Is this typical American Behavour

D

deleted356736

Guest
Parisiennes? Even the French hate them!

My French sister-in-law's Parissienne 85 yr old mother visits her in her quiet Breton village and stonks around the deserted streets of an evening contemptuously declaring "This is dead city! Dead city!".

Cette une ville mort? I have been to Paris a few times and never had any problems at all. It's not been anything I've done deliberately, and I guess it's just the way I am and the way I like to 'fit in'. Paris is truly the most beautiful city in the world (cette une ville magnifique!), and there is a combination of vitality and liveability that I've never seen anywhere else I've travelled to. And yes, I've been to the US, albeit briefly, and didn't like what I experienced much.

I do hope that any who read this discussion keep in mind two things. The first is to visit Paris at least once in their lives, because it truly is a magnificent city and the people there are quite fine. Second, if you do travel, you will gain a lot from the experience by keeping away from the tourist hotels and getting up close and personal with the local citizenary. An apartment in Montemarte, overnight in a village part-way between Harare and Bulawayo in Zimbabwe (my wife's country), apartments in inner-city Moscow and Saint Petersberg (Russia is fascinating country, although language is a challenge), and so on.

I think the thing with European travel is that it's very, very crowded. Small countries, big populations, massive population density. The big cities: London, Paris, Madrid, Barcelona, Roma et al; first and foremost they're peoples homes. They're living cities, not tourist theme parks. If you go there be discreet, like you're visiting someone's home. They gain a lot from tourists, but they have a limit. If you go to a cafe or restaurant, keep in mind that it IS small and crowded and you have to think and act small and keep the volume down. If you're on the metro, remember it's crowded as well. These are the mistakes that I see tourists make too often, especially tourists from wide-open countries.
 

MarkLondon

Sexy Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2008
Posts
1,911
Media
21
Likes
98
Points
193
Location
London, UK
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
Don't get me wrong. I love Paris.

Being a Londoner the aloof arrogance of the shop assistants, the efficient disdain of the waiters, the non-involvement of the fellow metro passengers are all reassuringly familiar to me.

I also love the egalitarianism. I've seen street-sweepers sipping un cafe next to smartly-dressed businesswomen getting their caffeine fix at a bar.

True, if you get out of the absolute centre and the tourist areas things are different. I've stayed in the 13th arrondisement (the most unfashionable of all, not even shabby-chic or prolatarian edgieness) where on the second visit to the local cafe the proprietor is giving me a back-slapping welcome and making jokes about my "late breakfast" when I order cafe-au-lait (or un grand creme, as they actually call it) in the afternoon.

But we digress...
 
Last edited:

QuiteOne

Sexy Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Posts
234
Media
5
Likes
26
Points
163
Oh boy. I just love these threads. I live in the Caribbean and am surrounded by tourists from all over the world. Here's my own generalizations:

Although Americans can be a little loud and in-your-face, I find they are often the friendliest people I encounter. You can invariably spot them on the street as they are the worst dressed and have a smile on their face. They are usually looking around and pointing at things of interest.

Europeans don't smile nearly as much and are less likely to engage in small talk than Americans. My partner often comments on how they look like they've lived a hard life.

In my experience, the Aussies and Kiwis are kinda like Americans Light. Full of smiles and typically friendly, just not so aggressive about it.

We don't get a lot of Asians (sorry to lump them all together) but generally they are excruciatingly polite and apologetic.

Latin Americans (although we don't see a lot of them as well) are generally friendly. Especially the Dominicans. Some of the friendliest people you'll ever come across.

Well, there's my generalizations. To address the OP directly, no that isn't typical American behavior in my experience.

Although I'm guilty of generalizing, I find that if you have the opportunity to spend a bit of time with people from all over the world you will quickly find how much you have in common and our differences will become less important.

A note to cbrmale, quit trying to blend in so much! You shouldn't be so sensitive about being different. Part of the joy of traveling is standing out from the crowd. You don't have to be obnoxious about it. But let them know you are from a different part of the world. People love that.
 

rbkwp

Mythical Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Posts
80,805
Media
1
Likes
46,032
Points
608
Location
Auckland (New Zealand)
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
Well, there's my generalizations. To address the OP directly, no that isn't typical American behavior in my experience.

Generalize ,, as much a you want matey
I can see that what you wrote is the BEST and most ACCURATE description of the peoples that you have mentioned
Fully endorse (for what its worth) all you have said ..I think a person would be an absolute fool to dispute it.
I am also talking as to how i found; each culture -30- years ago..exactly the same and really nothings changed about them
Good and Honest Post
Thanks
enz
 
2

2322

Guest
Jason, I've been to Paris about a dozen times in the past eight years. I also go to Cannes every September. I speak about two words of French and I can honestly say that I've not had any rudeness directed towards me whatsoever. I guess if I went looking for it, I'd find it, just like I do in Germany. But then I don't like Germany much.

I haven't noticed any stinky French. I'm sure they exist, but I think that stereotype is a relic of another time.

I too tend to blend in and stay out of the radar. But if some tourists want to stick out like sore thumbs, that's their business and other people, especially other tourists should just shut-up. Are you there to see the sights or are you're there to critique other tourists? Not everyone has to be the same as you.

See, this is where I think living in a foreign country for so long/so frequently has been helpful to you. Usually we either go to the Caribbean or Mexico or up to Canada. None of these places are unused to Americans and have skewed their tourism and expectations of tourists toward American customers. Europe is all around more expensive and requires more planning and time to see. Then there's the whole language thing which many Americans find intimidating. We just don't get away as much. I know Europeans complain about this a great deal but we don't get an entire month of the year off nor nearly as many other vacation days. A European drives 200 miles and may well have crossed several borders. We drive 200 miles and may well be in the same state!

We're not used to being guests in other countries either. I have tried being polite everywhere I go. In all fairness, out of the 16 European countries I've been to, only Paris was an issue. Everywhere else, even in Rome where I was underdressed and completely baffled by how to get around, I found people to be more helpful and courteous. My young, single, blonde, blue-eyed sister with the perky bosom did not. Ahem! Everywhere I went I tried to be polite and deferential. In Paris I tried speaking French and I would be immediately talked-over in English. They had no patience for my attempts to speak their language. Once out of Paris though, it was appreciated. In Paris I was overcharged in restaurants, had rude waiters, and impatient hoteliers. A few shop keepers were nice enough but mostly the people were rude to the point of shocking. I was using the men's room in the Musee d'Orsay and discovered that there weren't enough stalls in the women's room so the women use the men's room without any hesitation. One woman barged right past me and into a stall muttering something about Americans under her breath and I was just trying to pee!

The further south I went, the nicer the French became. Once I reached the Riviera, the people were much more relaxed, friendly, approachable, and tolerant (sometimes even praising!) of my attempts at French. I took three years of it so can usually understand what people are saying.

The first country I ever went to was Bermuda and I make a point of goinig when I can. I love the island and her people like no where else. I dress nicely, always greet people in shops or on the street, learned the island's history and customs, and always, Onions have been nothing but appreciative and charming in return. Now that their major source of tourists dollars are visiting cruise ships, Bermuda gets the worst of Americans who have no idea or appreciation for the island or how it works and don't care to. They want their souvenir T-shirts and get back on the boat. The Onions hate it and have actually reduced the number of ships allowed to visit the island because they feel these giant ships are full of obnoxious people who don't do much for their economy and fill the streets expecting to see people performing like trained seals. Time and again I've heard about these archetypal Ugly Americans from Bermudians and it saddens me.

So I do get it. I do appreciate that Americans, as those of other nationalities, can be rude when travelling. In New York, the rudest people are perceived to be the Japanese because they don't apologize when they bump into you, don't talk to you, seemingly ignore everything you say or do, and never thank you for not crossing in front of their camera shot. It's like they're above everyone else. But that's how the Japanese are in Japan. Without introductions you may as well not exist unless there is some reason to speak to you in which case they are exceptionally polite. I get this. I don't know how many other New Yorkers do.

I wish I had more funds and time to spend in Europe. I really want to go to Spain to visit my LPSG friends there and expereience what I've heard is a fantastic country. I have spent most of my time in Ireland where they love Americans and Americans get along very well with the Irish. I have found the same is true in Scotland and Wales. The English can be a bit stiff, but the friendliness in the Celtic countries is almost overwhelming and I don't know any Americans who have gone to these countries and complained about their welcome. In all my time in Ireland, which is not small, I've only had ONE person who had a problem with Americans and after we parted company someone I didn't even know bought me a drink as an apology for having been treated so rudely. Of course I brushed the whole thing off and thanked everyone generously for their supoort and then proceeded to buy all of them a round (which came to a shocking 180 Euros and that's with a discount the publican extended me for being so generous).

Anyway, I think Vince, you're lucky that you and others here are able to travel so easily. One of my Canadian friends purposely wears a Canada flag when he goes to Europe so he won't get mistaken for an American (though he wears black and brown socks with sandals so I'm not sure he gets mistaken for American anyway:wink:). His experience has been that when he wears that pin he gets treated better. I don't know how else to explain it, but there you go.
 

nudeyorker

Admired Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Posts
22,742
Media
0
Likes
854
Points
208
Location
NYC/Honolulu
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
In response to the OP I don't think there is anything typical about any nationality; there are always people who will be perceived as "typical" based on the stereotypes people assign and others who are seen as behaving "worldly" if the stereotypes are broken.
 
D

deleted356736

Guest
Anybody who tries to speak French in France and gets English in reply, here's the problem. French is about rhythm, and if you don't get the rhythm right they're not insulting you, they literally cannot understand you. The closest I can get is Indian English, which is often near impossible to understand. And yet the pronounciation is not that skewed, it's just the rhythm is all wrong. French is much more rhythmic than English, and you need to get it right. The only true way to speak French well is to listen and repeat, and listen and repeat, et al.

If you learn it this way as I did, then they will understand you and you can do everything from asking for directions to buying groceries and train tickets, and all in French. The tempo of the syllables, they're really critical.

But that still doesn't get around the fact that Americans are brash, Europeans are reserved, Australians are somewhere in the middle, and when we travel it's best to fit in with local customs.
 

hud01

Expert Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Posts
4,983
Media
0
Likes
106
Points
133
Location
new york city
Sexuality
80% Straight, 20% Gay
Gender
Male
I'm not going to the World Cup, but I can vouch that Americans are more outgoing than most of the rest of us, which is off-putting. When travelling, Americans would be well-advised to observe what's going on around them and try to blend-in more. In Europe, especially France, American tourists are loathed and detested for this reason, they just don't try to fit it. Instead they are brash, noisy and so on.

For me, the best part of travel is immersing myself in the local culture. In France I am French, and tourists come to me and ask directions! In Spain I become Spanish, although my Spanish isn't as good as my French, while in the UK I become British. And so it goes on.
You do know that a recent survey of many countries about tourists found the French to be the rudest tourists. The French government even felt a need to respond by saying the French are not used to traveling abroad, so they are not used to adapting to local culture.

Oh yeah the English hate the French too.
 

hud01

Expert Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Posts
4,983
Media
0
Likes
106
Points
133
Location
new york city
Sexuality
80% Straight, 20% Gay
Gender
Male
Anybody who tries to speak French in France and gets English in reply, here's the problem. French is about rhythm, and if you don't get the rhythm right they're not insulting you, they literally cannot understand you. The closest I can get is Indian English, which is often near impossible to understand. And yet the pronounciation is not that skewed, it's just the rhythm is all wrong. French is much more rhythmic than English, and you need to get it right. The only true way to speak French well is to listen and repeat, and listen and repeat, et al.

If you learn it this way as I did, then they will understand you and you can do everything from asking for directions to buying groceries and train tickets, and all in French. The tempo of the syllables, they're really critical.

But that still doesn't get around the fact that Americans are brash, Europeans are reserved, Australians are somewhere in the middle, and when we travel it's best to fit in with local customs.
Apologizing for their rudeness... nice.

I tell you the rudest tourists I saw when in Thailand were the Germans, reserved my ass. There was one guy who changed into his bathing suit on the walkway to a beach. He was nude in front of Thai people who are very reserved about showing skin in public.

The kicker is there was a bathroom less than 20 feet from where he changed
 

Fredro

Sexy Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Posts
266
Media
0
Likes
26
Points
163
Location
Crescent City, Florida
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
"You do know that a recent survey of many countries about tourists found the French to be the rudest tourists. The French government even felt a need to respond by saying the French are not used to traveling abroad, so they are not used to adapting to local culture."

I read about the same survey. I thought that was a big laugh. Everyone always calls US "ugly Americans".
 

vince

Legendary Member
Joined
May 13, 2007
Posts
8,271
Media
1
Likes
1,681
Points
333
Location
Canada
Sexuality
69% Straight, 31% Gay
Gender
Male
Got a link?

How many French tourists do you get down there in Crescent City?
 

matticus201

Expert Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Posts
475
Media
12
Likes
110
Points
248
Age
43
Location
Dallas, TX
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
I am so sick of the "Ugly Americans" schtick. I am Southern. That means that if you are in line next to me, you will probably be engaged in polite conversation regardless of the fact that you are a complete stranger. It also means that if you come to my house, you'll never go away hungry, and that if you are in a bar with me, you will probably get a round on me. That's the way I was raised: friendly, outgoing, and generous.

I admit I haven't traveled extensively, but I did spend an entire summer studying abroad in England (Stratford-upon-Avon), and was never met with rudeness, but rather with kindness and sincere curiosity and interest about me and where I came from. I extended the same interest in the people that I met, and still exchange cards with many of them, including the proprietors of the B&B that I stayed at, to this day. I simply refuse to believe that simple human kindness, friendliness and sincerity should ever be met with rudeness.

I've never been to France, and I'd love to go, but you can bet if I ever do, I'll be exactly the same way I am here, bad French and all, and you can also be assured I would try and put my knowledge of French to use. I'm not going to change who I am simply because I'm a bit out of my element.

Maybe it's the confidence that Americans have that is so offputting to other cultures? I don't know, just a thought.

To answer the OP, I think that depending where the person you're talking about came from, it may have been normal behavior for him. Yes, boisterous, assertive, and many other adjectives that have been mentioned here. But he was just being himself. What's so wrong with that?
 

vince

Legendary Member
Joined
May 13, 2007
Posts
8,271
Media
1
Likes
1,681
Points
333
Location
Canada
Sexuality
69% Straight, 31% Gay
Gender
Male
Apologizing for their rudeness... nice.

I tell you the rudest tourists I saw when in Thailand were the Germans, reserved my ass. There was one guy who changed into his bathing suit on the walkway to a beach. He was nude in front of Thai people who are very reserved about showing skin in public.

The kicker is there was a bathroom less than 20 feet from where he changed
Yeah. I'd second that. In Phuket my wife had to restrain me from fighting with German tourists. My blood was just boiling on several occasions. I've never ever seen a ruder, grosser bunch of animals in my life.
 

hud01

Expert Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Posts
4,983
Media
0
Likes
106
Points
133
Location
new york city
Sexuality
80% Straight, 20% Gay
Gender
Male
Yeah. I'd second that. In Phuket my wife had to restrain me from fighting with German tourists. My blood was just boiling on several occasions. I've never ever seen a ruder, grosser bunch of animals in my life.
This was in Hua Hin. Yeah and they say Americans are fat...lol
 
Last edited: