In your opinion what is a "virgin"?

[prepstudinsc]

To add even more to the equation, I was informed at the GYN if ANYTHING ( including a speculum) has penetrated certain orifices the individual is no long er considered technically a virgin. So, that means that in some cases even very young women and men after having a medical examination at the GYN or even urologist are technically and medically no longer a virgin.
Perhaps I am old school, but I always thought being a virgin meant no penetrative sex vaginally for a female, so I can not speak for any other types of sexual activity. I think there may be a difference between being pure and a virgin . Though one may abstain from the most intimate of sexual contact does sexual knowledge then remove one from the realm of virginity? If so, then the net is spread even further...

What do you all think about young men or women who have been sexually violated at a young age against their will yet they had no sexual intent on their own part? What do you call them?

This is when you get into technicalities. I understand your GYN's point that if a speculum has been inserted and the hymen broken, the girl is no longer a virgin. But come on, that's so black and white.

As to being raped, as has been stated already, that's not about sex. I would consider that person a virgin, because the rape was not sex. Sex is more than the physical, it's also emotional, and raper is pure violence/power, it's not about love or reproduction.

 

[pym]

To add even more to the equation, I was informed at the GYN if ANYTHING ( including a speculum) has penetrated certain orifices the individual is no long er considered technically a virgin. So, that means that in some cases even very young women and men after having a medical examination at the GYN or even urologist are technically and medically no longer a virgin.

A hymen that is broken through a medical procedure or perhaps through a sporting injury...or i think even accidently during SELF masturbation is simply that....a broken hymen. NO CARNAL KNOWLEDGE.

Perhaps I am old school, but I always thought being a virgin meant no penetrative sex vaginally for a female, so I can not speak for any other types of sexual activity. I think there may be a difference between being pure and a virgin . Though one may abstain from the most intimate of sexual contact does sexual knowledge then remove one from the realm of virginity? If so, then the net is spread even further...

That does NOT make you old school....just sensible. What constitutes being a "VIRGIN" was established thousands of years ago. What has changed? It implys ZERO sexual contact with 'ANOTHER'. I do not think that this a concept that needs a updated definition to suit various sexual MORES. It's clear cut: No sexual knowledge of another. This buissness that i see people discuss about teenage sex {ORAL}{ANAL}{HAND_JOBS} is VERY nebulous......For millenia the term and definition of VIRGIN has been set in stone.And for good reason. A person who denys themselves copulative sex can still be quite depraved, badly infected with any # of STD's, stigamatized by there community as promiscuous. Nor truly able to offer themselves up as "un-spoiled" goods to there marriage partners in any sort of honesty.


What do you all think about young men or women who have been sexually violated at a young age against their will yet they had no sexual intent on their own part? What do you call them?

AN unfortunate victim of predatory sexual assault. In the end Virginity is associated with the LACK of any physical sexual contact.....And believe me, i would not personally withhold the very harshest of punishments {up to and including death} to those who would take such a precious gift from someone by force or manipulation or predatory pederasty.

 

[naughty]

For years the idea of penetrative sex alone being used as the benchmark for virginity has created a slippery slide for many young men and women who I dont think fully understand the absolute consequences of their actions. Are we not now retroactively tightening the reins on what virginity constitutes? If what some of you are saying is true generations of alleged virgins went to their marriage beds not as pure as they and everyone else may have thought them to be. Since "heavy petting" is by definition what perhaps some others might call handjobs, fingering, etc... where is the line drawn?

 

[pym]

Like i said.....the definition is thousands of years old:NO sexual contact with another. Whats changed?

 

[naughty]

Like i said.....the definition is thousands of years old:NO sexual contact with another. Whats changed?

A lot... read my post directly above yours... In fact, I was just reading a post where a member was thinking that his soon to be marriage had not been consummated because he and his fiance had engaged in penetrative vaginal sex with a condom instead of without...

 

[pym]

A lot... read my post directly above yours... In fact, I was just reading a post where a member was thinking that his soon to be marriage had not been consummated because he and his fiance had engaged in penetrative vaginal sex with a condom instead of without...

I respect your thoughts on the matter.
But i don't personally see any ambiguity at all.....regarding 'zero sexual contact with another'. Nor did our ancestors. Some of the old laws and moralities came about through good common sense.
Terrible sexual std's existed even in the stone age.
An entire religous concept is founded on IMMACULATE CONCEPTION{the jews never really bought that}
As an aside, PRE-DNA verification times, The jews would only accept matriarchal lineage.....the paternity is NEVER certain...until recently.
I just don't think SOME things change with the times.
Sex is sex....condom or not.
Blow-jobs, hand-jobs , Anal or whatever.....it's sex
despite what Bill Clinton says:biggrin1:

 

[naughty]

I respect your thoughts on the matter.
But i don't personally see any ambiguity at all.....regarding 'zero sexual contact with another'. Nor did our ancestors. Some of the old laws and moralities came about through good common sense.
Terrible sexual std's existed even in the stone age.
An entire religous concept is founded on IMMACULATE CONCEPTION{the jews never really bought that}
As an aside, PRE-DNA verification times, The jews would only accept matriarchal lineage.....the paternity is NEVER certain...until recently.
I just don't think SOME things change with the times.
Sex is sex....condom or not.
Blow-jobs, hand-jobs , Anal or whatever.....it's sex
despite what Bill Clinton says:biggrin1:

THe question was not sex, the question was virginity. Do not get me wrong, in spite of much of the foolish jesting I engage in here on the board ,my views on these matters are really quite conservative.
I am just thinking that what one might call a handjob or any form of touching is quite not in the same category as anal penetration or even oral sex where the mouth is penetrated. I do believe that abstinence is the ultimate form of birth control, but I think much more needs to be said about what leads up to any activity and the reality of how many conduct their daily lives now.
Living in the USA in the 2001 century, I would hazard to say that very few unless rather young and under the guidance and direction of parents have not engaged in kissing or touching that may have advanced further than a handshake.
Though there are many cultures who are growing in numbers here in the US (coming from other countries) who may have brought with them much stricter senses of what is meant by sexual activity, for many the horse is already out of the box and it is quite unrealistic to view today's youth and even unmarried adults by those parameters.

 

[pym]

I'm still ok with the anceint definition. 'No outside sexual contact involving GENITALS'. An innocent kiss is just that. If people wanna have sex...so be it. But cop to it. You are only VIRGIN once...upon birth through to crossing sexual thresholds. Then you are NEVER a Virgin again.
No matter how specific segments of society debate it.
When the concept was first advanced thousands of years ago, it must have been serious consideration by tribal elders. I am sure that even long ago taboos regarding age were established.
I am sure long ago that STD's were recognized as a result of promiscuous sexual contact.
To some extent virginity was regarded in the same wise as purity.
It is certainly still a highly regarded thing between many young betrothed couples.
I dunno...what's changed?

Something that horrifies me is the fact that in countries like Afghanistan, barely pubescent 'GIRLS' are bartered off as wives for the best dowery.
VIRGINITY inspections ARE performed.
It would seem that 'Get em young' is the rule there, so as to avoid any possibilty of having VIRGINITY come into dispute.{this culturalism is far more HANDY for the Male practitioners}
I hate it when people say"who are you to question other cultures?"
It is a question of the state of mankind.

 

[IntoxicatingToxin]

In my opinion, if you haven't had sexual intercourse with someone, then you are a virgin. But handjobs and blowjobs don't count in that. But meh. Doesn't mean I'm right. :tongue:

 

[D_Ireonsyd_Colonrinse]

Xcuze: "I think the word has different meanings for Gays & Straights.

For straights its a word applied to those who have not had penetrative, vaginal sex. But for Gays it has a less strict meaning & generally means no sexual contact with another man.

Lets face it, if youve spent the night on your knees sucking cock then youre more of a slut than a virgin!"

--------------------

Different meanings for gays and straights?

So, by this logic, virgin gay guys who get a blowjob from T.R. Knight are no longer a "virgin" (since any "contact with another man" means loss of virginity).

Yet the virgin bi-curious straight guy ("90% straight") who decides to experiment and get the exact same blowjob from T.R. Knight --- he's still a virgin because of a lack of vaginal penetration??

Either blowjobs are or are not sexual intercourse. It has to work the same for everybody. The vagina, the mouth, the ass are all being penetrated by penis. Yet only one hole means loss of virginity?

 

[naughty]

LOL! Going back to my question how about hand jobs? touching breasts anuses, genitalia suddenly makes someone not a virgin? These are not penetrative acts. I think there can be a difference between having had some form of sexual contact and virginity. But why argue apples and oranges. It is like asking how close to the edge can you stand before you fall over... I do think the idea of virginity started within the heterosexual community probably for issues of paternity. That being said the lines of demarcation for virginity within the homosexual community may be different... Is it about intent or is it about the act itself. If it is about intent? Then there are probably fewer virgins at an even earlier age than ever before. What is the ultimate goal for most of sexual activity? Pleasure and release. You can not tell me that a small child who masturbates or even children playing doctor are not brought to it again and again because of its pleasurable properties. Does this make them non virginal? In their greater seeking of pleasure even at that young age may attempt using fingers and other object to penetrate orifices... Is it penetrative sex of any kind oral, anal, digital, vaginal? Where is the line drawn?

 

[pym]

I get the feeling that your looking for loopholes.:biggrin1:
Is that why you call yourself NAUGHTY?

 

[naughty]

I get the feeling that your looking for loopholes.:biggrin1:
Is that why you call yourself NAUGHTY?

LMAO! No, actually I am not. I would be what one might call a serious goody two shoes! I personally have held to a pretty strict standard for myself but I can totally see how the lines could be blurred depending upon the situation. Call it a curse I can see both sides of an argument. I found this blog which talks about virginity loss...

The Virginity Project: Virginity loss stories

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]t is an interesting question: what does it mean to lose your virginity?[/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]In the strictest term; you are a virgin until you've had sexual intercourse with the member of the opposite sex. But this definition leaves a lot of people out of the loop. While the social policy makers look to redefine marriage to include same sex partnerships, maybe it is time we also revisited what it means to be a virgin.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]When we think of virgins, we think of "white wedding innocents" who define sex as a synonym for gender. But the fact is, the standard definition of virginity lets you get away with having a lot of different kinds of sex was still being able to call yourself a virgin. In theory, under the traditional definition of virginity, someone who is homosexual can have sex every day and still be a virgin. Someone who has oral sex regularly is also still a virgin. Does that really make sense? Something is a miss![/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]The whole narrow definition of virginity is in desperate need of a rewrite. Who better to do it than the first generation of new millennium teens? What does "losing your virginity" mean to you? Is it a state of mind or a specific act? Is it something that can be taken from you, or does it only count if you willingly give it away? When does "fooling around" end and "having sex" begin?[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]When considering "the new definition", think about these situations and ask yourself how they fit in to the meaning of virginity.[/FONT]

• [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica][/FONT][FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]
  [*]Is someone who is raped or molested no longer a virgin?
  [*]Is actual intercourse the only act that counts when determining ones virginity?
  [*]If you willingly engage in other intimate sexual acts but do not have intercourse, is it fair to still consider yourself a virgin?
  [*]How would you define losing your virginity if you were/are homosexual or bisexual?
  [*]Is being a virgin based on your feelings, what you do, or is it a combination of both?
  [*]Is there an emotional component to losing your virginity, meaning if you have sex but don't feel anything is different about you, does it count?
  [*]Is the current definition of virginity, and all the social stigma attached to it, biased toward girls? Is this right?
  [*]Does the current definition of virginity exclude homosexuals? Is this right?
  [*]Is virginity subjective (based on how the individual views themselves and what they do) or objective (how the situation is viewed by others on the outside)?[/FONT]

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]Here is another definition...

[/FONT][FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica][SIZE=+1] Losing It: A New Definition... [/SIZE][/FONT]

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica][SIZE=-1]What does it mean to lose your virginity?[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] More of this Feature [/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] • The Traditional Definition

[/FONT]

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] Join the Discussion [/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] • Teen Advice
• Teen Love & Dating

[/FONT]

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] Related Resources[/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] • Teen Sexuality Books
• Age of Consent Chart
• FAQs on the AOC
• Sex & Pregnancy FAQ
• All About Virginity
• Being Sexually Active
• Practicing Abstinence

• QUIZ:
Sex, are you ready?

[/FONT]

[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] [/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] [/FONT] [FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica] [/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]I propose that virginity is twofold. I think there is an emotional virginity and a physical virginity. I think that to truly no longer be a virgin you must give up both the emotional attachment to your virginity and engage in physical acts of sex. In my "definition", any intimate sex act which involves nudity and stimulation with the goal of orgasm counts as sex. I think nudity and stimulation are the "points of no return", not penetration. Regardless of whether that act is heterosexual or homosexual in nature, if you share your body with another person, or if you give pleasure to another person that involves orgasm or intends to cause orgasm, you have had sex. I also feel that virginity is not something you "lose" or something that is "taken", but something you share with another person, like a rare chocolate or a once in a life time sunset. If you haven't given it, it doesn't completely count as being gone.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana, geneva, helvetica]I think that people who are raped and or molested are still virgins in the emotional sense even if their body has had sex. They have not stopped "being" a virgin, nor have they experienced the emotions that go along with giving ones body to another. If it is taken from you, although it may physically be sex, I don't think that it is fair to tell you you are no longer a virgin. You may still feel as if you have not had sex, you may still view sex with naivety. Being victimized should not force you to live with a label you neither wanted nor asked for. Virginity is not something we passively lose, non-virginity is something we deliberately choose to take.[/FONT]

 

[naughty]

Finally a test for those in doubt that happen to be straight. I didnt find one for gay individuals.

The Straight Virgin's Purity Test! quizzes test quiz tests trivia

 

[Principessa]

Different meanings for gays and straights?


So, by this logic, virgin gay guys who get a blowjob from T.R. Knight are no longer a "virgin" (since any "contact with another man" means loss of virginity).

Yet the virgin bi-curious straight guy ("90% straight") who decides to experiment and get the exact same blowjob from T.R. Knight --- he's still a virgin because of a lack of vaginal penetration??


Either blowjobs are or are not sexual intercourse. It has to work the same for everybody. The vagina, the mouth, the ass are all being penetrated by penis. Yet only one hole means loss of virginity?

Hmm, good argument. I take issue with the allegedly straight men who think they are virgins because they have thus far only had sex with she-males. Yes, I know a few on this very site. Or my personal favorite, the guy who had sex with a girl and she came but he didn't. So he thinks he is a virgin. :wtf1: Dude, you had your penis thrusting in and out of a vagina for 40 minutes. You are not a virgin! :duh:

 

[_avg_]

To me a virgin is someone who hasn't had sex. And sex is genital penetration of an orifice below the belt [sp. the vagina, but that's just my hetero bias]. I guess if you wanted to be so specific about it, you could call yourself a 'butt virgin.' :shrug:

I understand pym's point, though: if we allow someone who's sucked 100 dicks ("in a row?!") but never took one below the belt to be called a 'virgin,' what do we call someone who's never so much as touched a dick? ("A liar?" hehe) Conversely however, if we grant that a 'virgin' is someone who's never had contact with anothoer person's genitals (and vice versa), what do we call someone like our dick-sucker above? Until there's a term to adequetly describe someone who's had genital contact up to the point of penetration, I'm fine calling them 'virgins.'

 

[D_Ireonsyd_Colonrinse]

njqt:

Yeah. You're right. Sex with a she-male still means loss of virginity. Any other definition is denial.


I think an exception can be made for blow-up dolls though. Blow-up dolls are, technically, inanimate objects. So, I think the modern virgin is free to penetrate those holes - and exit them - with his virginity firmly intact.

 

[pym]

Blow-up dolls can take your virginity?:biggrin1::smile::biggrin1:

I'm LMAO !!:biggrin1:

 

[naughty]

Blow-up dolls can take your virginity?:biggrin1::smile::biggrin1:

I'm LMAO !!:biggrin1:

LOL! How about fleshlights? LOL!

 

[Jovial]

Each sexual act is rated as a percent of penetrative intercourse:
oral sex = 10%
rimming = 8%
handjob/fingering = 5%
sucking nipples or getting them sucked = 2%

If all you sexual acts add up to 100% or more then you aren't a virgin anymore.

For example, if you receive 5 blowjobs (50%), lick 2 pussies (20%), rim someone (8%), get 3 handjobs (15%) and suck 4 people's nipples (8%) it adds up to 101% so you are not a virgin anymore.