Is gay marriage really that serious?

Discussion in 'Relationships, Discrimination, and Jealousy' started by DV8, Jun 8, 2006.

  1. DV8

    DV8
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    Okay,( I want to apologize now, I'm half asleep, but I need to say this)

    So, my ex-boyfriend and I are still best friends, and we discuss things all the time, and one of his biggest concerns just so happens to be Gay Marriage. Personally, I don't really give a damn how it goes either way. I know that sounds horrible, with me being a gay male and all, but hear me out.
    Now, you watch the news, and see the bible thumpers screaming "Marriage is supposed to be between man and woman", "Adam and Eve, Not Adam Steve", etc. These are the same people whom are either married, or have been married, or too pathetic to have someone love them, so they sit at home all day watching day time television eating tuna with their 47 cats.
    It's 2006- you don't have to be in love to marry someone, and you sure as hell don't have to be "not in love with someone" to divorce(Jerry Springer has proved that quite well). In fact, it's starting to become apparent that many people do it just for the convience, and that's pathetic! What's the point?!?!?!? Is it really that serious?!
    And, I'm sure some of you know a few gay people who are all about committment. Me too! I'm one of them, but we also have a large number of those who end up having like 15 different boyfriends in one year! And those are the people who want to get married so badly!!!!! I can only imagine the divorce rate.
    55% of straight marriages end in divorce. That's a big number. If straight couples don't really value the unity anymore, why the hell should I? I've never been to value anything someone else didn't. Marriage isn't a sacred unity anymore. It's a sheet of paper that gives you power over property.

    Now, someone tell me- is it really that serious?

    Thanks,
    Dante':rolleyes:
     
  2. D_alex8

    D_alex8 Member

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    Is the institution of marriage per se all that important in this day and age?
    Probably not, imho, and on that level I agree with you.

    HOWEVER --- is the act of outlawing the possibility of gay marriage serious? Hell, yes. It is an attempt to enshrine homophobia and a non-egalitarian ethic on both a legal and a constitutional level.

    Therefore, whether one really cares or not about the institution is less relevant than whether one cares about equal rights for all. The latter is the real issue at stake.
     
  3. hottxboi16

    hottxboi16 Member

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    My view on the whole situation, is that i could care less about the marriage....what i care about is the fact that people are going out trying to set specific laws to limit my and other peoples abilities to do what we want.

    It has nothing to do with marriage, just the fact they are trying to tell us we cant do it which pisses me off. Hell if George W. Bush tried to pass a law that said Gays cant drive Hummers, despite the fact I hate hummers, I wouldnt care and itd still piss me off and still cause a lot of angst and so forth!

    basically what alex said...cuz I just read what he wrote xD
     
  4. Joseph

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    55% of all marriages?
    Wow... that's America wow...
    Well I could say some words about the meaning of marriage and about my theories why so many marriages end with divorce... but because im stupid and stuff I'll pass on that and I'll just say

    I think the question "what sense does marriage make?" is a question one must awnser himself ... but is it not the same question as "is there something like love?".
    Ok that sounded cheesy... sorry... ill try to make it sound difrent
    If you got nobody you want to spend the rest of your life with, then marriage truly is bullshit
    oh that sounded rough....
    I just want to say marriage is a nice thing if someone means it seriously and not like a "ticket to his own wedding party"

    Oh man im talking nonesense am I not?
     
  5. Timmoh

    Timmoh Member

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    Personally I don't give a fuck if 2 men marry eachother. Even if you want to marry your dog I wouldn't mind as long as it makes you happy.
     
  6. B_IanTheTall

    B_IanTheTall New Member

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    It isn't just an issue of gay marriage, it's about codifying discrimination into the Constitution. Once this has occurred the barriers to introducing other discriminatory legislation are lowered.

    There is also the risk of later defining marriage as being meant for procreation, preventing marriage between couples that have fertility issues. It might even get to the point where self righteous wingers and grandchild obsessed parents take it upon themselves to forcibly divorce heterosexual couples that don't want children. This might seem far fetched but in the post Terri Schiavo world anything is possible.
     
  7. JustAsking

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    Ya gotta love that John Stewart. The other day he was interviewing William Bennett, who was claiming that gay marriage destabilizes the institution of marriage. To which Stewart asked, "Fifty five percent of all marriages end in divorce. Are you telling me that 55% of all marriages end in gayness?"

    I agree with the posters here that even if you don't consider marriage an important institution, this recent move for a ban on gay marriages is an attack on homosexuals and an attempt to write bigotry and discrimination into the Constitution. That's what makes it an important concern, at the very least.
     
  8. Mr. Snakey

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    The question of gay marriage i feel will be left up to individual states Thats why its important for people to vote! sad fact is gay or straight alot of people are lazy and dont vote
     
  9. chico8

    chico8 New Member

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    marriage isn't about love, it's about a legal contract that confers certain legal rights and responsibilities. We're well past the point in history where marriage is solely about procreation and more about security and tax benefits. As Alex says, it's also about civil rights. This country has never passed an amendment singling out a subgroup of the population and limiting their rights. You need to look beyond the idea of marriage and see the big picture.
     
  10. Honey_Grrrl83

    Honey_Grrrl83 New Member

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    It doesn't matter to me if two people of the same sex get married,I mean,it's really none of my buisness,I think the reason why the gay marriage issue is so important is because of the legal rights that married people have,personally I think Bush brought the issue back into play to divert attention away from the Iraq mess:confused: Anyway,I think it is morally wrong to deny two people in love the same rights all of us straight people get to enjoy(?) I always tell people who are against gay marriage to think about something for a minute,which scenario is worse,two drunk straight people stumble into a 24 hour wedding chapel in Vegas,then get married and divorced within a 48 hour period:confused: Or the scenario involving a commited gay couple,with kids and everything,getting married and staying together until death do they part,seriously,which one is more moral?
     
  11. DC_DEEP

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    Thanks, chico. Seems there are many who are missing the point here. If marriage were only a matter of being with someone, whether or not you love them, you could just simply live together. The bigger issue is a legal one... and goes way beyond just the terminology. Civil unions and domestic partnerships a a couple of short steps in a miles-long journey. The GAO (General Accountability Office) of the United States has identified 1,138 items in federal law that provide specific protections and benefits only to legally married couples... not unions and not partnerships. It covers an amazingly broad area. Check the websites of Lambda Legal Defense of Human Rights Campaign for more information.

    If a same-gender couple has been together for 15 or 20 or more years, chances are that they have a lot of joint property, among other things. In the eyes of the feds, and of most states, that's just an unfortunate situation if one of them should die unexpectedly. The survivor (in many cases, even with a perfectly-executed will) has no legal protections. For our politicians to try to shore up those inequalities (not to mention 14th amendment violations) is nothing short of criminal.
     
  12. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

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    Yes. It's that serious. If for no other reason then our President himself finds it just cause to alter the most revered document in American history to disclude it from availabilty to those like you and me.

    Yes, it's that important. And for you not to see in those terms astounds me. Be as blasé as you like about the futility and success rate of heterosexual unions but make no mistake the message is clear:

    "You can be our interior decorators and our hairdressers but you'd better fucking watch you backs if you think for one moment we truly think you belong to this society in just that same way we do"

    It's a social issue DrGodiva not a religous one.

    I sincerely hope you're mistaken uncut. Were that the case in the south in the 1960s black children would still be segregated from their white counterparts...:rolleyes:
     
  13. D_Paul_Bunion

    D_Paul_Bunion Account Disabled

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    I'd like to agree with those that are saying that it is less about allowing any one couple to marry and more about discrimination aginst a group of people as a whole. My partner and I have now been together for 10 years. We own a house together, we share finances, etc. Now there are ways for us to protect each others interests but the government wants to permanently take the most meaningful option off the table. And like others have posted, there's a whole set of other rights/benefits that open up to you if you are married. All of those rights/benefits would be unavailable to any homosexual in this country.

    I always shake my head at those that say gay marriages would destroy the institution of marriage. Have they looked at the 'institution' recently? It doesn't look all that healthy right now. I don't see how allowing other loving couples to make a commitment to each other could possibly further erode its meaning.

    For our federal government to be actively pursuing discrimination against the homosexual community is disgraceful.
     
  14. ck85x65

    ck85x65 New Member

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    Happily married to the same woman for 23 years, two wonderful sons 15 and 13 years of age. We live in Toronto, and were recently invited to our first 'gay wedding'. Both of the guys were well known to us, one of them works alongside my wife. They have lived together for about 6 years.

    The attendees included many races, cultures, colours and different sexual orientations (this is Toronto, after all).

    The ceremony was conducted in what was once a church, an historic building (now it is a venue available for anyone who wants to rent it). The ceremony was conducted by one of the justices who helped draft the Law in Ontario that allowed same-sex marriage, both as a legal right and a recognized institution (which extended to same sex couples the same rights granted to male/female marriages, in the eyes of the law).

    Both grooms were dressed in finest Scottish full regalia (their heritage). The ceremoney was an exchange of vows very similar to 'regular' weddin, (forsake all others, in sickness and health, for richer or poorer, for as long as you both shall live -- you get the picture).

    To me the best part was the justice asking all attendees to stand and say 'I do" when he asked us to support this union, these two people who loved each other, who had, in public, declared their intent, for the rest of their lives. in other words, we - the community- have a vested interest in seeing the institutiuon of marriage prevail -- in all of its forms. He then whispered some special words only the two of them could hear, they sealed their union with a demure kiss, and went off to sign the licence at a table nearby. We were invited to go to the reception area while they took pictures, with all the families.

    It was magnificent. I do not understand why anyone would object. Can we not just say to our children -- when you find someone to love, who also loves you, grab them and hold on to them for the rest of your life ?
     
  15. marty

    marty New Member

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    hey there
    my now civil partner and myself had a fantastic civil ceremony on christmas eve of last year, it was attened by the people who care for us, and we are proud to be united as one. the cicvil ceremony 'marriage' has also ensured security for us both in knowing the each other will be looked after should anything happen and the government will get NOTHING.
     
  16. dong20

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    To me, that is what matters, in comparison, everything else is a 'nice to have'...:smile:
     
  17. fortiesfun

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    Although I am in a straight marriage, for well over 20 years now, I must join the chorus of those who say this is a big deal. Legalized discrimination, however you dress it up, disrupts democracy. Slippery slope, and all that jazz. I don't have any interest in personally entering into a gay marriage myself, but that is not the threshold for involvement in the political process. The right question is "Are fundamental human rights being threatened?" If so, we all have a reason to think it is a very big deal, indeed, and get involved. Vote. Vote early. Vote often.
     
  18. D_Elijah_MorganWood

    D_Elijah_MorganWood New Member

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    My partner and I have been together nearly 6 years. I used to have the "I don't give a fuck about Gay Marriage" attitude. As I matured and my situation changed from having a few boyfriends in a row to having a partner, it became important.

    From the Fundie bible beaters to right-wing republicans and hate-mongers, this issue has become their platform for spreading homophobia. They're absolutely terrified of gay people having the same rights they do.

    I've had many chances over the years to help change the minds of some of these people. Obviously, they hate what they fear and fear what they don't understand. They've come into my home, met my partner and were astonished to find our household the same in most respects as a straight married couple. As I've said here before, my partner and I will be married this year. It's looking like Boston.
     
  19. DC_DEEP

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    You know, I have tried many times over the last several years to get an opponent to explain, in a clear, logical, concise way, what their reasoning is. HOW exactly is it a threat to heterosexual marriage, I have asked. None, so far, have accepted the challenge. That should explain a lot.
     
  20. Wonderboy

    Wonderboy New Member

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    There should be a choice for gay marriage as there is for heterosexual marriage.

    I don't really have any intention of getting married. Although I would like a long term/lifelong partner...although maybe that's unrealistic. A series of good relationships with girls, without too much time being single is all I want.

    I fail to see the point in marriage.
     
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