Friendship (just friendship) with gay men

[Jake1973]

This is kind of off topic I guess but it seems like people talk about everything here. I am with another dude for a long time and have plenty of friends, and in most situations people either meet us together or through other friends, so it's not an issue. However I'm a lot more social than he is and because of my interests (live music, my gym, my local bar) a lot of the guys I interact with socially end up being straight, or at least present as such. And in one way it seems better to make friends with straight guys so there is no confusion about motive... except if there is.

There are guys who I would like to get to know better, strictly as friends, but i'm so freaking awkward about it because I know at some point this conversation is going to come up. Even though I don't act flirty or whatever, in my head if you start trying to chat up another guy, he's going to think something's up. One one hand I don't want to be going *handshake* "hi I like dudes, wanna spot me on this lift?" and on the other hand if I start to hit it off with someone I don't want to then have them think i was hiding it.

So I guess my questions are: 1.) If a guy you don't know seems to be making an effort to know you, do suspect his motives, and 2.) if you were on the other side of this equation, would you rather they just said something right away or would you be cool about if they waited until the conversation went in that direction?

Thx in advance

 

[sumbodii]

That's a tricky question with no always right answer to be honest. Different men have different opinions on things, and while some wouldn't care in the least if you reveal it later, others will start wondering if you were trying to cozy up to them before making a move. It's all down to the individual.

Myself personally I've only met two men who were upfront about being gay the moment we spoke to each other and I hated both of them. They made it so every other sentence that came out of their mouths was designed to remind everyone about how proudly gay they were. The thing is I didn't care in the least bit. I don't mind if you're one of those naturally flamboyant stereotypes but if you keep saying things like 'Where can a gay man get a drink around here!' for no good reason it just becomes annoying and obnoxious. If they had just revealed they were gay as a sort of 'warning' and then didn't keep rubbing it in everyone's face like they were looking for someone to start trouble over it I might have gotten along with them.

On the other hand there was one person I met through a friend at a mall and we hit it off and had a great time together. Only later when we parted did my friend tell me the guy was gay. I wouldn't mind hanging out with him again because he was a genuinely fun guy, and his orientation had nothing to do with it.

Again, that's just me and every other person you meet will think differently. Just like with any social interaction you never really know what you're getting into until you're already in it.

 

[StubbornMule]

You are just being friendly, so what is the problem? Also, I think you should keep the conversation as natural as possible; if you become friend with people the topic of your sexuality and relationship status will surface at some point.

 

[Beanie]

As long as you keep your intentions clear they shouldn't looomat you more than a friend

 

[elixer26]

This is kind of off topic I guess but it seems like people talk about everything here. I am with another dude for a long time..

That is kind of vague, so you're in a relationship with another guy? you're dating another guy?doesn't make any sense why that was so bleek. But anyway I think that making friends or Associate's should not be that complicated. I think people tend to quickly write somebody off if the person's gay or they write the person's a person off if the person doesn't have the same interests as them. But there's something to be said for helping someone develop a hobby, helping someone develop an interest in something. I definitely do not write people off. I am open to having friends gay straight bi transgendered whatever it is, I prefer to be around people of like mind, but just because we don't have things in common doesn't necessarily mean that we cannot be friends or socialize. There may be other things and other strengths that person has. I agree that sometimes it's challenging to find a gay friend that wants something non-sexual. But the point of what I noted above if you need to have a sit-down conversation with the person saying either we can just be platonic friends or this is not going to work. There needs to be some maturity.

 

[elixer26]

That's a tricky question with no always right answer to be honest. Different men have different opinions on things, and while some wouldn't care in the least if you reveal it later, others will start wondering if you were trying to cozy up to them before making a move. It's all down to the individual.

Myself personally I've only met two men who were upfront about being gay the moment we spoke to each other and I hated both of them. They made it so every other sentence that came out of their mouths was designed to remind everyone about how proudly gay they were. The thing is I didn't care in the least bit. I don't mind if you're one of those naturally flamboyant stereotypes but if you keep saying things like 'Where can a gay man get a drink around here!' for no good reason it just becomes annoying and obnoxious. If they had just revealed they were gay as a sort of 'warning' and then didn't keep rubbing it in everyone's face like they were looking for someone to start trouble over it I might have gotten along with them.

/QUOTE]
'Hate' is a strong word. I would avoid using that if I were you. This all sound ignorant; so you must be "straight" Would it make a difference if he said "Where can a white man get a drink? or where can a New Yorker get a drink? Well, that's the way he probably meant it.
YOU assume he's rubbing it in your face. There's something called 'Pride' meaning not ashamed of who you are. Then. there's something called being insensitive and taking things too personally. So, that's what you're doing. This is what always kept me from befriending straight guys. They assume and are quick to overanalyze. There will always be that 5th grade mentality of gay boys over there and str8 boys on the other side of the room. Let's grow up and get over ourselves, folks, It's 2016 not 1816.

 

[elixer26]

That's a tricky question with no always right answer to be honest. Different men have different opinions on things, and while some wouldn't care in the least if you reveal it later, others will start wondering if you were trying to cozy up to them before making a move. It's all down to the individual.

Myself personally I've only met two men who were upfront about being gay the moment we spoke to each other and I hated both of them. They made it so every other sentence that came out of their mouths was designed to remind everyone about how proudly gay they were. The thing is I didn't care in the least bit. I don't mind if you're one of those naturally flamboyant stereotypes but if you keep saying things like 'Where can a gay man get a drink around here!' for no good reason it just becomes annoying and obnoxious. If they had just revealed they were gay as a sort of 'warning' and then didn't keep rubbing it in everyone's face like they were looking for someone to start trouble over it I might have gotten along with them.

On the other hand there was one person I met through a friend at a mall and we hit it off and had a great time together. Only later when we parted did my friend tell me the guy was gay. I wouldn't mind hanging out with him again because he was a genuinely fun guy, and his orientation had nothing to do with it.

Again, that's just me and every other person you meet will think differently. Just like with any social interaction you never really know what you're getting into until you're already in it.

Hate' is a strong word. I would avoid using that if I were you. This all sound ignorant; so you must be "straight" Would it make a difference if he said "Where can a white man get a drink? or where can a New Yorker get a drink? Well, that's the way he probably meant it.
YOU assume he's rubbing it in your face. There's something called 'Pride' meaning not ashamed of who you are. Then. there's something called being insensitive and taking things too personally. So, that's what you're doing. This is what always kept me from befriending straight guys. They assume and are quick to overanalyze. There will always be that 5th grade mentality of gay boys over there and str8 boys on the other side of the room. Let's grow up and get over ourselves, folks, It's 2016 not 1816.

 

[Naughty Teacher]

its very simple, get out of your own head. if you're just going to be friends, then focus on the the things you have in common. talk about that.

'just friends' dont need every detail of the other person's sex life. maybe it will come up, but probably not. certainly not right away. when i think about the times ive learned a friend was gay, it was a surprise once or twice, but then i thought, 'still great at his job, still funny, still likes to swim...' overall, this is the same person, and i was never going to date him anyway, so thats the same as well.

this is a big giant hurdle, largely because you're making it one.

are there homophobic people out there? yes, but not that many. and they usually dont know, or dont think they know any gay people. if you allow them to get to know you as a friend, you're actually starting to solve the problem, one baby step at a time.

 

[Jake1973]

That is kind of vague, so you're in a relationship with another guy? you're dating another guy?doesn't make any sense why that was so bleek. But anyway I think that making friends or Associate's should not be that complicated. I think people tend to quickly write somebody off if the person's gay or they write the person's a person off if the person doesn't have the same interests as them. But there's something to be said for helping someone develop a hobby, helping someone develop an interest in something. I definitely do not write people off. I am open to having friends gay straight bi transgendered whatever it is, I prefer to be around people of like mind, but just because we don't have things in common doesn't necessarily mean that we cannot be friends or socialize. There may be other things and other strengths that person has. I agree that sometimes it's challenging to find a gay friend that wants something non-sexual. But the point of what I noted above if you need to have a sit-down conversation with the person saying either we can just be platonic friends or this is not going to work. There needs to be some maturity.

Yea I am in a LTR with another guy.

For some reason it seems like (some) guys think they have a stake in your sexuality even if it is not directed at them. So if you don't say anything you're hiding it, but if you bring it up too much, you're shoving it in their face or "flaunting it". Granted anybody that high-maintenance is probably not worth being friends with anyway.

The part about friendships with gay dudes is not so much that they can't control themselves as much as, if you're affectionate or physical in front of others, does that suggest more is going on when you're alone? If one guy is straight that helps eliminate or at least limit questions. Of course I learned the hard way that the label a guy wears is not always an indication of what he's actually into or capable of behind closed doors.

 

[Jake1973]

this is a big giant hurdle, largely because you're making it one.

*sigh* I know this.

"Don't overthink it" - Every straight guy I ever met.

 

[sumbodii]

Hate' is a strong word. I would avoid using that if I were you. This all sound ignorant; so you must be "straight" Would it make a difference if he said "Where can a white man get a drink? or where can a New Yorker get a drink? Well, that's the way he probably meant it.
YOU assume he's rubbing it in your face. There's something called 'Pride' meaning not ashamed of who you are. Then. there's something called being insensitive and taking things too personally. So, that's what you're doing. This is what always kept me from befriending straight guys. They assume and are quick to overanalyze. There will always be that 5th grade mentality of gay boys over there and str8 boys on the other side of the room. Let's grow up and get over ourselves, folks, It's 2016 not 1816.

Yes Hate is a strong word, and I defend my use of it and I won't avoid using it, so if you were me you'd also use it. I started that paragraph with "Myself Personally" so it's a personal opinion. I hate people like that, people who, again in my personal opinion, take their pride to far. Be it them being proud to be Gay, Straight, White, Black or Green I couldn't care less.

When I see someone I try to think of them as a person, nothing more nothing less. I say try because no matter what our minds are always going to make assumptions based on how the person looks or acts. By continually reminding people about how you are different from them you are you are intentionally alienating yourself from them. These guys had already made it very clear they were gay, and rather than let us get to know them outside of that one aspect of their lives they made it their defining trait, and in so doing maintained and built up the barrier that made us different. They didn't want to relate us in any way besides that.

So yes, I hate people who do that, because it's obnoxious and counter-productive. It's not just with Gay people but with any group or any of the examples you gave.

 

[elixer26]

Yes Hate is a strong word, and I defend my use of it and I won't avoid using it, so if you were me you'd also use it. I started that paragraph with "Myself Personally" so it's a personal opinion. I hate people like that, people who, again in my personal opinion, take their pride to far. Be it them being proud to be Gay, Straight, White, Black or Green I couldn't care less.

If I were you? I could never be like you, and never, ever want to be that delusional and bigoted.

When I see someone I try to think of them as a person, nothing more nothing less. I say try because no matter what our minds are always going to make assumptions based on how the person looks or acts. By continually reminding people about how you are different from them you are you are intentionally alienating yourself from them. These guys had already made it very clear they were gay, and rather than let us get to know them outside of that one aspect of their lives they made it their defining trait, and in so doing maintained and built up the barrier that made us different. They didn't want to relate us in any way besides that.

[/QUOTE]

Did you read and comprehend my last post? Yet, you're still vomiting all over with the same, low intelligent opinion. It seems you have a problem with the FACT that these guys are gay. If they didn't mention it, you wouldn't know. Yet, you'd still find some other way to degrade them. The problem is YOU, not gay, or bi, or black or rich.
I know someone who is wealthy, he boasts all the time about money, clothes and all the sex he has. Does it annoy me? yes, do I judge him? NO. That person is now my BEST FRIEND. He has a good heart and unlike you, he's a human being and respects people and DOES NOT JUDGE ANYONE. You and I can never be friends. You're a mental case, and have no clue who you are and why you are on this earth. Good luck. [/QUOTE]

So yes, I hate people who do that, because it's obnoxious and counter-productive. It's not just with Gay people but with any group or any of the examples you gave.

This garbage didn't make any more sense that the last BS you posted previously. You have some serious mental and emotional issues. Ignorance kills. Were you raised that way? Disgusting pig. Don't bother replying. Ignored.

 

[sumbodii]

I'm not replying to you @elixer26 , since you've ignored me. I'm replying to let anyone else following our argument see my final thoughts. This is a forum after all, and I'd be glad to continue engaging anyone who'd like to take this particular discussion string further.

I think you're the one with a reading comprehension problem. First I'll just address your starting sentences since you seem to have a short memory.

If I were you? I could never be like you, and never, ever want to be that delusional and bigoted.

I'll remind you of your first two sentences to me

Hate' is a strong word. I would avoid using that if I were you.

This is what prompted me to say "so if you were me you'd also use it". That 'if I were you' statement has never made any sense, because if you were someone else you'd always do what they would do.

Getting back to your reply I read and understood it, as best as I could, before I replied.

It seems you have a problem with the FACT that these guys are gay..

I said in my post my problem wasn't that they were Gay, it was that they wouldn't shut up about it. It's like if someone keeps alluding to the fact that they have a Ferrari with every other sentence. You wouldn't care about the car preference, you'd care that they aren't shutting up about it.

If they didn't mention it, you wouldn't know. Yet, you'd still find some other way to degrade them. The problem is YOU...

What makes you think I'd find some reason to degrade them? You're making assumptions about me now after accusing me of making assumptions about other people.

I know someone who is wealthy, he boasts all the time about money, clothes and all the sex he has. Does it annoy me? yes, do I judge him? NO. That person is now my BEST FRIEND.

That's personal. I wouldn't be able to stand him. I'd avoid him at all costs, the same way I would avoid these Gay gentlemen who simply won't shut up about their orientation. It's not about their orientation, it's that they feel the need to constantly talk/brag. That's a personality trait I find repulsive.

He has a good heart and unlike you

Judging me again. Just because I have a strong opinion I must be bad. Do you not see the hypocrisy in what you claim your beliefs to be and how you actually JUDGE other people?

You and I can never be friends. You're a mental case, and have no clue who you are and why you are on this earth.

Between you calling me ignorant, delusional, bigoted, and a clueless mental case for 'vomiting' my personal non-aggressive opinion I really don't see us being friends either.

This garbage didn't make any more sense that the last BS you posted previously. You have some serious mental and emotional issues. Ignorance kills. Were you raised that way? Disgusting pig. Don't bother replying. Ignored.

What a sad little person you are to resort to such school boy tactics. I've been nothing but cordial yet just because you disagree with my strong opinion you throw petty insults and then flee with your tail between your legs like a little child. Rather than try an discuss the issue you run like coward thinking you've had the last word. Well with this last post I claim that last word now, but since you've ignored me you can live on in blissful ignorance, so I guess we both win.

The truth is I'm glad you claim to have ignored me. I know you'll read this response eventually, and even if you don't everyone who passes through here and does read it will see how immature you are. Maybe you realised you had no idea what you were talking about and decided to run while you could. In any case if you ever find the courage to stand before me again (which may take a while seeing how quick you were to run away from me at the first hint of opposition) for an argument I'm watching the thread.

But if you do please try to avoid the insults and engage with me like a civilised human being. Or not, I don't know how you were raised and I wouldn't want to force you to behave differently on my account.

 

[thebiggulp]

I'm just going to step by the last few posts. I'm assuming that if you've got 1973 in your handle that you are in your forties. I don't know what your "personality" is like. You could be a flamer or the former quarterback or whatever on the spectrum. I don't really care. All are capable of being wonderful people or arseholes, so no judgement from me on that count. I've been pretty out as a person for most of my life (now 50). Inside, I'm decked out in glitter and feathers, but outside, I guess I'm less than glamorous. I've recently been told that I don't come off as gay until I open my mouth (and a handbag falls out...oops). Whatever. I have been accused of cracking on to people when they were the only interesting conversationalist in the room. No matter what your intentions, you have no control over how people perceive you. Sex, sexuality, etc... should only come up as a natural part of conversation. I don't meet people and say, "Hi, I'm Matt and I'm gay." ...nor do straight people, nor bi people, unless they are trying to illicit a response for/against for whatever their agenda is. If in the course of a normal conversation, someone inquires about my living arrangements, relationship status, etc.... I will mention that I have a partner of 20+ years or live with someone, whatevs. Sometimes you might want to move slowly and test the waters (mind you, if they are homophobes, I really don't want to waste my time with them, so I'm usually upfront straight away unless I could be in a potentially dangerous environment). This is a way of drawing a line in the sand, which can help put them at ease. You are basically saying, without saying "Yes, I'm gay, but I am off the market, so I am really no threat to you." You can both acknowledge this and immediately move beyond it as an issue. If you think of it in strictly heterosexual terms, a man and a woman can easily be friends. Either party may both be thinking "oh fuck, am I being hit on?", but through conversations you can find out that both of you are involved with someone else (or not), and just relax a bit. As sumbodii said, there is no one size, fits all solution. Use your instincts, and choose your friends wisely. I can only think of less than five people who dropped me like a hot potato when they "learned" that I was gay. Not missing them in the least. In the end, I can only talk about my experiences. My partner is nowhere near as involved in the social whirl as I am. I have been in a very public light for awhile (not that I'm somebody), and we have different needs. Just be yourself, be open and honest, and they should like you for you. Best of luck, mate.

 

[dongalong]

Your friendliness will be returned, however it gets more complicated if you want to become close friends. I always find that there's an invisible barrier in my friendships with gay men, kind of like when you are with someone with opposing political views. When the conversation turns to sex, things can get awkward and uncomfortable.

To answer your questions: 1 - If there is no obvious gay attraction involved, your intentions to be just friends should be welcomed. 2 - Build up a healthy rapport with the guy before stating your sexual preferences and wait until the subject of sex comes up, make it clear that you have no sexual attraction to him as soon as possible.

Expect to be placed in 4th place in the friendship hierarchy behind: platonic girlfriends (3rd) Hetero friends (2nd) and girlfriends/lovers (1st), that way you won't feel disappointed by the lack of attention given to you.

 

[boatnik]

Having lived in San Francisco for many years, I've had lots of friends, coworkers, employees, and business partners who were homosexual. They knew I was heterosexual and I knew they were homosexual. But sexuality is actually a small part of a whole person, and in general settings completely irrelevant. I've had men introduce themselves to me in the gym and ask for advice or ask if they can share a machine with me. If people are nice to me, I am more than happy to oblige and treat them all as friends. I never give a second thought to their sexuality. And besides, I don't use sexuality as a criteria to judge the likeability of a person.

 

[elixer26]

Having lived in San Francisco for many years, I've had lots of friends, coworkers, employees, and business partners who were homosexual. They knew I was heterosexual and I knew they were homosexual. But sexuality is actually a small part of a whole person, and in general settings completely irrelevant. I've had men introduce themselves to me in the gym and ask for advice or ask if they can share a machine with me. If people are nice to me, I am more than happy to oblige and treat them all as friends. I never give a second thought to their sexuality. And besides, I don't use sexuality as a criteria to judge the likeability of a person.

Well, said. We need more practical and logical people, like you. Respect.

 

[Jjz1109]

So I think I can relate.

I worked with a guy during college. We were in a small office, and he was almost rude to me most of the time. I couldn't figure out why, since I never did anyhting to him. A mutual friend, a woman, approached me to tell me he wanted to be friends, but was concerned how I would react because he was gay. I wasn't aware. Days went by before I finally broke the ice and said, "hey, it's cool, no problem." The look of relief on his face was amazing. He didn't know how to broach the subject, and just wanted to be friends. Can't say we were besties, but certainly had a better working relationship after this, and did go out in group settings.

Another time I wanted to be friends with a guy at work. He seemed cool, it appeared we had a lot in common (came from neighboring towns in the burbs, were roughly same age, and shared some common interests), but he was very standoffish. I tried a long time to work the friendship, to the point where I was trying way too hard, and eventually thought he might be getting the wrong impression. I backed off, and nothing every came of it. We continued to exchange pleasantries in the office, but that was it, the frienship never developed. I figured it was his loss. I came to realize over time that not everyone clicks, whether in a romantic relationship, or even in a friendship. That's just how things work.

So, my advice - - be yourself, and be natural. Be comfortbwle with yourself in your own skin. If it's going to happen, it's going to happen.

 

[ronin001]

I have good friendships with a few women, one of whom is a Lesbian. I just treat them like people, with no ulterior motives. If a guy can respect my boundaries the same way, I have no problem with him

 

[Itsmeandyou]

Had a partner in business who was gay. It was never once an issue.