Is the usa a racist country? yea or nay?

[marinera]

Why argue with him? ...

Right. It is a waste of time.

 

[marinera]

It's not specifically American.

American racism is different because it has roots in white Americans encouraging racism in poor white Americans in order to screw over poor white Americans. ...

America is where modern racism striclty said full grown (although the origin is in UK, With Thomas Galton).
Samuel George Morton (1799–1851) was an American physician and natural scientist.
Samuel George Morton is often thought of as the originator of "American School" ethnography, a school of thought in antebellum American science that claimed the difference between humans was one of species rather than variety and is seen by some as the origin of scientific racism.[6]
Samuel George Morton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

From there (pseudo)scientific racism, s the idea tha some races are better than others, spread in Europe. Hitler' theories about the aryan race, he learnt from there.

News papers with significative circulation is claiming that Jews were "The World' Problem" were print in America first. The raising of Nazi German as world threat was helped by some of the most important American entrepreuners, who liked Hilter' ideas.

Racism in America has targeted not just blacks, but Native Americans, Asians, Italians, Greeks, Spanish, Latins, shortly: anyone who wasn't a blond white Christian.

 

[Jjz1109]

Really? Well, since you are being so condescending and purposedly obtuse, I'll tell you something that you don't know: racism properly said, ad the idea tht one race is better than others, is a specific American product. Other nations could have the idea that their culture was better than others, but not theat a race is better than others. "White supremacy" is made in USA and you can find it in other English speaking countries. That can explain why you have Nazists and Klu Klux Klan supporting Trump right now, while you are dening that USA has a problem with racism.

Lol. Who is being condescending here?

You have missed the point. I have said racism exists everywhere. I have been to Rome and have seen how the police treat and hassle gypsies and the African peddlers. It's not too far off some of the incidents this country has dealt with. But does it get the same press? No. I have previously shared how my niece and her husband honeymooned in Rome and Tuscany. My niece was asked if her husband, who is black, was "a famous football player from America." Dude, ignorance and racism are everywhere. It may be more subtle in some places. We are more upfront in this country, we talk about, it's a daily issue. Your view is short sighted, and as I have said, elitist in thinking it's not a problem in your country. Open your eyes.

 

[Oxnard]

America is where modern racism striclty said full grown (although the origin is in UK, With Thomas Galton).
Samuel George Morton (1799–1851) was an American physician and natural scientist.
Samuel George Morton is often thought of as the originator of "American School" ethnography, a school of thought in antebellum American science that claimed the difference between humans was one of species rather than variety and is seen by some as the origin of scientific racism.[6]
Samuel George Morton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

From there (pseudo)scientific racism, s the idea tha some races are better than others, spread in Europe. Hitler' theories about the aryan race, he learnt from there.

News papers with significative circulation is claiming that Jews were "The World' Problem" were print in America first. The raising of Nazi German as world threat was helped by some of the most important American entrepreuners, who liked Hilter' ideas.

Racism in America has targeted not just blacks, but Native Americans, Asians, Italians, Greeks, Spanish, Latins, shortly: anyone who wasn't a blond white Christian.

It is hard to find any intellectuals from the 1700s and 1800s who didn't assume that non-whites are inferior, even the so-called liberals.

 

[marinera]

It is hard to find any intellectuals from the 1700s and 1800s who didn't assume that non-whites are inferior, even the so-called liberals.

As a theoretic statement, yes. It is something completely different than modern racism. Shortly said, before scientific racism, which developed in UK and USA (and thereafter in Australia), thinkers believe that the climate and education caused variations among ethnicitis, not that were biological differences. For example Immanuel Kant believed that blacks, since more exposed to the sun, had not enough iron in the blood, so they became lazy. His theory implies that the sons of an European would become lazy if raised in the same environment. Analogus views were expressed by Hegel and Schopenauer.

In the words of Michel Focault, a famous historian and philosopher who studied the phenomen, racism
......divided itself in the 19th century according to two rival lines: on one hand, it was incorporated by racists, biologists and eugenicists, who gave it the modern sense of "race" and, even more, transformed this popular discourse into a "state racism" (e.g. Nazism)... and, on the other hand, Marxists, for whom "race", applied to humans, was another example of division in classes.
(wikipedia)

The first example of modern racist theory was actually from a french, Joseph The Goubineau, who even invented the term aryan. That book though was pretty much an attempt to defend the Holy Bible; hironically, Goubineau was philo-semitic and believed that white americans were an inferior race. His book, cut ad hoc of the parts where he lauded jewish and insulted white Americans, became famous in USA and later in Nazi German,while In Europe had very limited popularity and was looked at as an extravagant blatering.

 

[marinera]

Lol. Who is being condescending here?

You have missed the point. I have said racism exists everywhere. I have been to Rome and have seen how the police treat and hassle gypsies and the African peddlers. ...

Really? Police treat and hassle gypises and African peddlers? Can you mention a case were Italian police shot an unarmed gypsie? Or beat a gypise to death? And listen this: peddling is not a habit that Africans have.

I highly doubt that you would be able to distinguish an African in Italy from other Europeans, because, differently from what you believe, the vast majority most of Africans who are in Italy aren't black, since they come from North Africa: thye are caucasians. I highly doubt that you would be able to distinguish a Gipsy either, since there aren't many gypsies in USA and the gypsies who are in Italy are mostly white too.

So listen what I think : you have never been in Rome, you are inventing things.

 

[Oxnard]

As a theoretic statement, yes. It is something completely different than modern racism. Shortly said, before scientific racism, which developed in UK and USA (and thereafter in Australia), thinkers believe that the climate and education caused variations among ethnicitis, not that were biological differences. For example Immanuel Kant believed that blacks, since more exposed to the sun, had not enough iron in the blood, so they became lazy. His theory implies that the sons of an European would become lazy if raised in the same environment. Analogus views were expressed by Hegel and Schopenauer.

In the words of Michel Focault, a famous historian and philosopher who studied the phenomen, racism
......divided itself in the 19th century according to two rival lines: on one hand, it was incorporated by racists, biologists and eugenicists, who gave it the modern sense of "race" and, even more, transformed this popular discourse into a "state racism" (e.g. Nazism)... and, on the other hand, Marxists, for whom "race", applied to humans, was another example of division in classes.
(wikipedia)

The first example of modern racist theory was actually from a french, Joseph The Goubineau, who even invented the term aryan. That book though was pretty much an attempt to defend the Holy Bible; hironically, Goubineau was philo-semitic and believed that white americans were an inferior race. His book, cut ad hoc of the parts where he lauded jewish and insulted white Americans, became famous in USA and later in Nazi German,while In Europe had very limited popularity and was looked at as an extravagant blatering.

Wait, is Goubineau the idiot who used Atlantis to "prove" that white people are superior?

 

[Drifterwood]

America is where modern racism striclty said full grown (although the origin is in UK, With Thomas Galton).



Do you mean Francis Galton?

 

[marinera]

Wait, is Goubineau the idiot who used Atlantis to "prove" that white people are superior?

To my knowledge, not; the myth of aryans as descendant of Atlantis comes from theosophy writers, who weren't racists t all (although some of theirs writings were lately misquoted and distorced to fit the Nazi ideology).

 

[marinera]

Yep drifterwood, Francis Galton. Thanks for the correction.

 

[Oxnard]

To my knowledge, not; the myth of aryans as descendant of Atlantis comes from theosophy writers, who weren't racists t all (although some of theirs writings were lately misquoted and distorced to fit the Nazi ideology).

Just curious. The whole "white people are superior because Atlantis" thing is one of the most hilariously stupid things about white supremacist ideology.

 

[Perados]

This thread is still alive???

Damn it! There is racism in the USA, where blacks got shot day in and out.
There is racism in Italy, where black refugees get treated worse that dogs (I talked to Guinean refugees, who made it via Italy to Germany)
There is racism in Germany, where a Turkish name guarantees you less chances to get a job.
There is racism in England, where east Europeans are damned as the pore evil.
There is racism in Japan, where shop owners refuse to serve foreigners.

To argue where is more or less racism is stupid and a waste of time and energy.
As long as there is racism in your neighbourhood, you should care to fight it and stop thinking about if there is another place with even more racism

 

[marinera]

Yes Perados this thread is still alive. If you don't like it don't read it, simple.

 

[Drifterwood]

Yep drifterwood, Francis Galton. Thanks for the correction.

It's not my area, but Galton's eugenics was limited to a couple of generations of "superiority" and then not when nurtured within that culture.

According to Galton there should be no grounds whatsoever for white supemacists in the U.S.

 

[marinera]

It's not my area, but Galton's eugenics was limited to a couple of generations of "superiority" and then not when nurtured within that culture.

According to Galton there should be no grounds whatsoever for white supemacists in the U.S.

Correct. As said, his work influenced other writers and "scientists", expecially in USA, where actually scientific racism has fluorished; but that was in a large part a misunderstanding and oversymplification of his work; Galton was really scientific, he was an open minded, rigorous thinker; not so the eugenetics that came after him.

 

[b.c.]

Lol. So you, of all people, have no problem with a posting that says "that's what people I know that have traveled there have told me." You, and others here, who decry and attack anyone who fails to back up their views without factual data or links?!

Look, I could give a crap if you're gunning for me for anytime I post something, but keep it real dude. If someone says "someone told me" be man enought to say, ah, yeah, ok. And as for your passive agressive "let's not forget where he's coming from" once again you take 1 + 1 and arrive at 5.

"Gunning" for you? That's a laugh. And as for that 1+1=5 b.s. and "keeping it real" HERE'S some math for ya:

what you criticize + what you DON'T + what you defend = A CONCLUSION!


Don't know about what others here think, but in MY opinion, anyone who posts some bigoted RANT about how an LGBT woman was hired because the company went "p.c." and how changing your name to Jamal might get you that RAISE you (apparently) otherwise didn't deserve, pretty much OUTS HIMSELF.

 

[Oxnard]

"Gunning" for you? That's a laugh. And as for that 1+1=5 b.s. and "keeping it real" HERE'S some math for ya:

what you criticize + what you DON'T + what you defend = A CONCLUSION!


Don't know about what others here think, but in MY opinion, anyone who posts some bigoted RANT about how an LGBT woman was hired because the company went "p.c." and how changing your name to Jamal might get you that RAISE you (apparently) otherwise didn't deserve, pretty much OUTS HIMSELF.

Indeed.

Racists make it sound like being African-American causes jobs to just fall out of the sky into your lap and you can have any promotion you want. Curiously, they only ever use anecdotal evidence to support this fantasy.

Whenever someone does a proper scientific study with proper sample selection, statistical weighting, etc, we find exactly the opposite: an African-American has to be more qualified on average than a white person to get the same job or promotion. Hell, white people with criminal records have an easier time getting jobs than African Americans without criminal records.

It is nothing more than a fantasy to allow racists to deny their own racism.

 

[b.c.]

Indeed.

Racists make it sound like being African-American causes jobs to just fall out of the sky into your lap and you can have any promotion you want. Curiously, they only ever use anecdotal evidence to support this fantasy.

Whenever someone does a proper scientific study with proper sample selection, statistical weighting, etc, we find exactly the opposite: an African-American has to be more qualified on average than a white person to get the same job or promotion. Hell, white people with criminal records have an easier time getting jobs than African Americans without criminal records.

It is nothing more than a fantasy to allow racists to deny their own racism.

Yep....

They object to someone using anecdotal evidence or saying "someone told me," but are surprisingly QUICK to employ it when it suits THEM.

 

[deleted15807]

what you criticize + what you DON'T + what you defend = A CONCLUSION!

b.c. that looks awfully like an equation/science/math. We don't believe in that stuff There's a lot of debate around math. A lot of scientists deny it's real.

 

[Klingsor]

Another point would be, how many people vote Trump because his racist views, and how many despite his racist views?

If I were ever to vote for a presidential candidate despite his or her racist views, it would have to be someone with far more positive accomplishments in their ledger than Donald Trump.