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Discussion in 'Politics' started by slurper_la, Feb 11, 2009.
...How the Neo-Cons have ruined the US and the World.
Fuck Ronald Reagon
who fucks veggies?
I heard some people find zucchinis to be perfect substitutes for dildos. :biggrin:
i did'nt say by.....lol, but then again i hear watermelons are nice not sure they are vegetables.
fruits -- just like a lot of us
As long as contemporary conservativism insists on maintaining the cult of St Ronnie, the GOP will remain a regional party of little national interest. It's a shame, because democracy depends on having more than one party.
i would agree with the assertion you made on the point about remaining wedded to certain philosophies so staunchly, but i would hardly consider the GOP a "regional party of little national interest".
Even at its worst point in god knows how many decades(2008 election) it still garnered 46-47% of the national vote in the presidential election, coming off an atrocious presidency, with a weak candidate, a terrible economy, two wars, a global meltdown and loss of "global prestige".
In fact, i would have to argue, that however right or wrong one might view their philosophical views, from 1980 onwards the GOP and conservatives have in fact made their largest gains. For a party that had not had control of the house for what, 40+ years, to then gain control of the house, and retain it for what, 12 years and also control the senate for a similar period, suggests the GOP's relevance. In fact, i would say as things become more polarized, the relative strength of the GOP will continue.
The fact that the independent vote is what delivered the victory to Obama suggests that the GOP is one bad democratic presidential term away from regaining control, no matter how un-inspiring their message.
The simple fact that people simply bounce back and forth between one corrupt, incompetent party to the other when they become dissatisfied is testament to the fact that the electorate really has no clue and rarely ever gives creedence to thinking of another way forward without these two very poor political dinosaurs
Probably the biggest pile of horseshit i've ever seen. This says alot about you cum slurper, allowing radical left wing shit like this influence how you see things.
Thank goodness for the radical right wing! Where would we get the truth without them?
And the young have no idea who he is and don't experience any 'shiver of excitement' when his name is mentioned as any true conservative does. Regional indeed. :smile:
I think youth are the Republicans' biggest problem. McCain did not inspire youth the way Obama did nor did Bush endear himself to youth. Gen Y is bigger and they don't get the conservative message as it's being delivered by these old guys. They grew-up during the prosperous Clinton years and feared being sent to war under Bush. Obama will have to screw-up enormously to get these young voters to vote for Palin or whoever the GOP puts up in 2012. Reinvention and rehabilitation should be their goal.
Nope. nothing needs to be reinvented. Conservatism lost its way when it became more like the democratic party over the last 8 years. Once the youth realize that Obama is nothing more than ALOT more of the same (minus the brass balls Bush had), the conservatives will make a comback. We need to just return to the ideals of Reagan. Greatest president we ever had. The dems ran us into the ground from 1940 to 1980, and Reagan dug us out of the ditch, and so the cycle continues.
Pretty good post Flashy.
The problem with this analysis is that it imagines that any potential 3rd party would not be precisely as corrupt as the two we have.
Part of the reason we don't have a viable 3rd party is that the 3rd party platforms are even MORE polarizing and extremist than the GOP and the Dems... and the third party policies are founded in belief systems that are even less grounded in reality.
Libertariansim is nothing but a good idea taken to an unworkable extreme.
Desptie the "free" sounding title, its about nothing but rights of PROPERTY and OWNERSHIP superseding the rights of a society as a group.
The Communist party? Again, a fine idea predicated upon a belief about human nature that simply is not true.
I would love to see a viable 3rd party... but they tend to coalesce around factions that have extreme feelings about extreme idea... rather than reasonable thoughts about well established and provable ideas.
In that regard, I think the best strategy is to PUNISH any party that oversteps its bounds and allows corruption to become its stock in trade...
And thereby FORCE them back to the central ground of reasonable ideas and policies.
Republicans won power as the result of what seemed the liberal excesses and failures of the 60s and 70s.
But they went hog wild and WAY off the the beam, proving themselves unable to govern.
The Democrats have had a long time to re-calibrate their policies- and now they get to have a turn awhile the Republicans must figure out what they did wrong.
Flashy... to imagine any group in power will not succumb to the corruption of power is an idealistic notion that does not reflect human nature.
It ain't gonna happen.
With what we put our politician thru to get elected... only those who are the MOST avaricious for power and wealth will run that gauntlet.
I agree we tend to bounce back and forth from one corrupt party to the other.
But I think that is the ONLY mechanism we have to try and keep those in power in Check.
When their corruption starts to show... and their policies fail, we yank the office out from under them and hand it to someone who promises to do better.
I tried to explain to a friend in communist China about the difference between democracy and Communism.
What it came down to is that both kinds of government are subject to the abuses of power... both populations rife with scoundrels.
The only real difference is that in a democracy, the people can effect change a LITTLE faster.
Abuses of law can be corrected in a matter of years, rather than a matter of decades.
What you see as the bane of our political system, I see as the one shining hope we have ever had.
Fuck ideology. Don't swear allegiance to ANY party. Support the party that is acting in your interests.... because your interests change, and the parties change.
The American people's biggest failing is that they root for a party like they do for a sports team.
That is political idiocy.
Conservatives have backed the republicans... who, in fact, did the exact OPPOSITE of what conservatives CLAIM to want.
The first step in achieving what you want, politically, is to divorce your understanding of what you want from the slogans of party and ONLY examine the results of their actions.
I couldnt agree more. fine post.
"Into the ground?" The mid 40s to the mid 60s were the most prosperous period in this nation's history and that includes a two-term Republican. As to the greatest president, I'll stick with the founding fathers. They all could have so easily fucked the entire system and yet didn't. They set the stage and then played the parts they wrote for themselves, setting aside the crown when asked. That precedent, given the times, was remarkable.
the example of the California Welfare State will be more than enough to revitalize and reignite the conservative movement
couple that with the next four years under Obama, and the liberal Democratic Party might yet see its demise
what's the answer nick both parties suck and not in a good way? neither party has any integrity the government has deteriorated in to a bunch of self important, whining, finger pointing ass wipes from both sides.
I think the answer lies with Americans, not their government or political parties
we will do what we have always done -- make things work
most of our major problems stem from government -- everything from race relations to the economy
when Africans were first imported, we saw social mixing and intermarriage, then we saw the British overlords outlaw that and implement a doctrine of racial supremacy articulated in London
when Lyndon Johnson had his Great Society programs implemented, we saw the consequent exploding prison populations in the following decades
it's true that Obama's proposals will likely have the same effect as FDR's New Deal programs in delaying recovery, but already I see Americans effecting the same dynamic that we saw was responsible for the recovery from the Great Depression -- saving
the forced savings of WWII, wage, cost, and price controls were responsible for the big boom we saw subsequently, once the war ended, and consumption and investment in the USA proceeded
the missing factors today are the mass conscription that erased unemployment then
hopefully, the massive unemployment we will be seeing will result in an end to outsourcing and other aspects of globaloney, and result in much needed investment in the USA, instead of elsewhere
Did you get a new job ... spokesperson for the department of the freakin' obvious?
But ,,, isn't the US Government made up of, and elected by Americans?
Ha, I wondered how long it would take you to blame Britain for US race relations. Nick, you are so full of it and as predictable as sunrise.
Miscegenation laws originated in Colonial America, no such legislation existed in England at the time the US colonies were founded. The may have been a culture of racial inequality in England - in many ways there still is but to suggest it was responsible for contemporary race relations in the US is simply laughable.
Are you also suggesting that the 'Jim Crow' laws (for example) were British in origin - after all they were formulated around 100 years post independence and still 'in effect' almost 100 years after that. I'm sure you will find a way ...
You clearly have an issue with race, and with Britain. There's nothing wrong the latter and the former is between you and your conscience. But please, when you seek to assign cause for the former on the latter, you simply come across as a bigot and a fool.
Ah yes, because that had nothing to do with people committing more crime. Mostly Americans, I'd imagine?
Maybe, maybe not but right now it's impossible to be sure one way or another.
Unlikely, but my crystal ball is in the shop. I figure you're a closet isolationist, your world view is positively myopic. Get some glasses. :wink: