Is it time to care yet?

madame_zora

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Shelby said:
I know hardly anyone here believes this is even remotely possible but my point was that it just might turn out GW is in this thing for exactly what he says. And 30 years down the road they won't be routinely murdering women over there for losing their virginity before marriage and all the other whacked out shit they do.

GW may, like Lincoln, be viewed by history as a hero, not a fool.


You're right, there's no way that's possible. In order to believe that I'd have to be able to ignore an avalanche of evidence to the contrary, and without being a fundamentalist, I just can't do that.
 

EnglishGentleman

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Shelby said:
I know hardly anyone here believes this is even remotely possible but my point was that it just might turn out GW is in this thing for exactly what he says. And 30 years down the road they won't be routinely murdering women over there for losing their virginity before marriage and all the other whacked out shit they do.

GW may, like Lincoln, be viewed by history as a hero, not a fool.

Nope. He's a fool now and always will be. He's made an ass of himself and shown up his nation. IMHO he'll be the president America will want to forget, even more than Nixon. At least he was just a liar, not a liar AND a fool.
 

Rikter8

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ORCABOMBER said:
how can anyone vote for someone so stupid! He's not got any logic, shine of leadership, or even "ulterior motives". I mean, Katrina was NOT his fault, it was a natural disaster, but the American response puts every third world country to shame.

Think about it, the famine in Somalia has a faster response then the US government to New Orleans. Aren't any of you Patriots? Aren't any of you upset that your own nation needed to pool resources from charity like a scrounging Nigerian (no offence). Aren't any of you embarrased that the richest nation on the planet needed help from foreign nations?

I was going to go into a very long rant. :rant:

However, I deleted it, and would rather just make brief statements.

1. Bush never won the election. He Bought it.
2. Bush and his administration have strategically imbedded themselves into many aspects of our system, intending to bankrupt all americans.
3. The current administration is making a clear and wide separation of RICH and POOR. The Middle Class is almost extinct.
4. I am not ashamed of being a True American. No Import or transplant can take that away from me.
5. I will not be ashamed of my heritage because One Completely Insane Person chooses to Bankrupt this Country, then leave with the bank.
6. Corrupt Laws have rendered many patriots powerless. (But not all...)
7. New Orleans is a double Edged Sword.

8. Why Should America Be Ashamed of asking for money from foreign nations?
How many BILLIONS of dollars have we donated out to the world to keep them afloat.
If foreign nations gave a Damn about the world as they proclaim, they would have helped.

The Flip side to #8 is imported goods should have been handled by local authorities. It was the goddamned greedy big-co contractors that monopolized everything.
 

EnglishGentleman

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I can't comment too much on the domestic issues, but Rikter8 talks sense to me. I've great respect for the American people, just not for your President and his fervent supporters.
 

Rikter8

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Im sorry if I seem so One sided, and Upset.

I guess Until you've lived in this hardship, you can't realize the intense frustration that I have felt over the past 10 years.
I'm sure there are Many more americans in the same boat, and it seems that the lake were floating in, gets larger day by day.

It's not easy watching your rights slip away, and everything you worked so hard for, taken away from you.

C
 

TylerDurden

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While I am a conservative politically (not ness. a republican, mind you) I'll admit - I'm losing more and more faith in GW. The handling of Katrina, the war in Iraq, outsourcing...we are in a time that historically has no precedent, and as such the need for an outstanding leader is exponentially greater. Kerry for sure wasn't one, Bush isn't going to turn into one overnight....so which do you choose - the devil you don't know, or the one that you do?

Or we all go live in cabins again, and force the world into a premature dark age to let the world recover....whatever works :)
 

D_Humper E Bogart

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Rikter8 said:
I was going to go into a very long rant. :rant:

However, I deleted it, and would rather just make brief statements.

1. Bush never won the election. He Bought it.
2. Bush and his administration have strategically imbedded themselves into many aspects of our system, intending to bankrupt all americans.
3. The current administration is making a clear and wide separation of RICH and POOR. The Middle Class is almost extinct.
4. I am not ashamed of being a True American. No Import or transplant can take that away from me.
5. I will not be ashamed of my heritage because One Completely Insane Person chooses to Bankrupt this Country, then leave with the bank.
6. Corrupt Laws have rendered many patriots powerless. (But not all...)
7. New Orleans is a double Edged Sword.

8. Why Should America Be Ashamed of asking for money from foreign nations?
How many BILLIONS of dollars have we donated out to the world to keep them afloat.
If foreign nations gave a Damn about the world as they proclaim, they would have helped.

The Flip side to #8 is imported goods should have been handled by local authorities. It was the goddamned greedy big-co contractors that monopolized everything.
You don't really need to rant y'know, it's called Karma, be at peace with yourself, and let everyone else kill each other. China rules with that idea so far. Anyway.

1) If Bush bought an election, then you're conceeding your country is undermocratic and by proxy a dictatorship. Way to go.
2) I don't care for local finances, let alone international, I'll take your word.
3) Same with the UK I suppose, I don't see that as a bad thing when money still decides your status, rather than your inbreeding pool as it traditionally is here.
4) Me, I'm a bit "grey". I believe that our biggest enemies our ourselves to be honest.
5) I tend to think along the lines of "Blair does not represent my view". But I'm politically neutral. Gives me the right to call everyone fools.
6) Same here, oh well.
7) Not really, there's a disaster, get it solved. Any president should be leading the charge, if there's problems, say there's problems. I don't blame the weather, I blame the person who sent more millitary vehicles than aid stuff. *shrug*
8) Just don't go with the "we're the most powerful nation on the world" chant. :p It's like the lion with the nail in it's claw asking the mouse for help. While the mouse is certainly happy to help, it's probably thinking "Hey, you're the lion, why can't you do it yourself?" Co-operation is not a bad thing. Just remember to shit in the direction of some third world countries who DID help from time to time.

8 2/3) Ultimately the way most countries see you is as an arrogant superpower who proclaim authority on all social and economic affairs, and have a huge and unbalanced influence in the affairs in foreign countries. Heck, my country even lets your millitary jets take priority over civilian airspace! So with all this power and control at one's fingertips, it isn't a question of "should" the world help, but why should they need to.

You're not a poor disadvantaged county, you are arming up to be in a position to destroy Asia and Europe if need be, heck, the technology resources and money is staggering, even your social and services are the envy of the world.

If anything, the slow response shows that your government cares more about containing a crisis over a foreign oil pipeline then for it's own citizens to be looked after.
 

D_Herin_Ghan

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madame_zora said:
Another in the long line of bush's blatant lies to the american public. I know nobody cares, but it looks like he was caught on film being briefed about katrina before it hit. He said he wasn't told the magnitude, which turns out to be false. NOW he says he was only told once, not several times. Wow, I guess the members of FEMA forgot that a babbling idiot needs things repeated several times to understand them. Otherwise he plays guitar.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060302/ap_on_go_pr_wh/katrina_video

I think everyone in the fucking country knew about this hurricane's magnitude. Saying OMG he knew! Isn't saying much. Everyone knew.
 

brainzz_n_dong

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One thing to keep in mind is that Katrina was officially a Cat 3 hurricane when it hit NOLA, not a 4 or 5 like it was earlier in its trek. It brought the storm surge of a strong 4 but had the actual wind power of one a notch lower. What level of destruction might have occurred at a higher wind level - hopefully the strained levees will never find out.

Nagin wouldn't use the large quantity of busses available to get the citizens out, Blanco would not authorize the call-up of the nat. guard and was holding a prayer vigil at one point during the unfolding disaster, and Bush said the fed gov't was ready to respond while he was making speeches on social security. They were all told 56 hours in advance what was potentially going to happen. Local and state officials did not officially order an evacuation until 19 hours before landfall and the feds didn't make any better use of their allotted time, either, to mass resources.

I think the best image available for what you'd want during a crisis are the pics of Guiliani walking the streets of NYC on 9/11 with the different commissioners either at his side or on his phone, responding and cutting through all levels of bureaucracy to get what needs to be done accomplished. Not 15 different vested interests all preparing as to how to defend themselves against charges of dropping the ball if ball-dropping happens.

The bureaucrats at the Dept of Homeland Hacks could prove to be useful if they'd personally sign up for inspection duty at our nat'l ports, guard duties at our southern borders, or, if that's too boring for them, be willing to become human cruise missles and be fired from B-52's at suspected Taliban/Al-Qaeda hideouts in Asia...munitions strapped to them, of course.
 

b.c.

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Well, perhaps i can add my 2 cents to this, as one who lived the disaster (tho not nearly to the degree of those poor unfortunates who either couldn't or wouldn't leave this city of New Orleans).

That Friday before the storm i got home and discovered there was a hurricane approaching the east coast of Florida. Tho it's predicted track took it across the mainland then turning northward into the Florida panhandle, I got on the phone and immediately made hotel reservations in Texas. Why? If you wait, they all go - every room within 1,500 miles. WE started securing and moving some things that nite.

But by noon (Saturday) the track had shifted to the west. And it was now coming right for us - a cat 5. That gave us less than 24 hours to pack up, board up, and get out. Why? The prior evacuation took us 20 hrs. in bumper to bumper traffic to get to Texas (normally a 5 hr. trip). Sunday morning we were hitting the road. Didn't take as long this time. Only 18 hours.

Well, in that situation there are a lot of things you don't think of doing. You're trying to do it all thru a mixture of emotions: fear, panic, hope, determination, sadness, excitement...

You're busy making ready while you're also hoping the track will change. You're struggling (in 95 degree heat) to board up your home, but you're thinking it'll all blow away anyway. You know there's going to be water, but you're not sure how much. You're thinking well maybe my roof will blow off but still you put stuff high on top of things...bookshelves, etc. (which as it turns out, collasped or floated anyway, after sitting for weeks in 5+ feet of water).

Point being, you just can't think of every eventuality. So you can't fault people for what they didn't think of doing BEFORE the storm. But you sure as HELL can fault them for what they didn't and STILL aren't doing 6 months afterward. And the response and support have been lousy.

It's said that good can come of bad. So if some good comes of this disaster, then maybe (just maybe) people's eyes will be opened to the lack of leadership this country has had under George Bush (and others), to the character of the people who get elected to office, and in particular, to the kind of political philosophies that gets these kind of people elected, time and time again.
 

Shelby

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Mostly lifelong moochers complaining about Uncle Sam (me) not doing enough to take care of their lazy asses.

They knew where they lived.

I reserve my pity.
 

b.c.

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Shelby said:
Mostly lifelong moochers complaining about Uncle Sam (me) not doing enough to take care of their lazy asses.

They knew where they lived.

I reserve my pity.

Yeah, there are many like u who dismiss it all with that kind of ignorant asshole logic.

Only, maybe the same logic can be applied to: they knew they lived on the shoreline, they knew they lived in tornado alley, they knew they lived on a faultline, they knew they worked in a highrise, they knew they lived on the side of a mountain...etc. etc.

Nor are we "mostly lifelong moochers" or "lazy asses" (or maybe you missed that part about us being homeowners).

Or maybe you just posted this comment to get a rise out of me. HEY! It worked. FUCK YOU buddy!!
 

Chrisie

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Hi again, I think youre probably right,mind you we in England have Tony Blaire now saying God will judge him on Iraq,all the rest of us with more than two brain cells already have .Hope your years going well ,Take care.