Is this PC? If you answer no please include why.

ZOS23xy

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Hmmm. I've been attracted enough to a few black men and women. And enough to bed them.

I know of history, so I know of what people have gone through. Being abused in my own family (and ignored over it), I can understand emotional burdens.

And in my family if my father knew I had slept with a black man or woman, he'd throw me out of the family emotionally. I know he's a bit racist.

Beyond that I don't understand beingracist. I don't feel anger to someone because of differences.

And, oh, the description of "jungle fever". I guess in Pagan and Sf fandom, the social arenas I circle around in, differences are part of solidarity. Division in those circles come from intellectual property: if Star Wars is better than Star Trek. If skyclad wicca makes any difference. Being openly racist there is to be led back to the opening they came into, and not gently.
 

jorpollew

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The term "jungle fever" (as it refers to inter-racial dating and not the malaria illness) is a relatively new phrase to pop culture-- less than 20 years old. However, there are undeniably some historical implications from slavery and the antebellum period. During that time, Black men were often depcited as "beasts" for several reasons:
  • to show Blacks as inferior and a sub-culture community;
  • to make people (esp. white women) fearful of Black men;
  • to warrant and sanction harsh punishment or cruel treatment toward Blacks
So, the term "jungle fever" is ultimately derived from these racist attitudes that associate love-making among Black people as primitive and animalistic behavior. And for a non-black person, it meant a taboo walk on the "wild side".

Some people may argue whether or not the term "jungle fever" is derogatory. However, when would it ever be considered a compliment? --and to whom?! Certainly not toward the Black person! At the very least, using the term is making a social commentary, and begs the follow-up question-- "Well, what did you mean by that?!!" And that is a legitimate question! Because, if the person who uses the term "jungle fever" claims to NOT have an issue with inter-racial dating, then why would s/he ever use the term? If it's meant as only a witty quip or inside joke, then keep it among close company and friends.

IMO: The term "jungle fever" is a racistly-charged term and politically incorrect. It should be used with caution, if at all. It is certainly inappropriate to use it in a professional setting or open social gathering.
 

D_Fiona_Farvel

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PC or not, I still use the term Jungle Fever when it applies. My current term is "swirl" when joking with GFs, other than that, interracial relationships, mine or anyones, are not usually worth mentioning.
 

naughty

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PC or not, I still use the term Jungle Fever when it applies. My current term is "swirl" when joking with GFs, other than that, interracial relationships, mine or anyones, are not usually worth mentioning.


That is how two of my girlfriends describe their marriages as vanilla chocolate swirls. and their kids truly are vanilla chocolate swirls! LOL! :biggrin1: Vanilla and chocolate are delicious! What's not to like?
 

naughty

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First time I ever heard the term was in the Spike Lee movie.


Speedo,

I think he could call it that because the term had been around for a while prior. It is sad that many people can not just have normal relationships devoid of the color issue. Most of the time when the relationship is not used to objectify another ( But then that happens with money and status as well) the reason the two persons are drawn to each other are mutual interests and lifestyle. Most of my friends black white male and female date or have dated or even married someone of another race because the basically clicked. THat is all one can hope for any relationship.It is sad that thinking about whether ones family will disown them is not something that anyone should have to choose.
Face it , in the U.S. like it or not, even for immigrants who have been raised on American racial propoganda, blacks have been portrayed negatively. THere is no status in marrying a black person unless they are extremely successful in some field of endeavor and are being paid accordingly. Even in that case, I have seen instances where people behaved as if they were doing the person of color a favor to have chosen them. Because women in general have second class citizenship white women have been more likely to traditionally date and marry black. It is only recently that I have seen an upswing of white males who were willing to date or marry black. Have sex, yes. Take them home to mama , not unless they had lost their mind.
 

lafever

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Interesting thread and posts, personally i love my wife who most of you know is interacial, i have the best of both worlds, although sometimes i wish she had less white, not all but most white women i`ve been with are just crazy.
I like the strong willed part of my wife and i`m 100% SURE where it comes from.

lafever:cool:
 

cklover

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Wow...talk about an incendiary topic! (I read or skimmed all of the afore posts.) That term was and maybe still is used by African-Americans to contemptuously refer to white people who lust after black people. The negative connotation has to do with the whites wanting contact with the blacks ONLY for sexual reasons. In the gay world, it's even more hateful....white men hot for Asian men....rice queens. Non-white hot for white....snow-queens. It's all very political and cultural...rules, regulations, taboos broken. When that happens, the intrigue for the forbidden fruit comes into play...and, VOILA! It's all basic human nature and will never change.:mad:
 

Principessa

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The 1980s called. It wants its innuendo back.
hahaha

I think he could call it that because the term had been around for a while prior. The phrase 'jungle fever' has been around since my mom was a little girl and she is 77. It is not a new term. It is sad that many people can not just have normal relationships devoid of the color issue. Most of the time when the relationship is not used to objectify another ( But then that happens with money and status as well) the reason the two persons are drawn to each other are mutual interests and lifestyle. Bingo! I wish I could find a decent black man with the same morals, values, and socio-economic background as myself, if only to get my family the heck off my back. *SNIP* Because women in general have second class citizenship white women have been more likely to traditionally date and marry black. It is only recently that I have seen an upswing of white males who were willing to date or marry black. Have sex, yes. Take them home to mama , not unless they had lost their mind. Therein lies the secret to my single status. :12::disappointed:

The term "jungle fever" (as it refers to inter-racial dating and not the malaria illness) is a relatively new phrase to pop culture-- less than 20 years old. Actually blacks and whites have used that phrase for close to 100 years. What is new is young white people being so brazen about wanting to have sex with black people just because they are black. :rolleyes: However, there are undeniably some historical implications from slavery and the antebellum period. During that time, Black men were often depcited as "beasts" for several reasons:
  • to show Blacks as inferior and a sub-culture community;
  • to make people (esp. white women) fearful of Black men;
  • to warrant and sanction harsh punishment or cruel treatment toward Blacks
So, the term "jungle fever" is ultimately derived from these racist attitudes that associate love-making among Black people as primitive and animalistic behavior. And for a non-black person, it meant a taboo walk on the "wild side". This is true.

Some people may argue whether or not the term "jungle fever" is derogatory. IMO it is derogatory. However, when would it ever be considered a compliment? --and to whom?! Certainly not toward the Black person! Nope! At the very least, using the term is making a social commentary, and begs the follow-up question-- "Well, what did you mean by that?!!" And that is a legitimate question! Because, if the person who uses the term "jungle fever" claims to NOT have an issue with inter-racial dating, then why would s/he ever use the term? If it's meant as only a witty quip or inside joke, then keep it among close company and friends. <---Thank you for saying this!!!

IMO: The term "jungle fever" is a racistly-charged term and politically incorrect. It should be used with caution, if at all. It is certainly inappropriate to use it in a professional setting or open social gathering.

salt n peper prson LMAO. Why is that funny? :confused: I secretly love the term and the idea (junglefever) because New Orleans was so segregated. It made it more exciting because I had never experienced a segregated society before until NOLA where it would even be noticed or expressed as junglefever. I date people I don' think of them as a race but as a description. Huh? :confused: Of, course I knew it meant being attracted to black people just not the history. It makes me sad that it is derived from bigotry and not some kind of Brazilian Carnival type of roots. Brazil has jungles and dark, passionate, sexy people. OMG!!! :aargh4: You are a moron!! Do you ever read what you have written before you post?!?
I used to go out in the Quarter and ask young, fine, black males to feel my head and say I was getting fever and other people would laugh and we would tease. :aargh4: See comments like that are why I don't like you. :mad: :aargh4: But ,white or black, we didn't know it was from something mean. Trust me, they knew and they were laughing, at you the crazy white girl. We were young and didn't think about it then. Some of them were shy with me and adorable. Not like anywhere else I had been. We liked it because we didn't know better. Ahhh ignorance is bliss! And you are apparently slap happy! :aargh4: :mad: :rolleyes: :aargh4:
 

snoozan

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Interesting thread and posts, personally i love my wife who most of you know is interacial, i have the best of both worlds, although sometimes i wish she had less white, not all but most white women i`ve been with are just crazy.
I like the strong willed part of my wife and i`m 100% SURE where it comes from.
lafever:cool:

Okay, so most white women are crazy and a strong will is a quality only black women have. Is that really what you're saying?

B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T.
 

jorpollew

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The phrase 'jungle fever' has been around since my mom was a little girl and she is 77. It is not a new term.
Actually blacks and whites have used that phrase for close to 100 years.


Really?!! This is very interesting to me! Until the Spike Lee movie popularized it, I do not ever recall reading or hearing the term "jungle fever" as it pertains to inter-racial dating. I do know that many people used the term to refer to the malaria illness, but that was it.

I would appreciate and be very grateful if you could refer me to any historical or literary reference that uses the phrase "jungle fever" for inter-racial dating prior to the 1970's.

I indexed several books from my personal library at home (see list), but could not find anything:
"Black Song" (Lovell); "Bullwhip Days" (Mellon); "End of Blackness" (Dickerson); "Nigger" (Kennedy); "Losing The Race" (McWhorter); "Winning the Race" (McWhorter); "White Men on Race" (Feagin); Beyond the Color Line" (Thernstrom); "Race Matters" (West); "Future of the Race" (West/Gates); "America Behind the Color Line" (Gates); "Our Kind of People" (Graham); "Envy of the World" (Cose)

I do not mean to over-kill, but since my childhood I've always been fascinated by Black History, Social Issues and Race in America. I would appreciate any light that you (or anyone reading) could shed on this topic of "jungle fever" (i.e., its term usage prior to 1970 on inter-racial dating).

Some "fyi" trivia: Frederick Douglass' second wife was white!! I just found that out a few months ago and it floored me. The term used back then was "miscegenation" (meaning "mixed kinds"). From the Civil War through WWII there were were anti-miscegenation laws that outlawed inter-racial marriages in most of the states. And in the mid-60's, anti-miscegenation laws were declared unconstitutional and banned in all states. So, inter-racial marriages have been fully legal for only about 40 years. Ironically, Douglass and his wife resided in Washington, DC, of all places!
 

naughty

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Really?!! This is very interesting to me! Until the Spike Lee movie popularized it, I do not ever recall reading or hearing the term "jungle fever" as it pertains to inter-racial dating. I do know that many people used the term to refer to the malaria illness, but that was it.

I would appreciate and be very grateful if you could refer me to any historical or literary reference that uses the phrase "jungle fever" for inter-racial dating prior to the 1970's.

I indexed several books from my personal library at home (see list), but could not find anything:
"Black Song" (Lovell); "Bullwhip Days" (Mellon); "End of Blackness" (Dickerson); "Nigger" (Kennedy); "Losing The Race" (McWhorter); "Winning the Race" (McWhorter); "White Men on Race" (Feagin); Beyond the Color Line" (Thernstrom); "Race Matters" (West); "Future of the Race" (West/Gates); "America Behind the Color Line" (Gates); "Our Kind of People" (Graham); "Envy of the World" (Cose)

I do not mean to over-kill, but since my childhood I've always been fascinated by Black History, Social Issues and Race in America. I would appreciate any light that you (or anyone reading) could shed on this topic of "jungle fever" (i.e., its term usage prior to 1970 on inter-racial dating).

Some "fyi" trivia: Frederick Douglass' second wife was white!! I just found that out a few months ago and it floored me. The term used back then was "miscegenation" (meaning "mixed kinds"). From the Civil War through WWII there were were anti-miscegenation laws that outlawed inter-racial marriages in most of the states. And in the mid-60's, anti-miscegenation laws were declared unconstitutional and banned in all states. So, inter-racial marriages have been fully legal for only about 40 years. Ironically, Douglass and his wife resided in Washington, DC, of all places!


Yes ,

Allegedly, he had a white mistress while he was married to the free black woman who helped him early on to establish himself. The mistress was not the woman he eventually married. She was a german born intellectual who supported his cause monetarily during the Ante Bellum period. He had a home in Anacostia and one on Capital Hill.

There have been interracial relations since the first European settler hit these shores and brought their black slaves with them. In the upper south, many of the first interracial relationships were between English and Irish indentured servants and African slaves .They lived together as husband and wife and their children were given free status. In Virginia today, many of the more prominant African American families pride themselves on having been the descendants of "free Issues". Those were the offspring of white mothers and Black fathers and due to the status of the mother were born free. Laws were changed a number of times as the mulatto population grew and gained a degree of autonomy . THe "one drop" rule was created in the colonies of the upper south to control this "problem". There were also laws to limit the growth freed black population as well. In Colonial Virginia up through the Ante bellum period slaves who had gained their freedom through purchase or bequest were required within a certain period of time to leave the state of their servitude.

We will never know if there were any true feelings between THomas Jefferson and Sallie Hemmings because relations between men and women let alone men and women of such an unequal status were probably not as they are today. Marriages were often economic arrangements. Conversely, Sallie Hemmings was a woman freed by circumstance but bound to Jefferson by familial ties and probably the need to stay near her children remaining at Monticello. The family probably achieved status not afforded others of Jefferson's slaves but it is very telling that the man who penned the Declaration of Independence did not free his offspring by Hemmings at birth.They stayed there on Monticello and some served the family till his death or their disappearance into the larger white community through passing. THough he may have had fond feelings for her , he probably never saw her as a more equal partner. WHite women also in essays express their feelings of bondage so how could a woman of color (minimal though it was) expect more. I really think the movies about the relationship are lessened by the titilation factor that still reigns supreme. HE was a man , a young man at that when his wife Martha died and made him promise not to remarry. That was good for his daughters who then were set to inherit his property gained through the Wayles family but it also left him as a man who was then obliged to fulfill his needs in other ways.
 

tim36

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I think its an old term and also an odd one and slightly offensive (even amusing in a way), why is interracial dating between a black person with a white person considered having a sickness or going to a "jungle" anyway?
 

jorpollew

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Yes ,

Allegedly, he had a white mistress while he was married to the free black woman who helped him early on to establish himself. The mistress was not the woman he eventually married. She was a german born intellectual who supported his cause monetarily during the Ante Bellum period. He had a home in Anacostia and one on Capital Hill.

There have been interracial relations since the first European settler hit these shores and brought their black slaves with them. In the upper south, many of the first interracial relationships were between English and Irish indentured servants and African slaves....

Thanks Naughty. Great reply and interesting stuff.

Allow to clarify my curiosity:
I am fully aware that there have been numerous inter-racial relationships in America (and beyond) for centuries. Even Shakespeare's "Othello" references that.

Referencing the other posts in this thread, however, what I cannot find is proof that those inter-racial relationships were ever referred to as "jungle fever" at anytime prior to the mid-20th century (1950-60s).

Based on my knowledge and information, the term "jungle fever" was linked to inter-racial relationships at some point in the 1970's-80's, and then popularized in the general culture with the Spike Lee film. And, that anytime the term was used before then was solely in reference to the malaria fever illness.

So, is there any writer, historian, educator, psychologist, sociologist, ethnocologist, anthropologist, etc., that purports use of the term "jungle fever" for inter-racial relationships during the 18th, 19th or early 20th centuries?

A disclaimer: I'm not in an expert position to debate anyone about this. I humbly claim ignorance, b/c all I have is just a lack of reference to the term "jungle fever" among my books and information. So, I would love to find a book, an essay or article on the subject that was written prior to 1970 or that chronicles that period. It'd be great to include in my library.
 

sweatyblackballs

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Okay, so most white women are crazy and a strong will is a quality only black women have. Is that really what you're saying?

B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T.

I think that you inferred that from what LA posted. I think it is fine for him to say his wife garnered her strong resolve from her stronger side of the family. You assumed he meant the black side. He may well have. That does not make his statement bullshit!

La, all the white women you met/dated are crazy? LOL ...

Jungle Fever is a term that should probably be derided as much as Jungle Bunny, but just another one of those racially inflammatory terms that has seeped into popular culture to characterise the black/white relationship. I am not sure if it is now a neutral term, but here in London it is rarely used and when I hear it, it is in jest or in mockery.
There are racial hotspots here in London and interracial relations is still frowned upon, though given the nature of a now vastly multicultural Britain this is mostly insidious racism as opposed to outright name-calling! Methinks insidious racism, just like positive racism is disgusting ... I hate racism and I hate people who objectifying black people! Therefore I am not a fan of the term nor of its connotations. Terms like this and 'Nigger' are not in my book suddenly neutral!

Stevie Wonder | Jungle Fever lyrics