For Thousands Of Years

pronatalist

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2007
Posts
916
Media
0
Likes
47
Points
193
Location
U.S.
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
Naturally large families, are more in harmony with nature.

Pronatalist said:
Encourage large families worldwide, so that far more people may enjoy life.

Sorry to go off a bit of a tangent, but am I the only one to find this statement odd?

And why should my signature be "strange?" It's just another way to say God's commandment (Gen. 1:28,9:1) to Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth.

Life is good, but I don't think it follows that more life is better - are six or seven children really better than one or two?

Well apparently more is better, especially to the parents who keep having more children. Do you think the 7th child is of less valuable, or enjoys life less, than the 1st child? Aren't we pretty much the same, in God's eyes? And in a society of 5 or 7 child families, most of the children are born to parents with experience raising children. In a society of 2-child families, half the parents are inexperienced. Now are "inexperience" parents, really the best sort of parents to be handling precious valuable babies?

Already it seems the world has too many people for everyone to have a good life and for the world to be able to sustain it. We're running out of resources, overfishing, overgrazing, deforesting... in some countries typical family sizes are very large and often there isn't enough food or money to support the children well. I don't think that is a good thing.

Well obviously not everybody agrees with the globalist depopulation agenda of certain deluded rich elites, that disregards what so many children and their parents may want. People have so many compelling reasons to have as many children as they do, and powerful reproductive urges to remind them of their duty/opportunity to reproduce. That all adds up to a global goal and nature desire, to enlarge the entire human race, for the greater good of the many. I would agree with most all reasons that could be cited, to have children or more children. What about the natural flow of human life? Nothing natural or elegant or beautiful about that?

Surely it's better to have fewer people with a good quality of life than more with a poorer one.[/QUOTE]

How about more people, with the proper leadership and development and population accomodation to match? Why let sloppy claims of "overpopulation" be used to retard proper needed reforms in favor of the same old corrupt status quo?

Most everybody seemed to think that large families were a good and natural thing, but only a few decades ago. People didn't even count the "cost" of having children, or so claims a humorous book I have on culture, as recently as the 1950s. And developing countries are trailing behind in their clinging to traditional pronatalist values, as Western contraceptive imperilists try to corrupt them with the decaying social mores of the "richer" countries. So it is "modern" day society decaying social mores, that are "odd."

You say that in some countries, typical family sizes are "very large." Perhaps they might actually have some very good reasons for that? If we would even bother to try to understand anything as to why?

Also, if large dick size runs in families, large family sizes may run in families as well. Spreading one's genes into the next generation, may not only pass on "well-endowed," but high fertility or nurturing-of-children traits as well. Although the available evidence doesn't appear very conclusive, but that may be largely because, people haven't kept very good records of such things.
 

sizexxx

1st Like
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
75
Media
0
Likes
1
Points
151
Location
Oregon
Sexuality
90% Straight, 10% Gay
Gender
Male
Yes, there are historical/sociological reasons why most traditional cultures emphasized large families, and many still do. I don't think this is a good reason to actively encourage the maintenance of such a practice, however.
While I do think the overemphasis on overpopulation as a source of problems is misguided, I think that there is absolutely no way that the current consumption habits of people in the United States, especially, can be expanded to the world population. So I think the first priority should be the wealthy countries reforming their economics from inflationary to sustainable practices, and encouraging sustainability in the developing countries. As the general well-being of the people improves, there will be a tendency to slowing population growth. But I think with the deployment of technology and smart planning, the carrying capacity of the planet for human population is actually much higher than the glib assumption based on the notion that everyone has to be able to consume as wastefully as Americans do now.
 

sizexxx

1st Like
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
75
Media
0
Likes
1
Points
151
Location
Oregon
Sexuality
90% Straight, 10% Gay
Gender
Male
On the main topic of this thread, it is well known that human males have the largest penises among the primates, both in absolute and relative size. Therefore, there must have been selective pressure at some point between when humans and chimpanzees branched off from their last common ancestor and the emergence of homo sapiens which favored increased penis size. So obviously at least during this past period, larger penises were favored and not the average which prevailed at the time. It is hard to say whether there is still selection toward greater penis size or whether those pressures which favored it have ceased to exist or have been counterbalanced by adaptive disadvantage to larger sizes than the current normal range.
If there was advantage to larger penis size, what was it? And if there is no longer, what has changed to make this the case? I have some ideas along these lines, but I leave those as open questions.
 

locomiax

Legendary Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Apr 20, 2008
Posts
388
Media
3
Likes
1,099
Points
598
Location
Spain
Verification
View
Sexuality
69% Straight, 31% Gay
Gender
Male
I think evolution changes are a mater of many many thousands years, so probably it all comes from the time when cavern women were atracted by bigk cocked man (big cocks have been always adored in all civilizations).
Human civilization as we know it, is only a drop in the ocean of the time that human kind is been on this planet earth. So i think, the fact that men have the biggest penis in primates, is because of this, and probably we have riched our average size of today, some thausand years ago. Then civilization came and women have felt more atracted by men for other reasons. I think if cavern women had not been atracted by big dicks the average cock today would have been maybe 3 inches.
I think, that in a old old world when people where really supersticious, and basic minded, they woulf relate the biggest cocks with a superior strengh to reproduction (really needed in those times). Soft dick doesn't work for reproduction it must be hard, when hard is bigger than soft, that equation should click in their minds " then...., the bigger must be beter" and it started the natural selection.
 

pronatalist

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2007
Posts
916
Media
0
Likes
47
Points
193
Location
U.S.
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
What if the many compelling reasons for "traditionally very large" families, are actually as relevant as ever?

Yes, there are historical/sociological reasons why most traditional cultures emphasized large families, and many still do. I don't think this is a good reason to actively encourage the maintenance of such a practice, however.

Then you must have not fairly considered all the practical reasons, and how most of them, are still quite relevant to the "huge" world population size of today. More and more people would be glad to live. Most everybody wants or ends up with having children. Promoting the natural flow of human life unhindered. Concerned about the possible "side effects" of shoddy and experimental "modern" methods of "birth control." It goes against nature. It favors too much problem socialistic and globalist modes of anti-freedom "control" of populations. "Religious objections." As the numbers of women of childbearing age naturally rises throughout many areas of the world, there's then no "need" to expand "family planning" to match, as babies can be welcome to naturally come out of more and more birth canals, and populate the planet faster and faster, so that all the more people may experience life, and the human race can naturally "blossom." And so on.

And people haven't considered near enough, that there are several practical reasons for the natural encouragement of large families, even in the "huge" human population size of today. It goes hand in hand with promoting family values and better respect for people and human rights. If we allow human numbers to go right on accumulating naturally, then we probably also have to allow for people to have decent places to live, decent family wage paying jobs, and so on. But if we allow the eugenics ideas of "limiting" natural family growth to go unchallenged, then that becomes a handy scapegoat for defending the corrupt status quo, and doing little or nothing for the "burgeoning billions" of people already here. "Family planning" becomes a handy cop-out, for not making already-needed improvements.

While I do think the overemphasis on overpopulation as a source of problems is misguided, I think that there is absolutely no way that the current consumption habits of people in the United States, especially, can be expanded to the world population.

That really isn't true, and promotes "old" ideas of conquest and colonialism, or "contraceptive imperilism." Actually, I say much the opposite. We see more and more of the world naturally growing so dense with people, that they should be adopting more "modern" methods of accomodating so many.

"The developing countries should become more like us, to better support their burgeoning populations. We should become more like them, and have more children." Pronatalist

One example of this that I often like to promote, is that I do agree with those who advocate that mothers should be allowed to breastfeed in public. Because that's what's common in developing countries, where people often are still more pronatalist than we are. If more people are to be encouraged to let their families grow naturally, without the burdens of unnaturally contracepting, then I figure that babies must be more welcome, most anywhere that parents may go. And isn't a quite fed baby, preferable to a fussing crying baby? And with more people all around, populating more densely, is it really reasonable to expect some nice nursing room to be found nearby, as in many Churches? Even on cramped airplanes? I don't think so. People eat in public, and mothers don't want to be couped up in some dirty old tiny restroom, to care for their infants.

One thing that people in developing countries increasingly need, is electricity. Why? I have heard that electricity is sort of a form of contraceptive, because what else is there to do in dark villages at night, but make more babies? But that's not the reason. The pro-life side of that, would be turning on lights at night, to change the baby's or babies' diapers. What they need electricity for, is because of respiratory problems people are having, with huddling around millions of smoky cooking fires in growing cities. Burning trash, wood, or dung to cook food. Surely there must be a better way? Aha! There is. Modern gas or electric cookstoves and microwave ovens. Modern appliances such as that, do the job so much better, control just the right amount of heat, right where it's needed—without smoke! Just what growing and increasingly densely populated cities would seem to need, to reduce rising concentrations of air pollution.

Growing families may also need larger homes, so as to not be too cramped. And better-paying jobs. Well all that, points to the more "modern" ways already popularized by the developed West.

Now I would agree with questioning some of our "consumptive" practices, but would disagree with the stupid condescending notion, that an increasingly populous world can't also be more "modernized." In fact, more population is fine and great, but more population + more poverty, really is not the ideal combination.

So I think the first priority should be the wealthy countries reforming their economics from inflationary to sustainable practices, and encouraging sustainability in the developing countries. As the general well-being of the people improves, there will be a tendency to slowing population growth. But I think with the deployment of technology and smart planning, the carrying capacity of the planet for human population is actually much higher than the glib assumption based on the notion that everyone has to be able to consume as wastefully as Americans do now.

With 4 or 5 babies being born worldwide, a second, we don't have the "luxury" of "first priorities." It's all already happening. Developing countries already are gaining in population size, as they are simutaneously modernizing. Sure, developing countries may benefit by being able to skip perhaps, some of our past "polluting" steps in the process, and copying the better or cleaner technologies of today. I am not at all interested in the phony contraceptive-induced "demographic transition" theory of slowing population growth. Rather, I would love to see technology better applied, to better promote and support, our naturally "high" birthrates, and go on encouraging natural family growth worldwide. We should work on breaking up the greedy oil corporation stranglehold on gasoline price-gouging, as people in China and India have just as much right to drive cars as we do, and I deeply resent the communist/enviro-radical economic trend towards making overpriced medical care/insurance, and driving cars, increasingly a priviledge reserved only for the rich.

Human population growth is beautiful, for it allows all the more people to experience life, and so let the growing human race "blossom."
 

locomiax

Legendary Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Apr 20, 2008
Posts
388
Media
3
Likes
1,099
Points
598
Location
Spain
Verification
View
Sexuality
69% Straight, 31% Gay
Gender
Male
sizexxx
If there was advantage to larger penis size, what was it? And if there is no longer, what has changed to make this the case?

The answer could be, no nudity around anymore to choose the bigger in some thousand years ?, could be this the reason why Africans have it one inch bigger in average? they have been nude around a bit longer than us.
 

locomiax

Legendary Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Apr 20, 2008
Posts
388
Media
3
Likes
1,099
Points
598
Location
Spain
Verification
View
Sexuality
69% Straight, 31% Gay
Gender
Male
sorry when i say us, i meant whites, as i am, talking as a white guy, is not a way to say them and us as a despective difference, i think you understand what i wanted to say, probably because in my town there are very very few afrodescendents. Anyway i had to have been concious that this forum is international and there are many kind of diferent heritage people here. So i apologize for that mistake
 

sizexxx

1st Like
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
75
Media
0
Likes
1
Points
151
Location
Oregon
Sexuality
90% Straight, 10% Gay
Gender
Male
What if the many compelling reasons for "traditionally very large" families, are actually as relevant as ever?

And people haven't considered near enough, that there are several practical reasons for the natural encouragement of large families, even in the "huge" human population size of today. It goes hand in hand with promoting family values and better respect for people and human rights. If we allow human numbers to go right on accumulating naturally, then we probably also have to allow for people to have decent places to live, decent family wage paying jobs, and so on. But if we allow the eugenics ideas of "limiting" natural family growth to go unchallenged, then that becomes a handy scapegoat for defending the corrupt status quo, and doing little or nothing for the "burgeoning billions" of people already here. "Family planning" becomes a handy cop-out, for not making already-needed improvements.

This is a complete non-sequitur. It is a moral imperative to defend human rights and economic justice whether we encourage people to breed irresponsibly and out of control or promote reasonable family planning for people to have only as many children as they can reasonably expect to provide proper sustenance, parenting, and education. Could you explain how it is "unnatural" for people to use their powers of reason and foresight to control their instinctual urges and emotional sentiments?

Family planning has nothing to do with eugenics. Maybe it is possible to promote it for such an agenda, but I think it should be promoted for the well-being of those children who end up being born. It has nothing to do with controlling who gets to pass on their genes.

That really isn't true, and promotes "old" ideas of conquest and colonialism, or "contraceptive imperilism."

I was referring to the simple fact that the United States' consumption habits are reckless and would be disastrous if expanded twenty-fold. I do not see how you fail to recognize that.

As a matter of fact, far from promoting colonialist and imperialist ideas, it actually indicts them. We are living our consumerist lifestyle at the expense of vast poverty and economic injustice visited elsewhere by our imperialism. Moderating our habits and moving to more sustainable modes of production and distribution is imperative both for the sake of the global environment and for human rights and socio-economic justice everywhere.

One example of this that I often like to promote, is that I do agree with those who advocate that mothers should be allowed to breastfeed in public.

I agree wholeheartedly with this position. People need to move beyond their prudishness and distaste at our natural biological functions.

Now I would agree with questioning some of our "consumptive" practices, but would disagree with the stupid condescending notion, that an increasingly populous world can't also be more "modernized." In fact, more population is fine and great, but more population + more poverty, really is not the ideal combination.

I did not suggest that developing countries cannot develop. It is simply impossible for the wasteful habits of the West to be adopted everywhere without wreaking ecological havoc. Insofar as population does continue to grow rapidly, it is imperative not only for infrastructure development to keep pace with population growth, but for economic development to occur in a way which learns from the past mistakes of those societies which industrialized earlier and implements sustainable practices from the outset. You may have the notion that "sustainability" somehow implies deprivation and poverty, but it is simply having the foresight to avoid egregious waste so that deprivation and poverty are not visited upon future generations.

With 4 or 5 babies being born worldwide, a second, we don't have the "luxury" of "first priorities." It's all already happening. Developing countries already are gaining in population size, as they are simutaneously modernizing. Sure, developing countries may benefit by being able to skip perhaps, some of our past "polluting" steps in the process, and copying the better or cleaner technologies of today. I am not at all interested in the phony contraceptive-induced "demographic transition" theory of slowing population growth. Rather, I would love to see technology better applied, to better promote and support, our naturally "high" birthrates, and go on encouraging natural family growth worldwide. We should work on breaking up the greedy oil corporation stranglehold on gasoline price-gouging, as people in China and India have just as much right to drive cars as we do, and I deeply resent the communist/enviro-radical economic trend towards making overpriced medical care/insurance, and driving cars, increasingly a priviledge reserved only for the rich.

You say that we don't have the luxury of first priorities, yet you essentially agreed with with what I set at a first priority. That is, applying our technology to make economic development sustainable. I failed to be clear that this should be done as if population growth was going to continue the way that it currently is, but that is what I meant. Now whether it will continue, or should continue, at current rates of growth, is another question.

No one has a "right" to drive cars, no matter what country they live in or its level of present economic development. At any rate, no one should drive a gas guzzler just because they like how it looks or because of its status-symbol value. If a family is huge and needs a bus to haul the whole crew around, that is one thing, but a single guy driving a monster truck just because it makes him feel cool is another entirely. It would be hypocritical to say that people in other countries shouldn't have what we have, consume the way we do without simultaneously saying we shouldn't either. That is my whole point.

Also, healthcare is a human right. Everyone deserves the best quality medical prevention and intervention, regardless of whether there are 6 billion people or 16 billion.

Finally, the "demographic transition" is something which has been observed in the past to occur in the industrialized world without any top-down policy of limiting population growth. I do not support any such top-down policy. I just support making education and resources for family planning universally available, and leave it to individuals to decide whether they want to have no children, 2 children, or 2 dozen children. Whatever the outcome, we still need to welcome every child that is born with love and care for their physical, emotional, and moral well-being. We just also need to be careful that we are not promoting a path which is likely to make all of these much more difficult to attain for future generations of children.

It seems to me you falsely assume a certain set of ideological principles and values necessarily go together as you have imputed several positions to my view which I do not hold. And I fail to see where you have given any argument for the promotion of high-birth rates grounded in anything other than subjective aesthetics or emotional sentiment.