Mr. Snakey
Expert Member
Hamas is nothing more than a terrorist organization. Israel has every right to defend itself.
Why is it disingenuous or inflammatory to use the term concentration camp? The Palestinians evicted from their homes have been concentrated in the Gaza Strip for the convenience of the militarily successful. The British used them in South Africa, the US used them for Japanese etc etc.. The Israelis have used them for Arabs. Though perhaps the Native American Reservations were the first example in modern history.
Tell me why one person is a great patriot and another a terrorist for fighting for their homes?
I don't agree with war, but I do agree that one country has the right to defend it's citizens from attack. It's about time Israel took action against these terrorists. The whole reason Gaza was returned to the Arabs was for peace. What have the Arabs done for peace in that time? Rained down thousands of rockets and mortars on Israeli towns and civilians.
Now I don't use the word "Palestinians" because there is no such a people or ethnic group. Before the 1945 founding of Israel these people were simply Arabs that were either Syrian, Jordanian, Egyptian or Lebanese. The term "Palestine" came from the British rule.
Any land that is taken in war to protect ones borders is fair game. Is the United States pressured into giving back land to Mexico that was taken in war? Most of the Southwest would be Mexico if that were the case.
I find it truly hypocritical to call the Israelis "aggressors" for defending their citizens while it is perfectly OK for Hamas to fire rockets at purely civilian targets in Israel, even after they have the land they wanted. Would the US government sit idly by if Mexican or Canadian forces were lobbing rockets over the border? Why should Israel? Israel went after military targets and of course there is going to be civilian Arab casualties since Hamas uses their own people as shields like a bunch of chicken shits.
Israel does not have to open it's borders in any way to Gaza. The border is their own and who comes and goes is their choice. The hardships are brought on by Hamas and their failure to live in peace within their borders. They want it both ways; they want their land and to be free to come and go into Israel, they want Israel to supply them with what they need but they don't want Israel to exist. An Arab can walk down the street freely in Israel and not be bothered. If I were to walk into Gaza I would be killed on the spot just for being a Jew.
Oh, and by the way, for anyone who doesn't know: Hamas means "Violence" in both Arabic and Hebrew. Yeah, so boo hoo for the poor Violence party in Gaza.
Is this level of response and the continued destruction of Hamas and the infrastructure, as it is, being destroyed, proportional? Will it only serve (except to help the corrupt Olmert win the elections) to breed the next generation of Jihadis?
Yes and no Rubester.
Hamas is the duly and democratically elected government of Gaza.
The question isn't so simple. One issue is why now?
Is this level of response and the continued destruction of Hamas and the infrastructure, as it is, being destroyed, proportional?
Will it only serve (except to help the corrupt Olmert win the elections) to breed the next generation of Jihadis?
But if the Israelis never retaliated, that would if anything cause the level of Palestinian aggression to ratchet upwards.
IThose attacks by Hamas upon Israel had been going on for some time. At some point, the elephant will trample the mouse. That is life.
Some rubbish grenade attacks do not threaten the State of Israel in any way. The response is an attempt to destroy further the Palestinian people in Gaza. Perhaps Israel has a policy at every opportunity to squeeze the will and life out of these people?
There were attacks before Hamas came to power, there will be attacks afterwards. Whay do you expect? What would you do if you had been forced from your land and made to live in a shit hole with virtually no autonomy?
I can't help but see that the Palestinians are living in an open concentration camp in Gaza...
The reason the Israeli regime is called the aggressors is because in the modern era they initiated the war.
Palestinians did indeed exist as a people and ethnic group.
Some rubbish grenade attacks do not threaten the State of Israel in any way. The response is an attempt to destroy further the Palestinian people in Gaza. Perhaps Israel has a policy at every opportunity to squeeze the will and life out of these people?
There were attacks before Hamas came to power, there will be attacks afterwards. What do you expect? What would you do if you had been forced from your land and made to live in a shit hole with virtually no autonomy?
No, they don't really threaten the Israeli state. But they do compromise the quality of life of Israelis living near Gaza ... and occasionally leave entirely innocent Israelis dead.
Hamas encourages these attacks so that Israel will eventually have to respond.
Israel loses a bit in the court of international public opinion each time it does.
But if it doesn't respond, the terrorism of its own citizens continues.
It is between a rock and a hard place.
But the fundamental blame is on the provocative stance and policies of Hamas.
I hope I would not worsen my situation by doing what Hamas is doing now.
I hope I would behave as the West Bankers are doing ... accepting the Israeli offer of peace and eventual integration into the Israeli economy, with help in establishing Palestinian businesses on the West Bank, and the chance, not necessarily too distant, of living in my own Palestinian state.
And why were they forced from their land? Because the day after Israel's 1948 Declaration of Independence, Arab armies from five nations attacked. Their bark proved worse than their bite. And the consequences for the Palestinians were ruinous.
So in other words, the Palestinians should lie down and accept that you've been conquered?
The "court of international public opinion" is a quaint notion that means absolutely nothing to the Israeli administration nor the factions in the USA that support it.
So in other words, the Palestinians should lie down and accept that you've been conquered?
The "court of international public opinion" is a quaint notion that means absolutely nothing to the Israeli administration nor the factions in the USA that support it.
I doubt the civilian casualties are of much 'concern' to Hamas' leadership, useful may perhaps describe them better. I may be doing them a gross disservice, but somehow I doubt it. Hamas may have misjudged the level of Israel's response, but when you play with fire ...