I'm still waiting for the Romans to apologize for what they did to my people back in 58 B.C.
House wants to apologize for slavery, how much do u know?
- Thread starter marleyisalegend
- Start date
I never said that and don't attribute that to me. He has the freedom to say what he said but he paid for it.
Al Sharpton lost a lot of his credibility a long time ago. Jesse has lost a lot of people's respect. Being in the limelight is a thrill for them. Their time there is fading. Al Sharpton has criticized Jesse Jackson before and claimed Martin Luther King said he was mainly involved in the Civil Rights movement to get glory for himself. How do people expect situations to improve, and our nation to advance if they don't stop all the infighting and back stabbing?
DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE REFERRING TO THE POST ABOVE YOU. IF YOU ARE, YOU COMPARE A LACK OF CREDIBILITY TO A PUBLIC LYNCHING AND AN ATTEMPTED PUBLIC LYNCHING A SECOND TIME ON DON IMUS?
I don't like IMUS but I don't hate him either. If a black man had made those remarks, there would have been some fuss but not the same outrage. It is the way things are in the real world. He should have known it would be received as such. Just as a black broadcaster calling white women a bunch of honky bitches would not be well received.
Peeps look for reasons to lynch. The same remarks made about anger being involved in racism apply here. Some people are always looking for a reason to cry racism. Some people like IMUS give them fuel for the fire. He should have known better.
transformer_99
Experimental Member
Too many loaded questions Marley ? Here's something you won't see people hoisting up for glory in February or any other month for that matter ?
Slave trade as root to African Crisis
Most slaves sold by Africans
Estimates of the total human loss to Africa over the four centuries of the transatlantic slave trade range from 30 million to 200 million. At the initial stage of the trade parties of Europeans captured Africans in raids on communities in the coastal areas. But this soon gave way to buying slaves from African rulers and traders. The vast majority of slaves taken out of Africa were sold by African rulers, traders and a military aristocracy who all grew wealthy from the business. Most slaves were acquired through wars or by kidnapping. The Portuguese Duatre Pacheco Pereire wrote in the early sixteenth century after a visit to Benin that the kingdom "is usually at war with its neighbours and takes many captives, whom we buy at twelve or fifteen brass bracelets each, or for copper bracelets, which they prize more." Olaudah Equiano, an ex-slave, described in his memoirs published in 1789 how African rulers carried out raids to capture slaves. "When a trader wants slaves, he applies to a chief for them, and tempts him with his wares. It is not extraordinary, if on this occasion he yields to the temptation with as little firmness, and accepts the price of his fellow creature's liberty with as little reluctance, as the enlightened merchant. Accordingly, he falls upon his neighbours, and a desperate battle ensues...if he prevails, and takes prisoners, he gratifies his avarice by selling them." Equiano was born in 1745 in an area under the kingdom of Benin. At the age of ten he was kidnapped by slave hunters who also took his sister. He was more fortunate than most other slaves. After serving in America, the West Indies and England he was able to save for and buy his freedom in 1756 at the age of twenty-one.
Ottobah Cugoano, who was about 13 years old when he was kidnapped in 1770 in Ajumako in today's Ghana, had no doubt the shared responsibility of Africans for the horrid business. Referring to his own capture Cugoano wrote after he regained his freedom "I must own, to the shame of my own countrymen, that I was first kidnapped and betrayed by some of my own complexion, who were the first cause of my exile and slavery." But he added, "If there were no buyers there would be no sellers." By the same token, if there were no sellers there would be no buyers.
A profitable trade
European slave buyers made the greater profit from the despicable trade, but their African partners also prospered. Many grew strong and fat on profits made from selling their brethren. Tinubu square, commercial centre of today's Lagos and home to Nigeria's Central Bank, is named after a major nineteenth century slave trader. Madam Tinubu was born in Egbaland and rose from rags to riches by trading in slaves , salt and tobacco in Badagry. She later became one of Nigeria's pioneering nationalists.
Africa's rulers, traders and military aristocracy protected their interest in the slave trade. They discouraged Europeans from leaving the coastal areas to venture into the interior of the continent. European trading companies realised the benefit of dealing with African suppliers and not unnecessarily antagonising them. The companies could not have mustered the resources it would have taken to directly capture the tens of millions of people shipped out of Africa. It was far more sensible and safer to give Africans guns to fight the many wars that yielded captives for the trade. The slave trading network stretched deep into the Africa's interior. Slave trading firms were aware of their dependency on African suppliers. The Royal African Company, for instance, instructed its agents on the West coast "if any differences happen, to endeavour an amicable accommodation rather than use force." They were "to endeavour to live in all friendship with them" and "to hold frequent palavers with the Kings and the Great Men of the Country, and keep up a good correspondent with them, ingratiating yourself by such prudent methods" as may be deemed appropriate.
To me, in it's basest form, there was a thriving market for a commodity to be bought and sold, that like anything along the way, you have the source of supply, middlemen and end users/consumers of the product, buying and selling at different price points. Wholesale thru retail if you will. This early form of marketing of humans as commodties, product (slaves) , price (trade of goods and even money), promotion (word of mouth) and distribution (ships or slave drives), basically is just an efficient capitalist economic model. Are African Americans willing to own this ? Are they simply just pissed off they didn't make the lion's share of the profits because they were at the wholesale level of their own product/commodity ? One must really analyze the motives behind slavery. There is a lot wrong in Africa, even today that is not European or American. This doesn't absolve anyone that participated of responsibility and accountability, but let's keep it real, a majority of the white's blamed for slavery, really had little to do with it. History is history, glory and shame at every point in the timeline and of accomplishment.
As I learned history, yeah, the accomplishments were hoisted and many attributed to white caucasians. They were just people along the way and it was spun for the glory of a name. The reality of Christopher Columbus was that he was not a discoverer for the good of mankind, he was commissioned to further the Spanish aristocracy's wealth and prominence. Just as today, any of us obtains a captains license, I highly doubt the company's that are involved in shipping would hand us a ship to go cruise the ends of the world. And in securing that job, we'd probably have to demonstrate the profitability of the excursion(s).
Slave trade as root to African Crisis
Most slaves sold by Africans
Estimates of the total human loss to Africa over the four centuries of the transatlantic slave trade range from 30 million to 200 million. At the initial stage of the trade parties of Europeans captured Africans in raids on communities in the coastal areas. But this soon gave way to buying slaves from African rulers and traders. The vast majority of slaves taken out of Africa were sold by African rulers, traders and a military aristocracy who all grew wealthy from the business. Most slaves were acquired through wars or by kidnapping. The Portuguese Duatre Pacheco Pereire wrote in the early sixteenth century after a visit to Benin that the kingdom "is usually at war with its neighbours and takes many captives, whom we buy at twelve or fifteen brass bracelets each, or for copper bracelets, which they prize more." Olaudah Equiano, an ex-slave, described in his memoirs published in 1789 how African rulers carried out raids to capture slaves. "When a trader wants slaves, he applies to a chief for them, and tempts him with his wares. It is not extraordinary, if on this occasion he yields to the temptation with as little firmness, and accepts the price of his fellow creature's liberty with as little reluctance, as the enlightened merchant. Accordingly, he falls upon his neighbours, and a desperate battle ensues...if he prevails, and takes prisoners, he gratifies his avarice by selling them." Equiano was born in 1745 in an area under the kingdom of Benin. At the age of ten he was kidnapped by slave hunters who also took his sister. He was more fortunate than most other slaves. After serving in America, the West Indies and England he was able to save for and buy his freedom in 1756 at the age of twenty-one.
Ottobah Cugoano, who was about 13 years old when he was kidnapped in 1770 in Ajumako in today's Ghana, had no doubt the shared responsibility of Africans for the horrid business. Referring to his own capture Cugoano wrote after he regained his freedom "I must own, to the shame of my own countrymen, that I was first kidnapped and betrayed by some of my own complexion, who were the first cause of my exile and slavery." But he added, "If there were no buyers there would be no sellers." By the same token, if there were no sellers there would be no buyers.
A profitable trade
European slave buyers made the greater profit from the despicable trade, but their African partners also prospered. Many grew strong and fat on profits made from selling their brethren. Tinubu square, commercial centre of today's Lagos and home to Nigeria's Central Bank, is named after a major nineteenth century slave trader. Madam Tinubu was born in Egbaland and rose from rags to riches by trading in slaves , salt and tobacco in Badagry. She later became one of Nigeria's pioneering nationalists.
Africa's rulers, traders and military aristocracy protected their interest in the slave trade. They discouraged Europeans from leaving the coastal areas to venture into the interior of the continent. European trading companies realised the benefit of dealing with African suppliers and not unnecessarily antagonising them. The companies could not have mustered the resources it would have taken to directly capture the tens of millions of people shipped out of Africa. It was far more sensible and safer to give Africans guns to fight the many wars that yielded captives for the trade. The slave trading network stretched deep into the Africa's interior. Slave trading firms were aware of their dependency on African suppliers. The Royal African Company, for instance, instructed its agents on the West coast "if any differences happen, to endeavour an amicable accommodation rather than use force." They were "to endeavour to live in all friendship with them" and "to hold frequent palavers with the Kings and the Great Men of the Country, and keep up a good correspondent with them, ingratiating yourself by such prudent methods" as may be deemed appropriate.
To me, in it's basest form, there was a thriving market for a commodity to be bought and sold, that like anything along the way, you have the source of supply, middlemen and end users/consumers of the product, buying and selling at different price points. Wholesale thru retail if you will. This early form of marketing of humans as commodties, product (slaves) , price (trade of goods and even money), promotion (word of mouth) and distribution (ships or slave drives), basically is just an efficient capitalist economic model. Are African Americans willing to own this ? Are they simply just pissed off they didn't make the lion's share of the profits because they were at the wholesale level of their own product/commodity ? One must really analyze the motives behind slavery. There is a lot wrong in Africa, even today that is not European or American. This doesn't absolve anyone that participated of responsibility and accountability, but let's keep it real, a majority of the white's blamed for slavery, really had little to do with it. History is history, glory and shame at every point in the timeline and of accomplishment.
As I learned history, yeah, the accomplishments were hoisted and many attributed to white caucasians. They were just people along the way and it was spun for the glory of a name. The reality of Christopher Columbus was that he was not a discoverer for the good of mankind, he was commissioned to further the Spanish aristocracy's wealth and prominence. Just as today, any of us obtains a captains license, I highly doubt the company's that are involved in shipping would hand us a ship to go cruise the ends of the world. And in securing that job, we'd probably have to demonstrate the profitability of the excursion(s).
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transformer_99
Experimental Member
Some more reading:
SeanBryson.Com Tunde Obadina.Black African Slave Traders RESISTED ABOLITION By Britain in 1807
Cause and effect. But let's face it and keep it real, the one's that benefited or profited from any of that simply aren't the majority of any ethnicity. Any angst should be directed at those directly involved, that's where accountability & responsibility must ultimately lay & rest.
SeanBryson.Com Tunde Obadina.Black African Slave Traders RESISTED ABOLITION By Britain in 1807
Cause and effect. But let's face it and keep it real, the one's that benefited or profited from any of that simply aren't the majority of any ethnicity. Any angst should be directed at those directly involved, that's where accountability & responsibility must ultimately lay & rest.
- b.c.,
There really is a peculiar kind of rationalization re. this slavery issue. The above (post 89) being (or perhaps implied) that the tragedy of this episode in our nation's history is somewhat lessened by the complicity of African traders and aristocracy. I've seen that kind of rationalization here before.
True some African rulers participated in the trade because it was profitable for them to do so. That they did makes them more despised (imo) than the Europeans who made the business profitable for them.
But this doesn't lessen the part that European traders played in the slave trade. On the contrary. The enticement of profit in dealing with the Europeans contributed to the decimation of continental societies and warfare as a whole. They (European slave traders) provided the increased demand for African slaves (it always did exist in varying degrees throughout history, though more often based on class status rather than race).
Nor does it lessen the part that slave holders and plantation owners played in their demand for a large workforce of free labour, nor the actions of their ancestors who, even decades after the Civil War, continued to deny the status of full and equal citizenship to those of African descent.
True some African rulers participated in the trade because it was profitable for them to do so. That they did makes them more despised (imo) than the Europeans who made the business profitable for them.
But this doesn't lessen the part that European traders played in the slave trade. On the contrary. The enticement of profit in dealing with the Europeans contributed to the decimation of continental societies and warfare as a whole. They (European slave traders) provided the increased demand for African slaves (it always did exist in varying degrees throughout history, though more often based on class status rather than race).
Nor does it lessen the part that slave holders and plantation owners played in their demand for a large workforce of free labour, nor the actions of their ancestors who, even decades after the Civil War, continued to deny the status of full and equal citizenship to those of African descent.
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We can sit here and argue till the end of time but it won't change the situation in the world. Why not get up and do something to make a difference? When was the last time you encouraged a child with no father to be the best that they could be? When did you tell them you believed in them? Checked on them regularly to see how they were doing? Smiled when you said their name, and looked them straight in the eye when you talked to them. Told them they were somebody because you believed it, and helped them to believe it too? Why not do the same for adults too? It is a part of some of our daily lives, and we could use some help.
People arent saying Europeans are innocent because of help from African king and chiefdoms. They're saying if you're going to point the guilty finger at me you need too point it back at yourself with the same intensity, hypocrite!
D_Gunther Snotpole
Account Disabled
D_Gunther Snotpole
Account Disabled
D_Gunther Snotpole
Account Disabled
I'm usually pretty clear about that.
But yup, your tag for the guy and your advice are spot on, b.c.
B_Think_Kink
Sexy Member
transformer_99
Experimental Member
My intent wasn't to rationalize it with any post. Mankind really hasn't evolved in it's basest greed and motivations. It's why a lot of goods on the shelves come from China. Capitalism is based on profitability and the materials of input are hardly any more expensive than they ever were. They are inflated and priced that way, because the money supply has grown. What wholesale supply inflation is because we see the middlemen handling that for a profit and prices keep going up with each successive middleman making their profit. It's gotten to the point where the end consumers can no longer afford it, unless they've been middlemen making profits themselves (for example, property flippers). Here's something that suggests exactly what I was trying to point out:
Zimbabwe: Battered white farmers vow to battle on against Robert Mugabe - Telegraph
Farm Murders
Has it come full circle ? The motivations are the same. What happened historically, is the fact that someone wants what another may have bought and paid for and is capable and willing to take it back by whatever means necessary, as heinous as it is, this is the human race. Those perpetrating it have been and will continue to be of all ethnicities. At some point, the blur is that it may have been acquired initially and perhaps decades & centuries ago through heinous acts and now today it's simply been a generational inheritance ? At this stage White farmers are simply fighting for their land/property they perceive as rightfully theirs, titled and deeded as such. Those perpetrating the acts simply using the convenience that it was stolen from them, perhaps it was or wasn't ? But you're looking at a militant group of marauders just the same, not representative of the government ?
20 questions on Black history hardly is fair to anyone posting in this thread that isn't black. It has generated discussions alternatively, and being a racially charged topic, it has escalated at times. It's not my intention to have myself and another go after one another pointing the finger and declaring the other more racist. If we are going to truly understand where we are today, we have to really understand the thought processes of those throughout history. My ancestors came to America to escape famine and poverty. They hardly came as slaves, but to suggest that sailing past the Statue of Liberty with literally the clothes on their backs, no place to stay and no job was the preferrable way to come to America isn't fair either. Same holds with the Orientals, they labored on the Pacific coast and throughout the heartland of America to build the railway system alongside many diverse ethnicities. What month should/do they get for history ? Perhaps a thread on those oppressions should begin with a 20 question survey of knowledge ?
Zimbabwe: Battered white farmers vow to battle on against Robert Mugabe - Telegraph
Farm Murders
Has it come full circle ? The motivations are the same. What happened historically, is the fact that someone wants what another may have bought and paid for and is capable and willing to take it back by whatever means necessary, as heinous as it is, this is the human race. Those perpetrating it have been and will continue to be of all ethnicities. At some point, the blur is that it may have been acquired initially and perhaps decades & centuries ago through heinous acts and now today it's simply been a generational inheritance ? At this stage White farmers are simply fighting for their land/property they perceive as rightfully theirs, titled and deeded as such. Those perpetrating the acts simply using the convenience that it was stolen from them, perhaps it was or wasn't ? But you're looking at a militant group of marauders just the same, not representative of the government ?
20 questions on Black history hardly is fair to anyone posting in this thread that isn't black. It has generated discussions alternatively, and being a racially charged topic, it has escalated at times. It's not my intention to have myself and another go after one another pointing the finger and declaring the other more racist. If we are going to truly understand where we are today, we have to really understand the thought processes of those throughout history. My ancestors came to America to escape famine and poverty. They hardly came as slaves, but to suggest that sailing past the Statue of Liberty with literally the clothes on their backs, no place to stay and no job was the preferrable way to come to America isn't fair either. Same holds with the Orientals, they labored on the Pacific coast and throughout the heartland of America to build the railway system alongside many diverse ethnicities. What month should/do they get for history ? Perhaps a thread on those oppressions should begin with a 20 question survey of knowledge ?
It is up to us to change things, and it is up to the individual to get up and try. Learn from those who lived under the darkness of segregation. See them hold their heads high in spite of the abuse, the taunts, the shame people tried to place upon them. See how they conducted themselves with dignity and grace. Encourage others to rise. Lend a hand if they need it. Get up and stop bitching and moaning and change!
My whole life, I have lived with racism in my own family. I was brown not lily white like my dad, sister, brother, and my dad's family. I endured taunts, slams, and verbal abuse. I was beaten, made sick and denied care in hopes that I would die. I was forced to wear the same old clothes for years. I would have to curl my toes up because my shoes were too small. My brother and sister had beautiful clothes and shoes. Toys, and records. Almost anything they wanted. I had nothing. I was nothing but a servant to wait on them hand and foot. A whipping post for their personal anger and unhappiness. The racial slurs cut like a knife deep into my heart. Until I decided.....
I choose to rise up and live. I choose to be the best me I can be. I choose to associate with people who will appreciate me for the man I am, and not let anyone else drag me down. I'm not dark enough to please my boss, and I'm not light enough to please the white racist. I refuse to let you reject me or define me. I will keep the hope alive in my heart, and reject the bitterness and defeat you long to place there. I will sing within the cage you place me. I will sing the song of freedom, and some day, people like me, will be free. Until that day, I will fight on, and on. I will keep coming back making advance after advance until the battle is won. I will not go away, get ready, here I come!
My whole life, I have lived with racism in my own family. I was brown not lily white like my dad, sister, brother, and my dad's family. I endured taunts, slams, and verbal abuse. I was beaten, made sick and denied care in hopes that I would die. I was forced to wear the same old clothes for years. I would have to curl my toes up because my shoes were too small. My brother and sister had beautiful clothes and shoes. Toys, and records. Almost anything they wanted. I had nothing. I was nothing but a servant to wait on them hand and foot. A whipping post for their personal anger and unhappiness. The racial slurs cut like a knife deep into my heart. Until I decided.....
I choose to rise up and live. I choose to be the best me I can be. I choose to associate with people who will appreciate me for the man I am, and not let anyone else drag me down. I'm not dark enough to please my boss, and I'm not light enough to please the white racist. I refuse to let you reject me or define me. I will keep the hope alive in my heart, and reject the bitterness and defeat you long to place there. I will sing within the cage you place me. I will sing the song of freedom, and some day, people like me, will be free. Until that day, I will fight on, and on. I will keep coming back making advance after advance until the battle is won. I will not go away, get ready, here I come!
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