Gay men's view of straight men -- please share

Discussion in 'Relationships, Discrimination, and Jealousy' started by B_henry miller, Dec 30, 2007.

  1. B_henry miller

    B_henry miller New Member

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    Very broad based and general, so it may seem an odd question. But I'm just wondering what some gay men here may have to say about straight men. For example, I have gathered that a lot of gay men seem to laugh at the gay behavior straight men get away with. In other words, straight men seem not to realize how "gay" they are behaving, such as with the ass patting in sports, drunked homoerotic behavior, communal nude bathing, etc.

    Anyway, I'm interested in what you guys think, and PLEASE let's not let it descend into flaming, okay? :cool:
     
  2. auncut10in

    auncut10in Well-Known Member

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    Personally I don't see that much difference between straight guys and gay guys other than their sexual orientation. One of the things I have gotten from this website is that we are more alike than different. We want the same things out of life, we really don't care wheither our friends are straight or gay. When a straight guy notices me at the gym, I don't automatically assume they want to have sex with me. And I assume that when I notice a straight guy at the gym, he doesn't think I want to have sex with him. So straight guys like girls. that's ok, someone has to. It is just not me.
     
  3. Kimahri

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    This is an interestinig thread. I'm gay, but the vast majority of my male friends are straight. It's funny how straight guys act when they are "safe" with one another. The "gay behavior" abounds. But it means nothing to the guys involved because they know there isn't anything meant by it.

    There are differences between straight and gay guys. Especially the gay guys that find it more important to be gay than a guy. The majority of straight guys I come across are more worried about being a guy than being straight or gay. Being in a fraternity and a former Lacrosse player, I've gotten to see a lot of straight boys in their "natural habitat". I love the guys that can get around my being gay and treat me like one of the guys and do guy stuff.
     
  4. Northland

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    Gay behavior? I'm queerly confused! I tend not to see ass patting in sports or communal bathing as gay- unless there's a raging hard-on it doesn't seem to be sexual. And what about all the gay men who comment on women and their tits and kiss them on the lips? Is that hetero behavior for homosexuals?

    My upbringing had nudity at times with other men-locker rooms in school and of the YMCA as well as the stint in the Boy Scouts. Never considered the orgy fest possibilities. There was even public nudity- men and young preteen boys in the shower section of Coney Island and Wolfe's Pond beaches (when I was out on Staten Island)- never saw it as a sex palace(although when I was 13 or 14 I did ogle an older man who was showering there- until my grandfather slapped me on the ass and scolded me).

    You mention communal bathing which has existed for centuries and with no sexual conotations- or at least none that we know of. As I indicated, unless there are signs of sexual stimulation it doesn't strike me as such. As for ass patting, there are parents who give their kid a smack on the rear as a form of friendly affection- nothing sexual. Just a slap on the tush as they are told to go do their homework or the dishes or something else. Never seen it as sexual, so why would it be such in sports?


    The gayest behavior I have found with supposed heterosexuals is where they glom onto men and need to spend every waking moment with them or talking about them- for crying out lout get out of the fucking closet Sammy! The rage in their eyes when a woman or even another man talks to the man they've set their cap for- it's revolting! What next? A man having a circumcision because his best bud just did? Now that would be gay behavior! Get your nodule pierced because your best male pal did? That would be gay!
     
  5. B_cigarbabe

    B_cigarbabe New Member

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    A voice of reason!
    Thank you Northland.
    cigarbabe:saevil:
     
  6. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    Characterwise, they seem more solid ... can't really say I've had any gay friends.
     
  7. sdbg

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    Throughout my adult life, I've always been one of the guys is my social circle. All my friends are straight. It just so happened that one of my "straight" friends and I were lovers for 6 years, yet all of us were still friends and went about our usual routines as a group. My one friend, Dave, will say to my other friend, Robert, "Robert, you're such a flaming homosexual!" and all of us laugh like crazy because they are married and straight. Robert constantly refers to me as "my boyfriend", and acts gayer than most gay people that I've met. I keep telling him that you can't call me that unless you put out, bitch! It's all in good fun.

    It would be cool to become friends with some real gay people. We never know who we're going to meet tomorrow!
     
  8. midlifebear

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    When I'm in the USA or Canada I'm regarded as every straight person's token "gay acquaintance." It seems that most (not all) straight men and women are anxious to use the fact that I'm gay as a notch on their belts so they can say, "Well, I know people who are gay and (fill in positive or negative remark here)." I’m not complaining. North Americans have come a long way since the 1980’s when I still had to worry that by being “out” I was putting myself in danger of getting the shit beat out of me. And I’m certain there are still a good number sexually threatened heterosexuals who still think I should be beaten and strung up because that’s how they’ve been raised: to hate. Anyway, to get back to answering your question . . .


    As I mentioned, North American straight male friends are usually very accepting and open about being my sexuality. However, they still get nervous when I behave "normally," in the sense that I no problem walking up to strange women in public and immediately making a connection. They generally seem to have a more difficult time than I do getting to know strangers of the opposite sex. I attribute their difficulty to learned behavior that prescribes there should be always be some sexual tension when approaching a woman. I've often been told by straight male friends that my normal behavior, being able to quickly socialize in a crowd of strangers, is "queer" - with an emphasis that it's a negative trait.

    There's no question North Americans and Northern Europeans tend to be emotionally "colder." Ask any person from a Latin culture. The norm in northern post WWII cultures is to shake hands and keep one another at a physical distance until sizing up one another: male or female. Straight male friends also often behave differently around me than they behave with their straight friends when we're at a bar and go to take a whiz. They hide "their stuff" as if they are afraid I'm going to make a pass. I never would. I can't tell you how many times a straight man's "wimmin" friend has told me he was shocked and a bit disappointed that I didn't try to hit on him. Odd. I chalk it up to ignorance, because I'm not into straight men. I only interested in gay men or men who are actively bi. But the pseudo homosexual behavior you mentioned about American Football with men patting each other on their asses is well-documented in anthropological/sociological/folklore studies done by faculty at Berkeley, UT Austin, and U of Indiana, among others. Academics have spent a lot of time and energy trying to understand the type of sexual display that goes on in American football. In contrast, I have yet to run across similar papers on similar behavior displayed by team members in World Football (soccer).



    As for Southern Europe, Argentina, and almost all of South America the situation is much different. Men, regardless of sexual orientation, wander around with their arms around one another. When meeting or saying goodbye, it's considered odd if you don't make at least some sort of physical contact by -- at the very least -- kissing or pressing cheeks. Men hug and kiss each as a easily as they breathe and walk; and they hug hard and sincerely -- straight or gay. Again, watch world football and you'll notice the players almost have a sexual attachment to one another when a team member makes a goal. They rush up to hold each other in a group, kiss, throw each other up in the air. They grab each other's crotches when they celebrate. In my humble opinion they definitely seem to have more fun than say, The Patriots vs. The Steelers. (correction solicited, because I know next to nothing about the names of American-style football teams)

    Another major difference that I've never observed anywhere else except in Italy, Spain, Greece, and especially here in Argentina is how straight men behave when they're taking a piss in a public restroom (bars, train stations, restaurants, football stadiums, etc.). They tend to whip it out with pride and show it off to everyone who will look. It's sort of obvious they like the attention. Latin men and those from Mediterranean countries are rarely bladder shy. I've even watched straight men at gyms openly compare dicks and (horror!) actually handle one another's tools. I'd never do that. Having been raised in the USA I'm afraid I'd get my lights punched out if I commented on or asked to handle a stranger's dick in public. But things are a bit different outside of North America. After all, it’s still illegal for women to sunbathe in public without a bikini top in most provinces and states in Canada and the USA. Remember the hoopla of some singer baring a tit (just one, not two) during a “family” performance during the Super Bowl intermission several years ago? That same performance wouldn’t have even caused an eyebrow to move except in Middle-Eastern cultures and North America (by North America I also include México).

    Here in Argentina -- at least in the city of Buenos Aires – everyone would have been curious at to why that singer only exposed one breast instead of two. This same nonchalance applies to Gay men, too; especially in BsAs. Down here it's as if every male, straight or gay, really, really wants to show you their dick. Why? I do not know. Culturally, it's just a "guy thing" as common as hugging and kissing when we meet and hugging and kissing when we say goodbye. There's no concept of it as being a gay thing.

    NOTE: In contrast you won't find this type of “openness” common in México or most of Central America. Yet, it’s very common in Brazil. And men’s sexual behavior is definitely changing in the same direction in Chile, Ecuador, Columbia, and Panama.

    So, from my experience of living outside of the USA for the last 15+ years I think I can say with some confidence that perceived "gay" behavior is really based upon the norms of your particular culture.

    Beets and Cheese Whiz! That sure took too long to try and explain!
     
  9. jorpollew

    jorpollew Member

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    Basically, I can put all straight men that I've met into 1 of 2 categories:

    Signs of the Totally Clueless straight man:
    1. His ideas and opinions are morphed from what the "other guys" think, do and say, and yet, only "his opinion" matters!
    2. He thinks primarily of himself, and is always "on guard", 24/7, of his precious reputation, his precious ego and his precious possesions.
    3. Everything he says, everything he does is a just a chance to show-off or prove his masculinity.
    4. Anything that he does not understand, he disregards as unimportant.
    5. He only buys products advertised during "the game", or endorsed by pro athletes.
    Signs of the Totally Enlightened straight man:
    1. His thoughts and opinions are based on personal experience and reflection, not on the popular consensus.
    2. He considers how the things he says and does will effect him and others.
    3. He undertsands that showing compassion is a sign of strength from his character, not a weakness.
    4. Because he is confident of who he is, he is not threatened by the differences in other people.
    5. He is open to learn and try new things.
     
  10. Rugbypup

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    Personally, str8 guys kinda frighten me. I find them fairly intimidating.
     
  11. mountainguy

    mountainguy New Member

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    One thing I've observed is that a lot of my straight male friends who are comfortable around gay men happen to be married (or in serious relationships). I'm not sure if that's just a coincidence within my group of friends, or if straight men in relationships are somehow more relaxed about their sexuality.

    I'll admit that I do find homoerotic behavior by straight guys to be amusing. At a party several years ago, a straight friend of mine once kissed another guy in public just to see "what it felt like." Afterwards, he just grinned and said "nah, that's not for me." For some reason, American culture seems to be more comfortable with letting straight women explore the limits of their sexual orientation than it is with men doing so. But I think a lot of straight guys are just as curious, even though most of them are still "straight."
     
  12. B_Monster

    B_Monster New Member

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    Gay men have longer post, :cool:
     
  13. mountainguy

    mountainguy New Member

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    I think that's understandable, rugbypup. I'm not terribly familiar with New Zealand culture's attitudes toward gay people, but here in the United States (even in progressive areas), a lot of straight guys are virulently homophobic. When I'm in unfamiliar social situations where a lot of straight men are present, I won't let down my guard until I get a better sense of how they feel about gay people.
     
  14. Rugbypup

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    True, especially if your 5'7" and the only fight you won was in junior school against a girl, lol.

    I've found tolorence, let alone acceptence of being gay very very rare in str8 guys and virtually non existant in str8 male environments.

    They seem to just assume a really condecening supereiority, like being gay make you as less than them but thats probably the arseholes i've had the misfortune to meet.
     
  15. MovingForward

    MovingForward Member

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    I had a girl beat my behind in middle school ( I would never hit a woman). I swear she hit like a man.

    Anyway , the funniest thing about hanging out with my straight friends is when they forget I am gay. The things they say about women and the things they describe sexually with women is crazy. Then they realize that I have no idea what they are talking about and change the subject.
     
  16. B_henry miller

    B_henry miller New Member

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    Brilliant post. One of the things that's always fascinated me is that Latin men are seen as so macho and masculine and yet they are often blisteringly homoerotic. The two seem to go hand-in-hand, which may be why masculine straight men are often homophobic (because they are threatened by their own homoeroticism).

     
  17. invisibleman

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    I don't think much about straight guys. I don't envy them. I don't hate any straight guy because he is who he is. So, everything is cool. :smile:
     
  18. str82fcuk

    str82fcuk Member

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    Straight guys are a big mystery to me. Sometimes I feel like they're a different species. But I think that also about the gay guys who are 'one of the guys'. I guess I just don't understand the 'guy thing' even tho' I'm a lot less clueless about it than I used to be.
     
  19. Lex

    Lex
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    Ray (Kimahri) and Northland make really good points.

    The entire crux of the OP rests upon the notion that there are feminine and masculine behaviors and that if a man does something "feminine" he must be gay and if a man does something "masculine" he must be straight. The truth is that everyone is both feminine and masculine to differing degrees--think of them as the Yin and Yang. They are both opposite and a part of each other, intricately intertwined and inseparable.

    I don't really tend to think much of anything about straight men. I have straight and gay male friends--as long as they are good people, all is well.
    As Ray notes, as long as everyone is comfortable, there need not be any "labels" and "judgments" placed on behavior.
     
  20. boerkie

    boerkie New Member

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    midlifebear , thanks for an excellent post!!!!


    i remember coming to america from a VERY concervative south africa 20 years ago. it was amazing to be able to rent porn, and to actually see openly gay bars, shops and cities!!
    the fact that it was all out there, in your face, took away a lot of my enjoyment, as i grew up having to sneak it, (the danger factor) and i missed that excitement.
    men as a whole were acting with such restaint towards each other!! memories of fun with men, gay or str8 in the old country made me determined to find the small % of gay in any man i met.
    it gave birth to the belief that a man, gay or str8, and a bottle of chivas regal go anywhichway!!
    it is refreshing, to see how, north american men, once they jumped the hurdle, relax in who they are, and are able to just enjoy their sexuality for what it is! sexuality.
    it is a full time job (but someone has to do it {wink ,wank}), bringing str8 men into touch with emotion shared freely.

    i LOVED one of the quotes on here:
    cook a man breakfast, no one calls you a chef.
    suck ONE dick and everyone calls you a cocksucker!!
     
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