The problem I see with utopian visions of the future comes down to human nature. They presume that everybody will be on the same page, be willing to share equally and achieve the same level of enlightenment. Human history and human nature say otherwise.
Even when there is more than enough to go around, there are, and I fear always will be, those who operate through competition and greed - be it lust for power or lust for material things - be it a larger pile of coconuts, a bigger house, a fatter stock portfolio, hotter better sex and romance, a need to control the game, be "the Decider", etc. It is the concentration of money power and resources in the hands of a few that forces everyone else to work harder to support them, and just to keep even. How do you propose to pry the money and power from their greedy grubby little hands, when they are the ones profiting from the labor of workers, the spending of consumers - and ultimately controlling the game?
I know people who live in cooperative communites and share the work, share the resources, share in consensus decision making. Though there is much more harmony than one sees in the wider world, still there are power politics, sexual politics, jealousies and petty grievances on some level. I believe that greed (based in fear) is the bane of human existence. It would be lovely to transcend all of that, but frankly, unless you can change human nature, how is it possible?
This is the best point raised so far imo. History shows us that change NEVER comes without a price. It relies often on the younger generations to push for change. A collective conscience, a greater voice brings issues to the forefront and humanity is ever advancing in an effort to stamp out the things regarded as unfair or problematic.
Money is partly it, Mitchy, I agree - but jobs also give a sense of purpose and security, and help define who we are.
I don't think it's ever going to be possible to do away with money - because it's just a form of trading where we swap what we have, for things we need; no way there's ever going to be enough food and resources to get to the point where no-one has to do anything.
Plus...who grows the food, builds houses - keeps the place clean, etc?? There's also the matter of educating people, which has to be done.
The point is that people WOULD choose to work. The fact that they can choose not to is a positive thing because it would be their choice and without huge consequences. Nobody would be paid to work in my visionary world, people would have a different system for obtaining things. The majority of work would be done by machines/computers/robots. I will explain the system in response to Pendlum
I don't know why...but this thread irrationally annoys me.
I think, if something seems obviously unworkable to me, and completely fanciful, I assume everyone else should see it too.
You lack imagination perhaps or perhaps you don't have a desire to see a better world because for now at least you are happy enough, contented with your position in life. You've mentioned striking a balance quite a few times but that just does'nt work when people on low income have no choice but to work long hours to make sufficient wages or skilled workers having to do the same because their job requires it.
Maybe "working class" means something different in the UK than it does here in the US, but I'd hardly call it the most educated, socially-progressive and spiritually honest group of people. They are generally those least inclined to value intellectualism or creative endeavors as worthy ways to spend one's time.
My experience shows working class stiffs to be clannish, xenophobic, suspicious and intolerant to social and cultural evolutions. They are quick to find threats, especially from things about with they have only the most rudimentary knowledge or experience (if any at all). I'm really unclear as to why you would choose such a demographic to be the one that survives whatever social apocalypse which would bring down to extinction the middle and upper classes (the aristocracy, on the other hand, is much easier for me to get my brain around).
And finally: how could there exist a working class when there's no actual work to be done?
PS: Otherwise, I'd agree that your other points have merit as a Utopian dream. If only I were still capable of utopian sentiments...:redface:
When i used the term working class, i meant it literally to define those who work and those who do not. The 'class' that exists in the world today only exists because of inequality. The attitude of the bad asses would likely improve and that of the snobs would mellow in a world where class is irrelevant. And there would still be work to do just not so much. Look at how many people are doing jobs in the service industry nowadays because machines do most of the work in manufacturing and when that sector was most popular it was because jobs in agriculture were replaced by machines. What happens in the future when cashiers are replaced by automated machines? when security gaurds replaced with sophisticated security systems? when post is all sent online? Humanity cannot sustain a balance between working like we do and advancing our technology.
I think if you could choose to do whatever work you wanted (which is stupidly unrealistic by the way, since many jobs require training), there might be an explosion in the porn industry. :tongue:
Money is what really gives you the ability to do just about anything you want and survive. Money is great, there is nothing evil about money. People are evil, and people are greedy. Replacing money with some kind of 'credit' system is just dumb, because all you are doing is changing what it looks like/its form. It's still money. So that idea actually doesn't do anything revolutionary. So to me it just sounds like you are putting a funny hat on it and trying to claim the idea s your own (or whoever told you it).
The point in bold is a great one. In a changing world, education changes too. How many people are learning I.T. at school nowadays compared to 20 years ago for example. People teach what needs to be taught and we become skilled, its not hard to do really. I COULD for example be trained as an astronaught, i'm intelligent enough to be trained and so the big issue is whether or not i fancy it with the biggest (and most unfair) being my chances in life to achieve it. Those with the highest grades, the better education, the more intellectual, friends in high places etc etc get first chances. Very few who have a real passion for something actually get the chance to live their dreams.
As for the credit system...
It is not the same exactly. Imagine that we each have an ID card that enables us access into places like shops, cinemas and bars. People who choose not to work would have a non-workers 'pass' which gives them access to basic places to obtain basic essentials for survival. They could live without fear of being homeless or starving because they are entitled to the basics. A person who works would have a workers pass which gives them access to places of entertainment or to order the latest gadgets as a reward for being a worker. They would only need to work a small quota each week to keep their workers pass from becoming a non-workers pass.
Each week credits are given to people on top of the pass system and these credits could be exchanged for things such as free holidays or works of art etc. Basically everyone would gain credits in accordance with the contribution they put in in terms of time. People would be free to embark on their dreams and perhaps find themselves working long hours purely by choice because they love what they do not because they have a need to survive. Homelessness would be eradicated, most crime would be pointless. (why would i want a fake rolex when i can exchange my credits for a real one) Most crucially there would be nothing in existance that anyone could want that they would'nt have enough credits for earned in a short space of time.
It would be fantastic to go on a round the world cruise but who can actually afford that? To be a space tourist?
People want equality and in time that means only one thing, the mechanisms that give power to the few will be removed, money is perhaps the last real mechanism in democratic nations.
People do not need money to work, we do it on a daily basis in our own homes off our own backs don't we?
