Is Romance Dead?

naughty

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WOW Gone A,

That is really sad. Needless to say she either had issues or was not being completely honest with you. I think as we get older many of the assumptions and arrogance of youth hopefully fade away and we look for what is real. I think for many of us it take a while to sort through all of the subterfuge to find what really works for us. I think many times we are suprised when we find that our personal best is not necessarily a perfect person but the perfect person for us.

naughty
 

GoneA

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naughty said:
WOW Gone A,

That is really sad. Needless to say she either had issues or was not being completely honest with you. I think as we get older many of the assumptions and arrogance of youth hopefully fade away and we look for what is real. I think for many of us it take a while to sort through all of the subterfuge to find what really works for us. I think many times we are suprised when we find that our personal best is not necessarily a perfect person but the perfect person for us.

naughty

wonderfully written. that really is great/sage advice.
 

MsLulu

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GoneA, that's pretty crummy. Am very sorry that happened. :( First off, I agree with a few ladies here in that the "bad boy" is a sexy fantasy and if a guy can pull off the "rough around the edges-yet gentlemanly at the same time" then that there would be the answer to everyone's prayers.

A girl that would actually say "you're not a big enough asshole for me to be with" is a girl who isn't ready to commit, or who doesn't have enough self confidence to pursue a healthy relationship. She must have felt pretty bad about herself to actually want to date "an asshole."

And for the record: there's a big difference between "the bad boys" that turn women on... and "the asshole."

Bad Boy - Happy Gilmore
Asshole - Shooter McGavin

(For any Adam Sandler fans out there)

On a side note:
In the movie Bridget Jones' Diary (yes, sorry guys a CHICK FLICK, one of the FEW I enjoyed) the "nice guy" (Colin Firth) kisses Bridget (Renee Z) at the end of the movie when she's finally realized just how much she likes this guy.

Bridget: (after having a kiss that literally knocked her socks off) "nice boys don't kiss like that."
Nice Guy Firth: (breathy) "Oh Yes, they fucking do."
(another kiss)

I think that one scene changed my mind forever in regard to "nice guys."
 

Lordpendragon

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Liberation works both ways - most are realising that women aren't made of sugar and spice and all things nice (incidentally I'm not made of slugs and snails and puppy dog's tails).

You may find youself with a female boss who breaks your balls worse than any guy would.

You may see your friends or family being destroyred by the bitch from hell and her pack of lawyers.

You will see in the news now, women who kill their children, women who physically abuse their partners and children, women marines who degrade humanity, cheats liars fraudsters that compete with any man. In the UK nearly 80% of women alleging date rape drugging were found to have massive levels of alcohol rather than any drugs and a large % of rape and sexual harassment allegations are admitted to be made as a tool for revenge.

Its just not possible to categorise women as one thing that a man is going to be a good husband/partner/father/provider for.

So I just treat everyone as I find them - but I will open the door for you.
 

KidBrown

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Man, don't start with the rape stuff. People bringing up stats like that make it that much harder for a woman to get a fair shake in court when she's been violated.

Provide me evidence with this "large percentage" argument as well.
 

B_caneadea

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:rolleyes:
madame_zora said:
Being alone is still preferable to being in an unhappy relationship, for whatever reason. If I don't find myself adequately compatible with someone I'd rather be fwbs than to attempt to turn it into more than it is.
I fully expect to be alone for a long time because my list of "wants" for a relationship are somewhat unrealistic, or at least won't be easy to fill. That being said, I'm perfectly content with things as they are, so in order for me to be willing to make a change, I'd have to believe that a relationship would add more to my life than it would take away.

Women generally can't compete with men physically, and I detest lowering standards in the workplace to include them. If a woman is one of those exceptional ones who can do a construction job as well as a man, she should be prepared to carry the same load, not get the nearest guy to lift the heavy stuff for her. I am especially cognisant of anyone less "able" than myself who may be in need of assistance with little things like opening heavy doors, bus seats and the like. I'm stronger than average and feel it is my self-chosen obligation to make things easier for those around me, but this is not because I feel they are ineffectual, it's just my way of trying to be a nice person. If a man holds a door for me, I will respond with a sincere "thank you" because I recognise that he is doing what I frequently do, and I appreciate that. If he does not, he is saying that he feels I am capable of doing it for myself and I appreciate that as well. Personally, I would be uncomfortable with a man that always felt it was necessary to do those sorts of things, because I would feel he saw me in a less-competent light.

Women who blither on about equality and never offer to split the check or take turns paying for outings should be shot. This is another area of antiquated thinking and makes those of us who truly do understand what equality is all about look suspicious. Generally, I feel that whoever makes the most money should pay the most frequently, but the job of paying for things should be shared, according to income. Times I've dated men who made significantly less than me, I've expected very little contribution from them for our dating. I don't feel that dating should be an unnecessary financial drain on anyone, and if you're on similar financial planes, things should be shared evenly. However, if one of you makes 100k and the other makes 20k, obviously splitting things evenly would place an unfair burden on the one who makes less. I'm tickled silly if a broke guy takes me to Taco Bell because he's living within his means and still trying to show me he cares.

WOW, Madame_Zora!

I was extremely impressed with everything you said. You sound like the partner most people are looking for. Seriously.
 

Lordpendragon

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KidBrown said:
Man, don't start with the rape stuff. People bringing up stats like that make it that much harder for a woman to get a fair shake in court when she's been violated.

Provide me evidence with this "large percentage" argument as well.

Self-defined “unapologetic feminist” Professor ? (female) Kelly spoke clearly and refused to be brow-beaten by Melanie Philips. She gave the current statistics as: police estimate 9% of reported rape allegations are false, 5% of reported rape accusations result in conviction, which leaves 86% of reported rapes which the police believe are true but don’t result in convictions.

Perhaps significant is a better word than large (particularly if it is you being accused) and there is more argument over the 86% than from this source - birdwoman.co.uk

False sexual harassment stats are much higher. I knew a teacher who was falsely accused by two girls who didn't like him - he proved his innocence (interesting way round) but it ruined his life.
 

naughty

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Gentlemen,

It is unfortunate that there are women out here who "cry wolf" . It really helps no one. In fact, there are many sexual assaults that go unreported because there will always be the insulting question , "Ms. so and so, are you a scorned woman?" Assault is no game. We all need to mean what we say, say what we mean, and leave games of exaggeration for the playground, not the bedroom. This type of behavior doesnt just start when we are old enough to engage in sexual relations. I happen to know one very pretty little girl who is on her way to a world full of trouble at the ripe age of 5. She already at this point can see the difference in the way she is treated versus other less attractive children. So, she has already begun using the very games that could lead her into tease and accusation situations.We need to stress honesty from the beginning and take responsibility to our actions and their consequences.
 

Ryandaoc

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I have a nice rule that I try to live by...

Treat every woman like a lady, until she proves to you that she is not.
Treat every man like a guy, until he proves to you that he deserves better.

I just find my Grand-Mother standing around me saying "If you can't say it before the Mother Mary, then you shouldn't say it in front of a girl."

This guide has worked for me both professionally and personally for many years with tremendous success.
 

Matthew

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Lordpendragon said:
police estimate 9% of reported rape allegations are false, 5% of reported rape accusations result in conviction, which leaves 86% of reported rapes which the police believe are true but don’t result in convictions.

Perhaps significant is a better word than large
I'd say small is a better word than large.

Assuming these statistics are correct (I haven't checked them), it would be interesting to see how they stack up against false accusations of other crimes. What I remember learning is the false accusation #s are about the same.

In any case, lordpendragon, it seems that part of your argument is undermined.
 

KidBrown

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The low conviction rate could occur because of a few factors. One, a lot of women don't go running to the police as soon as the rape occurs, because most cases happen with someone the woman knows. Thus, any physical evidence could be gone at that time. Two, you said yourself that only "nine percent" of rape accusations are considered false. That doesn't seem like a large percentage to me.
 

DC_DEEP

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(back to the original topic...) My partner and I are very romantic with each other, but mostly in a sense of just doing small things, unexpectedly, to make the other happy. We both, on occasion when out shopping, will make an impulse stop by a local florist, and pick up a small bouquet. We leave random love notes around the house. I hide Hershey's Kisses in his briefcase. He keeps a stash of postcards (from his travels) at his office, and sends them to me with a sexy message, and signed "Your secret admirer." Either of us will open the door for the other - just whoever gets there first. We hold hands when we walk through the park. Nothing super, nothing out of the ordinary, we just love each other and try to find ways to show it - other than just saying it (which we also do.) Romance is not dead, but you have to cultivate it.
 

GoneA

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DC_DEEP said:
(back to the original topic...) My partner and I are very romantic with each other, but mostly in a sense of just doing small things, unexpectedly, to make the other happy. We both, on occasion when out shopping, will make an impulse stop by a local florist, and pick up a small bouquet. We leave random love notes around the house. I hide Hershey's Kisses in his briefcase. He keeps a stash of postcards (from his travels) at his office, and sends them to me with a sexy message, and signed "Your secret admirer." Either of us will open the door for the other - just whoever gets there first. We hold hands when we walk through the park. Nothing super, nothing out of the ordinary, we just love each other and try to find ways to show it - other than just saying it (which we also do.) Romance is not dead, but you have to cultivate it.

i must say, you may have the best relationship in the Earth.
 

Lordpendragon

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Matthew said:
I'd say small is a better word than large.

Assuming these statistics are correct (I haven't checked them), it would be interesting to see how they stack up against false accusations of other crimes. What I remember learning is the false accusation #s are about the same.

In any case, lordpendragon, it seems that part of your argument is undermined.

If your local Police Force was known to be framing one in ten suspects, would you consider that of any consequence?

Our legal system demands proof beyond reasonable doubt, a minimum ten percent chance of the allegations being false would justify doubt in my mind. Certainly not proof of innocence, but that isn't the point.

People who make false allegations are doing everyone a serious dis-service, especially the genuine victims.

The growth of false accusations of sexual harassment are so serious that even our government workers have a formal group to defend the falsely accused amongst them.

I suppose the point that I am making is that the general environment for romance has taken a bit of a kicking.
 

B_caneadea

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DC_DEEP said:
(back to the original topic...) My partner and I are very romantic with each other, but mostly in a sense of just doing small things, unexpectedly, to make the other happy. We both, on occasion when out shopping, will make an impulse stop by a local florist, and pick up a small bouquet. We leave random love notes around the house. I hide Hershey's Kisses in his briefcase. He keeps a stash of postcards (from his travels) at his office, and sends them to me with a sexy message, and signed "Your secret admirer." Either of us will open the door for the other - just whoever gets there first. We hold hands when we walk through the park. Nothing super, nothing out of the ordinary, we just love each other and try to find ways to show it - other than just saying it (which we also do.) Romance is not dead, but you have to cultivate it.

:) Dear "DC_DEEP",
You said a mouthful and I can identify. I am romantic and I am lucky to have found a partner who is also romantic. It's definitely the little things.
My partner travels for work and he rarely fails to bring back a little something that he knows I would enjoy. I always unlock the passenger side car door so that he doesn't have to wait to get in. We make tea for each other. I try to make a nice dinner when he will be coming home from a trip. He calls(I hate the telephone) or we email each other to share our day. Such "little" things but, they let me know that I am loved and I know that he feels the same way. I'm lucky. I know it.
Romance is a voluntary effort and I've noticed that it has to be appreciated to keep it alive...............
 

D_Salmaine Sharpshlong

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Just because the topic tends toward penises does not mean that men don't appreciate the beauty of women and treat them as ladies. I alway try to behave as a gentleman. I think romance stems from treating a women as if she is the most special person in the world....which she often is.....and making her appreciate herself by showering her with affection.

That is the key to a good relationship. All this talk about big penises is purely about sex....most often short term.....the key to long lasting partnership is affection, love and respect.

no you weren't getting too philosophical,,,,,for me anyway.
 

DC_DEEP

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GoneA and Caneadea, thanks. <blush> I do think I have one of the best relationships in the world - but it doesn't just happen, we make it that way. It doesn't hurt that we are so very compatible. You know, the "golden rule" goes a long way in my book. If you treat someone with respect, and treat them as if they are the most important thing in the world, it just makes your whole environment more pleasant.

Something I left out of my original post - every night when we go to bed and the lights go off, we spend those last few waking moments snuggling and talking about the day's events and plans for tomorrow... and when the alarm goes off in the morning, we spend about 5 minutes or so snuggling and talking about plans for the day. Since he has to leave for work before me, I make coffee while he is showering & shaving, and have a cup waiting for him when he gets out of the shower and starts to get dressed.
 

GoneA

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and the two lived happily every after.

but the tale of GoneA's love-life is a horse of a different color. To quote from the illustrious Madame_Zora: "... i have a better chance of finding a unicorn" than finding the right person for me.

*goes hunting for unicorn*