Hillary making a second attempt?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by TinyPrincess, Jun 9, 2008.

  1. TinyPrincess

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    I might have been paying too little attention to Hillarys concession speech. It only occured to me right now, that she actually didn't drop out - she just suspended her campaign. :confused:

    By suspending her campaign instead of dropping out, she technically remains a candidate :eek:, entitled to keep statewide pledged delegates and district-level delegates. Hillarys site now asks her supporters to get behind Obama, but if you sign up or donate... Guess what... The contribution still goes to her campaign. :eek::rolleyes::cool:

    Now - imagine a scenario, where Obama mess up, who will be standing behind him waiting... Hillary - technically still a candidate. History have taught us never to underestimate a Clinton - she might have made a concession speech, but if they can find anything on Obama or he makes a mistake, she can be right back in the game... (Oh, no...:eek:)
     
    #1 TinyPrincess, Jun 9, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
  2. HyperHulk

    HyperHulk New Member

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    Her campaign is 30 million in the hole. She needs all the money she can get to pay down the debt. Romney suspended his campaign as well. It's a technicality. Relax.
     
  3. TinyPrincess

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    I should - but I can't with Hillary...
     
  4. Industrialsize

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    Suspension is a technical term. When a candidate "suspends" they can continue to raise money to retire campaign debt, which for Hillary is quite alot. Once Obama is officially nominated, Hillary can no longer raise money to retire her primary campaign debt and anyone who donated for her general election fund will be entitled to a refund.
     
  5. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    Besides, the chances of Hillary getting the Democratic nomination now is impossible. Obama has the delegates needed and it would look very foolish for the DNC and Clinton if she took back her concession speech and tried to get the nomination again. The only other way she could technically run is as an independent, which also makes no sense because then she's labeled as the Ralph Nader of this election. It would be political suicide for Clinton to do any of these things and she knows it.
     
  6. Trinity

    Trinity New Member

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    Actually your post is right on target. If there had been an offer to pay off debts or for the VP slot or for any other status in the campaign/at the Convention or any other agreement that was agreeable perhaps she would have closed out the campaign.

    Without that why would she? She can still get donations to pay off the debt and stay in the race until the end.

    Barring some major scandal, Obama will be nominated at the Democratic Convention. But if the Republicans open up a can of whoop ass on him...you never know what could happen. Decorated American War Hero Senator John Kerry was swiftboated... it is not beyond reason and Obama only received half of the votes in the Democratic Primary. He has no mandate. If something comes out that causes Obama to slip then the convention will be very interesting.
     
  7. Industrialsize

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    Trinity, are you HOPING WISHING and WANTING a "major scandal" to befall Obama??(that would be very sad)......I guess you didn't hear your candidate's very gracious concession speech where she said,""I am standing with Barack Obama to say, `Yes, we can!'" Hillary Clinton 6/7/08"..
     
  8. Trinity

    Trinity New Member

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    Oh, I forgot to say...I don't believe she is "making a second attempt." She is taking the next step in the process. Hillary Clinton is being smart and wise and doing what most candidates do...only she is not being given the same respect. When she did not give a concession speech when Obama crossed the threshold it was viewed differently from other male candidates running for president. There have been many instances including Ted Kennedy who took it to the convention and he didn't have half the votes in the Primary.
     
  9. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    It's pointless P. In Trinity's view, any time a male opposes or criticizes Clinton it's because he's sexist (as she implied in her post). Methinks it is a sad case of the pot calling the kettle black.
     
  10. Trinity

    Trinity New Member

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    That is one of the most ridiculous things you've posted. You obviously don't know "my view," so I will thank you for not attempting to state "my view." I have never said or implied that anytime a male opposes or criticizes Hillary Clinton it is because of sexism and that blanket statement was certainly not implied in my post.

    There has been quite alot of gender bias going on and unfair expectations placed on Sen. Clinton that were not placed on other male candidates. That can indeed be seen as sexism. When I called you out for your sexist post...it was just that. Deal with it. Not everyone, but you. To suggest that Obama got his senate seat because he was qualified but Hillary Clinton got her senate seat through her husband was sexist. As I stated before Political Experience can be gained through ways other than elected office as you ridiculously suggested. Not every First Lady has the experience of Hillary Clinton but if the spouse of the President uses 8 years and an executive office well, that honorary position can garner valuable political experience as it did for Sen. Clinton. Her experience on the domestic issue of Health Care is unmatched. Her experience with a number of domestic and foreign issues (S-Chip, NAFTA) by virtue of being involved in the strategy and policy sessions is certainly not matched by the likes of Obama.

    Chris Matthews has been guilty of spreading the same sort of vile sexist comments and had to apologize for it! Politico

    No, not every criticism or opposition to Hillary Clinton is sexist. But please do not assert that every criticism of Hillary Clinton and opposition to Hillary Clinton is without sexism either.
     
  11. faceking

    faceking Well-Known Member

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    she should run as an independent.
     
  12. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    You're lying. I never suggested Obama got his senate seat because he was qualified. As I pointed out, just about everyone in the field of candidates was better qualified only if one were using length of time in public office as a criteria, and that Clinton and Obama were the two least qualified people in the field by that measure.

    I did point out Hillary got her senate seat simply by being first lady and I stand by that comment. She was a partner in an Arkansas law firm. Please explain to me how, if she had not been first lady, a partner in an Arkansas law firm could come to be a senator from New York? The fact is she used her position as first lady to travel New York on an absurdly named, "listening tour," to see if she had a chance at running for office in the state. How many people would have attended a, "listening tour," by a mere law firm partner from Arkansas?

    She used her position, clear and simple, as a springboard to another springboard to another springboard to gain the White House. Had she remained Hillary Rodham, partner at law at Rose Law of Little Rock, she couldn't even get a parking ticket fixed in New York. To deny this requires either incredible naivete or the intent to deceive outright.

    Had Bill Clinton been first husband and did the same thing, I'd say the same of him.

    You just repeat the same tired, "qualifications," equating having an office in an executive building with having executive responsibilities when she had NO constitutional responsibilities at all, not a single one. You continually state she gained, "valuable political experience," yet fail to cite any example of just what those experiences were. Could they consist of travelgate? Monica Lewinsky? Universal Health Care? Entertaining spouses of foreign dignitaries? Hosting the White House Easter Egg Roll? What experience she gained from that time was not spent as a public official either elected or appointed. She had no responsibilities, no one to answer to. She didn't write, vote, or have anything to do with NAFTA, health care, or the S-chip. She was no more informed than any number of people sitting in the rooms unless you can explain why and how she would have been, "involved," in any of these cases beyond just sitting on her ass smiling benignly. Of course, if she really did have anything to do besides that then what the hell was she doing there? As someone unelected and unappointed it would be wholly unethical for her to have anything to do with them.

    I can't believe you can actually post, in all apparent seriousness, that, "Her experience on the domestic issue of Health Care is unmatched." She's not a public health administrator, not an insurance company CEO, not a doctor, not even an EMT. She has headed no department, worked in no department, not even swept the floors of a public health agency! She has precisely ZERO experience in the field short of a disasterous aborted attempt during the first Clinton administration when she held closed-door meetings and refused to disclose the list of people involved in her task force.

    And yes, you did imply sexism, by citing the sex of other candidates who did not make concession speeches:

    Had you not meant to imply it then you wouldn't have made the distinction of the other candidates' sex.

    I am, happily, not Chris Matthews, and I will not apologize.
     
  13. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    She'll never do it. She ain't THAT stupid.
     
  14. Shelby

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    Damn Trinity, 5 days no word. I was starting to worry.

    Anyway, good to have you back.
     
  15. Trinity

    Trinity New Member

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    Your initial post was about Hillary Clinton and her candidacy for President. It did not mention what you state above that both Clinton and Obama were least qualified in the field by length of public office. It did however suggest that holding public office was a criteria to be President and it also suggested that Hillary Clinton not even completing two terms made her further unqualified.

    "Prior to her seating in the Senate, she had no experience as an elected official. Now, after less than two terms in the senate, she wants to be president. Many people think she hasn't earned a thing on her own; that she has relied on her husband and his political clout to get where she is. She appears to be less of a senator and more of a brand of odious-smelling cleaning fluid." Jason_els


    Nope. That's not what you stated. You were stating that Hillary Clinton was unqualified to get her senate seat and as a Presidential Candidate and that she has only gotten as far as she has by her husband's political clout. You are now trying to say it in a different way, but knowing what you initially stated, both statements are sexist. Read what you stated in blue again.
    &#8220;So I get it. On the particular point: if I&#8217;d said that the only reason John McCain has come so far is that he got shot down over North Vietnam and captured by the enemy, I&#8217;d be brutally ignoring the courage and guts he showed in bearing up under his captivity. Saying Sen. Clinton got where she&#8217;s got simply because her husband did what he did to her is just as callous, and I can see now, came across just as nasty, worse yet just as dismissive..." Chris Matthews
    I can list vast information for you to read on Sen. Clinton's involvement in all types of issues as First Lady and during her first term and current term as a U.S. Senator but what good would it do? I've been posting it for months. I have posted articles and statements from officials but what does it prove to you? I've already proved by factcheck Hillary Clinton's involvement and credit for S-Chip and Family Leave Act. In this post

    The last part of your post in bold is the part that I want to address. Karl Rove was an advisor. All a person has to do is be appointed by the President to advise on policy and issues. Hillary Clinton was that from day one whether her title was first lady or Domestic/Foreign Policy Advisor to the President.

    First Lady Hillary Clinton gets Policy Job and New Office - New York Times

    Her experience in working on Universal Health Care was unmatched by her opponents in the race for President. The next president is going to need her expertise to achieve universal health care period.

    My comment did not imply a blanket statement that every criticism of Hillary Clinton is sexist. There have been several instances of gender bias in this race to discuss and the recent controversy over if, when, and how Hillary made a concession speech definitely ranked up there on the sexism meter. That does not state nor imply a blanket statement on every criticism of Senator Clinton.
     
    #15 Trinity, Jun 9, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2008
  16. ZOS23xy

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    Hillary will announce her run for the presidency around Nov 10th, for 2012.

    I will ignore it.
     
  17. rawbone8

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    fixed that for ya.

    It's not going to happen, and she'll help the Dems take the White House, and there's a good chance they will make gains and dominate both the Senate and House of Representatives. Deal with it.
     
  18. D_Gunther Snotpole

    D_Gunther Snotpole Account Disabled

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    My money's on all three.
    I think McCain's looking washed out.
    And the tide's going out for the Republicans.
     
  19. transformer_99

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    Wouldn't that be something, she'd effectively leave the Democratic party, put herself at risk for that. She'd ensure that the Democratic party would be fragmented. In essence those delegates and super delegates that deserted her would be screwed over. This has legs, let's see how far it can go ? Just the threat of it, might be enough to get her on the ticket as VP ?
     
  20. TinyPrincess

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    Now that would be fun - McCain would win, but it would make a nice mess - could be fun...
     
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