Impeachment?? WTF???

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by B_enter today, Jul 11, 2008.

  1. B_enter today

    B_enter today New Member

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    Ok, so I was watching the news today, (not sure if anyone's talked about this yet) and I wanted to hear some of y'alls thoughts.

    So the Dems have decided to.. once again.. suggest impeachment for President Bush. Now, I've got to say, I am a Bush supporter, I don't agree with a lot of the things he's done, but reguardless... So I was thinking, "What for? Why spend tons of our tax dollars to impeach this guy?" Well already I think the Dems hate him and want to make sure that they crush the rest of his legacy, but what's the point other than that? So they said on the news that they want to impeach him because he "Falsly told them that the Iraqis have WMD's" and they want to impeach him because he brought us into a war without real knowledge.

    So I'm sitting there thinking, Ok, we're in Iraq, but Bush didn't do that all on his own. He didn't walk into a room and come out and say "Hey lookie here, I think that we should invadify this here teeny place called Iraq cuz I think they might have them thar weapons of the mass destruction. harharhar lets go to war!" He went to the Joint Cheifs who told him that Iraq had them, and we could win. I'm not seeing the gain to impeach him. If Bush had this uber secret agenda to get oil, (Which we aren't, almost all of our oil is coming and has been coming since before the war and even till now from the Saudis and more recently from Venezuela.) Secondly, we know that the Iraqis had the WMD's at some point in time because... hello! we gave it to them.

    So to wrap this all up. I don't really see the need to impeach him and spend our hard working money to tell him "You did bad! We wanna know if you have a secret agenda for being there."

    I dunno. Ok, so... yeah, I guess discuss it lol. I wanna know other people's thoughts on the whole issue of impeaching him.
     
  2. novice_btm

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    Like him, or hate him, I think it'd be a huge waste of time and money THIS late in the game. I mean, 7.5 years into his terms?

    EDIT: BTW, nice impressions of him. :tongue:
     
  3. B_enter today

    B_enter today New Member

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    Definitely, it's just waaay to far in. I mean, if they wanted to, they should have done it two years ago when it was originally proposed. It probably won't go anywhere, but to even start talking about it, I think that means they've already been spending money to draft up things. You know no one in Washington does anything until they've spent some money lol.

    Thank you lol
     
  4. TurkeyWithaSunburn

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    at the risk of being crass... why would anybody want to impeach Bush,
    Emperor CHENEY is next in line!!!! Run for your LIIIIIVVVESS!!!!

    Cheney should be impeached cuz the leaking of the Valerie Plame (sp?) the undercover cia agent to the media.

    It's too late to have any useful effect other than as a nifty statement on a resume..
     
  5. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    Congressman's Article's of Impeachment are a bit more involved than described by the OP:
    Following is a summary of the allegations against President Bush that are included in Kucinich's Articles of Impeachment:
    Article I: Creating a Secret Propaganda Campaign to Manufacture a False Case for War Against Iraq
    Article II: Falsely, Systematically, and with Criminal Intent Conflating the Attacks of September 11, 2001, With Misrepresentation of Iraq as a Security Threat as Part of Fraudulent Justification for a War of Aggression
    Article III: Misleading the American People and Members of Congress to Believe Iraq Possessed Weapons of Mass Destruction, to Manufacture a False Case for War
    Article IV: Misleading the American People and Members of Congress to Believe Iraq Posed an Imminent Threat to the United States
    Article V: Illegally Misspending Funds to Secretly Begin a War of Aggression
    Article VI: Invading Iraq in Violation of the Requirements of HJRes114
    Article VII: Invading Iraq Absent a Declaration of War.
    Article VIII: Invading Iraq, A Sovereign Nation, in Violation of the UN Charter
    Article IX: Failing to Provide Troops With Body Armor and Vehicle Armor
    Article X: Falsifying Accounts of US Troop Deaths and Injuries for Political Purposes
    Article XI: Establishment of Permanent U.S. Military Bases in Iraq
    Article XII: Initiating a War Against Iraq for Control of That Nation's Natural Resources
    Article XIIII: Creating a Secret Task Force to Develop Energy and Military Policies With Respect to Iraq and Other Countries
    Article XIV: Misprision of a Felony, Misuse and Exposure of Classified Information And Obstruction of Justice in the Matter of Valerie Plame Wilson, Clandestine Agent of the Central Intelligence Agency
    Article XV: Providing Immunity from Prosecution for Criminal Contractors in Iraq
    Article XVI: Reckless Misspending and Waste of U.S. Tax Dollars in Connection With Iraq and US Contractors
    Article XVII: Illegal Detention: Detaining Indefinitely And Without Charge Persons Both U.S. Citizens and Foreign Captives
    Article XVIII: Torture: Secretly Authorizing, and Encouraging the Use of Torture Against Captives in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Other Places, as a Matter of Official Policy
    Article XIX: Rendition: Kidnapping People and Taking Them Against Their Will to "Black Sites" Located in Other Nations, Including Nations Known to Practice Torture
    Article XX: Imprisoning Children
    Article XXI: Misleading Congress and the American People About Threats from Iran, and Supporting Terrorist Organizations Within Iran, With the Goal of Overthrowing the Iranian Government
    Article XXII: Creating Secret Laws
    Article XXIII: Violation of the Posse Comitatus Act
    Article XXIV: Spying on American Citizens, Without a Court-Ordered Warrant, in Violation of the Law and the Fourth Amendment
    Article XXV: Directing Telecommunications Companies to Create an Illegal and Unconstitutional Database of the Private Telephone Numbers and Emails of American Citizens
    Article XXVI: Announcing the Intent to Violate Laws with Signing Statements
    Article XXVII: Failing to Comply with Congressional Subpoenas and Instructing Former Employees Not to Comply
    Article XXVIII: Tampering with Free and Fair Elections, Corruption of the Administration of Justice
    Article XXIX: Conspiracy to Violate the Voting Rights Act of 1965
    Article XXX: Misleading Congress and the American People in an Attempt to Destroy Medicare
    Article XXXI: Katrina: Failure to Plan for the Predicted Disaster of Hurricane Katrina, Failure to Respond to a Civil Emergency
    Article XXXII: Misleading Congress and the American People, Systematically Undermining Efforts to Address Global Climate Change
    Article XXXIII: Repeatedly Ignored and Failed to Respond to High Level Intelligence Warnings of Planned Terrorist Attacks in the US, Prior to 911
    Article XXXIV: Obstruction of the Investigation into the Attacks of September 11, 2001
    Article XXXV: Endangering the Health of 911 First Responders
     
  6. Channelwood

    Channelwood New Member

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    "So the Dems have decided to.. once again.. suggest impeachment for President Bush."

    It's really important to separate one person's opinion from the whole group.

    It's not "The Dems" it's Dennis Kucinich. He's been on this roll for awhile now. Up until now Nancy Pelosi has blocked previous proposals for exactly the reasons any sane person would think ... wasting time and effort. She's now suggested that the Judiciary Committee can hear some of the arguments solely for the purpose of airing the Democrats' grievances. She has no intention of taking up the articles of impeachment or supporting any measure that would assuredly throw Congress into a gridlock.

    When the House voted to send Kucinich's articles to committee for review last month, Democratic leaders opposed the measure.

    Don't believe everything you watch on the news.
     
  7. slurper_la

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    OK, impeachment discussion aside; you really have no fusking idea what you're talking about, do you?

    I hope this miserable rotten bastard and his entire administration is tried, jailed and strung up for war crimes, crimes against the constitution and treason.

    And yes the entire war was his doing. He lied to congress, the American people and the world about his motives and the trumped up reasons for going into Iraq.

    He has wasted trillions of dollars on this catastrophe, most dollars wasted on war profiteering by KBR, Halliburton & Bechtel.
     
  8. B_enter today

    B_enter today New Member

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    Honestly, I feel like 99% of those are absoulte bull crap. I mean, why not add:
    Causing global warming
    Making the people of Mexico so poor that they have to come here
    Burning the rainforest

    This is all bull.

    "Article I: Creating a Secret Propaganda Campaign to Manufacture a False Case for War Against Iraq"

    I would like to know what they think his "secret propaganda" is.

    "Article III: Misleading the American People and Members of Congress to Believe Iraq Possessed Weapons of Mass Destruction, to Manufacture a False Case for War"

    I'm not sure how he falsly made EVERYONE BELIEVE IRAQ HAD WMD's. Can none of these people think for themselves so they just listened to him? And like I said before, we freaking gave Iraq the weapons, they had them. We gave them fair warning to let them know we were coming, they could have easily moved them to another location.

    "Article IV: Misleading the American People and Members of Congress to Believe Iraq Posed an Imminent Threat to the United States"

    Well you know what, Saddam Hussien wasn't a problem at all.... Nope, not at all... Dumbasses! There was a threat coming from there.

    "Article V: Illegally Misspending Funds to Secretly Begin a War of Aggression"

    War of agression?????? Uhmmm.... do they have their heads so far rammed up their own asses that they forget how Iraq wages "war of agression" on people every single day?

    "Article VIII: Invading Iraq, A Sovereign Nation, in Violation of the UN Charter"

    If I remember correctly, almost everyone in America was FOR invading Iraq... oh, but that was before they voted against it huh? So their ignorance doesn't count either.

    "Article IX: Failing to Provide Troops With Body Armor and Vehicle Armor"

    Where are they getting this? I know TONS of soldiers who said they were more than prepared to be there.

    "Article XI: Establishment of Permanent U.S. Military Bases in Iraq"

    We have military bases all over the world... since when is it a crime?

    "Article XII: Initiating a War Against Iraq for Control of That Nation's Natural Resources"

    I think these guys are on crack. We hardly get anything from Iraq... oh yeah, I forgot some of our soldiers bring back a bunch of sand and rocks, silly me.... maybe Iraq's in a sand shortage. Oh boys, you gotta bring all that sand back now, sorry.

    "Article XIV: Misprision of a Felony, Misuse and Exposure of Classified Information And Obstruction of Justice in the Matter of Valerie Plame Wilson, Clandestine Agent of the Central Intelligence Agency"

    Haha, I don't think Bush had anything to do with this.

    "Article XVI: Reckless Misspending and Waste of U.S. Tax Dollars in Connection With Iraq and US Contractors"

    If waste of tax dollars is a crime now, maybe THESE guys should be impeached for using their tax free paychecks, that come from our pockets, to purchace these big old SUV's and shit. Maybe also someone should be impeached for spending millions of dollars to aid illegal immigrants too. "Waste of tax dollars" bull crap.

    "Article XVIII: Torture: Secretly Authorizing, and Encouraging the Use of Torture Against Captives in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Other Places, as a Matter of Official Policy"

    Ok, let's stop torturing people... Our men are tortured every single day by enemies, but... you know what, let's just stop. Sooner or later... everyone else will see our example and stop....

    "Article XX: Imprisoning Children"

    I guess Bush is also responsible for bad country songs, the WGA strike, why tampons leak.. Where the hell do they get that he imprisoned children? Is there some secret underground tunnel they found in the White House that goes down to a prison chamber??

    "Article XXII: Creating Secret Laws"

    If they're secret laws..... how do they know about them?????

    "Article XXIV: Spying on American Citizens, Without a Court-Ordered Warrant, in Violation of the Law and the Fourth Amendment"

    Times are different. People want to be protected, but when it comes down to the mechanics, they compain. What the heck is anyone supposed to do about that. If we took the Patriot Act away and something happened, then there would be another article "Failing to Protect America from Foreign threats"

    "Article XXIX: Conspiracy to Violate the Voting Rights Act of 1965"

    When did he do this?

    "Article XXX: Misleading Congress and the American People in an Attempt to Destroy Medicare"

    Did he? I'm pretty sure he proposed a bill that was better than Medicare, but it was shot down.

    "Article XXXI: Katrina: Failure to Plan for the Predicted Disaster of Hurricane Katrina, Failure to Respond to a Civil Emergency"

    FEMA had NO idea this would happen. What was Bush supposed to do? Go down to New Orleans and say "Stop Storm!"
    If he had gone down there, resources that were NEEDED to rescue people would have had to be diverted to Bush for reasons of security. He would have compromised the entire rescue attempt.

    "Article XXXII: Misleading Congress and the American People, Systematically Undermining Efforts to Address Global Climate Change"

    Uh... he's been trying to fix it for a long time, but nothings been done about it until now.

    "Article XXXIII: Repeatedly Ignored and Failed to Respond to High Level Intelligence Warnings of Planned Terrorist Attacks in the US, Prior to 911"

    He just stepped into office when this happened, furthermore, no one told him until after it happened! So here's the stupidity, he gets in trouble for failing to do something before it happened, but when he did something to prevent it in the future, he gets in trouble again.... Hmmm???

    "Article XXXIV: Obstruction of the Investigation into the Attacks of September 11, 2001
    Article XXXV: Endangering the Health of 911 First Responders"

    How and how?


    This is my whole point. This was already millions of dollars just to draft this bull up! And I don't know where a lot of this is coming from.

    Thanks for posting that Industrial, I got to vent lol.
     
  9. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    If you want more than a facile understanding of the issues behind these charges, I suggest studying them a bit more thoroughly than you have. It's good to be interested in politics, not good to be uninformed.
     
  10. Sklar

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    Kind of a side topic here.

    I just find it funny that the Democrats who come into office these past four years all vowed to stop the war, yet they keep funding it AND they helped to pass the new surveilance (sp) act that was just signed into law.

    Makes me wonder who lied to who.
     
  11. VeeP

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    It's pretty simple, really: Kucinich is one of many congressional ass clowns who are up for re-election this year. He's catering to the far-left kooks with his impeachment charade. And yes, he's wasting taxpayer dollars.

    He must be packing, though (as has been discussed here previously) as he has one HOT wife who is 31 years younger!

    They vowed to do a lot of things when they gained majority in 2006, and look where we are now. :rolleyes:
     
  12. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    Does Bush deserve to be impeached? Yes he does. If the government can impeach Clinton for lying about having sex with an intern, then they should definitely consider all of the blunders, lies and horrible mistakes that our current president has made. But why at this point? He has barely more than 6 months left in his presidency. This would have made more sense even a few years ago.

    I say, let the term end and then go after him for more serious claims. Trying to impeach the man now, especially being so close to an election, is just silly.
     
  13. D_Gunther Snotpole

    D_Gunther Snotpole Account Disabled

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    Nope.

    Flashy posted on this in the America-bashing thread:

     
  14. B_Austin Blue

    B_Austin Blue New Member

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    I'm surprised nobody's tried to shoot Bush dead.
     
  15. erratic

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    Meanwhile in Afghanistan, Osama bin Laden is welcoming more recruits than ever before.

    Did Kucinich mention that part?
     
  16. erratic

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    There is no single act that could restore the world's respect of America more than impeaching and disgracing George W. Bush.

    I know it's politically impracticable and that Americans as a whole don't seem to care about their reputation, but the day is passed that America can claim to be the only superpower and it's going to have to start worrying about its reputation fast.
     
  17. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    I agree with you, but it's just the timing of this move that bothers me. Being this close to an election, an impeachment procedure would just make things even harder for the American people to come together. We've all come to grips realizing that Bush & Friends will no longer be in office in about 6 months time. Deal with the election and get the right person in office (which I hope is Obama since Clinton is no longer on the ticket). Then we can bring Bush and members of his administration to trial and try to bring him down using more severe tactics. Impeachment is one thing, but being tried for things like War Crimes is even more condemning.
     
  18. Pecker

    Pecker Retired Moderator
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    Article XXXVI: Being marginally better looking that Dennis Kucinich.
     
  19. B_Morning_Glory

    B_Morning_Glory New Member

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    my only answer to this for you since you say your a bush supporter would be in the form of a question. which is worse screwing a intern or screwing the country? not meaning to be smart ass here but he [bush]hasnt done much but screw up everything this country was built on. but i will agree with you impeachment is a waste of time and money. but the republicans couldnt wait to use it on the clinton white house so if it comes to that which it never will i would support it being used now.
     
  20. VeeP

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    Our highest percentage of imports is from Canada, as someone noted. That said, I avoid patronizing oil companies whose imports are largely from the Middle East or Venezuela. I use the following site to guide me in voting with my wallet:

    Company Level Imports
     
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