GM failure - what does it mean to you?

Rikter8

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just to clear up some things.

Good idea:

"The SSR was the Retro Hot Rod truck priced at $40k. It was a slow performer, both sales and on the street. It cost GM very little to build this. It used the frame and engine from the Trailblazer."

-Agreed, but there was no market for it. Thus, the 365 day inventory sitting in the holding lots.

The Aztek went on record as the UGLIEST vehicle. But it was cheap. And fairly reliabile. People who bought them tended to love them. There is a bit of a cult following.

-It was cheap. That's why people bought those god ugly things. Since when has a 3.1 or 3.4L been reliable?? Unless you replaced the intake and head gaskets right off the bat, they were a joke. Right down to the hollow camshaft. And they followed that 60 Degree V6 configuration for the 3.5 and 3.9L engines. Guess what? Intake manifold issues and head gasket issues on those as well. Why? - Because they did a carryover design using cheap gaskets, and Dexcool to top it off.

Camaro is back for 2010, however priced at $22K, it's higher than the Dodge Challenger in cost, and has so-so looks. Yet another hard sell. Looks are subjective, but generally the looks of Camaro are popular. The base MSRP of the Challenger is $22,945, the base price of the Camaro is $22,245 and the Camaro has better performance for the price.

- The purchase price of a Challenger is around $17K, for the V6. The camaro starts at $22K, that's why I made that comment. Plus...you can test drive a Challenger. As of now, most dealerships won't let you test drive it as it's sitting in the showroom. I agree, per dollar performance is better, but with the market collapsing, who's going to be able to spend the big bucks?

(Also, I've worked on this mongral...and it's going to be a PITA to fix) Dunno how you've worked on a new Camaro unless you work in Oshwa Canada.

- Man, I know your smarter than this one...
The camaro has been at the suppliers and GM's garage for over 8 months. How else do you think we fit this "showpiece" together? Blind?? Cad models only go so far.

There's lots of things that need to be ironed out.
.... Oshawa Canada.


Speaking of SS - Isn't everything Chevy an "SS" now? What a joke. The Cobalt SS was the fastest FWD car around Nurburgring until very recently when it was beaten by 2 tenths of a second by a Renault. The HHR SS has the same 260hp turbo from the Cobalt that you can buy a GM factory chip for that will push it to 290hp and you still keep your warranty. The Impala SS puts down 303hp and 323 ft/lbs of torque at 4000 rpm. 90% of that is available at 1700 rpm. Sounds pretty SS to me.

- Eh. Not SS to me.
Can you give a link to that information? Because based on the forums that I've read, the Cobalt is a turd as far as reliability goes. They fall apart.
And, if your a car guy - how long do you honestly think that little 5 speed trans is going to last behind a motor that torqy?

Likewise with the Impala - they aren't that quick. Off the line theyre not bad, but top end, the govenor kicks in, and kiss your butt goodbye against older cars. The torque steer is stupid under hard acceleration, and that 4T65E is going to get shredded after time of that torque.

Instead they kept buick, which between Caddilac - has no youth appeal. They kept Buick because it has an international appeal that we don't see. The Chinese LOVE Buick. You'll see a major transformation at Buick over the next few years. Buick has a stunning new Lacross coming and a new Regal as well.

- Yes, already have worked on these as well.
They're not that grand, until you start shelling out the big bucks for the top model.


Who the hell can afford a Caddillac, and who would want one? Have you ever tried to get parts for a Caddy? Generally triple the cost. I bought my first new Cadillac CTS when I was 24 years old. Loved every minute of it and it was dead reliable. My black CTS always turns heads. When you turn your car on, does it return the favor?

- The Northstar V8 had a buttload of issues with burning oil. It was generally reliable, but who want's a car that they have to feed a quart or two of oil every week.


Not to debunk your replies, just things that I can say for sure.
 

Drifterwood

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Jason, Suburu also do a legacy estate 4 wheel drive, on the rally chassis with a 3 litre engine. I test drove it about 2 years ago and it was a lot of fun. However I still went for the BMW with a similar performance.

Why doesn't the US seem to have a car brand that captures the spirit of the US? and I mean the good positive things that most of us admire?
 

jason_els

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Jason, Suburu also do a legacy estate 4 wheel drive, on the rally chassis with a 3 litre engine. I test drove it about 2 years ago and it was a lot of fun. However I still went for the BMW with a similar performance.

Why doesn't the US seem to have a car brand that captures the spirit of the US? and I mean the good positive things that most of us admire?

I don't think the 6 is as good as the four. It's less tractable and has a power dip in the mid-band. Now I know Subaru has reworked the engine for the Tribeca crossover, but I haven't driven it. BMW has the finest straight 6 in the business so I'm not surprised you went with that beyond the fact you seem far more the heel-clicking Prussian Mercedes than the large and jolly snow-haired Bavarian BMW.

Do cars reflect the country they're made in? Can we tell anything about a nation's character by the cars it makes? Is there even any way to do that any more?

If you want to know the American romance with the car, then I refer you to the greatest car ad to ever capture it.

I'd say that there's less a car company than a car. If America were a car, it would be a muscle car: simple, cheap, powerful, crude, egalitarian, and outrageously styled. That car would be running through the high desert into the sunset, stereo loud, top down, Wayfarered blond in the passenger seat, drivin' to Vegas baby.... drivin' to Vegas.
 

Drifterwood

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I'm not surprised you went with that beyond the fact you seem far more the heel-clicking Prussian Mercedes than the large and jolly snow-haired Bavarian BMW.

You have to respect the Merc, a friend had an SL500 AMG which was awesome, and I did try the CLK when it first came out, but they leave me cold - no soul. The BM is my sensible car, I have something else for fun, British.
 

Reallyonlyme

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None of my GMs, even the old ones that most people think are unreliable, were traded under 160k miles.

And don't try to tell me that BMWs are super reliable either. They drive well, handle well, and are fast, but their maintenance bills are scary once they are out of warranty.

I think all modern cars with modern electrics can be expensive if you go to a main dealer. Plus of course BMW spares will cost more in the USA just due to shipping costs.
My BMW is 12 years old, I look after it myself, it's approaching 200,000 miles and all I've had to do in the 3 years I have owned it, apart from basic servicing, is a new exhaust, one head lamp and a radiator (head lamp and radiator were damaged by a lump of rock thrown my a road gritter).

Oh, I think it blew a brake light bulb once!