Girlfriend just told me I'm average

[drabman]

...I doubt she would purposely do anything to hurt you.

I have to disagree. I think the vast majority of people will say or do deliberately hurtful things to their partners at one time or another, even if they regret it later. No matter how wonderful this girl might be, I think it's entirely possible that her remark was calculated on some level. She might not have been acting in a deliberately spiteful way, but that doesn't preclude a bit of game-playing on her part. She might even have acted out of character for a second, but feel as though she can't recant without looking bad.

It doesn't exactly appear to be a rare phenomenon after all. I've read a significant number of posts from many men on various forums who claim to be well above average, but who say they have been told by a sexual partner that they are not. It's possible that some of these women might have had previous atypical partners that gave them a distorted idea of the truth, but not the great majority. Assuming these male posters are telling the truth, there does seem to be a significant proportion of women who do play games in this way (as there is of men who play games over other things). In fact there's a post somewhere on the women's forum by a female FM who says she gets so annoyed if a partner asks where he stands in the ranks of former lovers that she deliberately says he's only average even if he isn't.

The overall demeanour of a new partner is not a reliable indication that they won't play games - the argument that "she wouldn't play games - she's not, or doesn't seem to be, like that" is not a compelling one in my view. People and relationships are a lot more complex and subtle than that.

Of course it's possible that she might have been speaking honestly - she might have been remembering previous partners inaccurately, or may have genuinely believed Shannon is only average, although given that he's as big as most big-cock porn stars, I find that unlikely. However I find that very difficult to believe if Shannon is measuring correctly - and he doesn't seem the sort to exaggerate.

 

[drabman]

The premise appears to be that if you aren't manipulating her then she must be manipulating you.

I've dated guys who tried to play dumbass games like that. They aren't worth my time. Good riddance. I want someone real.

Everyone plays games to some extent some of the time in relationships - even if it's at an unconscious or reflexive level. Even the commonplace behavioiur of presenting the best of yourself at the beginning of a relationship is a game.

I personally don't believe that 100% honesty exists in any relationship of any kind.

 

[drabman]

...this was part of my identity as a single man/in previous relationships that just doesn't exist any more because we're together. I really hope it can be a good thing in the long run but it's confusing right now.

It's a shame, because the chances are that she's either mistaken or being economical with the truth. You are never going to know for sure, however the statistical probability that you are significantly larger than most, if not all of her previous partners is far greater than the statistical likelihood of her statement being correct.

If I was faced with a choice between two possible truths with no way of defintively proving which of the two was the actual truth, I'd go with the one that was statistically far more likely, whatever claim someone makes.

 

[D_Dick_S_Lapp]

Everyone plays games to some extent some of the time in relationships - even if it's at an unconscious or reflexive level. Even the commonplace behavioiur of presenting the best of yourself at the beginning of a relationship is a game.

I personally don't believe that 100% honesty exists in any relationship of any kind.

While it may be true, i think his reaction to it is more important. If he were to become withdrawn and insecure it would negatively effect the relationship one way or another even further and negatively effect him more in the long run. If he were to take it the other way he might begin to see himself further as just the guy with the big penis, which is an accident waiting to happen.

 

[redbear52]

I suppose that's the idea. It's strange since I'm pretty sure it came up just because of how little she cares to play games. It's not a subject many women really care that much about, so if she really thought it was important she'd never have said it in the first place. Reading back on the original conversation, she really just put it sandwiched in a bunch of other things she said specifically because it's such a non-issue for her.

Just talking about her perceptions, she also said how she knew black guys had bigger dicks, in spite of never having sex with one, because she drew one as an art model (she went to art school) and he was really big. I think if someone's whole perception is based on someone that self-selected, as well as only the few guys who have slept with her (which I do think cuts out the small guys because of her size) then it's not that surprising it would skew up. With that set, true average is small, big is average, and huge is big.

I never really wanted this thread to validate me -- I have a ruler and an internet connection so it's not difficult to confirm that I'm bigger than the large majority of guys out there. I'm especially not looking to get back at her or anything like that. I don't feel like I've lost any power in the relationship and I'm sure sex together is awesome because we're the ones having it.

No matter what the stats in the world are like, this was part of my identity as a single man/in previous relationships that just doesn't exist any more because we're together. I really hope it can be a good thing in the long run but it's confusing right now.

It sounds as if we have roughly the same penis size. You might be a trifle longer and I might be a bit thicker, at least at the base.

I have been married for several decades now, but I had some experiences before marriage and I don't recall any females going ga-ga over my dick size. There were a few pleasant comments like "you're kind of big" or "you really fill me up" or "you're perfect for me" but that is about it.

I have only discussed penis size of exes with my wife and two other women. I can't really recall how the conversation turned to that topic with any of them but it wasn't the result of me asking them out of the blue how big their exes were compared to me. In all three cases, the woman had experienced someone bigger, although I don't recall any of the three calling me average. My wife was talking about one of her exes (not in a particularly complementary way) who was "really big" and I wound up asking her how I compared to him and to her prior partners (who were fairly numerous). I was pretty hard at the time and I recall my wife looking at my cock in a rather analytical way as if she had been asked to solve a mathematical equation. She used the length of her hand as a measuring device and concluded that I was definitely bigger than average but the guy who was really big was about 2 inches longer and that a couple of other guys were probably about the same size. This was after we had been having sex for about 6 months, and I found it bemusing that she still had to carefully consider the question before she came up with an answer.

I wound up hooking up with one other gal unexpectedly at a friend's place one weekend. She was a relative of his wife visiting from out of state. We weren't prepared with any method of contraception so we spent a pleasant evening pleasuring each other with non-penetrative sex. She certainly didn't make any comment or have any reaction to my penis size. The next morning she surprised me by going out early to buy coffee and some condoms and came back with large ones so I expect she had some experience with guys about the same size as me before.

I'm sure there are some women who will call a guy average in size even when she thinks he is bigger than average, out of a reluctance to "stoke his ego". My guess is that the majority of women just have a matter-of-fact attitude about penis size. To them it is what it is and doesn't represent a rating scale. And I think for many women who have encountered a guy much bigger and/or much smaller than average, everyone else becomes average. So average winds up being 90%+ of the male population.

 

[ShannonH]

Redbear - what's interesting in your post is where you're talking to your wife and she had to really study you after 6 months. It really points to this being more of a male obsession than anything else.

The thing about statistics is that probabilities become extremely unlikely when you expect a probable outcome to happen more and more times in sequence, while they become extremely likely when you expect one improbable outcome out of many attempts. e.g. if you flip a coin once it's 50/50 for heads/tails, but if you flip it 100 times, it's very rare that every flip would be heads, but also extremely likely that 10 of them would be tails.
Also, as you start to add controls to a system that are different than the original test it skews things pretty fast. You get a girl who's more likely to be around big dicks (since she only sees self-selected art models and guys who want to fuck a girl with a big butt) and it skews her average quite a bit.

So in this case, the chance that I've been the biggest for at least one girl I'm with is very high, but the chance that one of the 12+ girls I've been with longer-term has had a sample set that puts me at average for her isn't super high but it is fairly probable. Just look at the distribution on the lifestyle's study:
Fileenis percentile.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't think anyone would really differentiate from memory a +/- 0.25" difference -- maybe not even a +/- 0.5" difference. If a girl's set happens to be in the top 33% for whatever reason (and finding one girl out of 12 whose sample set is the top 33% is reasonably likely) then just under 6.75" would be 50th percentile, and I'd be within the range that looks 'about average, or a little above'.

I remember one time when I was helping her clean out her old apartment, and found her old tin of condoms. A lot of the ones left were the standard sized ones, many the kind you get for free. They seemed very small to me (I'd even tried some of those brands before and some I couldn't roll on), and she commented that not I nor any of her previous boyfriends would fit in them. Obviously someone is wearing those -- I think if this was even a topic she thought about she'd conclude that means she's with bigger guys, but like every subject people don't care about we assume that our experience is typical. e.g. if I cared a lot about flossing I'd know about every kind of floss, but since I don't I was recently surprised to find that a lot of people use unwaxed floss. Every dentist I've been to gives me rolls of waxed floss. I assume my experience is the standard.

Like I said I don't feel 'small' and it's not insecurity. I neither think or feel that a bigger dick would make sex better for either of us in any way shape or form, it's really just that I've always felt like a big guy and with her I'm not able to define myself by something so easily quantifiable.

If I do have any sexual insecurity right now, it's definitely more related to my recent struggles with hypertension. I'm a young otherwise healthy guy but poor handling of stress/anxiety (mostly an aversion to expressing anger so I push everything down) has my heart pounding out of my chest half the time unless I'm totally relaxed. I seriously think it might have hurt my EQ too (it's hard to feel in the mood when your head starts pounding when you go too fast) so maybe I've been punching below my weight class this past year and a half. I seem to go limp a lot more now when I really start going and hit a wall so my body starts to shut down. It's especially tough since my gf likes it rough and would prefer I go harder on her (she said the other day she wished I'd pound her as hard as I do with my two fingers, which my dick is plenty bigger than obviously.) Doctors just treat me like I'm an 80 year old man with this issue so I'm worried they might not help. Anyway.. OT.

 

[redbear52]

I think I understand where you are coming from. I agree that according to credible available info on adult erect penis size you are at least at the 90th percentile, quite possibly the 95th percentile. I think most guys of that size sort of expect a woman with significant prior experience to immediately realize and acknowledge that you are bigger than average, but I'm not sure most women think that way about penis size.

In my wife's case I got the distinct impression that it had never occurred to her to even consider how I compared to her prior lovers.

She did know immediately that one had been much larger, however. Her reaction to my asking how I compared in general was about what I would have expected if I had asked her whether the third toe on my left foot was bigger or smaller than the average of her ex-partners --- "Hmmm, lets see..."

 

[ShannonH]

I think I understand where you are coming from. I agree that according to credible available info on adult erect penis size you are at least at the 90th percentile, quite possibly the 95th percentile. I think most guys of that size sort of expect a woman with significant prior experience to immediately realize and acknowledge that you are bigger than average, but I'm not sure most women think that way about penis size.

In my wife's case I got the distinct impression that it had never occurred to her to even consider how I compared to her prior lovers.

She did know immediately that one had been much larger, however. Her reaction to my asking how I compared in general was about what I would have expected if I had asked her whether the third toe on my left foot was bigger or smaller than the average of her ex-partners --- "Hmmm, lets see..."

Yep, though I think most women I've been with who had a lot of experience do notice more, but the ones with fewer previous partners won't be. More than anything it's probably like you said, except if it's a really extreme case it's not something they really even think about. Like I'm sure if she'd been with a guy with a third-toe the size of his middle finger she'd probably remember that.
It could be a fundamental difference between the two kinds of sex you'd have with one or the other: those with more partners are more focused on the physical, while those with fewer definitely still enjoy the physical, but that enjoyment is heavily based on connecting with another person. Of course, there are plenty of people who like the physical variety and have an open relationship but have great sex with their primary partner too. One doesn't exclude the other.

My last LTR was with a pretty dick-crazy girl too, so maybe that's changed what I expect women to even care about. With my ex, I could pretty much just helicopter it in her face or smack her in the back of the head with it and she'd be ready to go. Just the sight and feel of my dick got her going right away. With my now-gf, she's clearly very attracted to me physically, but that's nowhere near enough to get her started (unless we've been away from each other for a while..) This woman gets in the mood from one main thing: feeling like I'm distracted by doing something important. If I'm working or doing something physical there's no stopping her, but if I'm just on the couch kissing her (or playing minecraft or something) then nothing will happen.

So out of all the women I've been with, they either care a lot about dicks and love mine, or they don't really think very much about dicks in general but love everything about me. I think that's a pretty good situation to be in

 

[latinluva]

Just remind her that she doesn't have the biggest titties you ever had, and her pussy is just "average also", maybe she could lose a lil weight.......but you love her just the same. Sounds like she needs a reality check.

By the way, you are fuckin hot......

 

[nicenycdick]

I have never had a woman judge me because of the size of my penis. It may have been small for some, average for another or large for a few. But I don't think it every really mattered much to them. What matters was how I treated them and how I cared. Even for the women I have met on this site, if they liked me, it was not because of my cock size. There are certainly many, many member much larger!

Don't give your size the importance you have. She sure as hell doesn't.

 

[hud01]

If you were 3 inches and she loved sex it would not matter. As someone said there is always someone bigger, stronger, smarter. All you can do is be the best you can be in all the important areas and it sounds like this is the case with you.

 

[dickapick]

I always read your posts because I think they are interesting, while mostly fact based. Down to earth is another term. Never thought it could be an obsession for you, other than the obsession that brought most of us here. How do I compare to ..?

I have to admit I had a similar issue some time ago with a GF, which made me doubt for a moment I am really that big. She always told me I had a thick, big cock. How she felt me so good insight. That it was the biggest she had ever seen. But then on a day she was talking about an experience she had while working in some sort of old people nursery. There was an old man living there, who still was able to get it hard every time he knew a nurse would come into his room (or maybe more often. Who knows?). She was quite inexperienced in her work at that moment and in sex for that matter. She had heard other nurses talk, about them being afraid of his size). Then she laid eyes on it herself. And it was by far the biggest cock she had ever seen in her life.

I know I am not the biggest. I knew, and I will always know. And (I really think?) I am very happy with my size (overall). But somehow that hurt my feelings. I am not sure why. It could be I felt incapable at that moment or that she apparently lied to me before (I was the biggest she had ever seen).

I don't believe it was on purpose. Maybe even because she knew I am interested in penis size generally she never wanted to hurt my feelings. Wanted to compliment me. Whatever her reason was, I think she mentioned it accidentally. And she wanted me to believe I am the biggest she ever had (not to say the best of course .. :wink.

I also don't believe your GF wanted to hurt you. She had seen a very big one before, and thus thinks you are average. Whatever that means. 5-7 inches is average. Know that statement? There is a lot of difference between a 5 incher and a 7 incher, still they are both defined as average in that particular study (Durex I think?). Bottom line. Average can be quite a range. It is in the eye of the beholder. What she had seen before makes her believe you are average. Still within a certain range, and yet very pleasurable ..

 

[MelbourneGirl]

Personally if it were me I'd claim to have had a bad experience with a former girlfriend who was so hot I found it stressful having other men constantly hit on her and then tell her how glad I was to have found the perfect girl for me.
.

Drabman, are you single?

 

[ShannonH]

Of course it's possible that she might have been speaking honestly - she might have been remembering previous partners inaccurately, or may have genuinely believed Shannon is only average, although given that he's as big as most big-cock porn stars, I find that unlikely. However I find that very difficult to believe if Shannon is measuring correctly - and he doesn't seem the sort to exaggerate.

Well thanks, yes I've never seen the point in exaggerating, especially on an anonymous forum. The only thing number inflation would do is make big dicks seem more common, which is counter-productive to the reasons most people would fudge their number.

I really did question whether I might have just been self-deceptive, since my GF seems to genuinely think every other girl was just trying to boost my ego (and if you see the OP, some of the things I've heard couldn't in a million years be construed as ego boosts.) I even recorded a video today so I wouldn't get an angle boost, didn't press at all and measured just from a stretched position that's not stretched to the max (which actually pulls the pubic area forward shortening the measurement) and the smallest I could go was 17cm. I think this is what they used in this study here:
Penile length is normal in most men seeking penile lengthening procedures
and that still puts me at least 95th percentile. If we go a step further and compare a shorter stretched-state to self-measured erections in the Kinsey, that's still my 6.7" vs the 6.2" average there. Any way I slice it there's no good way to even be pessimistic and bring me down to just at the average. In a lot of ways this is why it's such a surprising thing to hear.

As I was saying in my other post though, when you get a series of probabilities, even low ones, with enough in the series you eventually get a high chance of it occurring just once. This is especially true when nobody's comparing an exact point on a graph but just a general range they have a feel for. She wasn't saying 'average' as a euphemism for 'smaller' like many people do, she just meant a more typical range. Especially if you only have 8 in your sample set, if there's 3 noticeably smaller, 3 in a range that seems 'pretty close' to me, and one significantly larger, then I'd be grouped as average. This grouping happening for any random woman would be unusual, but 1 in 12 women having this sort of experience might be less than 33% likely, but that's still likely enough that it's believable.

To other points you've brought up, I really don't believe at all that she was trying to be hurtful or make a power play. I think it's like in dickapick's story, and like what redbear was saying: unless a woman really cares about dick size, it's not something she'll pay attention to unless it's really out of the ordinary. Past experience will dictate normal range, and then even if two guys are statistically very far apart in size they'll appear to be in the same range.

 

[MelbourneGirl]

Shannon, do you think you have become fixated on this? It seems to be really bothering you. You know you have a bigger than average dick, as do we LPSG members. Does it matter if she thinks you are average based on her sexual history? Her perception doesn't change the truth.

 

[B_Over_Endowed_EMT]

Seriously is youre that size and she says average shes either messing with you or a bitch (pardon my language). And if shes messing with you that a bitch move too. Dont listen to her and next time she says something tell her shes got a gaping vagina or something. Lol.

 

[ShannonH]

Shannon, do you think you have become fixated on this? It seems to be really bothering you. You know you have a bigger than average dick, as do we LPSG members. Does it matter if she thinks you are average based on her sexual history? Her perception doesn't change the truth.

Oh I know I've become fixated on this. Knowing you're being irrational isn't all it takes to stop being fixated. It's actually helpful to talk about this with people to get it in perspective and understand why I feel the way I do.
Psychological issues are funny that way.. e.g. there's a world full of successful people whose parent's don't approve of them, and they get stuck on that. There are gorgeous women who were called ugly a couple times as a kid and always have hangups about it. Great musicians who are absolutely terrified to play in front of other people. etc. etc. We have emotions that are essential to our survival and well being, but often our rational minds bang up against emotions that we just cannot process properly.
The most irrational part of it all is that she didn't really say anything bad about me. I really do think that average is a good thing, and in any case the woman who said this is probably the least physically-focused person I've ever known. She's been interested in fat, short, bad skin, bald, etc. men - everything men generally believe women are turned off by. It's almost 100% about style, composure and personality with her. Yet I care a lot. Very strange.

 

[bobg4400]

Knowing you're being irrational isn't all it takes to stop being fixated. It's actually helpful to talk about this with people to get it in perspective and understand why I feel the way I do.

Have you talked about it with her?
Since she made the comment only she'll know the reasons behind it better than anyone else.
It seems your problem is more with why she made the comment rather than the comment itself, especially since in all your other posts about penis size you usually give well-informed and thought-out responses.

At least that's what I think. If I've completely misjudged it at all, then feel free to ignore me.:smile:

 

[D_Aberchirder_Crustinuts]

Have you talked about it with her? Since she made the comment only she'll know the reasons behind it better than anyone else.

Yes, but in doing that he will make it very clear that it bothered him, so whatever she does as response may not mean so much to him. I went through the same thing recently after having my (now ex) girlfriend compare me to some amazon guy she briefly dated. After it blew up she started trying to rephrase and explain what she meant by things and I didn't buy any of it.

Shannon seems a good bit less hard headed than me though, so maybe it will work out better. :smile:

Take Care

 

[redbear52]

I think another thing that colors peoples perceptions regarding penis size is that there are some seriously huge "outliers" around. Although statistically rare, they may be up 4 inches or more longer than whatever is average. If you happen to have seen one, then nothing else looks "big" in comparison even if it is at the 90th percentile of size.