Help needed with HIV Question

TomCat84

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Posts
3,414
Media
4
Likes
173
Points
148
Location
London (Greater London, England)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
What part of GAYDOC did you not understand????

We know how the younger guys with HIV are going to turn out - dead - that's how they are going to turn out, much quicker than if they did not have HIV. I'm so glad you work in an HIV clinic and see everything that goes on. I'm so glad you see teenagers with chronic diarrhoea and other illnesses, I'm so glad you see the 20-30 year olds and older not able to leave their homes without incontinence pads. I'm so glad you see people with HIV vomiting because the anti-emetics aren't working, I'm so glad you fully understand how totally toxic the drugs are that people with HIV have to take to have a relatively stable life

I'm really pleased that you know so much more than GAYDOC. The clue is in the title

You're sounding like that South African country president (name escapes me) who believed you can cure HV by having sex with a virgin baby. FYI that is mumbo jumbo - you cannot beat HIV that way.

Yes diet and exercise help, but they don't make for utopia. You are being naive in the extreme.

I think it would be very interesting to read what the HIV+ people have to say about the drugs they have to take and side effects

Brinz

Lose the dripping sarcasm, fuckwad. I didn't dispute ANYTHING (ANYTHING) he said- I asserted he ommitted information- like, they don't know what the NEW drugs will do. You're an absolute MORON who didn't pay attention to the fact that I HAVE BEEN HIV POSITIVE FOR OVER FIVE YEARS. I AM ON ATRIPLA. I know what it's like to ACTUALLY HAVE HIV! You have taken what I said, and thrown back at me red herrings, straw mans, and literally new words that I did NOT say. I'm so glad that you're attacking a person for actually speaking from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. :rolleyes:
 

TomCat84

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Posts
3,414
Media
4
Likes
173
Points
148
Location
London (Greater London, England)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
What part of GAYDOC did you not understand????

We know how the younger guys with HIV are going to turn out - dead - that's how they are going to turn out, much quicker than if they did not have HIV. I'm so glad you work in an HIV clinic and see everything that goes on. I'm so glad you see teenagers with chronic diarrhoea and other illnesses, I'm so glad you see the 20-30 year olds and older not able to leave their homes without incontinence pads. I'm so glad you see people with HIV vomiting because the anti-emetics aren't working, I'm so glad you fully understand how totally toxic the drugs are that people with HIV have to take to have a relatively stable life

I'm really pleased that you know so much more than GAYDOC. The clue is in the title

You're sounding like that South African country president (name escapes me) who believed you can cure HV by having sex with a virgin baby. FYI that is mumbo jumbo - you cannot beat HIV that way.

Yes diet and exercise help, but they don't make for utopia. You are being naive in the extreme.

I think it would be very interesting to read what the HIV+ people have to say about the drugs they have to take and side effects

Brinz

You DON'T know that young guys will die much more quickly than if they didn't get HIV. If they have access to the latest treatments- and take care of themselves, they very well may lead normal life spans. To take what I said, and spin and twist it into saying it's like I said that having sex with a virgin baby will cure you of HIV is RIDICULOUS, and you should be fucking ashamed of yourself.:mad:
 

TomCat84

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Posts
3,414
Media
4
Likes
173
Points
148
Location
London (Greater London, England)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
What part of GAYDOC did you not understand????

We know how the younger guys with HIV are going to turn out - dead - that's how they are going to turn out, much quicker than if they did not have HIV. I'm so glad you work in an HIV clinic and see everything that goes on. I'm so glad you see teenagers with chronic diarrhoea and other illnesses, I'm so glad you see the 20-30 year olds and older not able to leave their homes without incontinence pads. I'm so glad you see people with HIV vomiting because the anti-emetics aren't working, I'm so glad you fully understand how totally toxic the drugs are that people with HIV have to take to have a relatively stable life

I'm really pleased that you know so much more than GAYDOC. The clue is in the title

You're sounding like that South African country president (name escapes me) who believed you can cure HV by having sex with a virgin baby. FYI that is mumbo jumbo - you cannot beat HIV that way.

Yes diet and exercise help, but they don't make for utopia. You are being naive in the extreme.

I think it would be very interesting to read what the HIV+ people have to say about the drugs they have to take and side effects

Brinz

Unless you have HIV yourself, you do NOT know what it's like to live with HIV. You just do not know. Even if you were he most notable HIV researcher on the planet, you really DON'T know what it's like.
 

D_5tyujik

Just Browsing
Joined
Jul 29, 2010
Posts
9
Media
0
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Pennsylvania
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Female
As a medical student and researcher I would strongly advise you not to have sex with this indivdual. You my friend are flirting with fire. It just takes once for you to become infected. A sore in your mouth or a simple break of the condom could result in you becoming infected. I agree with GayDoc 100% on his medical advise. If anything listen to him, for he is a physician. Hey, I'm still in training, lol.

Also it an excellent idea to be tested before any type of sex, whether it be homosexual or heterosexual. I would tell anyone to get tested together so you can see the proof on paper. Even woman have AIDS/HIV and hep C.

I think your walking a very fine line here. Why risk your entire life for a few nights in bed? There are more fish in the sea. Lets face it, in a year you will find someone new. Thats life, relationships never last forever anymore. Lets make it known that AIDS is a death sentence. It will eventually kill you. It is not something you live with and will die of natual causes such as MS or high blood pressure.

Good luck!
 
Last edited:

D_5tyujik

Just Browsing
Joined
Jul 29, 2010
Posts
9
Media
0
Likes
0
Points
36
Location
Pennsylvania
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Female
According to the National Institue of Health the average age of male death with HIV is 37.5 years.


In lecture last week discussing the geriatric population the professor said the normal age of death for males is 78-82 years.


Many other nasty problems come along with AIDS such as Pneumocystis jirovecii, TB, and Karposi's sarcoma. Just google them!

Many of these posts are correct there are different types of AIDS. Some mutate quickly some do not. Some people live longer than others. There has been cases of people dying a year after testing positive, despite best medical treatments!!!!!!
 

Bbucko

Cherished Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Posts
7,232
Media
8
Likes
325
Points
208
Location
Sunny SoFla
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
Of course it was frank, but it was overly pessimistic. The truth is we really have no idea how the new drugs will affect someone long term.

<big sigh>

The reason why I no longer post at AIDSmeds is because two of my favorite people in the universe were banned after heated confrontations with n00bs on this very same topic: they took the bait and flamed themselves right off the board. Their eventual re-admission (after more than a year) didn't sweeten the ashes I felt in my mouth for the way that site is managed and moderated. One has since died.

I was honestly thinking precisely of you when I posted the response you quoted. There is no right answer to this dilemma, TC. I really really get why you feel that Gaydoc's post was overly pessimistic. If I were in your position I'd feel exactly the same way: when I first began treatment in I felt that way myself. My now-ex (whom I infected via a broken condom) and I attended support groups in Boston and Connecticut where this issue came up constantly. It divides the HIV community now just like it has since the introduction of PIs in 96.

The meds effect everyone differently, but eventually they fail either through viral mutation, lack of strict compliance or sheer toxicity. I took AZT, DDI and Zerit for years and have the facial wasting to prove it. In my first three weeks on Kaletra, my cholesterol went from 150 to 525; I was given the choice of discontinuing using it or making astonishingly brutal changes in my diet. On the counsel of my doctor (whom I adored), I chose the latter, and in the process lost almost 40 pounds. This gave me back the body I had when I was 21 (yay!) but it took years to get my cholesterol and triglyceride levels back to normal and resulted in permanent arterial damage that cannot be undone.

Gaydoc was also correct in pointing out something I've known to be obvious for years: the meds suppress the virus in the blood but not the lymphatic system nor the central nervous system (with a few and very limited exceptions). Undetectable doesn't mean that the virus isn't present, it just means that its presence in your blood is too small to be measured. I remember when undetectable meant fewer than 100, when the refined the test to its current level, I crossed back over to detectable levels (usually anywhere from ~50 up) and burned my way through an entire class of meds trying to achieve that illusive and magical undetectable level again.

I sincerely and honestly hope that your experience will somehow be different, and I truly understand why you've taken the steps you have to maintain both your health and state of mind. If only as a placebo, they help you if you honestly believe that they do. This issue is much like what's referred to as "immaculate infections", where the person with HIV insists that s/he always practiced safer-sex precautions and still somehow became infected anyway: there is no win/win way to discuss this, but it needs to be addressed.
 

OCMuscleJock

Superior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Posts
3,187
Media
88
Likes
3,080
Points
198
Location
San Luis Obispo, CA
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
Well...I have to agree with TomCat on this posting. He didn't disagree with the Doc..but more the gloom and doom approach to his post. As a physician, you should know that everyone will respond differently to treatment and different drugs. Also, as TC84 stated, how you live daily will have a tremendous effect on how much well you respond to the treatments.

OP...I would definitely say, let your heart decide. If you like this guy, do not let fear of the unknown lessen your chance to have a happy/healthy relationship with this man.

**for the record...I'm neg, and been in a happy healthy serodiscordant relationship for almost 13 yrs. *not that he likes me to talk about it, for fear of reactions from other people* Also, he's the first and only man I've had a relationship with. He has been "Undetectable" for as long as I've known him and his meds are a daily routine."

One of my clients is a infectious diseases Dr. and he has a TOTALLY different view than the "Doc". Being that it's my client's specialty and the fact he worked for years with HIV patients,hands on and now does only research. I tend to believe him and his views more. Irregardless, of the doom and gloom aspect of other peoples views, I'm not regretful of the choice I have made for my relationship and most people I know WISH they had as good of a relationship that will last as long as ours has so far.
 

Bbucko

Cherished Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Posts
7,232
Media
8
Likes
325
Points
208
Location
Sunny SoFla
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
Many of these posts are correct there are different types of AIDS. Some mutate quickly some do not. Some people live longer than others. There has been cases of people dying a year after testing positive, despite best medical treatments!!!!!!

I sincerely hope you learn a lot more before you begin practicing on real people, rr.

There are different strains of the virus, sure, but what's up with "different types of AIDS"? Seriously? You're a medical student and you wrote that?

AIDS is a condition, not a disease in and of itself. People don't "die of AIDS", they die from complications arising from opportunistic infections once their immune system is completely shot: there are many different types of these infections, ranging from KS (which is a type of cancer) to virulent types of pneumonia and beyond.

Oh, and awesome post, OC :wink:
 

ManchesterTom

Legendary Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Posts
985
Media
31
Likes
1,489
Points
423
Verification
View
Sexuality
80% Straight, 20% Gay
Gender
Male
What part of GAYDOC did you not understand????

You're sounding like that South African country president (name escapes me) who believed you can cure HV by having sex with a virgin baby. FYI that is mumbo jumbo - you cannot beat HIV that way.
Brinz

Being a South African of birth, but with a European cultural influence / mindset, those of us with 1st world education were totally horrified by the ex-president Thabo Mbheki's stance on HIV. Firstly, he did not ever say that having sex with a baby / virgin would cure AIDS - Those rumours and lies were spread by the witch-doctors. The same voices were spreading rumours that the white population had invented Aids to infect blacks, and that this was done by the Apartheid white government prior to 1994. What Mr Mbheki and his health department said was that HIV and AIDS have no proven connection, and that eating foods such as beetroot would keep the immune system up. Mbheki was replaced by Jacob Zuma - who appears to be taking the aids pandemic seriously. HIV currently affects around 40% of the indigenous population in certain regions. President Zuma was up on a rape charge before he became president, and reportedly prevented himself from contracting HIV by taking a shower. Inspite of President Zuma receiving a lot of bad press and allegations of corruption, he actually seems to have the balls to take a stand against ridiculous odds. During his 1st December 2009 AIDS day speech, Zuma announced his "free" anti retro viral treatment for pregnant women and people with low CD4 counts. He also came out against promiscuity, (and then polygamously married 5 wives - but that's another story.) Circumcision clinics have been set up in 100s of centres (centers for the American spellers) around the country. It has apparently been proven without a doubt that male contraction of AIDS can be lessened if the male is circumcised. It is thought that the virus can be kept alive longer under the foreskin than if it is exposed to air. Please don't shoot me, I'm only the piano player! Correcting a small comment regarding the previous president and reporting back as to what is happening on our side of the ball.
 

Bbucko

Cherished Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Posts
7,232
Media
8
Likes
325
Points
208
Location
Sunny SoFla
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
Circumcision clinics have been set up in 100s of centres (centers for the American spellers) around the country. It has apparently been proven without a doubt that male contraction of AIDS can be lessened if the male is circumcised. It is thought that the virus can be kept alive longer under the foreskin than if it is exposed to air. Please don't shoot me, I'm only the piano player! Correcting a small comment regarding the previous president and reporting back as to what is happening on our side of the ball.

The circumcision question has not been "proven without a doubt": it is, in fact, a snake-oil approach. In the US, where the vast majority of men are circumcised, tops and straight men get infected every day. It's not as easy for this type of transmission to take place, but it happens.

The only proven way of preventing the spread of HIV is either abstinence or the proper use of a condom (which are now available in a female variety). Circumcision is not the answer; it may slow infection rates slightly but will not eliminate them.
 

Jay1074

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2007
Posts
374
Media
2
Likes
125
Points
113
Location
A Very Warm Handbasket
Sexuality
50% Straight, 50% Gay
Gender
Male
Gaydoc was not being pessimistic but rather very matter of fact. He logically pointed out the consequences of engaging in risky sex and even gave some good examples of them. He was correct in describing the differences in treatment and how results can vary from person to person. This is the exact kind of thing a doctor should do. He wasn't knocking or promoting anything that I could see. Just laying out the facts to help the OP make an informed decision.

That said, I really do empathize with TomCat's need for optimism. We all know keeping a positive and hopeful attitude can really benefit your overall health and well being when dealing with HIV. BUT... at the same time, he probably ought not to base his hopes and optimism in hypotheticals. True, many better treatments, vaccines, and maybe someday a cure for HIV are on their way but you have to live in the now and realize that current situations are what they are. That might sound cruel or insensitive but believe me I'm not trying to be and I don't believe gaydoc was either.

As for the OP's original question, I really have to say go with your heart, buddy. Don't let something that can be manageable with the right precautions kill any chance for love to blossom. There are lots of thing you both can do that can drastically reduce the risk of transmission and still have a very hot and healthy sexlife together. The main thing to always remember is to be careful with one another and don't engage in rough or unsafe sex and keep good oral hygiene. It sounds like alot but how much would you do for the person you love? I know it would all be worth the effort for someone I love.
 

Randyvoorburg

Sexy Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Posts
473
Media
17
Likes
65
Points
248
Sexuality
60% Gay, 40% Straight
Gender
Male
It's been mentioned that even tops get infected, I think it should be mentioned too that even precum has concentrations of the virus. I know of people who bareback as long as nobody cums inside anybody thinking that precum doesn't contain the virus.
 

Bbucko

Cherished Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Posts
7,232
Media
8
Likes
325
Points
208
Location
Sunny SoFla
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
It's been mentioned that even tops get infected, I think it should be mentioned too that even precum has concentrations of the virus. I know of people who bareback as long as nobody cums inside anybody thinking that precum doesn't contain the virus.

They're idiots.
 

B_TonyK8483

Experimental Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2010
Posts
107
Media
0
Likes
9
Points
53
Location
DuPage, Illinois
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
Hey, I think if your lover has HIV and you're not infected, you shouldn't have sex with them! You can be friends, sure, but why risk getting a fatal disease?
 
Last edited:

OCMuscleJock

Superior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Posts
3,187
Media
88
Likes
3,080
Points
198
Location
San Luis Obispo, CA
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
Hey, I think if your lover has HIV and you're not infected, you shouldn't have sex with them! You can be friends, sure, but why risk getting a fatal disease?

you're an idiot. sorry...but if you play safe...then you are fine. You run just as much risk having any kind of sex with anyone else when you are safe. Read a book!
 

TomCat84

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Posts
3,414
Media
4
Likes
173
Points
148
Location
London (Greater London, England)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
According to the National Institue of Health the average age of male death with HIV is 37.5 years.


In lecture last week discussing the geriatric population the professor said the normal age of death for males is 78-82 years.


Many other nasty problems come along with AIDS such as Pneumocystis jirovecii, TB, and Karposi's sarcoma. Just google them!

Many of these posts are correct there are different types of AIDS. Some mutate quickly some do not. Some people live longer than others. There has been cases of people dying a year after testing positive, despite best medical treatments!!!!!!

Also, youre confusing AIDS and HIV. There are many types of HIV, but only one type of AIDS. AIDS is when your T Cells drop below a certain level. HIV is the virus itself.
 

TomCat84

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Posts
3,414
Media
4
Likes
173
Points
148
Location
London (Greater London, England)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
Look folks, I wasnt saying you need to be optimistic (though you do if youre poz). I'm saying for those HIV+ folks who take care of themselves and have access to meds and doctors (like me) , the life expectancy is pretty much normal. In fact, I'll live longer than most overweight neg folks that I see. I'm healthier and in better shape than the vast majority of people- on this board even. My ONLY point is that the Doc was not ONE HUNDRED PERCENT honest. He gave VERY good information, but it was not complete. I will not necessarily start looking like Tom Hanks in Philadelphia.

Recent research has suggested that an HIV+ bottom who is undetectable is pretty safe to have sex with....and read my lips- the CDC has not recorded ONE case...NOT ONE case where someone has 100% definitely contracted HIV from oral sex- receptive or otherwise. Does that mean it hasn't happened? No, of course not- but if someone has told you they definitely have- thats bullshit.