sticking to his supposedly leftist ideals...

There is LOTS of room for valid criticism of Obama.


But you don't attack on his actual record... you attack him on republican dis-information trying to shift the blame for THEIR policies and actions onto someone who had nothing to do with them..

And your willingness to ignore the actual sequence of events, that you yourself lived thru, and believe and promulgate utter falsehoods in attacking the elected president reveals that you must have some compelling emotional reason for being willing to sacrifice reality in favor of a mythology that masks your true feelings.


c'mon... admit it... with your right wing white bread buddies you have called him 'nigger'... you know you have.

So... really... don't imagine you can hide your true motivations...

Your backwards and elitist prejudices shine thru in the total lack of any substantive argument regarding things the man has actually done.


You are just parroting the talking points you got from watching FOX.
 
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deleted15807

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Eisenhower's interstate highway project was the largest government jobs bill in history... a huge expense in government spending that he could ONLY get passed by claiming it was a national Defense initiative.

In retrospect, the interstate highway system is known to have tripled the GNP of the US.

Rather sad in retrospect as it will never happen again. Now it's called big government, socialism, Marxism, you name it. China is busy building a nationwide high-speed rail system while Florida's GOP governor is rejecting it.
 

Phil Ayesho

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Rather sad in retrospect as it will never happen again. Now it's called big government, socialism, Marxism, you name it. China is busy building a nationwide high-speed rail system while Florida's GOP governor is rejecting it.

And Europe is thinking that the solution to their problems is "austerity"...

Yeah, stupidity reigns supreme.
 

FuzzyKen

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1. The GOP has in it's vast lack of wisdom hammered through decisions which historically in time will show where their interests really did lie. They have refused to invest in repair and maintenance of infrastructure. Transportation and commerce spends millions of dollars each year which is one of the many things added on to the cost of goods you buy. This may seem trivial to some, but bad roads shorten the life of the long haul trucks that haul the goods. They increase fuel consumption and create increased repairs and maintenance schedules. Nationwide the Interstate Highway System is in a bad state of disrepair with cracked pavement, pot holes, and cracked pavement taking a heavy toll on the trucks that deliver the goods you buy and the maintenance of the vehicle you drive. The Interstate System as it now exists is over 50 years old with no where near enough improvements in those decades to keep it current to vehicle technology.

2. The GOP by allowing banking to move so many of it's jobs "offshore" has compromised national security. They placed profits far above the security and welfare of this country in the hands of a number of third world countries where people work for little more than a enough food to eat. An unfriendly power trying to destroy this country does not have to bother with burning planes into skyscrapers, they can do us in with basic computer viruses introduced at these satellite locations which basically lock up and freeze the bank accounts of most Americans. I don't care about back-up data, imagine the systems simultaneously taken down for the top ten major banking institutions in this nation. It could be weeks before you have any access to any of your funds and then trying to determine who had what could be another issue. The profit and loss statement more important than YOU are to the GOP.

3. In the past thirty years the power grids have been "milked" for profit and the GOP has allowed the owners of those grids to interconnect in such a manner as to cause a problem in Arizona to "black-out" not only parts of Arizona in total but parts of Southern California, New Mexico and West Texas with one single small malfunction. This has happened it is not imagination here.

4. A very high ranking member of the GOP who was a former California Governor (Pete Wilson) was the one who laid the groundwork for one of the largest economic fiascos in speculation in history and that was ENRON. They don't generate a single watt of electricity and yet through speculation they dominate, control, and manipulate a market causing vastly increased rates, brown-outs and black outs. Oh, yes, a few guys went to jail for a short time on this one, but, not going to jail was former California Governor Pete Wilson.

5. The GOP and conservatives approve mergers and acquisitions of the nations railroads to the point that Union Pacific is in control of virtually everything eliminating competition. Under GOP guidance and a GOP dominated congress Rail passenger transportation is nearly destroyed and Amtrack which in a time of National Emergency is allowed to wither on the vine and sell off equipment to frightening levels.

6. Under the GOP the transportation of the people are again impacted when Greyhound Absorbs Continental Trailways buslines. Then, again under GOP watch Greyhound is purchased by Laidlaw which is the largest foreign owned operator of buses in the world. Laidlaw as the "only game in town" changes the game when they start milking equipment for all it is worth. This results in the sale of GM Truck and Coach to foreign concerns. The foreign manufacturer bites off more than it can chew and finds itself in red ink. This ultimately results in the sale of MCI and Flxible bus manufacturing companies to Dina of Mexico. Here is what we have. Under the effervescent leadership of the GOP, GM Truck and Coach is sold to White which is sold to Freightliner which is owned by Mercedes Benz. Eagle Coach which made Eagle Buses did it's manufacturing in Brownsville Texas. Eagle is sold to Dina of Mexico. Dina of Mexico got it's start when they bought the Highway Coach operation from Flxible of Loudonville Ohio. Flxible made transit coaches for a few more years and then that finally went away too. With GM and Flxible gone the next target to export American jobs was MCI which was actually a company that started in Canada, but had plants in Pembia North Dakota and Roswell New Mexico. Woops when it was sold to Dina of Mexico all production went to Mexico. There is now damn little in the way of busses made here for highway use any more.

7. In 1965 it would have been unheard of to have a CEO of a major corporation run a company into bankruptcy and then receive a monstrous severance package well into seven figures after a terrible job performance.
By 2008 the deal was if you want to get rich is to not be a success at your job but to be a failure. One of the best examples of this is a man by the name of Bob Nardelli. Bob Nardelli started out with General Electric. Under his leadership General Electric was on the verge of bankruptcy and because he had a "Contract" to get rid of him they bought him out and said goodbye. It cost them millions of dollars and other percs. Bob Nardelli was then hired and moved to Atlanta, Georgia. He took Home Depot stores and made numerous very bad decisions taking a then Fortune 500 Company and running that one way down. Depot did not let it go to the verge of bankruptcy when they bought him out again with millions of dollars and a severance package with percs that were outrageous. Nardelli then moves within a few months over to Chrysler Group. It was Bob Nardelli that placed Chrysler into bankruptcy and it was Bob Nardelli that was paid millions when workers were laid off based on his bad decisions. This is not unlike the movie and stage play "THe Producers" where to make money you need to produce a flop instead of a hit. That was a comedy and unfortunately this is real. . . . . .

8. We all bristle at the bail out of wallstreet, but under the GOP we ventured into ground that based on contract nobody could reverse. We subsidized really bad management and allowed these bums to have contracts that the government could not overturn. These contracts which the government could not reverse gave these crooks millions in bonuses for doing a "bad" job.
I do not like President Obama, but he was not responsible for the work of his predecessors.


There was a time that I was a devout Republican. I was not pleased with Nixon but felt him better than the alternative, I was not pleased with Ronald Reagan but felt him better than the alternative, and the final end for me was George H.W. Bush who made it obvious where the interests of the party had moved. I was for Bill Clinton even though I thought that the Dems could have done better and I absolutely despised George W. Buss because he was a total bafoon who was used by the worst elements in the Republican party as a shield while Dick Cheney who was really running the show maneuvered and shoved the dumbest United States President in recorded history into positions that shielded the real crooks and gave Bush the brunt of the blame for the real scoundrels behind the scenes. Bush II was not bad he was completely overwhelmed and was so stupid he was diverted and his temper and other failings as a person were used to maneuver him into what others wanted.

The current plans are not plans at all but failed past attempts that will penalize the American People, raise the debt and deficit to astronomical levels and result in total economic collapse worldwide. When this happens the very rich will go out and with their fortunes start buying up everything for pennies on the dollar. That foreclosed home will sell for a few hundred dollars because the loans will not go to any american to buy them and those with the money will step in and grab property at in incredible rate. This is already starting with the very rich going into the worst hit cities and buying foreclosures by the block for next to nothing. They will sit on it for a decade or so and then they will make billions of dollars more.

The religious right are the dumbest of all. They back people on a few issues not realizing that within history there is precedent for this happening before and the religious ones are always in the end used for as much as possible taking the few core beliefs rallying the people around those beliefs and then after the power seekers have gotten what they want they crack down and take away the power of the religious transferring it to themselves.
 

1kmb1

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There's it is...the typical insult again by you and your party! Whoever criticizes this president is a raciest! I'm not even going to read your response it doesn't deserve my attention...This is coming from the party that CREATED RACISM.

did you seriously just say that?

actually what the fuck did you just say? i think you're trying to say democrats created racism... but it says YOU created racism.

actually actually, don't bother trying to explain, i don't really care and it'll probably be stupid... and racist.
 

upone

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actually, don't bother trying to explain, i don't really care and it'll probably be stupid... and racist.

In truth, it is living proof of what several recent studies have shown: People who watch Fox News are less informed than people who have no regular source of information about current events. It really does make people dumber.
 

FuzzyKen

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The biggest problems have taken place within the legislative branch of this government while probably the smallest has been with the Administrator of the whole thing which is the President. Yes, we can easily find things to criticize with most of the sitting Presidents since JFK, but the truth is that the President can only act on what he is handed by the legislative branch and if he is handed "garbage" his only real power is to say yes or no.

In reality, the President does not create any form of legislation and there is no such thing as "Obamacare" because Barak Obama did not in fact author the bill that was signed. If he had authored that health care bill he could be legitimately given credit for it. The "publicity machine" has distorted the actual executive powers to the point that people running for office these days it seems do not actually know what the job is and what it's limitations are.

The same is true of many other things and unfortunately as people kill their brain cells by watching extremists spout fantasy, blame, rhetoric and try to maneuver public opinion with it as if it were truth, the real scoundrels get away and the wrong guy gets the blame.

The past four years are similar to the following scenario in reality: You have a bunch of car thieves involved in a chase in an expensive sports car. They temporarily lose the law enforcement chasing them and on the way out of abandoning the stolen car they toss the keys to an innocent bystander. The police come along and arrest the bystander as if he were the thief. This is the attitude currently of the American People in that many act like it is far easier to blame than to do some real research and find out what the truth really is and who the crooks really are.

The United States Congressional Record is available on the Internet. Researching the real facts of who shows up and who doesn't, who authored what and who didn't and what was signed and what was veto'd are for the most part available to anyone who chooses to do the research. The same is true for many State Governments and remember that a Governor is by actual function a "mini-President" and is a member of that State's executive branch of Government. They are not legislators either. . . . .

There are many things needed in this country, the one I would value most right now would be giving the President the power of "line item veto" meaning he could veto part of a bill and pass the good parts. This whole "line item" mess gets bad bills passed and good bills veto'd as it stands right now.

Another simple act that would simplify elections and prevent problems would be the elimination of the Electoral College. It was formed and came into existence because of communications problems long before modern life had come to this or any other country. By the 1940's it had outlived it's usefulness, and that is even more true these days with satellite and wireless communications taking a few seconds to get around the world.

Probably the best thing would be to turn the pay raises and benefits packages of the United States Congress over to the Legislative Oversight Committee. These are the people who see to it that the power bills at the Capitol Building get paid and that the toilets in the White House Flush and work. That organization can be very much a bunch of sarcastic "knit pickers" and they would find a way to bring the house under control by watching things like attendance etc..
 

TheBestYouCan

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Both sides? You ignore who and what has been the main driving force behind the tax cuts (Bush et al) which account for big percentage of the debt. And how can we forget the 'pledge' that all Republican candidates must sign? And the Iraq War (the $3 trillion war) would not have happened had The Supreme's knighted Al Gore president.

Did the dems roll over and play dead? Yes but it would not have happened had we had a semi-educated electorate. Just like moderate Republicans are rolling over now as the Tea Party wackos run the country further back in time.

Your idea about Al Gore is speculation. You just admitted dems rolled over and went along with the above mentioned. I do agree with one thing you said though, the electorate needs to wake up and understand who and what they are voting for instead of getting the wool pulled over their eyes every 2-4 years by new pretenders to the fiscally responsible throne.
 
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deleted15807

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Your idea about Al Gore is speculation..

Yes but knowing who Gore is I am pretty confident he would not have done what Bush and Darth Cheney did.

You just admitted dems rolled over and went along with the above mentioned.

Yes and like wide moderate Republicans are rolling over and letting the wacko Tea Party brigade run the country off the cliff at a time when there is no real safety net. And whatever safety net is there they want to get rid of that.
 

cigar1965

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You are so transparently racist.

Bush and a GOP congress tripled the US debt. AND ran the economy right down the shitter...
BUSH gave the trillion dollar bailout-
Reagan, Bush I and Bush II are responsible for 80% of the current US deficit. EACH of them pushed the deficit dramatically higher, without the slightest murmur from the GOP over the deficits they were racking up.

Obama has raised the deficit only a FRACTION as much as Bush did- at a time when the US economy NEEDS the government to pump money into the system to keep it from dying.

FDR already proved that when the National Economy is failing, the ONLY way out is thru government spending. ( great depression was caused by Austerity measures after the stock market collapse- it was alleviated slightly by FDRs new deal policies, and then GOP pressure to deal with deficits caused the recovery to stagnate... and the depression only really ended when the US committed to MASSIVE SPENDING for WWII- debts that we paid of handily with the improved industries created thru government spending )


Oh, and, during TWO wars, that Bush paid for with DEFICIT borrowing, and never even put the bill on the budget, No president vacationed more than Bush.
Oh, and Bush spent a trillion dollars and in 7 years did NOT get Bin Laden, the entire object of those wars.

Americans losing their homes is because of the BUSH economic catastrophe, and Obama is actually trying to pas legislation to offer them relief. Despite GOP attempts to PREVENT that relief.



Shit, everything you complain of is entirely attributable to BUSH and his GOP congress. From the foreclosure crisis, to the deficit... its ALL shit that went down BEOFRE Obama was even elected.

And you thinks its Obama?!
somebody gets his "information" only from FOX....

But hey, I don't blame you... science has shown that conservatives are far less bright than other people... its not your fault you're too stupid to comprehend cause and effect.
too stupid to understand how a calendar works...


Stupid liberals all just want to get something for Free!!
 
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deleted15807

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Wow. Two whole posts in 5 years...i wonder what valuable insight your other post brought to the discussion?

Are these sleeper cells? Terror babies? One has to wonder.
 

B_Marius567

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The latest posting by the Treasury Department shows the national debt has now increased $4 trillion on President Obama's watch.

I will hate to see 4 more years of this!!!!

everyone is looking for a hand out :(