I don't understand....

JustAsking

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well it's not just the love part of the relationship it's more like
am I cooking right? Am I doing laundry right? Is the house up to par? Does he like the way that I am neat? Is my job acceptable to him? Is my family acceptable or his family? Just stuff... I mean I did take eco in school but I mean it's school there is no role playing the husband and wife in that matter. And well today things are different. I am scared I will get cheated on cuz I can't cook something correctly or if I do laundry incorrectly or if my job isn't something he likes me doing....

It's alot on my mind, I am kinda scared.

Now I see what what you are worrying about. You are worried about being a competent wife or girlfriend in practical matters, such as cooking and working, etc, so your husband/boyfriend doesn't get disappointed in you and lose interest or cheat on you. Is that right?

It does seem like a woman would have to be Martha Stewart and a great mom at the same time to live up to the image of today's supermom in this complicated world we live in. The truth is, though, is the very few woman can live up to those expectations, a lot more don't even try, and finally, the lucky ones realize that the whole thing is a crock.

One thing I can say is that it seems as if your view of a relationship is not complete. It is based on the idea that men and women are only looking for a mate to perform essential functions and make their lives easier. Or, even worse, it is based on a very unbalanced view that the important thing in a relationship is that the man gets what he needs out of it from a long list of items that make his life easier, increase his social standing, and boost his ego.

In fact, it is true that there are plenty of self-centered men out there who might think this way. Its also true that its very easy for a woman to end up thinking that all men think this way. The good news is that not only is it not true, but any relationship with a man who is like this is doomed to misery or failure. Let me say this again. The good news is that all men do not think this way, and furthermore, a relationship with a man like that is doomed to failure whether you are Martha Stewart or Crissy.

No one deserves a life of that kind of misery, where you are paired up with some selfish, uncommunicative man, whose main preoccupation in the relationship is evaluating your performance as to household chores, job status, and boosting his ego. This is not a man, this is a grown up spoiled 12 year old child.

So not only do not all men think this way, but there are as many men as women who are worried about the same thing. In fact, job status and income, sexual performance, etc., from a traditional point of view is a huge concern for a man, who thinks that this sort of thing is the only thing that would attract a woman. So don't forget that most men are also worried about being suitable for marriage from that point of view.

What is incomplete about all of this, in your mind, Crissy, is that you have taken this value system of personal competence in wifely duties and projected it out to the world as if it is a fact that everyone shares this and only this kind of value system. What is missing from this world view is people who marry each other for all kinds of other reasons, such as intellectual compatibility, shared interests in adventure, deeply caring for each other, etc.

What is also missing is the mature component of a relationship where a man and a woman care deeply for each other come hell or high water. In a relationship like this, the husband cares deeply about his wife's interests no matter what they are. If she wants to become a good cook, he encourages and participates in that activity. If instead she wants to have a career or go back to school, he sacrifices things in his career or alters his work schedule to help with childcare and other household practical matters. And in turn, she does the same thing for him, when the time is right. Even better, both the husband and the wife make these kinds of decisions as a team of two people who are mutually interested in each other's wellbeing.

This is the kind of mature relationship that can endure all kinds of hardship, and embrace all kinds of situations from the early lean years when you are both struggling financially, to the problems and maybe even tragedies when raising children, to the empty nest years when all the kids are off on their own, and you both need to redefine your lives once again.

Don't forget that both of you will be awake in the middle of the night with your first screaming baby who just won't sleep for more than a few hours a night and wants to sleep all day. Who do you want to be looking at across the room during those moments: a man who might cheat on you because you burnt the omelettes or a man who would go through hell and back with you because you and he love each other and you and each would give up your life for each other? Suppose the child is deathly ill, or has a disability that makes life difficult for the child and the parents financially or practically. Or, suppose get seriously ill or disabled in the same way. Don't you deserve a husband who would go through these kinds of hardships with you? The answer is yes, not only do you deserve it, but you should not settle for anything less.

Allow yourself to entertain the idea that what you really deserve and what you really should look for is a man who would love you in a way that includes how he might love his beloved sister. In other words, amidst the husband/wife relationship is that component of love where you and he see each other as more related than you do to your own families, and are as loyal and supportive to each other as you would be to them.

This is what you deserve and this is what you should look for in a man. Let the rest of the men, who don't live up to these standards, go off and live their miserable selfish lives.
 

snoozan

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Don't forget that both of you will be awake in the middle of the night with your first screaming baby who just won't sleep for more than a few hours a night and wants to sleep all day. Who do you want to be looking at across the room during those moments: a man who might cheat on you because you burnt the omelettes or a man who would go through hell and back with you because you and he love each other and you and each would give up your life for each other? Suppose the child is deathly ill, or has a disability that makes life difficult for the child and the parents financially or practically. Or, suppose get seriously ill or disabled in the same way. Don't you deserve a husband who would go through these kinds of hardships with you? The answer is yes, not only do you deserve it, but you should not settle for anything less.

You just made me cry. *sniffles*

I am a terrible housekeeper, a good cook when I'm in the mood, have asthma attacks when I vacuum or try to do the laundry, and am a real bitch if I get woken up on the weekends.

And yet, my husband would make bottles at 2am so I could sleep a little bit, wouldn't leave my son's side at the hospital when he was mauled by a dog at 9 months, takes off work to go to my son's physical therapy appointments with us, and cared for me in a way that was almost superhuman when I was so sick that I couldn't get out of bed or function for almost a year. When I got really fat he told me I was still the most beautiful woman he'd ever met.

In truth, he's a better person than I am most of the time, and I don't know how I got so lucky. To him, though, I am the perfect wife. I'm not what I'd like to be all the time, but he sees in me things that he thinks are exceptional even when I don't.

I still struggle with being a good person and a good wife, and I think that's what a partner and being a partner is for-- making each other better people. The practical aspects aren't important except that you've got to be compatible about them-- there's no formula for what makes a good wife or girlfriend.
 

SpoiledPrincess

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Are your asthma attacks when you vacuum and do laundry caused by dust mite allergy? If so fill a plant spray with cold weak tea and spray everywhere lightly, the tannic acid kills dust mites, do this once a week and it really keeps them down. I was the Martha Stewart type know it all wife and I still ended up divorced :)
 

snoozan

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Are your asthma attacks when you vacuum and do laundry caused by dust mite allergy? If so fill a plant spray with cold weak tea and spray everywhere lightly, the tannic acid kills dust mites, do this once a week and it really keeps them down. I was the Martha Stewart type know it all wife and I still ended up divorced :)

This is a great idea but it means I'd be on the hook for vacuuming and laundry. :biggrin1:

Seriously, though, I will try it. I've had some of my worst attacks trying to sort laundry and it gets so frustrating that I ignore the signs that an attack is pending and end up in the ER.

Does the tea stain the clothing/carpet at all?
 

rob_just_rob

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If someone says that you aren't girlfriend/wife material because you can't cook a souffle or keep the bathtub clean, it means one of two things:

- he's living in what he imagines to be the 1950s; or
- he's making an excuse to not marry/live with you. For some men, nobody is wife material.
 
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What is incomplete about all of this, in your mind, Crissy, is that you have taken this value system of personal competence in wifely duties and projected it out to the world as if it is a fact that everyone shares this and only this kind of value system. What is missing from this world view is people who marry each other for all kinds of other reasons, such as intellectual compatibility, shared interests in adventure, deeply caring for each other, etc.



This is the kind of mature relationship that can endure all kinds of hardship, and embrace all kinds of situations from the early lean years when you are both struggling financially, to the problems and maybe even tragedies when raising children, to the empty nest years when all the kids are off on their own, and you both need to redefine your lives once again.

Men like this are hard to find really hard to come by...... fucking sucks. But anywho I loved reading what you wrote, it really does change my thinking since I have alot on my mind about relationships. I mean I never had a bf so sometimes I wonder how will that turn out will it be great or will it suck? I don't want to have sex with him until I know he is the right guy I can't give myself up so easily. Then if I do find the right one after the first phase I want to make sure he is the ONE. The one and only guy I will stick with no matter what and never divorce. Somebody I hope to spend the rest of my life with and have a family and die with. Seriously it's been on my mind lately alot and it bothers me.

I talk to other people especially females and friends they tell me oh well you better know how to cook and clean and have good sex that's how you keep a man from going astray or cheating. It hurts me to know that what if I don't do these things and he runs to some chicken head. I will get upset and maybe what if she is a better house keeper and really is serious about starting a family with the guy I love and they are in love together. I hear stuff like this all the time. But we can't be perfect. Perfection is my problem I want things to be perfect. It drives me insane.
 

SpoiledPrincess

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You can't hold out for the one, because you can only know if he's the one because you have a frame of reference. With every relationship you grow and develop and learn more about yourself, get out there and mix :)

The women and friends who are telling you a man will run if you don't know how to cook and clean are talking crap, it's not Victorian England, a marriage is a partnership, why should you be expected to cook and clean any more than he is?
 

nicenycdick

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Being married is all about being in a healthy partnership. Others have said that here. But...how do you have a healthy partnership? I know the answer. It is all about communication: you tell her what your need; you ask what she wants; the listen; you talk; sometimes, you yell. The only way that it works for the long haul is if you really talk about everything. So often, marriage becomes just two people living separate lives in the same house. The goal is for two people to live the same life. And I don't mean that you have to give up what makes you what you are...that is, after all, what attracted each of you to each other in the first place. But what happens when communication is good is that you find that you are truly a team. And you are a team that can handle anything that life throws you, any adversity, and shit that falls into our laps over time

So don't worry about whether you are "wife material"...you will know when you are part of that team.
 

snoozan

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Perfection is my problem I want things to be perfect. It drives me insane.

I'm not saying this to be flippant, but those sorts of thoughts are exactly the kind that make you not at all ready for a relationship. Talking about this to a therapist while you're still young may help you resolve some of there issues, especially if you have tendencies towards perfectionism in other parts of your life.
 

B_New End

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I want to make sure he is the ONE. The one and only guy I will stick with no matter what and never divorce. Somebody I hope to spend the rest of my life with and have a family and die with.

I thought the same way, waited until I was 24, then realized what a waste it was. Plus, if you dont have sex, he's gone (for a man, a woman will leave too).

the world is much different now, and its in the age of birth control.

You are just cruising for a world of hurt. You may find honest men who say they would rather fool around, and see where it goes, and you may meet liars who promise you the world... until they end up thinking you are "annoying". Really, people are incredibly complex, and you will never know if he is right for you, without knowing him for at least 6 months....

...and, you'll meet some guy soon, and after a week, be convinced its all perfect and good... and he is the one.

And chances are, you'll be wrong. :D But that's life, dont regret, and dont feel guilt.
 
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I thought the same way, waited until I was 24, then realized what a waste it was. Plus, if you dont have sex, he's gone (for a man, a woman will leave too).

the world is much different now, and its in the age of birth control.

You are just cruising for a world of hurt. You may find honest men who say they would rather fool around, and see where it goes, and you may meet liars who promise you the world... until they end up thinking you are "annoying". Really, people are incredibly complex, and you will never know if he is right for you, without knowing him for at least 6 months....

...and, you'll meet some guy soon, and after a week, be convinced its all perfect and good... and he is the one.

And chances are, you'll be wrong. :D But that's life, dont regret, and dont feel guilt.


Reality really sux here
 

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I am a terrible housekeeper, a good cook when I'm in the mood, have asthma attacks when I vacuum or try to do the laundry, and am a real bitch if I get woken up on the weekends.

And yet, my husband would make bottles at 2am so I could sleep a little bit, wouldn't leave my son's side at the hospital when he was mauled by a dog at 9 months, takes off work to go to my son's physical therapy appointments with us, and cared for me in a way that was almost superhuman when I was so sick that I couldn't get out of bed or function for almost a year. When I got really fat he told me I was still the most beautiful woman he'd ever met.

In truth, he's a better person than I am most of the time, and I don't know how I got so lucky. To him, though, I am the perfect wife. I'm not what I'd like to be all the time, but he sees in me things that he thinks are exceptional even when I don't.

I still struggle with being a good person and a good wife, and I think that's what a partner and being a partner is for-- making each other better people. The practical aspects aren't important except that you've got to be compatible about them-- there's no formula for what makes a good wife or girlfriend.

njqt466 retreats to her lab, to see if she can create an exact duplicate of Snoozan's husband for herself.

If someone says that you aren't girlfriend/wife material because you can't cook a souffle or keep the bathtub clean, it means one of two things:
- he's living in what he imagines to be the 1950s; or
- he's making an excuse to not marry/live with you. For some men, nobody is wife material.

Talk about spot on advice! That was perfect.
 

SurferGirlCA

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Crissy, there's a big leap of faith involved in any committed relationship, on the part of both people. There are no guarantees - ever. Most people, especially when they're younger, aren't even sure of who they are or what they really want yet, so how can they possibly bring someone else into that headspace and expect things to always work out perfectly? Trust me, I was engaged when I was in my early 20s and I bent over backwards (yes, even outside the bedroom) to try and make everything just right for him and I finally snapped out of it one day and realized there was no way it would ever be good enough for him. Some people realize this only after they get married.

Don't be so hard on yourself and definitely don't expect perfection from others or from relationships, because you'll just have to deal with constant disappointment in life. Yes, there are amazing and wonderful things when you find a guy you're compatible with and the chemistry is there and you enjoy each other's company and all of that. It's just important to understand that heading into a committed relationship is something both of you have to a) want and b) be ready for and c) be willing to put the work into. That doesn't happen all the time - it just doesn't. There's definitely a learning curve involved and I've been where you are now. Just make sure you're aware of what it is you want and then be comfortable being who you are and assume that there are guys out there who will appreciate that... because there are. Good luck.
 

Sixofspades

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I haven't given this too much thought and hope to never be hitched myself, but the women who are most marriage-oriented are generally the ones we don't want to be married to.
 

Jovial

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I agree with New End, it's not realistic to wait very long to have sex. You have to be sexually intimate with someone to see if you like them like that, even if you don't have actual intercourse. No one (or most people) don't want to take a lot of time getting to know someone just to be disappointed. Just look at some threads here where women eventually found the guy was small and had to end it. But it's not just that. It could be how frequently your partner wants sex or what kind of lover he is or whatever.

I don't think you can just give a lot to keep a guy around. That only works in the short term. In the long run there needs to be equal give and take.

Also important is respect and appreciation. If someone doesn't respect your feelings and appreciate what you give, then you won't be too motivated to keep giving. These things only come out in the longer term.

And like someone else said, don't end up being someone's mother. There are plenty of guys that are just grown up kids and I don't understand why women put up with them.

Ideally, the person you're with is someone that you can be relaxed around. You just understand each other and can be yourself. It's a drag being with someone and always worrying that they will get mad at you if you do something wrong.
 

sxy_vince

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Men like this are hard to find really hard to come by...... fucking sucks. But anywho I loved reading what you wrote, it really does change my thinking since I have alot on my mind about relationships. I mean I never had a bf so sometimes I wonder how will that turn out will it be great or will it suck? I don't want to have sex with him until I know he is the right guy I can't give myself up so easily. Then if I do find the right one after the first phase I want to make sure he is the ONE. The one and only guy I will stick with no matter what and never divorce. Somebody I hope to spend the rest of my life with and have a family and die with. Seriously it's been on my mind lately alot and it bothers me.

I talk to other people especially females and friends they tell me oh well you better know how to cook and clean and have good sex that's how you keep a man from going astray or cheating. It hurts me to know that what if I don't do these things and he runs to some chicken head. I will get upset and maybe what if she is a better house keeper and really is serious about starting a family with the guy I love and they are in love together. I hear stuff like this all the time. But we can't be perfect. Perfection is my problem I want things to be perfect. It drives me insane.

Hi Chrissy, I don't think there's a simple solution but here's my thoughts - I hope they help:

It seems to me that you like the idea of being a "one-man woman" and being married for life, and you are scared of being cheated on.

I think some of the advice you get from your "females and friends" is a bit unwise - A man who cheats on his wife going to cheat regardless of how well you cook and clean. (Have the "females and friends" actually been sucessful with their strategies?)

If fidelity and life-long monogamy is that important to you then look for a "one-woman man". Look for a "nice guy" - someone who is sensitive and doesn't like hurting you, and someone who genuinely wants to get married and live with someone for the rest of his life. I know I could classify some of my friends like this (although, admittedly, they do tend to be religious).

You can get a good sense of what a guy is like, but you can never be completely certain, as others have pointed out. You can't control what other people do so you could never be certain that its forever.

Also, you may have to accept being single for a long time until you find someone who shares your commitment. Again, you can't control a lot of what happens to you. You are correct - you can't be perfect - just do your best!

I don't know you but you seem like a nice person. You probably shouldn't be so hard on yourself.

Good luck for everything,