Excellent NYT editorial/Senate Intell. Committe report on Iraq

D

deleted15807

Guest
1. I am aware of what a revolution is. But the fact is that it was not that sudden. It had been coming for years. You are simply talking of the collapse itself....even then, the Warsaw Pact and the Soviet Union certainly didn't fall that quickly in some bloodless revolution.

In 1989, many Eastern Europeans, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Albania, the Soviet Union, East Germany, Poland, Romania, and Bulgaria all overthrew their governments.

Last i checked, Gorbachev had been reforming Russia for awhile...before some pro-soviets began plotting a coup.

it took a full years from when the wall fell in Germany to the eventual dissolution of the Warsaw PAct in full in 1991.

You cannot just discount the solidarity movements and all the other factors. That is extreme ignorance

you stated - "The Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact fell with not one shot fired and not one life lost. That is the kind of revolution that says to the world what the United States and it's allies stand for."



if that was the case then that should have just happened in the 50s...ah well, la dee da, socialism was fun, boom collapse.

That "revolution" was nearly a half century of warfare in a variety of ways, economic, political, military.

Sorry, totally off base.


2. I haven't forgotten the number of Iraqi dead. However the vast majority were not killed by Americans. They are killing each other in sectarian violence. If they were able to hash out their differences without violence, there would be far less.
Millions have died in civil wars. That is how things change, that is how dictatorships are overthrown. Our birth was a violent founding of vicious partisanship vs. loyalists that went on for 8 years costing hundreds of thousands of lives...then we had a civil war for another 5 that cost millions.

That's life. That is what happens. All free countries are born in and of violence. Wherever they are.

They are not lab mice...they are people, and sometimes people get stuck in war. War began before Bush, and wont end with Bush.

there are approximately 27 major wars and conflicts going on in the world right now. Alot of people suffer all around the globe, and that is not the fault of the US.

I think you have a serious problem between distinguishing a sad reality, and me being happy about it.

In fact, your pathetic insult that i seem to believe that:

"They do not count. Their tears and loss are just 'the sad reality of war'. You don't sound very sad at all. In fact you sound happy."


Is just a pathetic excuse for you since your logic cannot differentiate with killing to be cruel and sadistic and deliberate, and the sad, inescapable fact of war and conflict on this planet.

Please show me where i "sound happy" that people are dying. I'd like you to point that despicable slander out to me.

You keep ignoring the fact that the US is responsible for untold suffering in Iraq. And you dismiss it as 'war is sad'. Unbelievable. And even worst you say we didn't kill them. They would be ALIVE if we didn't break Iraq. Shit happens I guess huh?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Flashy

Sexy Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Posts
7,901
Media
0
Likes
27
Points
183
Location
at home
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
You keep ignoring the fact that the US is responsible for untold suffering in Iraq. And you dismiss it as 'war is sad'. Unbelievable. And even worst you say we didn't kill them. They would be ALIVE if we didn't break Iraq. Shit happens I guess huh?

excuse me, where have i said that the US is not responsible for the war in Iraq?

where have i ever dismissed it?

Saying war is sad and horrible is hardly a dismissal. It is a clear and concise fact of the brutal reality of life on this planet.

Wear did i say we didn't kill them?

I said we didn't kill the ones who are being killed by the sectarians and terrorists who feel compelled to blow themselves up in a pet market, killing 200 innocents and other such gruesome acts.

just fyi...there is no guarantee, that they would be ALIVE, if we did not "break Iraq".

[FONT=Arial, Geneva]"Along with other human rights organizations, The Documental Centre for Human Rights in Iraq has compiled documentation on over 600,000 civilian executions in Iraq.(the Saddam Era) Human Rights Watch reports that in one operation alone, the Anfal, Saddam killed 100,000 Kurdish Iraqis. Another 500,000 are estimated to have died in Saddam's needless war with Iran. Coldly taken as a daily average for the 24 years of Saddam's reign, these numbers give us a horrifying picture of between 70 and 125 civilian deaths per day for every one of Saddam's 8,000-odd days in power"


[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva]So while indeed, some Iraqis would be alive, many others would not. It is likely that the Kurds, who are alive in large numbers today, and who have made the most of the situation, and are free and happy, would likely be dead in large numbers.

As for the Shi'ites, Saddam had no problem killing them at his whim.
[/FONT]

It is sort of sad that you cannot differentiate between your flippant "Shit happens" line and my cold, realistic discussion of the brutality of life on this planet and in international relations, politics and wars for the 3200 + years of life on this planet.

you are a typical hysteric, incapable of distinguishing fact, shrieking at the top of your lungs about the unfairness of it all, and accusing anyone who does not agree with you in lockstep, of some sort of causal and deliberate interest in mayhem and murder for no reason.
 

Flashy

Sexy Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Posts
7,901
Media
0
Likes
27
Points
183
Location
at home
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male

B_becominghorse

Sexy Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2006
Posts
1,111
Media
0
Likes
33
Points
183
Location
new york city
Sexuality
50% Straight, 50% Gay
Gender
Male
The AV...and your pathetic attempts in creating anti-american threads as well as your laughable attempts to categorize Iran as a government/state not controlled by radical islamofascism...

I agree, because it certainly is. It took me years to see what this species of person was up to. It's because of love of stinking, suffering, losing, you name it. They're always sympathetic to the most evil of poor people, of course, and concerned with cuntbrains like Moussaoui more than they are 9/11 victims. Oh well, let them become Food Stamp Victims and eat Macaroni and Cheese Product.
 
D

deleted15807

Guest
excuse me, where have i said that the US is not responsible for the war in Iraq?

where have i ever dismissed it?

Saying war is sad and horrible is hardly a dismissal. It is a clear and concise fact of the brutal reality of life on this planet.

Wear did i say we didn't kill them?

I said we didn't kill the ones who are being killed by the sectarians and terrorists who feel compelled to blow themselves up in a pet market, killing 200 innocents and other such gruesome acts.

just fyi...there is no guarantee, that they would be ALIVE, if we did not "break Iraq".

[FONT=Arial, Geneva]"Along with other human rights organizations, The Documental Centre for Human Rights in Iraq has compiled documentation on over 600,000 civilian executions in Iraq.(the Saddam Era) Human Rights Watch reports that in one operation alone, the Anfal, Saddam killed 100,000 Kurdish Iraqis. Another 500,000 are estimated to have died in Saddam's needless war with Iran. Coldly taken as a daily average for the 24 years of Saddam's reign, these numbers give us a horrifying picture of between 70 and 125 civilian deaths per day for every one of Saddam's 8,000-odd days in power"


[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva]So while indeed, some Iraqis would be alive, many others would not. It is likely that the Kurds, who are alive in large numbers today, and who have made the most of the situation, and are free and happy, would likely be dead in large numbers.

As for the Shi'ites, Saddam had no problem killing them at his whim.
[/FONT]

It is sort of sad that you cannot differentiate between your flippant "Shit happens" line and my cold, realistic discussion of the brutality of life on this planet and in international relations, politics and wars for the 3200 + years of life on this planet.

you are a typical hysteric, incapable of distinguishing fact, shrieking at the top of your lungs about the unfairness of it all, and accusing anyone who does not agree with you in lockstep, of some sort of causal and deliberate interest in mayhem and murder for no reason.

Are you off your meds again? There are huge gaps in your 'logic' is why I'm asking. I could argue what do you actually know about the CPA and who Paul Bremer is and what he did but what would it matter? For you the ends justify the means. My one solace is the populace is finally realizing Iraq wasn't worth it and the public has slowly but surely come around to understanding they were deceived at the very highest levels of government.

And please no links to CNN or other large American corporations that have totally corrupted journalism. If that's were you get your news....ahh now I understand why you think the way you do.