Great British Banking Crisis : The Third Act - Hubris

Discussion in 'Politics' started by gingernuts, Nov 1, 2009.

  1. gingernuts

    gingernuts Member

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    Looks like the British Treasuries attempt to confer some dignity on the banking debacle is going to crash straight into a healthy dose of reality. Putting a straitjacket on a madman unfortunately does not render them sane. BBC NEWS | Business | High Street banks to be broken up

    I have scrimped and saved and suffered the swaggering and flashyness of credit munchers showing off the crap they bought with money borrowed from banks I was saving with.

    Now, when I should be cashing in with high interest rates, the government is ignoring all sensible economic strategy in an attempt to keep the flash harry's afloat.

    Long live the Moronarchy:mad:
     
  2. SpeedoGuy

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    In other words: Too Big To Fail.

    I wouldn't characterize my own efforts at fiscal responsibility as "scrimping" but rather as living always within my means. Nevertheless, it does chap my ass that I'm helping to subsidize those institutions and individuals who didn't.
     
  3. Jason

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    For those who've missed the story the idea is that in the short run the UK will continue to pump billions into parts of the banking system. In the middle term the government plans to sell off the profitable bits of the banks. They say that this will recoup the money that was invested to keep the banks afloat.

    Of course this is sleigh of hand - it won't. The government may be able to buy shares in a failing bank, split the profitable and the toxic bits and sell of the profitable bit to cover its initial investment. Indeed it would be shocking if it couldn't do this. But what the government will be left with is the toxic bit which has zero value and produces substantial costs.

    The banking crisis has hurt Britain. The government is trying to suggest that the worst is over and that there is a rosy future - but I'm far from sure. These toxic assets remain toxic. We have national debt at a level so high that it is quite possible that the bond markets will move against the government. We are still in recession.
     
  4. Drifterwood

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    Unless they have changed the rules again (and that wouldn't surprise me), it is unlikely that the costs of the toxic bits will be as high as the 100% provision that has to be made.

    Sleight of hand or downright lie? Who in their right mind is going to incur debt in investments/new cars/mortgages when we all know that our tax will be going up next year? Increased tax basically increases the real cost of everything, takes away your disposeable income if you re lucky enough to have some, or put you further into debt because you are already fully committed financially.

    This is Brown's catch 22. But don't worry, someone else will pay for it. Oh yes, us who save and create wealth. Silly us.
     
  5. gingernuts

    gingernuts Member

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    I can see a theme emerging here. We are all wondering why behaviour beneficial to our society, (saving, living within your means, not having more children than you can afford), is being punished, while harmful behaviour is going unpunished and even being encouraged.:confused:

    Any thoughts ?
     
  6. Jason

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    How controversial can I be?

    What you call beneficial behaviour is responsible action within a context of individual responsibility. This is action recommended by Christianity and by all the major religions. It is appropriate behviour for individuals, as well as for individuals acting in groups - families, communities, nations.

    What we are seeing from our government is contrary action justified by socialism. Individual responsibility is not supported and in many cases actively penalised. Individuals have a lifetime of unhappy dependence on state benefits, families are fragmented by laws which discourage marriage and the traditional nuclear family, communities have right action and mutual support replaced by a mantra of political correctness while nation states run up debts that will keep their people poor for the working life of everyone reading this board.

    Socialism is the enemy. Labour has broken Britain - as a society through broken families and a greatly increased class divide, financially through the present mess, ethically through an illegal war, and as a nation by the Lisbon betrayal.

    The pity is that while we might just manage a Conservative government after the next election we are probably looking at a hung parliament. And that means more years of muddle. How badly do Labour have to act before the penny drops that voting for them is a wrong act. They follow a failed political philosophy which has brought misery to Britain.
     
  7. Sergeant_Torpedo

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    Good to see honest people voicing their concerns; the BBC and ITV stopped doing that under Blair. I am sure you are good people, but suspect you will all vote for the same old scoundrels you have always been dazzled by. My MP is a thief and a lazy cunt, but I'll bet anyone £1000 she gets re-elected. At least Nellie Gwyne had a heart. This Nellie would fight a crippled woman for 50p.
     
  8. Sergeant_Torpedo

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    Jason: sorry mate but if you are hear to bash socialism under the pretense of informed debate then it isn't working. Brown isn't a socialist, he is what the Europeans call a Christian Liberal (a concept invented by the children of the top Nazis and their sympathizers) socialism was judiciously mudered by the shopkeeper's daughter, and its remains hung from Westminster Bridge by the great golem himself, Blair.
     
  9. Jason

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    Whatever Brown might be I just hope people don't vote for him.
     
  10. Drifterwood

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    People will vote for whoever they think will give them the best deal. Be afraid, very afraid and do the maths.

    The social contract between those who create wealth and tax and those who spend it (misspend it) has been broken.

    I really think that we have got to a point in the UK where the deal isn't worth it.
     
  11. sargon20

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    If it's too big to fail it's too big to exist. Too big to fail means they are now publicly backed enterprises which are not supposed to exist in a capitalist system.

    Paul Volker is absolutely right. They need to be broken up. NOW!
     
  12. gingernuts

    gingernuts Member

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    Sad but true, the state aid to banks amounts to protectionism. If Coal, Steel and Shipbuilding didn't merit protection, then neither can banks.

    I feel like there is a hole in the roof, and rather than try to fix the hole the governments are buying new carpets and furniture which is doomed to be ruined.
     
  13. Drifterwood

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    Basically there is short, medium and long term debt. The banks forgot this or rather mismanaged it. Sadly, we have had to come in and sort out the mess, though I see no reason why we can't use the old fashioned principles on the Banks themselves. That is, make them pay for the fuck up eventually. They will make the profits in the future and so we should not need to have to pay for it long term.

    Brown is very good at getting things off balance sheet so that everything looks rosy.
     
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