have the fucking kid and then tidy your damn room

[Nienna]

Stats on teen pregnancy

As for the "fundie" thing, you post pictures like the ones above, PARTICULARLY without a warning stating that this is NOT where you got your information but is a new direction you are taking in your argument, people around here are going to scream "Fundie"; I don't know what it's like up in Canada but around here I'm getting sick of seeing pictures like that on my way to work and there is only so much satisfaction that can be derived from hitting the nutjobs with the posters with lit cirgarrette butts. Really, am I suppossed to be that shocked that a developing human has features that actually might appear human? News flash! a human embryo doesn't look like a chicken!

[post=307634]Quoted post[/post]​

I don't what its like where you live, but here, we don't have pictures like that posted all over town. Infact the only places you will see them is in Sex ed class, medical books, pro life clinics, or if you specifically look for them on the net. I already said what I was trying to show with those pictures. As For the "fundie" thing, that must be an american thing, because after talking about this with friends of mine, none of us ever hear people call people fundies.

And you know what, some people are shocked that a devoloping embryo looks as human as it does at such early gestation. Some people just don't take the time to learn or just don't give a shit. Sometimes they "hear" it, but until they actually see it, it doesn't quite seem as important.

 

[madame_zora]

Nienna, first off, I do apologise for calling you a fundie. I didn't know your affiliation and was making an assumption based on what I perceived, which turned out to be wrong, so I am sorry for that.

I think CarolinaCurious might have come closer to what our communication problem is- here in the states, many of us feel our personal freedoms are being attacked on many fronts, not just this one. Our backs are up. I can't take one more personal infringement on my individual freedoms. Gays, minorities and women are being stripped of their rights from everything from voting, to banning marriage, to the pharmacy debacle. Wehn someone starts posting about how abortion is only for the lazy and careless I get offended. There's so much more to the issue than that and I feel that attitude is reductionsist at best.

Our healthcare system can use a good poking at, no hard feeling there. One of the greatest problems we Americans have is that anywhere from 40 to 60% of us (depending on whose stats you read) have no coverage at all. You can assume that the vast majority of women who choose abortion would fall into this group. We live in a society with very little heart for women, so it's hard for me to understand a woman taking the side of no choice. I know you don't see your position as such, but I still do. Not meaning to offend you, I'm sure your reasons are based on your own experience, but I really do have a part time hobby of fucking with the fundie abortion clinic picketers with their signs of chopped up fetuses and messages of hatred. It's not like anyone doesn't know what their alternatives are, or that the choices they make are found lightly. When I said "stay the fuck out of it" I meant there should always be safe legal abortions for those who decide it's best for them. Anyone who doesn't think abortion is right should never do it, but that should NEVER limit anyone else's decision. If you prefer to think less of women who make this choice and put them down, don't be surprised if that position ruffles feathers. I have nothing personally against you, but I do vehemently object to your position on this issue.

 

[Nienna]

I don't have anything against women who get abortions. It does, to me, seem sad that they feel that is thier only choice.

What I do hold against some women is the fact they are useing it as birth control, I know one girl who has had three abortions just because she doesn't want to raise another child (she has one). To me, if you know you don't want anymore kids ( and she didn't even want the first one but kept it) you should take precautions BEFOREHAND. I find it extremely disgusting that one person would continuously have repeated abortions merely because she's to stupid or lazy to take a pill or use other precautions, hell get your tubes tied if you know you don't want kids. I know I don't want anymore kids. My husband offered to get fixed, and if that fails, then we are fully prepared to raise another one. But I will get my tubes tied if that happens and he will revisit Dr.Snips.

I strongly disagree with the nutjob fanatics who stand outside aborion clinics and get all crazy. I think they are hypocrites and ignorants when they kill abortion doctors or bomb abortion clinics etc.... Have fun, throw a tomato at one for me (or a cigarette butt)

I do still wish that there would be more education for youth, not only on pregnancy but on every other aspect of sex, emotional, psychological, sexual health care etc......

AS for the state of your country......All I will say, is I am glad I'm a Canadian. I hope that your next president does a better job.

 

[madame_zora]

I hope so too, and thanks for that.

I wish we had better education on sex and birth control too, we did in the 70's when I was in school. Now it's "Just Say No". Our children can hardly be held responsible for the adults being too prudish and uptight to educate them properly! I hate this administration, our poor children are damned if they do and damned if they don't. The fundamentalists are affecting every aspect of our lives, no wonder teen preganacies have gone up. We aren't talking about these things with our kids, then dumping on them when the worst happens.

We were originally talking about one little girl, but I also dislike abortion being used as birth control. Sometimes birth control products fail and people who didn't want to have children still don't if pregancy occurs. I want them to be free to choose. I wish people didn't have abortions frivolously, but I want to keep it safe for those who need it. Mostly, I want my goverment out of my life. We are probably not that far apart, I would think.

 

[jonb]

Originally posted by DoubleMeatWhopper@May 3 2005, 11:40 AM
I think I have the perfect solution: we should just stone the little slut.

[post=307548]Quoted post[/post]​

I can tell you're being sarcastic, but I'll reiterate, it's easy for you to be pro-life, seeing as you'll never have that little "accident". I mean, when a gay guy's condom breaks, it means going in for emergency PEP.

Nah, the government got her into this mess. We should stone the Bush family. (Remember all the Biblical remedies involving stoning the whole family?)

 

[Freddie53]

For the record, the words Fundie and Christian were interchanged a few times in preceding discussions. The United Methodist Church, the third largest Christian denomination in the United States, is officially pro-choice. And the UMC has gotten a lot of flak from the fundie's for our position.

The Methodist Church's position is that abortion should not be used primarily as a birth control method. But there are situations where it is best. The minister, woman and/family in consultation with the doctor prayfully consider what is best.

That makes the United Methodist Church neither pro abortion or against abortion. The church is pro choice. There is a very distinct difference in the three positions. Ulitmately it is the decision of the mother or in some states the guaradian of a minor or a mentally incompetent woman.

I've said it before and I will say it again. When it comes down to the wire for a who can make a decision whether or not to have an abortion, "outsiders" need to butt out. "Outsiders" include the government and yes the church if it is trying to manipulate the situation. Also, friends, distant family and so on and so forth. It is an ordeal for the girl or lady. The whole issue doesn''t need a microscope and telescope on it from people from a far.

And this comes from a very devout Christian who takes the love and what is best for others seriously. It is a shame that the "fundie's" don't do that. I will give the Catholic Church credit. They are against abortion, but they will take the child and raise it someway. They seem to do much more in providing help for the women who choose to carry the baby then the "fundies" do. And they are consistent. Catholics always come down on the side of life as they interpret it to be. Fundie's are not consistent at all.

 

[jonb]

Yeah, well, AFAIAC, 90% of fundie ministers are looking for a buck and the other 10% are schizos who think that voice in their head is God.

 

[madame_zora]

My honest opinion of their movement is that a few of the ministers are corrupt individuals who have learned that fueling these issues is very profitable, but many of them are actually "true believers" who are just detatched from reality. The second group is far scarier than the first, at least greed is a motive I can understand.

 

[jonb]

Oh, so 10% of them are in it to make money and 90% need some more thorazine.

 

[steve319]

Originally posted by jonb@May 4 2005, 01:35 AM
We should stone the Bush family. (Remember all the Biblical remedies involving stoning the whole family?)

[post=307761]Quoted post[/post]​

Make an event of it. Sell tickets, with proceeds to support Planned Parenthood, perhaps? :evilgrin:

 

[madame_zora]

Originally posted by jonb@May 4 2005, 02:20 PM
Oh, so 10% of them are in it to make money and 90% need some more thorazine.

[post=307838]Quoted post[/post]​

I hear lobotomies calm one down significantly as well.