Is this why people are voting for McCain?

D_Chocho_Lippz

Account Disabled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Posts
1,587
Media
0
Likes
13
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
I know... and I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but the influx of these uber-conservatives coming into the forums and getting into political arguments to start fights, gets me thinking this is not some strange coincidence.
I'm not Sherlock Holmes either, but the influx of name calling and blaming of said conservatives by frequent LPSG politics visitors spread among multiple threads gets me thinking that you have some sort of blinders on.

Let's see, what did someone just make an entire post about... oh yeah.... "conservative douche bags"! Hmmm, I wonder why said uber-conservatives get pissed off.... :mad:

In fact, even though I love talking about politics, all the conservative stereotypes and conservative name calling have got me pissed off enough that I've thought about leaving LPSG (not that anyone would miss me, I'm sure). Do said uber-conservatives sometimes start shit, yeah. But then the opposition surely doesn't take the high road, instead they jump in with their own petty bullshit games. Then said opposition goes and makes threads calling conservatives all sorts of stuff. Great!

So yeah VB, its just the uber-conservatives starting fights around here. :headache:
 

curious n str8

Experimental Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2005
Posts
913
Media
6
Likes
8
Points
163
Age
33
Location
The big AK
Sexuality
99% Straight, 1% Gay
Gender
Male
I'm not Sherlock Holmes either, but the influx of name calling and blaming of said conservatives by frequent LPSG politics visitors spread among multiple threads gets me thinking that you have some sort of blinders on.

Let's see, what did someone just make an entire post about... oh yeah.... "conservative douche bags"! Hmmm, I wonder why said uber-conservatives get pissed off.... :mad:

In fact, even though I love talking about politics, all the conservative stereotypes and conservative name calling have got me pissed off enough that I've thought about leaving LPSG (not that anyone would miss me, I'm sure). Do said uber-conservatives sometimes start shit, yeah. But then the opposition surely doesn't take the high road, instead they jump in with their own petty bullshit games. Then said opposition goes and makes threads calling conservatives all sorts of stuff. Great!

So yeah VB, its just the uber-conservatives starting fights around here. :headache:
Hey I'd miss ya... We need more people with your intelligence and peaceful candor
 

D_Chocho_Lippz

Account Disabled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Posts
1,587
Media
0
Likes
13
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
Hey I'd miss ya... We need more people with your intelligence and peaceful candor
I'm getting really tired of getting called names, having people try to prove that I am genetically/chemically ill, and stereotyped just because I identify as more conservative than liberal.

It's getting really sickening...
 

faceking

Cherished Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2004
Posts
7,426
Media
6
Likes
281
Points
208
Location
Mavs, NOR * CAL
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
I'm getting really tired of getting called names, having people try to prove that I am genetically/chemically ill, and stereotyped just because I identify as more conservative than liberal.

It's getting really sickening...

If you aren't part of the solution PK, then you are problem.

After all you are a douche bag, neo-Christian, right wing, racist, anti-gay, rich & greedy, selfish, liar, in denial, fear mongering, war loving, ... shoot what else am I missing, feel free to finish your personal resume... or if you are struggling to recall, look at what I've been called over the last month for some ideas.

:twak:
 

B_Nick4444

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2007
Posts
6,849
Media
0
Likes
106
Points
193
Location
San Antonio, TX
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
all the conservative stereotypes and conservative name calling have got me pissed off enough that I've thought about leaving LPSG (not that anyone would miss me, I'm sure).


not true

yours are some of the few posts on politics that show any intelligence

plus, you bring some balance to the board
 
D

deleted213967

Guest
I'm getting really tired of getting called names, having people try to prove that I am genetically/chemically ill, and stereotyped just because I identify as more conservative than liberal.

It's getting really sickening...

On the ideological spectrum, the bulk the US electorate lies around that loose median between Obama (to the left) and McCain (to the right).

Americans are (fortunately) infinitely more moderate in their positions than the few extremist poodles barking on here.

You will learn to derive entertainment from the plethora of "ultra" agitprop threads.

I am not sure why they bother expending so much energy selling their defective message on here. They are mostly selling to themselves, not converting anyone.

If anything, they have only managed to reinforce my independence.


 

unabear09

Expert Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Posts
6,763
Media
14
Likes
233
Points
283
Sexuality
90% Straight, 10% Gay
Gender
Male
Perfect forum (LPSG) to post an anti-Christian thread. Doesn't shock me that some feel that way. No different than Muslim extremists don't want McCain in office for their own religious endeavours.

It's always the fringe (nee sub 1%) that get the attention.

I'm seeing a shitload of threads now here, that are "here's what Republicans feel about Obama", "this is what Christian Palin supporters are REALLY like" and the lame attempt at the OPs trying to caveat their take... "I didn't believe it at first, but now I'm wondering if it's true about...." (rollseyes)

I think you/we are better than that to stereotype a whole class of ppl as such. If you think so, and more so,... say so... than you are just as equal a bigot as they are.

On the spectrum, I believe 99% of us are closer together at the center, than the entire fringe. There's no need for this crap, just as there is no need to post Rev Wright sermons and attempt to connect the dots to a populus of race and/or supporters.


Hey! Great job of misconstruing my post! It was by no means a christian bashing thread. If you'll go back and read carefully, I said that I am hearing a lot of rhetoric from people saying that they can't vote for Obama b/c he's an Arab, Muslim, and above all else, the antichrist.

I personally consider my religious/spiritual basis to be christianity. I think you are the one who is being over zealous and drawing huge conclusions here. I personally think very highly of John McCain. He's served his country for the majority of his life, and in the past has been a 'maverick,' but during his campaign, I've seen him as more of a confromist of the GOP simply to get the republican base behind him. Truthfully, if he does get elected, I'll be happy. I pray that he turns back into the maverick he once was and does everything he has said he will.

My biggest reason for not supporting McCain is Sarah Palin. I've done too much research (this does not include the crap I hear on television...I'm talking about from newspapers, the AP, Reuters, etc.) on her, have found her to but unprepared, over-zealous in her religious convictions, manupalitive, untrustworthy, and simply not experienced enough as a national leader to our country. Now, if after her govenorship in Alaska is over, and she decides to come to the lower 48, and work to be a representative of the people in the rest of the states outside of Alaska, and then run for a high ranking office, then I'd feel much more comfortable with her representing me. However, she is the leader of Alaska, which has very little diversity, and is does not have the populous the adequately represent a nation full of many different people, and frankly I do not think she is the person for the job.
 

SpeedoGuy

Sexy Member
Joined
May 18, 2004
Posts
4,166
Media
7
Likes
41
Points
258
Age
60
Location
Pacific Northwest, USA
Sexuality
99% Straight, 1% Gay
Gender
Male
I'm getting really tired of getting called names, having people try to prove that I am genetically/chemically ill, and stereotyped just because I identify as more conservative than liberal.

It's getting really sickening...

I get weary of the same.

Its why I haven't listened to AM radio on weekdays for the last 20 years.
 

B_Hung Jon

Loved Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Posts
4,124
Media
0
Likes
615
Points
193
Location
Los Angeles, California
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
I'm getting really tired of getting called names, having people try to prove that I am genetically/chemically ill, and stereotyped just because I identify as more conservative than liberal.

It's getting really sickening...


I think my take on this is that a conservative POV seems based in fear and closed-mindedness. It also doesn't seem very spiritual or even christian in how it explains the world. What's the moral importance of low taxes, small government, and a strong defense? It seems to denigrate our social responsibility to our neighbors (every man or woman for themselves). I don't feel the current liberal attitude is much better however, but it does seem that they at least pretend to care about the people. Just my view.
 

B_VinylBoy

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Posts
10,363
Media
0
Likes
68
Points
123
Location
Boston, MA / New York, NY
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
I'm not Sherlock Holmes either, but the influx of name calling and blaming of said conservatives by frequent LPSG politics visitors spread among multiple threads gets me thinking that you have some sort of blinders on.

Let's see, what did someone just make an entire post about... oh yeah.... "conservative douche bags"! Hmmm, I wonder why said uber-conservatives get pissed off.... :mad:

I say things like "uber" and "hyper" to address the fact that the thoughts of this small minority are extreme. I know not all Republicans think or act that way. But there are a few on this board that honestly do and that's scary.

In fact, even though I love talking about politics, all the conservative stereotypes and conservative name calling have got me pissed off enough that I've thought about leaving LPSG (not that anyone would miss me, I'm sure). Do said uber-conservatives sometimes start shit, yeah. But then the opposition surely doesn't take the high road, instead they jump in with their own petty bullshit games. Then said opposition goes and makes threads calling conservatives all sorts of stuff. Great!

So yeah VB, its just the uber-conservatives starting fights around here. :headache:

The "ubers" on both side are to blame. You and I both know this. I'm sure some people tend to think that I'm an extreme liberal because I'm siding with Obama. But if you can REALLY look at my gripes, it's all about supporting someone that is truly like me, and even though no politician can truly be like me I know one is closer to it than the other. And sadly, that means I cannot support (or even relate) to a privileged male who owns multiple houses and cars, and thinks the middle class is defined by those who make less than $5 Million. Doesn't matter if he's a war hero.
 

D_Chocho_Lippz

Account Disabled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Posts
1,587
Media
0
Likes
13
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
I think my take on this is that a conservative POV seems based in fear and closed-mindedness. It also doesn't seem very spiritual or even christian in how it explains the world. What's the moral importance of low taxes, small government, and a strong defense? It seems to denigrate our social responsibility to our neighbors (every man or woman for themselves). I don't feel the current liberal attitude is much better however, but it does seem that they at least pretend to care about the people. Just my view.
Look. If you are going to vote based on your religion in saying that if you are an evangelical so you have to vote for the GOP, then you are an idiot. Are there people out there like this? Yes, absolutely. Just like there are militant-atheists who will always vote against the person who is the most religious (Or will never vote for someone who is religious). We never hear about this latter group, however.

But for this forum (LPSG politics) to repeatedly say that a "conservative... seems based in fear and closed-mindedness" and all the other claims is just getting really old. It is as-if, I am automatically defaulted when I speak because (1) I am conservative leaning and (2) because I am a Christian.

What are you questioning about the low taxes, small government, and strong defense? Yes, I believe in low taxes. Actually, I think that we should make what we make, not give it to a government that repeatedly does all the wrong stuff with it. Yes, I believe in a small government. I believe this is right because that is why this country was founded. The settlers wanted government out of their life, so they moved here to gain freedom. They didn't want the government taking their money, "just because" so they also didn't have taxes. And as for a strong defense, by this I mean a very lean, mean strong defense. We spend way too much on our military as is. But, I do think it is our Federal government's job to protect the States should it be attacked (we can't have Maine protect itself if it is attacked, type thing).

In all, I just believe in personal liberty, freedom, and responsibility. Should we take care of our neighbors? Yeah, but it should be out of morality and duty to ones neighbor. It should not be arm-behind-the-back taken from you (taxes). We need to quit thinking that some faceless entity (government) is going to take care of our neighbors for us and start doing it ourselves.

A perfect example of this change of mind is this... Back in the day if your carriage or car broke down, people would stop and help you. Now, today, people just drive by and hope that you can find your own help (here in AZ, I've seen people with their cars on fire, and the whole highway just drives by and stares). Back in the day if your house burned down, your neighbors would come over to help you rebuild it and let you sleep in their house while it is being rebuilt. Today, we all hope that the government will provide some sort of disaster relief and we don't even go ask our neighbor if they are OK or need anything. These are a few things that come to mind. In a nut shell we don't need to take more money to force us to "do good," we need to obtain a sense of community again. I don't like giving my money to some entity who is going to spend it however it feels is "best." Perfect example, is the Iraq war. I didn't and don't want to pay for the Iraq war, but I have to anyways because the government says so. Wouldn't it be nice to have some voice in where your money and thus your help goes?

The "ubers" on both side are to blame. You and I both know this.
So where did you mention this? All I saw in the post you put above was "influx of these uber-conservatives coming into the forums" and I don't see any mention or blame of this other side. I never do, it is always the GOP/Republicans/Conservatives who come in and "start stuff."

I'm sure some people tend to think that I'm an extreme liberal because I'm siding with Obama. But if you can REALLY look at my gripes, it's all about supporting someone that is truly like me, and even though no politician can truly be like me I know one is closer to it than the other. And sadly, that means I cannot support (or even relate) to a privileged male who owns multiple houses and cars, and thinks the middle class is defined by those who make less than $5 Million. Doesn't matter if he's a war hero.
I am confused here VB. In another post you said that you were a hillary supporter but am now a Obama supporter because he still more closely resembles what you believe than the othe side. However, here you are saying you support Obama because his net worth is closer to your own. So, with that said, why would you have gone for Clinton in the first place when her net worth is right up there with McCains? I mean are they all really that different? They all live in million dollar homes. They all have investments worth a lot of money. I'm sure they all have multiple [nice] cars. So, in other words, none of these people are close to you and I. At the end of the day, we are picking between Millionaire A or Millionaire B, someone who makes 10x more than a healthy family $100k!

(On a side note I think it is interesting that a lot of the figures I've found about how each candidate made took Cindy McCain's net worth and combined it with Johns. Same with Hillary, they counted in Bill Clinton's money to her net worth. However, when doing Obama's, they did not count in Michelle's money. Interesting, but I could be wrong.).
 

B_VinylBoy

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Posts
10,363
Media
0
Likes
68
Points
123
Location
Boston, MA / New York, NY
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
So where did you mention this? All I saw in the post you put above was "influx of these uber-conservatives coming into the forums" and I don't see any mention or blame of this other side. I never do, it is always the GOP/Republicans/Conservatives who come in and "start stuff."

Let me clarify.
Most of the name calling and fights are brewed by the people on the extreme sides of both parties. However in this particular case, it's not the uber-liberals that tried to make this election into a race about character. Nor is it the uber-liberals that tried to smear their opponent's reputation with fear mongering rhetoric. That's why you haven't heard me say things about the uber-liberals in this thread.

I am confused here VB. In another post you said that you were a hillary supporter but am now a Obama supporter because he still more closely resembles what you believe than the othe side.

Correct. Hillary was my first choice. But now that she's not in the contest anymore, I made my choice on who was left. Obama was always my second choice.

However, here you are saying you support Obama because his net worth is closer to your own. So, with that said, why would you have gone for Clinton in the first place when her net worth is right up there with McCains? I mean are they all really that different? They all live in million dollar homes. They all have investments worth a lot of money. I'm sure they all have multiple [nice] cars. So, in other words, none of these people are close to you and I. At the end of the day, we are picking between Millionaire A or Millionaire B, someone who makes 10x more than a healthy family $100k!

I'm not picking a candidate based on their financial assets. My comments about McCain and his monetary value was just mere sarcasm. Sorry if you got the two confused.

(On a side note I think it is interesting that a lot of the figures I've found about how each candidate made took Cindy McCain's net worth and combined it with Johns. Same with Hillary, they counted in Bill Clinton's money to her net worth. However, when doing Obama's, they did not count in Michelle's money. Interesting, but I could be wrong.).

To be honest, I'm not sure if anyone did a total of the Obama's assets. Regardless, the actions of each candidate speak loudly. Both candidates are trying to appeal to the general public as being more in tune with the common man & typical American family. Obama classifies the middle class as people who make less than $250,000 while McCain puts it at $5 Million. Considering that the average family makes about $40-$45K, it doesn't look good for McCain's side of this argument. It also doesn't help when his wife is on stage at the RNC wearing an outfit that is 5x the average family income, and that he briefly forgot he owned multiple homes and cars. Of course, this isn't the reason why I'm not voting McCain/Palin.. although it does make for a good chuckle.
 

B_Nick8

Cherished Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Posts
11,402
Media
0
Likes
301
Points
208
Location
New York City, by way of Marblehead, Boston and Ge
Sexuality
80% Gay, 20% Straight
Gender
Male
Unabear, I forwarded this e-mail to my born-again brother, a highly educated man who considers himself rational and socially moderate but who nonetheless believes the Bible to be the literal word of God and who, two years ago, moved his young family from Massachusetts to Tennessee because he couldn't find a school system sufficiently Christian for his children. I will be very interested to hear his reaction to this and will pass it on.
 

D_Chocho_Lippz

Account Disabled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Posts
1,587
Media
0
Likes
13
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
To be honest, I'm not sure if anyone did a total of the Obama's assets. Regardless, the actions of each candidate speak loudly. Both candidates are trying to appeal to the general public as being more in tune with the common man & typical American family. Obama classifies the middle class as people who make less than $250,000 while McCain puts it at $5 Million. Considering that the average family makes about $40-$45K, it doesn't look good for McCain's side of this argument. It also doesn't help when his wife is on stage at the RNC wearing an outfit that is 5x the average family income, and that he briefly forgot he owned multiple homes and cars.
McCain is a complete imbecile for forgetting how many homes he owns. But, I still think that any candidate is not going to know how a middle class American lives. The only difference is - who is going to listen more or make the perception that they are going to listen more.

With that said, I reiterate the question of why does it even matter what is middle class and what is not? Just so we can have some sort of different tax bracket - so we can be categorized? Why don't we base each individual on their own qualities instead of some sort of "class." Man, I really hate collectivism...

Of course, this isn't the reason why I'm not voting McCain/Palin.. although it does make for a good chuckle.
So why is it when I say I won't vote for Obama I am told that I am a racist or that I just want to protect the CEO's uber-greed? Or that I hate my neighbors and want them to suffer? Or that I hate women because I don't support abortion? (This is what I get most the time when I say that I don't like Obama)

Why can't I dislike him for his policies? Why do I have to be a racist, greedy, un-empathetic, sexist for not supporting him?
 

mindseye

Experimental Member
Joined
Apr 9, 2002
Posts
3,399
Media
0
Likes
15
Points
258
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
Why can't I dislike him for his policies? Why do I have to be a racist, greedy, un-empathetic, sexist for not supporting him?

That's a fair question: let me probe further. Earlier, you wrote:

Yes, I believe in low taxes. Actually, I think that we should make what we make, not give it to a government that repeatedly does all the wrong stuff with it. Yes, I believe in a small government.

The choice isn't a choice between small government and big government: it's between a big fair government, and a big unfair government:

  • Barack Obama voted for a 700-billion-dollar bailout package for the ailing financial services markets; he's also pledged to raise taxes on Americans making $250,000 or more and to close several loopholes in the corporate tax structure.
  • John McCain also voted for the 700-billion-dollar bailout package, but opposes raising taxes and opposes restructuring of the corporate tax law.
Both candidates are willing to nationalize the losses of an entire industry -- forcing the taxpayers (and taxpayers for several generations to shoulder their losses). But John McCain thinks that the industry's losses should be nationalized, but their profits and gains should stay private.

You say you want a small government, but neither candidate will give you that. You can choose between a candidate who'll raise the government's share in both losses and gains on Wall Street, or a candidate who'll put his thumb on the scales and have the public shoulder the losses only.

How exactly is supporting the latter anything but greedy?
 

B_VinylBoy

Sexy Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Posts
10,363
Media
0
Likes
68
Points
123
Location
Boston, MA / New York, NY
Sexuality
90% Gay, 10% Straight
Gender
Male
So why is it when I say I won't vote for Obama I am told that I am a racist or that I just want to protect the CEO's uber-greed? Or that I hate my neighbors and want them to suffer? Or that I hate women because I don't support abortion? (This is what I get most the time when I say that I don't like Obama)

Why can't I dislike him for his policies? Why do I have to be a racist, greedy, un-empathetic, sexist for not supporting him?

I don't ever recall calling someone a racist because they don't want to vote for Obama. As for people that do, I tend to think that it's not the vote that makes them want to say these things, it's the reason. Some people generally think McCain is the better choice. That's fine. Even if I don't agree with you, if your choice is based on critical issues that do involve the president and his responsibilities then I can understand why you would be upset at the name calling. But to vote for McCain because they think Obama is an Arab Terrorist? That would be a choice based on race, and that isn't arguable. To vote for a candidate because he's going to raise taxes? That is an argument regarding greed, because everyone knows that some taxes are going to increase in some fashion regardless of who wins. To vote for Obama just because McCain has a woman on the ticket? Yes... that's sexist. Although to be fair, I don't think Palin is the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree. And personally, I don't think any man should have a vote on abortion. But that's just my opinion.
 

D_Chocho_Lippz

Account Disabled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Posts
1,587
Media
0
Likes
13
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
That's a fair question: let me probe further. Earlier, you wrote:



The choice isn't a choice between small government and big government: it's between a big fair government, and a big unfair government:

  • Barack Obama voted for a 700-billion-dollar bailout package for the ailing financial services markets; he's also pledged to raise taxes on Americans making $250,000 or more and to close several loopholes in the corporate tax structure.
  • John McCain also voted for the 700-billion-dollar bailout package, but opposes raising taxes and opposes restructuring of the corporate tax law.
Both candidates are willing to nationalize the losses of an entire industry -- forcing the taxpayers (and taxpayers for several generations to shoulder their losses). But John McCain thinks that the industry's losses should be nationalized, but their profits and gains should stay private.

You say you want a small government, but neither candidate will give you that. You can choose between a candidate who'll raise the government's share in both losses and gains on Wall Street, or a candidate who'll put his thumb on the scales and have the public shoulder the losses only.

How exactly is supporting the latter anything but greedy?
Since when am I defending and/or lobbying for McCain? Hmmmm? I'll let you get back to me....

I don't ever recall calling someone a racist because they don't want to vote for Obama. As for people that do, I tend to think that it's not the vote that makes them want to say these things, it's the reason. Some people generally think McCain is the better choice. That's fine. Even if I don't agree with you, if your choice is based on critical issues that do involve the president and his responsibilities then I can understand why you would be upset at the name calling.
I didn't say you called me racist. While I get a little heated when debating you, I don't mind it and I think that you have been one of the most fair [leftist] debaters on here. I just don't like it when people, as can be seen above (thanks for the example ME), try to put words in my mouth or get called something I am not just because of a label they put on me.

But to vote for McCain because they think Obama is an Arab Terrorist? That would be a choice based on race, and that isn't arguable.
I agree.

To vote for a candidate because he's going to raise taxes? That is an argument regarding greed, because everyone knows that some taxes are going to increase in some fashion regardless of who wins.
I disagree. Just because I think I should have the personal freedom and responsibility to fiscally care for my neighbors instead of giving it to some faceless entity in hopes of them giving it to the right people and places doesn't mean that I am greedy, does it?

To vote for Obama just because McCain has a woman on the ticket? Yes... that's sexist.
I agree. I always try to be fair and I have said that there are all sorts of people voting for people and against people for stupid reasons (black, white, religion, sex, and so many more)... and this occurs on both sides of the aisle. I have always advocated this fact but somehow always get confronted with some lefty that just drills the right for the right's transgressions and ignore their own faults and crazy members.

And personally, I don't think any man should have a vote on abortion. But that's just my opinion.
And you have a right to that opinion. I just think that even though unborn, a child still has rights because it is still a human. To me, it is not an issue about women's rights, it is about the right of a human who cannot defend themselves in any fashion; therefore, it is a issue a woman and a man should vote on. Again, like you said, this is just my opinion.